From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1754116AbcHVWnA (ORCPT ); Mon, 22 Aug 2016 18:43:00 -0400 Received: from mail.kernel.org ([198.145.29.136]:35458 "EHLO mail.kernel.org" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1751168AbcHVWm5 (ORCPT ); Mon, 22 Aug 2016 18:42:57 -0400 Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2016 00:42:49 +0200 From: Sebastian Reichel To: "H. Nikolaus Schaller" Cc: One Thousand Gnomes , Oleksij Rempel , Rob Herring , Greg Kroah-Hartman , Marcel Holtmann , Jiri Slaby , Pavel Machek , Peter Hurley , NeilBrown , Arnd Bergmann , Linus Walleij , "open list:BLUETOOTH DRIVERS" , "linux-serial@vger.kernel.org" , "linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org" Subject: Re: [RFC PATCH 0/3] UART slave device bus Message-ID: <20160822224247.vdh3plda6dxelvzw@earth> References: <20160818202900.hyvm4hfxedifuefn@earth> <20160819052125.ze5zilppwoe3f2lx@earth> <53A846F1-33E5-48C3-B3A6-DB251661CDD5@goldelico.com> <20160820143405.04303834@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk> <20160822203947.ksxwnvzhc3tpnnx7@earth> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="ujbmmsf7oj6qiqrs" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.6.2-neo (2016-07-23) Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org --ujbmmsf7oj6qiqrs Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, On Mon, Aug 22, 2016 at 11:23:26PM +0200, H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote: > > Am 22.08.2016 um 22:39 schrieb Sebastian Reichel : > >=20 > > Hi, > >=20 > > On Sun, Aug 21, 2016 at 09:50:57AM +0200, H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote: > >>> Am 20.08.2016 um 15:34 schrieb One Thousand Gnomes : > >>>> What it is not about are UART/RS232 converters connected through USB= or virtual > >>>> serial ports created for WWAN modems (e.g. /dev/ttyACM, /dev/ttyHSO)= =2E Or BT devices > >>>> connected through USB (even if they also run HCI protocol). > >>>=20 > >>> It actually has to be about both because you will find the exact same > >>> device wired via USB SSIC/HSIC to a USB UART or via a classic UART. N= ot is > >>> it just about embedded boards. > >>=20 > >> Not necessarily. > >>=20 > >> We often have two interface options for exactly the sam sensor chips. = They can be connected > >> either through SPI or I2C. Which means that there is a core driver for= the chip and two different > >> transport glue components (see e.g. iio/accel/bmc150). > >>=20 > >> This does not require I2C to be able to handle SPI or vice versa or pr= ovide a common API. > >=20 > > I don't understand this comparison. I2C and SPI are different > > protocols, >=20 > Yes, they are different on protocol level, but on both you transfer block= s of data from/to a slave device > which usually can be addressed. And for some chips they are just two slig= htly alternative serial interfaces. >=20 > > while native UART and USB-connected UART are both UART. >=20 > I see what you mean, but kernel divides between directly connected UART a= nd USB-connected UART. >=20 > drivers/usb/serial/ vs. drivers/tty/serial/ >=20 > to implement two different groups of UARTs. Although on user space level = they are harmonized again. > This is why I compare with i2c and spi. But each such comparison is not p= erfect. >=20 > Anyways, to me it looks as if everybody wants to make the solution work f= or usb-uarts as well > (although I still would like to see a real world use-case). >=20 > >=20 > >> And most Bluetooth devices I know have either UART or a direct > >> USB interface. So in the USB case there is no need to connect > >> it through some USB-UART bridge and treat it as an UART at all. > >=20 > > I think having support for USB-UART dongles is useful for > > driver development and testing on non-embedded HW. >=20 > Hm. I assume you mean the Bluetooth situation where both, embedded UART > connected chips and USB dongles are available. No. I mean I have some serial device, which is connected to the embedded UART, but I also have a standalone version. For driver development I can just use my standalone serial device, connect it to an USB-UART and develop the driver on non embedded HW. Then I can use the same driver on my embedded platform and it works, since it uses the same API. For e.g. I2C this works perfectly fine. I already did this with the I2C interface exposed on my notebook's VGA port. > I am not a specialist for such things, but I think you have three > options to connect bluetooth: >=20 > a) SoC-UART <-> BT-Chip-UART-port > b) USB-UART (FT232, PL2303 etc.) <-> BT-Chip-UART-port > c) USB <-> BT-Chip-USB-port (not UART involved at all) > > Case c) IMHO means you anyways need a special USB driver for the BT-Chip = connected > through USB and plugging it into a non-embedded USB port does not automat= ically > show it as a tty interface. So you can't use it for testing the UART driv= ers. >=20 > BTW: the Wi2Wi W2CBW003 chip comes in two firmware variants: one for UART= and > one for USB. So they are also not exchangeable. Yes, let's ignore option c). I'm talking about UART only. If the chip has native USB support, then that's a different driver. Note, that for more complex drivers it may become possible to use the same high-level driver via regmap at some point. Not sure if this kind of HW exists, though. > Variant b) is IMHO of no practical relevance (but I may be wrong) > because it would mean to add some costly FT232 or PL2302 chip > where a different firmware variant works with direct USB > connection. Well for some chips there is not native USB support. But my scenario was about development. Let's say I have a serial-chip and I want to develop a driver for it. It would be nice if I can develop the driver with a USB-UART and then use it on my embedded system. There are usb-serial devices, which could benefit from support btw. I would find it really useful, if the Dangerous Prototype's Bus Pirate would expose native /dev/i2c and /dev/spi and it's based on FT232. > So to me it looks as if you need to develop different low-level > drivers anyways. No. You say, that option b) is irrelevant and assume, that every serial chip also has native USB support. -- Sebastian --ujbmmsf7oj6qiqrs Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1 iQIcBAEBCgAGBQJXu3/dAAoJENju1/PIO/qamhMP/0/9leORfw1QA9CDbLQYGyW0 g1OOaANGvP8PH49x0kSl9NSXPwU7+KizSK0k3V0ZnAUQ8NHJyeakuDyck15ezyg8 zqeXXcmC+iDO7LDGOg5WwdupHxZiYYPZeBi0C0RxbmNA4yyH/30WZJv01WZGYOTa V1GjC/F/VU1It1oVLEfrXfsklbUQUpsANx5MNl9PzKZRXYzFuBVmJ4Hd4I5apupO kpfaCMw+ZXiMgLDsoC5juty0MmN4guVtD8ie/t23ImQd8RE1lqFY9d4TQqjqpmCO 2FOk1frVyEffVTjLO8l9EbbEWaVunmiUIDDjPcYND5l3xL17TpoT7KgHH1Vkm9R4 dteOpY8uLbxugG0VMzd02q+iSHu9Q7i+t97+J5IqsQVOfr21rxdcDzTk4ioVUIZU i7cJBhvMX6fNzVd96G03A3igDAsyRbSOopmp5NGor4LEUwUpT3M+8QqlWjrzHeUk SGeYwOPzF/kBMPVfr2au3Dle6h6UJMe15CPTVXS5KaJGvT9L+CgneDlv4eI4uGVF EG3zsj+Qyff+rOZUrEVYM1pIUUJEFwMb9a/bNBXiHHDUKWUHAvC2iLvPmwKvLaqd B9dJ/7ZCltcRRQIWqCPr6R6lOU/DtB+8HnXZ3ThIEW/XoPu3ai0OG8NugjUwYxw1 jf9NSZH+0rL5HNxSaTui =Zbkn -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --ujbmmsf7oj6qiqrs--