From: Jeff Layton <jlayton@redhat.com>
To: "J. Bruce Fields" <bfields@fieldses.org>,
Christoph Hellwig <hch@infradead.org>
Cc: linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
linux-nfs@vger.kernel.org, linux-ext4@vger.kernel.org,
linux-btrfs@vger.kernel.org, linux-xfs@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: [RFC PATCH v1 00/30] fs: inode->i_version rework and optimization
Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2017 13:23:24 -0400 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <1490117004.2542.1.camel@redhat.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20170321163011.GA16666@fieldses.org>
On Tue, 2017-03-21 at 12:30 -0400, J. Bruce Fields wrote:
> On Tue, Mar 21, 2017 at 06:45:00AM -0700, Christoph Hellwig wrote:
> > On Mon, Mar 20, 2017 at 05:43:27PM -0400, J. Bruce Fields wrote:
> > > To me, the interesting question is whether this allows us to turn on
> > > i_version updates by default on xfs and ext4.
> >
> > XFS v5 file systems have it on by default.
>
> Great, thanks.
>
> > Although we'll still need to agree on the exact semantics of i_version
> > before it's going to be useful.
>
> Once it's figured out maybe we should write it up for a manpage that
> could be used if statx starts exposing it to userspace.
>
> A first attempt:
>
> - It's a u64.
>
> - It works for regular files and directories. (What about symlinks or
> other special types?)
>
> - It changes between two checks if and only if there were intervening
> data or metadata changes. The change will always be an increase, but
> the amount of the increase is meaningless.
> - NFS doesn't actually require that it increases, but I think it
> should. I assume 64 bits means we don't need a discussion of
> wraparound.
I thought NFS spec required that you be able to recognize old change
attributes so that they can be discarded. I could be wrong here though.
I'd have to go back and look through the spec to be sure.
> - AFS wants an actual counter: if you get i_version X, then
> write twice, then get i_version X+2, you're allowed to assume
> your writes were the only modifications. Let's ignore this
> for now. In the future if someone explains how to count
> operations, then we can extend the interface to tell the
> caller it can get those extra semantics.
>
> - It's durable; the above comparison still works if there were reboots
> between the two i_version checks.
> - I don't know how realistic this is--we may need to figure out
> if there's a weaker guarantee that's still useful. Do
> filesystems actually make ctime/mtime/i_version changes
> atomically with the changes that caused them? What if a
> change attribute is exposed to an NFS client but doesn't make
> it to disk, and then that value is reused after reboot?
>
Yeah, there could be atomicity there. If we bump i_version, we'll mark
the inode dirty and I think that will end up with the new i_version at
least being journalled before __mark_inode_dirty returns.
That said, I suppose it is possible for us to bump the counter, hand
that new counter value out to a NFS client and then the box crashes
before it makes it to the journal.
Not sure how big a problem that really is.
> Am I missing any issues?
>
No, I think you have it covered, and that's pretty much exactly what I
had in mind as far as semantics go. Thanks for writing it up!
--
Jeff Layton <jlayton@redhat.com>
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2017-03-21 17:24 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 87+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2016-12-21 17:03 [RFC PATCH v1 00/30] fs: inode->i_version rework and optimization Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 01/30] lustre: don't set f_version in ll_readdir Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 02/30] ecryptfs: remove unnecessary i_version bump Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 03/30] ceph: remove the bump of i_version Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 04/30] f2fs: don't bother setting i_version Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 05/30] hpfs: don't bother with the i_version counter Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 06/30] jfs: remove initialization of " Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 07/30] nilfs2: remove inode->i_version initialization Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 08/30] orangefs: remove initialization of i_version Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 09/30] reiserfs: remove unneeded i_version bump Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 10/30] ntfs: remove i_version handling Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 11/30] fs: new API for handling i_version Jeff Layton
2017-03-03 22:36 ` J. Bruce Fields
2017-03-04 0:09 ` Jeff Layton
2017-03-03 23:55 ` NeilBrown
2017-03-04 1:58 ` Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 12/30] fat: convert to new i_version API Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 13/30] affs: " Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 14/30] afs: " Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 15/30] btrfs: " Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 16/30] exofs: switch " Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 17/30] ext2: convert " Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 18/30] ext4: " Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 19/30] nfs: " Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 20/30] nfsd: " Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 21/30] ocfs2: " Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 22/30] ufs: use " Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 23/30] xfs: convert to " Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 24/30] IMA: switch IMA over " Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 25/30] fs: add a "force" parameter to inode_inc_iversion Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 26/30] fs: only set S_VERSION when updating times if it has been queried Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 27/30] xfs: avoid setting XFS_ILOG_CORE if i_version doesn't need incrementing Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 28/30] btrfs: only dirty the inode in btrfs_update_time if something was changed Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 29/30] fs: track whether the i_version has been queried with an i_state flag Jeff Layton
2017-03-04 0:03 ` NeilBrown
2017-03-04 0:43 ` Jeff Layton
2016-12-21 17:03 ` [RFC PATCH v1 30/30] fs: convert i_version counter over to an atomic64_t Jeff Layton
2016-12-22 8:38 ` Amir Goldstein
2016-12-22 13:27 ` Jeff Layton
2017-03-04 0:00 ` NeilBrown
2016-12-22 8:45 ` [RFC PATCH v1 00/30] fs: inode->i_version rework and optimization Christoph Hellwig
2016-12-22 14:42 ` Jeff Layton
2017-03-20 21:43 ` J. Bruce Fields
2017-03-21 13:45 ` Christoph Hellwig
2017-03-21 16:30 ` J. Bruce Fields
2017-03-21 17:23 ` Jeff Layton [this message]
2017-03-21 17:37 ` J. Bruce Fields
2017-03-21 17:51 ` J. Bruce Fields
2017-03-21 18:30 ` J. Bruce Fields
2017-03-21 18:46 ` Jeff Layton
2017-03-21 19:13 ` J. Bruce Fields
2017-03-21 21:54 ` Jeff Layton
2017-03-29 11:15 ` Jan Kara
2017-03-29 17:54 ` Jeff Layton
2017-03-29 23:41 ` Dave Chinner
2017-03-30 11:24 ` Jeff Layton
2017-04-04 18:38 ` J. Bruce Fields
2017-03-30 6:47 ` Jan Kara
2017-03-30 11:11 ` Jeff Layton
2017-03-30 16:12 ` J. Bruce Fields
2017-03-30 18:35 ` Jeff Layton
2017-03-30 21:11 ` Boaz Harrosh
2017-04-04 18:31 ` J. Bruce Fields
2017-04-05 1:43 ` NeilBrown
2017-04-05 8:05 ` Jan Kara
2017-04-05 18:14 ` J. Bruce Fields
2017-05-11 18:59 ` J. Bruce Fields
2017-05-11 22:22 ` NeilBrown
2017-05-12 16:21 ` J. Bruce Fields
2017-10-30 13:21 ` Jeff Layton
2017-05-12 8:27 ` Jan Kara
2017-05-12 15:56 ` J. Bruce Fields
2017-05-12 11:01 ` Jeff Layton
2017-05-12 15:57 ` J. Bruce Fields
2017-04-06 1:12 ` NeilBrown
2017-04-06 7:22 ` Jan Kara
2017-04-05 17:26 ` J. Bruce Fields
2017-04-01 23:05 ` Dave Chinner
2017-04-03 14:00 ` Jan Kara
2017-04-04 12:34 ` Dave Chinner
2017-04-04 17:53 ` J. Bruce Fields
2017-04-05 1:26 ` NeilBrown
2017-03-21 21:45 ` Dave Chinner
2017-03-22 19:53 ` Jeff Layton
2017-03-03 23:00 ` J. Bruce Fields
2017-03-04 0:53 ` Jeff Layton
2017-03-08 17:29 ` J. Bruce Fields
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