From: Alexei Starovoitov <alexei.starovoitov@gmail.com>
To: Jakub Kicinski <kuba@kernel.org>
Cc: "John Fastabend" <john.fastabend@gmail.com>,
"Toke Høiland-Jørgensen" <toke@redhat.com>,
"Andrii Nakryiko" <andrii.nakryiko@gmail.com>,
"Alexei Starovoitov" <ast@kernel.org>,
"Daniel Borkmann" <daniel@iogearbox.net>,
"Martin KaFai Lau" <kafai@fb.com>,
"Song Liu" <songliubraving@fb.com>, "Yonghong Song" <yhs@fb.com>,
"Andrii Nakryiko" <andriin@fb.com>,
"David S. Miller" <davem@davemloft.net>,
"Jesper Dangaard Brouer" <brouer@redhat.com>,
"Lorenz Bauer" <lmb@cloudflare.com>,
"Andrey Ignatov" <rdna@fb.com>,
Networking <netdev@vger.kernel.org>, bpf <bpf@vger.kernel.org>
Subject: Re: [PATCH bpf-next 1/4] xdp: Support specifying expected existing program when attaching XDP
Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2020 11:06:38 -0700 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <20200325180638.el22n4ms6aau42r4@ast-mbp> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20200324191554.46a7e0c2@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com>
On Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 07:15:54PM -0700, Jakub Kicinski wrote:
>
> It is the way to configure XDP today, so it's only natural to
> scrutinize the attempts to replace it.
No one is replacing it.
> Also I personally don't think you'd see this much push back trying to
> add bpf_link-based stuff to cls_bpf, that's an add-on. XDP is
> integrated very fundamentally with the networking stack at this point.
>
> > Details are important and every case is different. So imo:
> > converting ethtool to netlink - great stuff.
> > converting netdev irq/queue management to netlink - great stuff too.
> > adding more netlink api for xdp - really bad idea.
>
> Why is it a bad idea?
I explained in three other emails. tldr: lack of ownership.
> There are plenty things which will only be available over netlink.
> Configuring the interface so installing the XDP program is possible
> (disabling features, configuring queues etc.). Chances are user gets
> the ifindex of the interface to attach to over netlink in the first
> place. The queue configuration (which you agree belongs in netlink)
> will definitely get more complex to allow REDIRECTs to work more
> smoothly. AF_XDP needs all sort of netlink stuff.
sure. that has nothing to do with ownership of attachment.
> Netlink gives us the notification mechanism which is how we solve
> coordination across daemons (something that BPF subsystem is only
> now trying to solve).
I don't care about notifications on attachment and no one is trying to
solve that as far as I can see. It's not a problem to solve in the first place.
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2020-03-25 18:06 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 120+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2020-03-19 13:13 [PATCH bpf-next 0/4] XDP: Support atomic replacement of XDP interface attachments Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-19 13:13 ` [PATCH bpf-next 1/4] xdp: Support specifying expected existing program when attaching XDP Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-19 22:52 ` Jakub Kicinski
2020-03-20 8:48 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-20 17:35 ` Jakub Kicinski
2020-03-20 18:17 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-20 18:35 ` Jakub Kicinski
2020-03-20 18:30 ` John Fastabend
2020-03-20 20:24 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-23 11:24 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-23 16:54 ` Jakub Kicinski
2020-03-23 18:14 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-23 19:23 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-24 1:01 ` David Ahern
2020-03-24 4:53 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-24 20:55 ` David Ahern
2020-03-24 22:56 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-24 5:00 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-24 10:57 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-24 18:53 ` Jakub Kicinski
2020-03-24 22:30 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-25 1:25 ` Jakub Kicinski
2020-03-24 19:22 ` John Fastabend
2020-03-25 1:36 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-03-25 2:15 ` Jakub Kicinski
2020-03-25 18:06 ` Alexei Starovoitov [this message]
2020-03-25 18:20 ` Jakub Kicinski
2020-03-25 19:14 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-03-25 10:42 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-25 18:11 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-03-25 10:30 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-25 17:56 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-03-24 22:25 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-25 9:38 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-25 17:55 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-03-26 0:16 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-26 5:13 ` Jakub Kicinski
2020-03-26 18:09 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-26 19:40 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-03-26 20:05 ` Edward Cree
2020-03-27 11:09 ` Lorenz Bauer
2020-03-27 23:11 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-03-26 10:04 ` Lorenz Bauer
2020-03-26 17:47 ` Jakub Kicinski
2020-03-26 19:45 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-03-26 18:18 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-26 19:53 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-03-27 11:11 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-04-02 20:21 ` bpf: ability to attach freplace to multiple parents Alexei Starovoitov
2020-04-02 21:23 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-04-02 21:54 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-04-03 8:38 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-04-07 1:44 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-04-07 9:20 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-05-12 8:34 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-05-12 9:53 ` Alan Maguire
2020-05-12 13:02 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-05-12 23:18 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-05-12 23:06 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-05-13 10:25 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-04-02 21:24 ` Andrey Ignatov
2020-04-02 22:01 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-03-26 12:35 ` [PATCH bpf-next 1/4] xdp: Support specifying expected existing program when attaching XDP Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-26 19:06 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-27 11:06 ` Lorenz Bauer
2020-03-27 16:12 ` David Ahern
2020-03-27 20:10 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-27 23:02 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-03-30 15:25 ` Edward Cree
2020-03-31 3:43 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-03-31 22:05 ` Edward Cree
2020-03-31 22:16 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-03-27 19:42 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-27 19:45 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-27 23:09 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-03-27 11:46 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-27 20:07 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-27 22:16 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-27 22:54 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-28 1:09 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-28 1:44 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-28 19:43 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-26 19:58 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-03-27 12:06 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-27 23:00 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-03-28 1:43 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-28 2:26 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-03-28 19:34 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-28 23:35 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-03-29 10:39 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-29 19:26 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-03-30 10:19 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-29 20:23 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-30 13:53 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-30 20:17 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-31 10:13 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-31 13:48 ` Daniel Borkmann
2020-03-31 15:00 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-31 20:19 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-31 20:15 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-30 15:41 ` Edward Cree
2020-03-30 19:13 ` Jakub Kicinski
2020-03-31 4:01 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-03-31 11:34 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-31 18:52 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2020-03-20 20:30 ` Daniel Borkmann
2020-03-20 20:40 ` Daniel Borkmann
2020-03-20 21:30 ` Jakub Kicinski
2020-03-20 21:55 ` Daniel Borkmann
2020-03-20 23:35 ` Jakub Kicinski
2020-03-20 20:39 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-23 11:25 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-23 18:07 ` Andrii Nakryiko
2020-03-23 23:54 ` Andrey Ignatov
2020-03-24 10:16 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-20 2:13 ` Yonghong Song
2020-03-20 8:48 ` Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-19 13:13 ` [PATCH bpf-next 2/4] tools: Add EXPECTED_FD-related definitions in if_link.h Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-19 13:13 ` [PATCH bpf-next 3/4] libbpf: Add function to set link XDP fd while specifying old fd Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
2020-03-19 13:13 ` [PATCH bpf-next 4/4] selftests/bpf: Add tests for attaching XDP programs Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
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