From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Josef Bacik Subject: Re: [PATCH] ext4: turn on i_version updates by default Date: Mon, 14 May 2012 14:51:38 -0400 Message-ID: <20120514185138.GB1894@localhost.localdomain> References: <20120514140618.GA29902@fieldses.org> <9124E59E-2479-4C32-A528-3237B48DEC01@dilger.ca> <20120514152334.GB29902@fieldses.org> <14B38D68-FAE4-444A-BCD9-7EBF7E1BBFE1@dilger.ca> <20120514175822.GC1439@thunk.org> <20120514183316.GA1894@localhost.localdomain> <20120514144802.679551fa@corrin.poochiereds.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Cc: Josef Bacik , "Ted Ts'o" , Andreas Dilger , "J. Bruce Fields" , "linux-ext4-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org" , "linux-nfs-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org" , "linux-fsdevel-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org" To: Jeff Layton Return-path: Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20120514144802.679551fa-4QP7MXygkU+dMjc06nkz3ljfA9RmPOcC@public.gmane.org> Sender: linux-nfs-owner-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org List-Id: linux-fsdevel.vger.kernel.org On Mon, May 14, 2012 at 02:48:02PM -0400, Jeff Layton wrote: > On Mon, 14 May 2012 14:33:17 -0400 > Josef Bacik wrote: > > > On Mon, May 14, 2012 at 01:58:22PM -0400, Ted Ts'o wrote: > > > On Mon, May 14, 2012 at 11:27:42AM -0600, Andreas Dilger wrote: > > > > > And if it at all possible I'd rather have it be something that Just > > > > > Works rather than something that requires extra configuration. > > > > > > > > Sure, but this is only useful for NFSv4, but costs everyone using > > > > ext4 continuous overhead, so it isn't a clear-cut case to enable > > > > the version just on the thought that NFS might one day be used on > > > > any particular filesystem. > > > > > > It's not a matter of "NFSv4 might one day be used"; if we don't turn > > > on i_version updates until the file system is actually exported via > > > NFSv4, there would be no deleterious effects. > > > > > > I always thought that was going to be the plan; that there would be > > > some flag that would be set in struct super_block when the file system > > > was exported that would enable i_version updates. > > > > > > That way we satisfy the "no extra configuration" needed requirement, > > > which I agree is ideal, but we also don't waste any CPU overhead if > > > the file system is not exported via NFSv4. I tried to implement > > > anything along these lines because I don't care enough, and I don't > > > use NFSv4 personally.... > > > > > > > Seems like this is just a bad place to be doing inode_inc_iversion(). If > > MS_IVERSION is set we will update iversion in file_update_time() and then call > > mark_inode_dirty which will jack up the iversion again. In btrfs we just change > > it wherever we change ctime and that way you don't really notice the extra > > overhead since you are doing it in paths where you are changing a bunch of stuff > > in the inode already, and mostly where you hold the i_mutex so you aren't going > > to be hitting any contention on the i_lock. Thanks, > > > > Well, you do incur a bit more overhead in btrfs too: > > ------------------[snip]---------------------- > if (!timespec_equal(&inode->i_mtime, &now)) > sync_it = S_MTIME; > > if (!timespec_equal(&inode->i_ctime, &now)) > sync_it |= S_CTIME; > > if (IS_I_VERSION(inode)) > sync_it |= S_VERSION; > ------------------[snip]---------------------- > > So you'll end up with sync_it being 0 if i_version updates are > disabled, and the mtime/ctime didn't visibly change. > > If your jiffies are coarse-grained enough, then you might get "lucky" > rather often, but is that a case worth optimizing for? How often does > it happen that you mark the inode dirty, flush it to disk and then > re-mark it dirty within the same jiffy? > Well sync_it just means do we need to call mark_inode_dirty, not necessarily do we need to write it to disk, so you are just updating a field in memory. Now if your jiffies are coarse enough for you to not notice the ctime update then yes you are incurring an extra lock/inc/unlock, but this is called in the write path where you are going to do much more latency inducting operations than locking and unlocking a generally uncontended spin lock. Thanks, Josef -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-nfs" in the body of a message to majordomo-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: linux-nfs-owner@vger.kernel.org Received: from mx1.redhat.com ([209.132.183.28]:11867 "EHLO mx1.redhat.com" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S932073Ab2ENSvp (ORCPT ); Mon, 14 May 2012 14:51:45 -0400 Date: Mon, 14 May 2012 14:51:38 -0400 From: Josef Bacik To: Jeff Layton Cc: Josef Bacik , "Ted Ts'o" , Andreas Dilger , "J. Bruce Fields" , "linux-ext4@vger.kernel.org" , "linux-nfs@vger.kernel.org" , "linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org" Subject: Re: [PATCH] ext4: turn on i_version updates by default Message-ID: <20120514185138.GB1894@localhost.localdomain> References: <20120514140618.GA29902@fieldses.org> <9124E59E-2479-4C32-A528-3237B48DEC01@dilger.ca> <20120514152334.GB29902@fieldses.org> <14B38D68-FAE4-444A-BCD9-7EBF7E1BBFE1@dilger.ca> <20120514175822.GC1439@thunk.org> <20120514183316.GA1894@localhost.localdomain> <20120514144802.679551fa@corrin.poochiereds.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii In-Reply-To: <20120514144802.679551fa@corrin.poochiereds.net> Sender: linux-nfs-owner@vger.kernel.org List-ID: On Mon, May 14, 2012 at 02:48:02PM -0400, Jeff Layton wrote: > On Mon, 14 May 2012 14:33:17 -0400 > Josef Bacik wrote: > > > On Mon, May 14, 2012 at 01:58:22PM -0400, Ted Ts'o wrote: > > > On Mon, May 14, 2012 at 11:27:42AM -0600, Andreas Dilger wrote: > > > > > And if it at all possible I'd rather have it be something that Just > > > > > Works rather than something that requires extra configuration. > > > > > > > > Sure, but this is only useful for NFSv4, but costs everyone using > > > > ext4 continuous overhead, so it isn't a clear-cut case to enable > > > > the version just on the thought that NFS might one day be used on > > > > any particular filesystem. > > > > > > It's not a matter of "NFSv4 might one day be used"; if we don't turn > > > on i_version updates until the file system is actually exported via > > > NFSv4, there would be no deleterious effects. > > > > > > I always thought that was going to be the plan; that there would be > > > some flag that would be set in struct super_block when the file system > > > was exported that would enable i_version updates. > > > > > > That way we satisfy the "no extra configuration" needed requirement, > > > which I agree is ideal, but we also don't waste any CPU overhead if > > > the file system is not exported via NFSv4. I tried to implement > > > anything along these lines because I don't care enough, and I don't > > > use NFSv4 personally.... > > > > > > > Seems like this is just a bad place to be doing inode_inc_iversion(). If > > MS_IVERSION is set we will update iversion in file_update_time() and then call > > mark_inode_dirty which will jack up the iversion again. In btrfs we just change > > it wherever we change ctime and that way you don't really notice the extra > > overhead since you are doing it in paths where you are changing a bunch of stuff > > in the inode already, and mostly where you hold the i_mutex so you aren't going > > to be hitting any contention on the i_lock. Thanks, > > > > Well, you do incur a bit more overhead in btrfs too: > > ------------------[snip]---------------------- > if (!timespec_equal(&inode->i_mtime, &now)) > sync_it = S_MTIME; > > if (!timespec_equal(&inode->i_ctime, &now)) > sync_it |= S_CTIME; > > if (IS_I_VERSION(inode)) > sync_it |= S_VERSION; > ------------------[snip]---------------------- > > So you'll end up with sync_it being 0 if i_version updates are > disabled, and the mtime/ctime didn't visibly change. > > If your jiffies are coarse-grained enough, then you might get "lucky" > rather often, but is that a case worth optimizing for? How often does > it happen that you mark the inode dirty, flush it to disk and then > re-mark it dirty within the same jiffy? > Well sync_it just means do we need to call mark_inode_dirty, not necessarily do we need to write it to disk, so you are just updating a field in memory. Now if your jiffies are coarse enough for you to not notice the ctime update then yes you are incurring an extra lock/inc/unlock, but this is called in the write path where you are going to do much more latency inducting operations than locking and unlocking a generally uncontended spin lock. Thanks, Josef