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[2603:6081:7b01:cbda:5170:f33c:21eb:73eb]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id c126sm1134489qkg.45.2021.07.06.08.33.28 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-CHACHA20-POLY1305 bits=256/256); Tue, 06 Jul 2021 08:33:29 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 6 Jul 2021 11:33:27 -0400 From: Tom Rini To: Wolfgang Denk Cc: Sean Anderson , Simon Glass , U-Boot Mailing List , Marek =?iso-8859-1?Q?Beh=FAn?= , Roland Gaudig , Heinrich Schuchardt , Kostas Michalopoulos Subject: Re: [RFC PATCH 05/28] cli: lil: Rename some functions to be more like TCL Message-ID: <20210706153327.GS9516@bill-the-cat> References: <20210701061611.957918-1-seanga2@gmail.com> <20210701061611.957918-6-seanga2@gmail.com> <163753.1625507898@gemini.denx.de> <20210705185141.GA9516@bill-the-cat> <192285.1625557976@gemini.denx.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="QuIQr2klPSZMyC/n" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <192285.1625557976@gemini.denx.de> X-Clacks-Overhead: GNU Terry Pratchett User-Agent: Mutt/1.9.4 (2018-02-28) X-BeenThere: u-boot@lists.denx.de X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.34 Precedence: list List-Id: U-Boot discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: u-boot-bounces@lists.denx.de Sender: "U-Boot" X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.103.2 at phobos.denx.de X-Virus-Status: Clean --QuIQr2klPSZMyC/n Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Tue, Jul 06, 2021 at 09:52:56AM +0200, Wolfgang Denk wrote: > Dear Tom, >=20 > In message <20210705185141.GA9516@bill-the-cat> you wrote: > >=20 > > I think I want to try and address this. While with "hush" we have > > something that's in heavy active development outside of U-Boot, with LIL > > we have something that's mature and "done". >=20 > Mature? And still without consequent error checking? And done, > i. e. this will never be fixed? Intentional design by upstream, and then for the actual problem part (error checking, test suite), Sean is saying he'll fix it, and has started on it. > > Tracking an active outside development is HARD and requires > > constant resync. >=20 > Based on that logic we should stop supporting Linux, and stop using > DTs or file systems - all of these are under "active outside > development". >=20 > This is a bogus argiment. Alright, go and update our Kbuild integration to be in sync with current Linux. Or just v5.0. I'd suggest picking up the metadata_csum support patch but someone did say they'd try and update that (off-list) so that ext4 filesystem made with default options in the last 5 years (not exaggerating) work. I'm not even going to talk about the various level of out of sync our DTs files are but I do have some hope there will be more re-syncs especially as it comes to more light that the DT U-Boot uses can just be the DT the OS gets. Then tell me it's easy to keep this stuff in sync. Because we certainly don't want to just fork-and-forget again, right? Because that's why we have both crazy parse bugs as well as lack of now old-and-expected features. OK, snark aside, I'm very serious here, any "we'll just import ..." needs to have a plan to keep it up to date, or be easy enough to do such that I can set a monthly reminder to check for and do the update. Every area where we don't do this is a set of problems waiting to get worse, as we can see with the hush shell right now as it's one of the oldest things we stopped syncing with. > > Look at the last few > > LIL releases. That could be easily re-worked in to our fork if needed. > > I see that as a positive, not a negative. >=20 > OK, this is your opinion. Mine differs. >=20 > Please consider this as a full NAK from me when when you think of it > as a _replacement_ (even an optional one) of the standard shell. If > you like, have it added as an _additional_ command, of course fully > optional and without impact on the rest of U-Boot if not > intentionally selected. Any new cli for U-Boot won't be a default build as a command for a long while after it's merged. I'm not sure how much past that point it would further need to be to become the default cli. And I'll even repeat what I said elsewhere about how an sh syntax is a good user feature. But I really think we want a shell environment that is not actively adding new features is a good thing, for the default. Just how much stuff should we be doing or need to be doing before we hand things over to the OS? --=20 Tom --QuIQr2klPSZMyC/n Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQGzBAABCgAdFiEEGjx/cOCPqxcHgJu/FHw5/5Y0tywFAmDkd8MACgkQFHw5/5Y0 tywwDwwAnmURzQN9IHZsVBtBocoP2JU1aV4FuX9lSPaGE4iSIRGF1n8eBe2QqjIF 4AbQ+iN7ltENKzW7FIeeJ9oPpokXAM4jVZL7iVMCQ7E0rZS+A/kTyzalIn2QmVGc IEncaSC14nk2dgy8+tA8Igl4ttKgEXBFyz83wyogv/bMvDQMy19QIw3P81/8xZ44 CEfyLuWr7fE2Y5Hp8Y7p1mnXga67Xd+l3qdvBu3adZUPL6ygwdmGEBAGjcX95bKM pPrUJeH4PUjGFP+zCEiqzzNZ8k4ldOoxbWMEEOjgrHIJaCGZuseRPHCAftaxlUDV vFtjRPtkXETD8Fy6xRTH36kfjjyvCJ9IF6Ocimm5L51eEnaKp3LIF9pfBFHur0IE Ac3dEQJSFtTzQ+aIfgRtI1uHkDztuRdxm1mrfK/B+hfT6uUp+yK6Zl2v5Vh9mQm9 f/G+unMoLftBAJrTpWYOAvdOhdtjQvQZQdYx9jQ7p5w48Tr2UT6Irj5+eg7tq3d3 bjFBtBpo =vlhh -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --QuIQr2klPSZMyC/n--