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From: Chase Venters <chase.venters@clientec.com>
To: "J.A. Magallón" <jamagallon@ono.com>
Cc: "linux-os \\(Dick Johnson\\)" <linux-os@analogic.com>,
	Linus Torvalds <torvalds@osdl.org>,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: [patch] spinlocks: remove 'volatile'
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2006 17:22:22 -0500 (CDT)	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0607071718080.23767@turbotaz.ourhouse> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20060708000531.410cd672@werewolf.auna.net>

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On Sat, 8 Jul 2006, J.A. Magallón wrote:

> #include <stdint.h>
>
> //volatile
> uint32_t spinvar = 1;
> uint32_t mtx;
>
> void lock(uint32_t* l)
> {
>    *l = 1;
> }
>
> void unlock(uint32_t* l)
> {
>    *l = 0;
> }
>
> void spin()
> {
>    uint32_t local;
>
>    for (;;)
>    {
>        lock(&mtx);
>        local = spinvar;
>        unlock(&mtx);
>        if (!local)
>            break;
>    }
> }

This is _totally_ incorrect. Your "lock" functions are broken, because 
they do not introduce syncronization points or locked bus operations. Due 
to this huge failure, the compiler and/or processor is free to re-order 
your loads and stores, resulting in totally unpredictable runtime 
behavior.

> without the volatile:
>
> spin:
>    pushl   %ebp
>    movl    spinvar, %eax
>    movl    %esp, %ebp
>    testl   %eax, %eax
>    je  .L7
> .L10:
>    jmp .L10
> .L7:
>    movl    $0, mtx
>    popl    %ebp
>    ret
>
> so the compiler did something like
>
>   local = spinvar;
>   if (local)
> 	for (;;);
>
> (notice the dead lock/unlock inlined code elimination).

...which indicates that your code is wrong.

> With the volatile, the code is correct:
>
> spin:
>    pushl   %ebp
>    movl    %esp, %ebp
>    .p2align 4,,7
> .L7:
>    movl    spinvar, %eax
>    testl   %eax, %eax
>    jne .L7
>    movl    $0, mtx
>    popl    %ebp
>    ret

Actually, it's not. It's never setting "mtx" to 1, and it's certainly not 
doing any sync or locked ops.

> So think about all you inlined spinlocks, mutexes and so on.

Yes, you got it wrong, and the current code gets it right. (Linus's patch 
of =m to +m, combined with -volatile, is best)

> And if you do
>
> void lock(volatile uint32_t* l)
> ...
> void unlock(volatile uint32_t* l)
> ...
>
> the code is even better:
>
> spin:
>    pushl   %ebp
>    movl    %esp, %ebp
>    .p2align 4,,7
> .L7:
>    movl    $1, mtx    <=========
>    movl    spinvar, %eax
>    movl    $0, mtx    <=========
>    testl   %eax, %eax
>    jne .L7
>    popl    %ebp
>    ret

NO! It's not better. You're still not syncing or locking the bus! If you 
refer to the fact that the "movl $1" has magically appeared, that's 
because you've just PAPERED OVER THE PROBLEM WITH "volatile", which is 
_exactly_ what Linus is telling you NOT TO DO.

> So volatile just means 'dont trust this does not change even you don't see
> why'.
>

No.

Thanks,
Chase

  reply	other threads:[~2006-07-07 22:22 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 163+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2006-07-05  8:49 [patch] uninline init_waitqueue_*() functions Ingo Molnar
2006-07-05  9:31 ` Andrew Morton
2006-07-05  9:32   ` Ingo Molnar
2006-07-05  9:53     ` Andrew Morton
2006-07-05 10:26       ` Ingo Molnar
2006-07-05 11:30         ` Ingo Molnar
2006-07-05 11:46           ` Ingo Molnar
2006-07-05 17:10             ` Andrew Morton
2006-07-05 19:35               ` Ingo Molnar
2006-07-05 20:18                 ` Andrew Morton
2006-07-05 20:36                   ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-05 20:47                     ` Ingo Molnar
2006-07-05 21:15                       ` Ingo Molnar
2006-07-05 21:21                       ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-05 21:45                         ` Ingo Molnar
2006-07-05 21:58                           ` Randy.Dunlap
2006-07-05 22:00                             ` Ingo Molnar
2006-07-05 22:10                               ` Randy.Dunlap
2006-07-05 22:27                                 ` Ingo Molnar
2006-07-05 23:15                               ` Adrian Bunk
2006-07-05 22:09                           ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-05 22:30                             ` Ingo Molnar
2006-07-05 23:11                             ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-06  8:16                               ` [patch] spinlocks: remove 'volatile' Ingo Molnar
2006-07-06  8:23                                 ` Ingo Molnar
2006-07-06  9:27                                 ` Heiko Carstens
2006-07-06  9:34                                   ` Arjan van de Ven
2006-07-06 11:59                                 ` linux-os (Dick Johnson)
2006-07-06 12:01                                   ` Arjan van de Ven
2006-07-06 12:29                                     ` linux-os (Dick Johnson)
2006-07-06 12:39                                       ` Arjan van de Ven
2006-07-06 13:39                                         ` J.A. Magallón
2006-07-06 13:43                                           ` Arjan van de Ven
2006-07-06 14:05                                           ` Chase Venters
2006-07-06 14:26                                           ` Andreas Schwab
2006-07-06 16:40                                       ` Nick Piggin
2006-07-06 23:19                                       ` David Schwartz
2006-07-06 18:15                                     ` Mark Lord
2006-07-06 19:15                                       ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-06 19:33                                         ` Chris Friesen
2006-07-06 19:37                                           ` Mark Lord
2006-07-06 20:28                                             ` Chris Friesen
2006-07-06 20:32                                               ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-06 19:38                                           ` Arjan van de Ven
2006-07-06 19:41                                           ` Måns Rullgård
2006-07-06 19:42                                           ` Jeff Garzik
2006-07-06 19:58                                           ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-06 20:27                                             ` Mark Lord
2006-07-06 20:40                                             ` Chris Friesen
2006-07-06 21:00                                               ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-08  8:40                                         ` Avi Kivity
2006-07-08  8:51                                           ` Arjan van de Ven
2006-07-08  9:20                                             ` Avi Kivity
2006-07-08  9:51                                               ` Arjan van de Ven
2006-07-08 10:18                                                 ` Avi Kivity
2006-07-08 10:28                                                   ` Thomas Gleixner
2006-07-09  4:19                                                   ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2006-07-09 12:47                                                     ` Avi Kivity
2006-07-09 19:16                                                       ` David Schwartz
2006-07-09 19:51                                                         ` Theodore Tso
2006-07-09 20:40                                                           ` [OT] 'volatile' in userspace Rutger Nijlunsing
2006-07-10  3:42                                                             ` Theodore Tso
2006-07-10 17:00                                                               ` Joshua Hudson
2006-07-10 17:54                                                                 ` Nick Piggin
2006-07-11  7:48                                                                   ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-07-11 11:53                                                                     ` Nick Piggin
2006-07-11 19:09                                                                       ` Björn Steinbrink
2006-07-11 20:55                                                                       ` Jeff Dike
2006-07-10 18:54                                                                 ` Jeff Dike
2006-07-10 20:09                                                                   ` Philippe Troin
2006-07-10 20:52                                                                     ` Jeff Dike
2006-07-06 16:07                                   ` [patch] spinlocks: remove 'volatile' Linus Torvalds
2006-07-06 16:13                                     ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-06 17:04                                       ` Jeff Garzik
2006-07-06 17:52                                       ` linux-os (Dick Johnson)
2006-07-06 18:00                                         ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-06 21:02                                           ` J.A. Magallón
2006-07-06 21:12                                             ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-06 18:10                                         ` Michael Buesch
2006-07-06 18:16                                         ` Chase Venters
2006-07-07 18:16                                         ` Krzysztof Halasa
2006-07-07 19:51                                           ` linux-os (Dick Johnson)
2006-07-07 20:25                                             ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-07 21:22                                               ` linux-os (Dick Johnson)
2006-07-07 21:48                                                 ` Chase Venters
2006-07-08 10:00                                                   ` Krzysztof Halasa
2006-07-08 13:41                                                     ` Chase Venters
2006-07-08 20:09                                                       ` Krzysztof Halasa
2006-07-08 20:40                                                         ` Chase Venters
2006-07-08 20:47                                                           ` Chase Venters
2006-07-09 10:57                                                           ` Krzysztof Halasa
2006-07-07 21:59                                                 ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-07 22:06                                                   ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-08 20:49                                                   ` Pavel Machek
2006-07-08 21:43                                                     ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-07 22:05                                                 ` J.A. Magallón
2006-07-07 22:22                                                   ` Chase Venters [this message]
2006-07-07 22:37                                                     ` J.A. Magallón
2006-07-08  9:33                                                       ` David Schwartz
2006-07-07 22:49                                                     ` J.A. Magallón
2006-07-07 22:59                                                       ` Vadim Lobanov
2006-07-07 23:18                                                       ` Chase Venters
2006-07-07 23:36                                                   ` Davide Libenzi
2006-07-07 22:09                                                 ` Ingo Molnar
2006-07-08  7:36                                                   ` Ingo Molnar
2006-07-07 20:39                                             ` Krzysztof Halasa
2006-07-07 23:06                                             ` Björn Steinbrink
2006-07-08  8:36                                             ` Avi Kivity
2006-07-06 19:32                                       ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-07-06 20:26                                         ` Jeremy Fitzhardinge
2006-07-06 20:55                                           ` Jan Engelhardt
2006-07-06 21:07                                             ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-06 19:56                                 ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-06 20:34                                   ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-08 22:50                                     ` Ralf Baechle
2006-07-09  3:09                                       ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-09  3:07                                     ` Keith Owens
2006-07-09  3:29                                       ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-09  3:43                                         ` Keith Owens
2006-07-09  3:58                                       ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-09  6:13                                         ` David Miller
2006-07-09 14:28                                         ` Roman Zippel
2006-07-09 15:27                                           ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-06  8:18                               ` [patch] lockdep: clean up completion initializer in smpboot.c Ingo Molnar
2006-07-06  8:23                               ` [patch] uninline init_waitqueue_*() functions Ingo Molnar
2006-07-06  9:02                                 ` Andrew Morton
2006-07-06  9:12                                   ` [patch] uninline init_waitqueue_head() Ingo Molnar
2006-07-05 20:45                   ` [patch] uninline init_waitqueue_*() functions Ingo Molnar
2006-07-05 10:37     ` Christoph Hellwig
2006-07-05 10:44       ` Andrew Morton
2006-07-05 10:46         ` Andrew Morton
2006-07-05 10:47         ` Ingo Molnar
2006-07-05  9:54 ` [patch] uninline init_waitqueue_*() functions, fix Ingo Molnar
2006-07-07 10:21 [patch] spinlocks: remove 'volatile' Chuck Ebbert
2006-07-07 17:09 ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-08  3:54 Albert Cahalan
2006-07-08  5:25 ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-08  6:39   ` Nick Piggin
2006-07-08 18:53     ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-08  9:45 ` Joe Korty
2006-07-08  9:52   ` Arjan van de Ven
2006-07-08  9:59   ` David Schwartz
2006-07-08 10:24   ` Thomas Gleixner
2006-07-08 15:49     ` Albert Cahalan
2006-07-08 18:31       ` Thomas Gleixner
2006-07-08 19:33         ` Albert Cahalan
2006-07-08 20:11           ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-09 21:10             ` Pavel Machek
2006-07-09 22:18               ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-10 16:25               ` marty fouts
2006-07-08 23:10           ` David Schwartz
2006-07-08 13:57   ` Andi Kleen
2006-07-08 19:13     ` Linus Torvalds
2006-07-08 10:45 ` Krzysztof Halasa
2006-07-08  6:12 trajce nedev
2006-07-08  6:19 ` Chase Venters
2006-07-08  6:45   ` trajce nedev
2006-07-08  6:58     ` Arjan van de Ven
2006-07-08  7:02     ` Vadim Lobanov
2006-07-08 13:46     ` Chase Venters
2006-07-09  4:39       ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2006-07-14  3:30       ` Steven Rostedt
2006-07-08 18:23 ` Linus Torvalds

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