From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from mail-qk1-f177.google.com (mail-qk1-f177.google.com [209.85.222.177]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.subspace.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B571C70 for ; Thu, 10 Jun 2021 20:12:39 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-qk1-f177.google.com with SMTP id k11so27065957qkk.1 for ; Thu, 10 Jun 2021 13:12:39 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=linuxfoundation.org; s=google; h=date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:references:mime-version :content-disposition:in-reply-to; bh=KND7DoY/09NzlHDGlCKkV1pirvEJ2hmpAejnVKY3Dhc=; b=a+kj5hpoDoIiocT8sQb4ui2hitct/vz3LCP0HlE1h6aTQr3F/X6y/t5I6nME0j9QIX BkMnFIY3Y3zcXUGpx9lxPm62SPk6b9/C67aYWoB4kHQ3D+7VAAeNFSLICUOOGXF3iEcv ESIwss4AW/PpYGkSdtOfey1/zCc5sY9k/3Row= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:references :mime-version:content-disposition:in-reply-to; bh=KND7DoY/09NzlHDGlCKkV1pirvEJ2hmpAejnVKY3Dhc=; b=DONo/fVebuE5E7gcX/Wkn5IYAVavFt8xa8sBJZtYFu02nf7SjgQ3lw8KcmBaoEPjBW MyfZjYMEp8PZn0cp1DrvchHl8raKzfRPb8cR1C9hiVFfyhMFjwE8ZJAjVFFHfCK9QU0J SA8nq4bIzHfvp9VPOEvIVwDg5WRWLuDb9507Q5tY1AcRVyfj/k77KjzdyLYQO7so/V/D JIU1so+OO79BI2ri7wveRLSALxE0Oa3feofS0COJBe/M++BeHRfce+jb5LCBi8CkH5FI nqRFWwFBH+7FnXVPD00EQAYHtM1fdiPqMYbfzMY8HDNf39gtdq0Gn5CdjqYTouwXtIst TSHQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532yta4JACE789oDOlCkUOvVgKYU4IBpKkyiQacjICIlSfUL70uI q1YrskdUznrWxzximjvhMJXb4g== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwmGpJRpwbiikCRaxnDlsqqyl8jr1T1WEDZKeq7K9RKTwXiT2bBsg2nxY13t+OmoaiRlW9D4Q== X-Received: by 2002:a05:620a:1113:: with SMTP id o19mr347803qkk.229.1623355958654; Thu, 10 Jun 2021 13:12:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nitro.local ([89.36.78.230]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id e128sm2890894qkd.127.2021.06.10.13.12.38 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Thu, 10 Jun 2021 13:12:38 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 16:12:36 -0400 From: Konstantin Ryabitsev To: Laurent Pinchart Cc: ksummit@lists.linux.dev, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Subject: Re: Maintainers / Kernel Summit 2021 planning kick-off Message-ID: <20210610201236.gvxxmgl6ubjsbc3h@nitro.local> References: <5038827c-463f-232d-4dec-da56c71089bd@metux.net> <20210610182318.jrxe3avfhkqq7xqn@nitro.local> X-Mailing-List: ksummit@lists.linux.dev List-Id: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: (Trimming the huge CC list) On Thu, Jun 10, 2021 at 09:39:49PM +0300, Laurent Pinchart wrote: > The topic of how to best organize hybrid events to maximize > inclusiveness for remote participants is more interesting to me. LPC did > an amazing job last year with the fully remote setup, but a hybrid setup > brings new challenges. One issue I've previously experienced in hybrid > setups, especially for brainstorming-type discussions, was that on-site > attendees can very quickly break out conversations in small groups (it's > an issue for fully on-site events too). As a (high-functioning) introvert, I'd say that a lot of it depends not so much on the on-site/off-site nature of participation, but on individual communication preferences. I've presented quite a bit at conferences, and, to me, "brainstorming-type discussions" never really happen post-presentation, largely because being in a spotlight makes me uncomfortable and I generally try to slink away. I suggest that something that would help is providing information on where to ask questions in an informal setting. For example, add the following on the last slide of your presentation: Thank you! Join the discussion: 1. Mailing list: foo@lists.example.com 2. IRC: #foochan on exampleirc.com 3. Matrix: #foochan:example.com 4. My email: foo@example.com This gives enough options for folks to ask questions whether they are in the real-life audience or attending online. Listing both your individual email and a group chat option will help bridge many cultural divides -- some people will feel intimidated asking a question directly (especially if you are a luminary in your field) and will prefer to address a group. Others will feel intimidated addressing a group (what if my question is stupid) and will prefer to address you directly. > Session leads should be aware of the need to ensure even more than usual > that all speakers use microphones. I don't think we need to go as far as > specific training on these topics, but emphasizing the importance of > moderation would be useful in my opinion. I think with most sessions being recorded, people are already well conditioned to use microphones. I try to at least always repeat the question being asked if I notice that the person asking it isn't using a mic. > There will always be more informal discussions between on-site participants. > After all, this is one of the benefits of conferences, by being all together > we can easily organize ad-hoc discussions. This is traditionally done by > finding a not too noisy corner in the conference center, would it be useful > to have more break-out rooms with A/V equipment than usual ? I'm generally of the opinion that we should split conferences from hackathons, anyway. - conferences are great for finding about cool new things happening in your field, and work great online where there is no limit on how many people can join the stream; if the presentation is not what you thought it was going to be, switching to a different video stream is dramatically cheaper than getting out of the dark room to find a different presentation. - hackathons are great for getting things done and meeting up with folks you rarely get to see in real life -- and they work well as on-site, multi-site or hybrid events. For example, the maintainer summit is a "hackathon", even if there is no actual code hacking done. The thing being hackathoned is the development process itself and general direction of things. The LinuxCon is for sure a conference and generally has little tangible value other than a pretext to get your employer to pay for the trip. :) So, perhaps more frequent but smaller events around narrower topics as opposed to huge colocated events? I do appreciate that this is more difficult for organizers, but perhaps it would result in more tangible benefits? -K