From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1754193AbdCPWLh (ORCPT ); Thu, 16 Mar 2017 18:11:37 -0400 Received: from atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz ([195.113.26.193]:39226 "EHLO atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1752681AbdCPWLe (ORCPT ); Thu, 16 Mar 2017 18:11:34 -0400 Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2017 23:11:22 +0100 From: Pavel Machek To: Mauro Carvalho Chehab Cc: Hans Verkuil , Sakari Ailus , Russell King - ARM Linux , Steve Longerbeam , robh+dt@kernel.org, mark.rutland@arm.com, shawnguo@kernel.org, kernel@pengutronix.de, fabio.estevam@nxp.com, mchehab@kernel.org, nick@shmanahar.org, markus.heiser@darmarIT.de, p.zabel@pengutronix.de, laurent.pinchart+renesas@ideasonboard.com, bparrot@ti.com, geert@linux-m68k.org, arnd@arndb.de, sudipm.mukherjee@gmail.com, minghsiu.tsai@mediatek.com, tiffany.lin@mediatek.com, jean-christophe.trotin@st.com, horms+renesas@verge.net.au, niklas.soderlund+renesas@ragnatech.se, robert.jarzmik@free.fr, songjun.wu@microchip.com, andrew-ct.chen@mediatek.com, gregkh@linuxfoundation.org, shuah@kernel.org, sakari.ailus@linux.intel.com, devicetree@vger.kernel.org, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org, linux-media@vger.kernel.org, devel@driverdev.osuosl.org, Steve Longerbeam , Jacek Anaszewski Subject: Re: media / v4l2-mc: wishlist for complex cameras (was Re: [PATCH v4 14/36] [media] v4l2-mc: add a function to inherit controls from a pipeline) Message-ID: <20170316221122.GA31588@amd> References: <20170310223714.GI3220@valkosipuli.retiisi.org.uk> <20170311082549.576531d0@vento.lan> <20170313124621.GA10701@valkosipuli.retiisi.org.uk> <20170314004533.3b3cd44b@vento.lan> <20170314072143.498cde9b@vento.lan> <20170314223254.GA7141@amd> <20170314215420.6fc63c67@vento.lan> <20170315180421.GA10206@amd> <20170315172627.6b7cc955@vento.lan> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="bg08WKrSYDhXBjb5" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20170315172627.6b7cc955@vento.lan> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.23 (2014-03-12) Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org --bg08WKrSYDhXBjb5 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi! > > > > mplayer is useful for testing... but that one already works (after = you > > > > setup the pipeline, and configure exposure/gain). > > > >=20 > > > > But thats useful for testing, not really for production. Image will= be > > > > out of focus and with wrong white balance. > > > >=20 > > > > What I would really like is an application to get still photos. For > > > > taking pictures with manual settings we need > > > >=20 > > > > a) units for controls: user wants to focus on 1m, and take picture > > > > with ISO200, 1/125 sec. We should also tell him that lens is f/5.6 = and > > > > focal length is 20mm with 5mm chip. > > > >=20 > > > > But... autofocus/autogain would really be good to have. Thus we nee= d: > > > >=20 > > > > b) for each frame, we need exposure settings and focus position at > > > > time frame was taken. Otherwise autofocus/autogain will be too > > > > slow. At least focus position is going to be tricky -- either kernel > > > > would have to compute focus position for us (not trivial) or we'd n= eed > > > > enough information to compute it in userspace. > > > >=20 > > > > There are more problems: hardware-accelerated preview is not trivial > > > > to set up (and I'm unsure if it can be done in generic way). Still > > > > photos application needs to switch resolutions between preview and > > > > photo capture. Probably hardware-accelerated histograms are needed = for > > > > white balance, auto gain and auto focus, .... > > > >=20 > > > > It seems like there's a _lot_ of stuff to be done before we have > > > > useful support for complex cameras... =20 > > >=20 > > > Taking still pictures using a hardware-accelerated preview is > > > a sophisticated use case. I don't know any userspace application > > > that does that. Ok, several allow taking snapshots, by simply > > > storing the image of the current frame. =20 > >=20 > > Well, there are applications that take still pictures. Android has > > one. Maemo has another. Then there's fcam-dev. Its open source; with > > modified kernel it is fully usable. I have version that runs on recent > > nearly-mainline on N900.=20 >=20 > Hmm... it seems that FCam is specific for N900: > http://fcam.garage.maemo.org/ >=20 > If so, then we have here just the opposite problem, if want it to be > used as a generic application, as very likely it requires OMAP3-specific > graph/subdevs. Well... there's quick and great version on maemo.org. I do have local version (still somehow N900-specific), but it no longer uses hardware histogram/sharpness support. Should be almost generic. > > So yes, I'd like solution for problems a) and b). =2E..but it has camera parameters hardcoded (problem a) and slow (problem b).=20 > > Question is if camera without autofocus is usable. I'd say "not > > really".qv4l2 >=20 > That actually depends on the sensor and how focus is adjusted. >=20 > I'm testing right now this camera module for RPi: > https://www.raspberrypi.org/products/camera-module-v2/ >=20 > I might be wrong, but this sensor doesn't seem to have auto-focus. > Instead, it seems to use a wide-angle lens. So, except when the > object is too close, the focus look OK. Well, cameras without autofocus are somehow usable without autofocus. But cameras with autofocus don't work too well without one. > > If we really want to go that way (is not modifying library to access > > the right files quite easy?), I believe non-confusing option would be > > to have '/dev/video0 -- omap3 camera for legacy applications' which > > would include all the controls. >=20 > Yeah, keeping /dev/video0 reserved for generic applications is something > that could work. Not sure how easy would be to implement it. Plus advanced applications would just ignore /dev/video0.. and not be confu= sed. > > > > > > You can get Nokia N900 on aliexpress. If not, they are still av= ailable > > > > between people :-) =20 > > >=20 > > > I have one. Unfortunately, I never had a chance to use it, as the dis= play > > > stopped working one week after I get it. =20 > >=20 > > Well, I guess the easiest option is to just get another one :-). >=20 > :-) Well, I guess very few units of N900 was sold in Brazil. Importing > one is too expensive, due to taxes. Try to ask at local mailing list. Those machines were quite common. > > But otoh -- N900 is quite usable without the screen. 0xffff tool can > > be used to boot the kernel, then you can use nfsroot and usb > > networking. It also has serial port (over strange > > connector). Connected over ssh over usb network is actually how I do > > most of the v4l work. >=20 > If you pass me the pointers, I can try it when I have some time. Ok, I guess I'll do that in private email. > Anyway, I got myself an ISEE IGEPv2, with the expansion board: > https://www.isee.biz/products/igep-processor-boards/igepv2-dm3730 > https://www.isee.biz/products/igep-expansion-boards/igepv2-expansion >=20 > The expansion board comes with a tvp5150 analog TV demod. So, with > this device, I can simply connect it to a composite input signal. > I have some sources here that I can use to test it. Well... it looks like TV capture is a "solved" problem. Taking useful photos is what is hard... Pavel --=20 (english) http://www.livejournal.com/~pavelmachek (cesky, pictures) http://atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz/~pavel/picture/horses/blo= g.html --bg08WKrSYDhXBjb5 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: Digital signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1 iEYEARECAAYFAljLDYoACgkQMOfwapXb+vLuxgCgioDKBFPW0CY5+q+9qy7KLVu+ YXsAnA1T4q6VZAJcB0AR0khbSR5/eSKo =A/Nh -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --bg08WKrSYDhXBjb5-- From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Pavel Machek Subject: Re: media / v4l2-mc: wishlist for complex cameras (was Re: [PATCH v4 14/36] [media] v4l2-mc: add a function to inherit controls from a pipeline) Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2017 23:11:22 +0100 Message-ID: <20170316221122.GA31588@amd> References: <20170310223714.GI3220@valkosipuli.retiisi.org.uk> <20170311082549.576531d0@vento.lan> <20170313124621.GA10701@valkosipuli.retiisi.org.uk> <20170314004533.3b3cd44b@vento.lan> <20170314072143.498cde9b@vento.lan> <20170314223254.GA7141@amd> <20170314215420.6fc63c67@vento.lan> <20170315180421.GA10206@amd> <20170315172627.6b7cc955@vento.lan> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============6309288828561686480==" Return-path: In-Reply-To: <20170315172627.6b7cc955@vento.lan> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: driverdev-devel-bounces@linuxdriverproject.org Sender: "devel" To: Mauro Carvalho Chehab Cc: mark.rutland@arm.com, andrew-ct.chen@mediatek.com, minghsiu.tsai@mediatek.com, sakari.ailus@linux.intel.com, nick@shmanahar.org, songjun.wu@microchip.com, Hans Verkuil , Steve Longerbeam , robert.jarzmik@free.fr, devel@driverdev.osuosl.org, markus.heiser@darmarIT.de, laurent.pinchart+renesas@ideasonboard.com, shuah@kernel.org, Russell King - ARM Linux , geert@linux-m68k.org, Steve Longerbeam , linux-media@vger.kernel.org, devicetree@vger.kernel.org, kernel@pengutronix.de, arnd@arndb.de, mchehab@kernel.org, bparrot@ti.com, robh+dt@kernel.org, horms+renesas@verge.net.au, tiffany.lin@mediatek.com, Jacek Anaszewski , linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org, niklas.soderlund+renesas@ragnatech.se, gregkh@linuxfoundation.org, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, Sakar List-Id: devicetree@vger.kernel.org --===============6309288828561686480== Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="bg08WKrSYDhXBjb5" Content-Disposition: inline --bg08WKrSYDhXBjb5 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi! > > > > mplayer is useful for testing... but that one already works (after = you > > > > setup the pipeline, and configure exposure/gain). > > > >=20 > > > > But thats useful for testing, not really for production. Image will= be > > > > out of focus and with wrong white balance. > > > >=20 > > > > What I would really like is an application to get still photos. For > > > > taking pictures with manual settings we need > > > >=20 > > > > a) units for controls: user wants to focus on 1m, and take picture > > > > with ISO200, 1/125 sec. We should also tell him that lens is f/5.6 = and > > > > focal length is 20mm with 5mm chip. > > > >=20 > > > > But... autofocus/autogain would really be good to have. Thus we nee= d: > > > >=20 > > > > b) for each frame, we need exposure settings and focus position at > > > > time frame was taken. Otherwise autofocus/autogain will be too > > > > slow. At least focus position is going to be tricky -- either kernel > > > > would have to compute focus position for us (not trivial) or we'd n= eed > > > > enough information to compute it in userspace. > > > >=20 > > > > There are more problems: hardware-accelerated preview is not trivial > > > > to set up (and I'm unsure if it can be done in generic way). Still > > > > photos application needs to switch resolutions between preview and > > > > photo capture. Probably hardware-accelerated histograms are needed = for > > > > white balance, auto gain and auto focus, .... > > > >=20 > > > > It seems like there's a _lot_ of stuff to be done before we have > > > > useful support for complex cameras... =20 > > >=20 > > > Taking still pictures using a hardware-accelerated preview is > > > a sophisticated use case. I don't know any userspace application > > > that does that. Ok, several allow taking snapshots, by simply > > > storing the image of the current frame. =20 > >=20 > > Well, there are applications that take still pictures. Android has > > one. Maemo has another. Then there's fcam-dev. Its open source; with > > modified kernel it is fully usable. I have version that runs on recent > > nearly-mainline on N900.=20 >=20 > Hmm... it seems that FCam is specific for N900: > http://fcam.garage.maemo.org/ >=20 > If so, then we have here just the opposite problem, if want it to be > used as a generic application, as very likely it requires OMAP3-specific > graph/subdevs. Well... there's quick and great version on maemo.org. I do have local version (still somehow N900-specific), but it no longer uses hardware histogram/sharpness support. Should be almost generic. > > So yes, I'd like solution for problems a) and b). =2E..but it has camera parameters hardcoded (problem a) and slow (problem b).=20 > > Question is if camera without autofocus is usable. I'd say "not > > really".qv4l2 >=20 > That actually depends on the sensor and how focus is adjusted. >=20 > I'm testing right now this camera module for RPi: > https://www.raspberrypi.org/products/camera-module-v2/ >=20 > I might be wrong, but this sensor doesn't seem to have auto-focus. > Instead, it seems to use a wide-angle lens. So, except when the > object is too close, the focus look OK. Well, cameras without autofocus are somehow usable without autofocus. But cameras with autofocus don't work too well without one. > > If we really want to go that way (is not modifying library to access > > the right files quite easy?), I believe non-confusing option would be > > to have '/dev/video0 -- omap3 camera for legacy applications' which > > would include all the controls. >=20 > Yeah, keeping /dev/video0 reserved for generic applications is something > that could work. Not sure how easy would be to implement it. Plus advanced applications would just ignore /dev/video0.. and not be confu= sed. > > > > > > You can get Nokia N900 on aliexpress. If not, they are still av= ailable > > > > between people :-) =20 > > >=20 > > > I have one. Unfortunately, I never had a chance to use it, as the dis= play > > > stopped working one week after I get it. =20 > >=20 > > Well, I guess the easiest option is to just get another one :-). >=20 > :-) Well, I guess very few units of N900 was sold in Brazil. Importing > one is too expensive, due to taxes. Try to ask at local mailing list. Those machines were quite common. > > But otoh -- N900 is quite usable without the screen. 0xffff tool can > > be used to boot the kernel, then you can use nfsroot and usb > > networking. It also has serial port (over strange > > connector). Connected over ssh over usb network is actually how I do > > most of the v4l work. >=20 > If you pass me the pointers, I can try it when I have some time. Ok, I guess I'll do that in private email. > Anyway, I got myself an ISEE IGEPv2, with the expansion board: > https://www.isee.biz/products/igep-processor-boards/igepv2-dm3730 > https://www.isee.biz/products/igep-expansion-boards/igepv2-expansion >=20 > The expansion board comes with a tvp5150 analog TV demod. So, with > this device, I can simply connect it to a composite input signal. > I have some sources here that I can use to test it. Well... it looks like TV capture is a "solved" problem. Taking useful photos is what is hard... Pavel --=20 (english) http://www.livejournal.com/~pavelmachek (cesky, pictures) http://atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz/~pavel/picture/horses/blo= g.html --bg08WKrSYDhXBjb5 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: Digital signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1 iEYEARECAAYFAljLDYoACgkQMOfwapXb+vLuxgCgioDKBFPW0CY5+q+9qy7KLVu+ YXsAnA1T4q6VZAJcB0AR0khbSR5/eSKo =A/Nh -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --bg08WKrSYDhXBjb5-- --===============6309288828561686480== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ devel mailing list devel@linuxdriverproject.org http://driverdev.linuxdriverproject.org/mailman/listinfo/driverdev-devel --===============6309288828561686480==-- From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: pavel@ucw.cz (Pavel Machek) Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2017 23:11:22 +0100 Subject: media / v4l2-mc: wishlist for complex cameras (was Re: [PATCH v4 14/36] [media] v4l2-mc: add a function to inherit controls from a pipeline) In-Reply-To: <20170315172627.6b7cc955@vento.lan> References: <20170310223714.GI3220@valkosipuli.retiisi.org.uk> <20170311082549.576531d0@vento.lan> <20170313124621.GA10701@valkosipuli.retiisi.org.uk> <20170314004533.3b3cd44b@vento.lan> <20170314072143.498cde9b@vento.lan> <20170314223254.GA7141@amd> <20170314215420.6fc63c67@vento.lan> <20170315180421.GA10206@amd> <20170315172627.6b7cc955@vento.lan> Message-ID: <20170316221122.GA31588@amd> To: linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org List-Id: linux-arm-kernel.lists.infradead.org Hi! > > > > mplayer is useful for testing... but that one already works (after you > > > > setup the pipeline, and configure exposure/gain). > > > > > > > > But thats useful for testing, not really for production. Image will be > > > > out of focus and with wrong white balance. > > > > > > > > What I would really like is an application to get still photos. For > > > > taking pictures with manual settings we need > > > > > > > > a) units for controls: user wants to focus on 1m, and take picture > > > > with ISO200, 1/125 sec. We should also tell him that lens is f/5.6 and > > > > focal length is 20mm with 5mm chip. > > > > > > > > But... autofocus/autogain would really be good to have. Thus we need: > > > > > > > > b) for each frame, we need exposure settings and focus position at > > > > time frame was taken. Otherwise autofocus/autogain will be too > > > > slow. At least focus position is going to be tricky -- either kernel > > > > would have to compute focus position for us (not trivial) or we'd need > > > > enough information to compute it in userspace. > > > > > > > > There are more problems: hardware-accelerated preview is not trivial > > > > to set up (and I'm unsure if it can be done in generic way). Still > > > > photos application needs to switch resolutions between preview and > > > > photo capture. Probably hardware-accelerated histograms are needed for > > > > white balance, auto gain and auto focus, .... > > > > > > > > It seems like there's a _lot_ of stuff to be done before we have > > > > useful support for complex cameras... > > > > > > Taking still pictures using a hardware-accelerated preview is > > > a sophisticated use case. I don't know any userspace application > > > that does that. Ok, several allow taking snapshots, by simply > > > storing the image of the current frame. > > > > Well, there are applications that take still pictures. Android has > > one. Maemo has another. Then there's fcam-dev. Its open source; with > > modified kernel it is fully usable. I have version that runs on recent > > nearly-mainline on N900. > > Hmm... it seems that FCam is specific for N900: > http://fcam.garage.maemo.org/ > > If so, then we have here just the opposite problem, if want it to be > used as a generic application, as very likely it requires OMAP3-specific > graph/subdevs. Well... there's quick and great version on maemo.org. I do have local version (still somehow N900-specific), but it no longer uses hardware histogram/sharpness support. Should be almost generic. > > So yes, I'd like solution for problems a) and b). ...but it has camera parameters hardcoded (problem a) and slow (problem b). > > Question is if camera without autofocus is usable. I'd say "not > > really".qv4l2 > > That actually depends on the sensor and how focus is adjusted. > > I'm testing right now this camera module for RPi: > https://www.raspberrypi.org/products/camera-module-v2/ > > I might be wrong, but this sensor doesn't seem to have auto-focus. > Instead, it seems to use a wide-angle lens. So, except when the > object is too close, the focus look OK. Well, cameras without autofocus are somehow usable without autofocus. But cameras with autofocus don't work too well without one. > > If we really want to go that way (is not modifying library to access > > the right files quite easy?), I believe non-confusing option would be > > to have '/dev/video0 -- omap3 camera for legacy applications' which > > would include all the controls. > > Yeah, keeping /dev/video0 reserved for generic applications is something > that could work. Not sure how easy would be to implement it. Plus advanced applications would just ignore /dev/video0.. and not be confused. > > > > > > You can get Nokia N900 on aliexpress. If not, they are still available > > > > between people :-) > > > > > > I have one. Unfortunately, I never had a chance to use it, as the display > > > stopped working one week after I get it. > > > > Well, I guess the easiest option is to just get another one :-). > > :-) Well, I guess very few units of N900 was sold in Brazil. Importing > one is too expensive, due to taxes. Try to ask at local mailing list. Those machines were quite common. > > But otoh -- N900 is quite usable without the screen. 0xffff tool can > > be used to boot the kernel, then you can use nfsroot and usb > > networking. It also has serial port (over strange > > connector). Connected over ssh over usb network is actually how I do > > most of the v4l work. > > If you pass me the pointers, I can try it when I have some time. Ok, I guess I'll do that in private email. > Anyway, I got myself an ISEE IGEPv2, with the expansion board: > https://www.isee.biz/products/igep-processor-boards/igepv2-dm3730 > https://www.isee.biz/products/igep-expansion-boards/igepv2-expansion > > The expansion board comes with a tvp5150 analog TV demod. So, with > this device, I can simply connect it to a composite input signal. > I have some sources here that I can use to test it. Well... it looks like TV capture is a "solved" problem. Taking useful photos is what is hard... Pavel -- (english) http://www.livejournal.com/~pavelmachek (cesky, pictures) http://atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz/~pavel/picture/horses/blog.html -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 181 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: