From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S261161AbVF1UyE (ORCPT ); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 16:54:04 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id S261634AbVF1UvD (ORCPT ); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 16:51:03 -0400 Received: from nysv.org ([213.157.66.145]:11219 "EHLO nysv.org") by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S261270AbVF1Ur1 (ORCPT ); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 16:47:27 -0400 Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2005 23:47:09 +0300 To: Horst von Brand Cc: David Masover , Alan Cox , Hans Reiser , Jeff Garzik , Christoph Hellwig , Andrew Morton , Linux Kernel Mailing List , ReiserFS List Subject: Re: reiser4 plugins Message-ID: <20050628204709.GH11013@nysv.org> References: <20050627092138.GD11013@nysv.org> <200506281344.j5SDixiH003441@laptop11.inf.utfsm.cl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="DEfZqDS1MPR2ysog" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200506281344.j5SDixiH003441@laptop11.inf.utfsm.cl> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i From: mjt@nysv.org (Markus =?ISO-8859-1?Q?=20T=F6rnqvist?=) Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org --DEfZqDS1MPR2ysog Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Tue, Jun 28, 2005 at 09:44:59AM -0400, Horst von Brand wrote: > >No. But just relying on perfect hardware and concientious sysadmins is >reckless. Hardware /is/ flaky, sysadmins /are/ (sometimes) lazy (and >besides, today they are increasingly just plain Joe Sixpack users). Also, >backing up a few hundred GiB is /not/ fun, and then keeping track of all >the backups is messy. Even home users have started to set up raid mirrors at home now that disk space is cheap. That's a step in the right direction, I suppose, with hardware never being good. Taking backups in an environment where you need a few hundred GiB backed up is not that difficult. Get a separate, redundant box with a big tape changer and drop periodical backups off at your bank's vault. Get a separate, very reduntant box, with a truckload of proven=20 drives in a separate raid box and run your stuff there. Get both of the above. If Joe Sixpack loses his mp3 collection, I don't really care, nor should anyone else. Anything important enough to care about is easy enough to back up. Always. Arrogance? Maybe. >Also, I'm not claiming that they are /solely/ responsible, but not having >the filesystem fall apart utterly every time some bug breaths on it /is/ a >requirement. Reiserfs does not fall apart utterly every time some bug breaths on it. >> *still trying to understand how that can be* >You haven't been around too much yet, do you? Rather I take backups, buy better hardware and understand there's a risk involved. Computers as a complete set can't be trusted, you can only make the best accomodations you can. --=20 mjt --DEfZqDS1MPR2ysog Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: Digital signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.5 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFCwbdNIqNMpVm8OhwRAg7yAJsHTe6asb4HRSNSAUFIXinO1MmU+ACfaHiT HARynNEimEs+CwJrIgjX7SM= =pYYj -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --DEfZqDS1MPR2ysog-- From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: mjt@nysv.org Markus =?unknown-8bit?q?T=F6rnqvist?= Subject: Re: reiser4 plugins Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2005 23:47:09 +0300 Message-ID: <20050628204709.GH11013@nysv.org> References: <20050627092138.GD11013@nysv.org> <200506281344.j5SDixiH003441@laptop11.inf.utfsm.cl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="DEfZqDS1MPR2ysog" Return-path: list-help: list-unsubscribe: list-post: Errors-To: flx@namesys.com Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200506281344.j5SDixiH003441@laptop11.inf.utfsm.cl> List-Id: To: Horst von Brand Cc: David Masover , Alan Cox , Hans Reiser , Jeff Garzik , Christoph Hellwig , Andrew Morton , Linux Kernel Mailing List , ReiserFS List --DEfZqDS1MPR2ysog Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Tue, Jun 28, 2005 at 09:44:59AM -0400, Horst von Brand wrote: > >No. But just relying on perfect hardware and concientious sysadmins is >reckless. Hardware /is/ flaky, sysadmins /are/ (sometimes) lazy (and >besides, today they are increasingly just plain Joe Sixpack users). Also, >backing up a few hundred GiB is /not/ fun, and then keeping track of all >the backups is messy. Even home users have started to set up raid mirrors at home now that disk space is cheap. That's a step in the right direction, I suppose, with hardware never being good. Taking backups in an environment where you need a few hundred GiB backed up is not that difficult. Get a separate, redundant box with a big tape changer and drop periodical backups off at your bank's vault. Get a separate, very reduntant box, with a truckload of proven=20 drives in a separate raid box and run your stuff there. Get both of the above. If Joe Sixpack loses his mp3 collection, I don't really care, nor should anyone else. Anything important enough to care about is easy enough to back up. Always. Arrogance? Maybe. >Also, I'm not claiming that they are /solely/ responsible, but not having >the filesystem fall apart utterly every time some bug breaths on it /is/ a >requirement. Reiserfs does not fall apart utterly every time some bug breaths on it. >> *still trying to understand how that can be* >You haven't been around too much yet, do you? Rather I take backups, buy better hardware and understand there's a risk involved. Computers as a complete set can't be trusted, you can only make the best accomodations you can. --=20 mjt --DEfZqDS1MPR2ysog Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: Digital signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.5 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFCwbdNIqNMpVm8OhwRAg7yAJsHTe6asb4HRSNSAUFIXinO1MmU+ACfaHiT HARynNEimEs+CwJrIgjX7SM= =pYYj -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --DEfZqDS1MPR2ysog--