All of lore.kernel.org
 help / color / mirror / Atom feed
From: Steve Grubb <sgrubb@redhat.com>
To: Pavel Begunkov <asml.silence@gmail.com>, linux-audit@redhat.com
Cc: Jens Axboe <axboe@kernel.dk>,
	selinux@vger.kernel.org, linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org,
	linux-audit@redhat.com,
	Kumar Kartikeya Dwivedi <memxor@gmail.com>,
	linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org, io-uring@vger.kernel.org,
	Alexander Viro <viro@zeniv.linux.org.uk>,
	Paul Moore <paul@paul-moore.com>
Subject: Re: [RFC PATCH 2/9] audit,io_uring,io-wq: add some basic audit support to io_uring
Date: Wed, 26 May 2021 11:11:50 -0400	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <2197994.ElGaqSPkdT@x2> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAHC9VhTAvcB0A2dpv1Xn7sa+Kh1n+e-dJr_8wSSRaxS4D0f9Sw@mail.gmail.com>

On Wednesday, May 26, 2021 10:38:38 AM EDT Paul Moore wrote:
> > > We would need to check with the current security requirements (there
> > > are distro people on the linux-audit list that keep track of that
> > > stuff),

The requirements generally care about resource access. File open, connect, 
accept, etc. We don't care about read/write itself as that would flood the 
analysis.

> > > but looking at the opcodes right now my gut feeling is that
> > > most of the opcodes would be considered "security relevant" so
> > > selective auditing might not be that useful in practice. 

I'd say maybe a quarter to a third look interesting.

> > > It would
> > > definitely clutter the code and increase the chances that new opcodes
> > > would not be properly audited when they are merged.

There is that...

> > I'm curious, why it's enabled by many distros by default? Are there
> > use cases they use?
> 
> We've already talked about certain users and environments where audit
> is an important requirement, e.g. public sector, health care,
> financial institutions, etc.; without audit Linux wouldn't be an
> option for these users,

People that care about auditing are under regulatory mandates. They care more 
about the audit event than the performance. Imagine you have a system with 
some brand new medical discovery. You want to know anyone who accesses the 
information in case it gets leaked out. You don't care how slow the system 
gets - you simply *have* to know everyone who's looked at the documents.

-Steve



WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Steve Grubb <sgrubb@redhat.com>
To: Pavel Begunkov <asml.silence@gmail.com>, linux-audit@redhat.com
Cc: Jens Axboe <axboe@kernel.dk>,
	selinux@vger.kernel.org, linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org,
	linux-audit@redhat.com,
	Kumar Kartikeya Dwivedi <memxor@gmail.com>,
	linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org, io-uring@vger.kernel.org,
	Alexander Viro <viro@zeniv.linux.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [RFC PATCH 2/9] audit, io_uring, io-wq: add some basic audit support to io_uring
Date: Wed, 26 May 2021 11:11:50 -0400	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <2197994.ElGaqSPkdT@x2> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAHC9VhTAvcB0A2dpv1Xn7sa+Kh1n+e-dJr_8wSSRaxS4D0f9Sw@mail.gmail.com>

On Wednesday, May 26, 2021 10:38:38 AM EDT Paul Moore wrote:
> > > We would need to check with the current security requirements (there
> > > are distro people on the linux-audit list that keep track of that
> > > stuff),

The requirements generally care about resource access. File open, connect, 
accept, etc. We don't care about read/write itself as that would flood the 
analysis.

> > > but looking at the opcodes right now my gut feeling is that
> > > most of the opcodes would be considered "security relevant" so
> > > selective auditing might not be that useful in practice. 

I'd say maybe a quarter to a third look interesting.

> > > It would
> > > definitely clutter the code and increase the chances that new opcodes
> > > would not be properly audited when they are merged.

There is that...

> > I'm curious, why it's enabled by many distros by default? Are there
> > use cases they use?
> 
> We've already talked about certain users and environments where audit
> is an important requirement, e.g. public sector, health care,
> financial institutions, etc.; without audit Linux wouldn't be an
> option for these users,

People that care about auditing are under regulatory mandates. They care more 
about the audit event than the performance. Imagine you have a system with 
some brand new medical discovery. You want to know anyone who accesses the 
information in case it gets leaked out. You don't care how slow the system 
gets - you simply *have* to know everyone who's looked at the documents.

-Steve


--
Linux-audit mailing list
Linux-audit@redhat.com
https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/linux-audit


  reply	other threads:[~2021-05-26 15:12 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 144+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2021-05-21 21:49 [RFC PATCH 0/9] Add LSM access controls and auditing to io_uring Paul Moore
2021-05-21 21:49 ` Paul Moore
2021-05-21 21:49 ` [RFC PATCH 1/9] audit: prepare audit_context for use in calling contexts beyond syscalls Paul Moore
2021-05-21 21:49   ` Paul Moore
2021-05-21 21:49 ` [RFC PATCH 2/9] audit,io_uring,io-wq: add some basic audit support to io_uring Paul Moore
2021-05-21 21:49   ` [RFC PATCH 2/9] audit, io_uring, io-wq: " Paul Moore
2021-05-22  0:22   ` [RFC PATCH 2/9] audit,io_uring,io-wq: " Pavel Begunkov
2021-05-22  0:22     ` Pavel Begunkov
2021-05-22  2:36     ` Paul Moore
2021-05-22  2:36       ` Paul Moore
2021-05-23 20:26       ` Pavel Begunkov
2021-05-23 20:26         ` Pavel Begunkov
2021-05-24 19:59         ` Paul Moore
2021-05-24 19:59           ` Paul Moore
2021-05-25  8:27           ` Pavel Begunkov
2021-05-25  8:27             ` Pavel Begunkov
2021-05-25 14:53             ` Paul Moore
2021-05-25 14:53               ` Paul Moore
2021-05-26  1:11           ` Jens Axboe
2021-05-26  1:11             ` Jens Axboe
2021-05-26  2:04             ` Paul Moore
2021-05-26  2:04               ` Paul Moore
2021-05-26 10:19               ` Pavel Begunkov
2021-05-26 10:19                 ` Pavel Begunkov
2021-05-26 14:38                 ` Paul Moore
2021-05-26 14:38                   ` Paul Moore
2021-05-26 15:11                   ` Steve Grubb [this message]
2021-05-26 15:11                     ` [RFC PATCH 2/9] audit, io_uring, io-wq: " Steve Grubb
2021-05-26 15:17                   ` [RFC PATCH 2/9] audit,io_uring,io-wq: " Stefan Metzmacher
2021-05-26 15:17                     ` Stefan Metzmacher
2021-05-26 15:49                     ` Richard Guy Briggs
2021-05-26 15:49                       ` Richard Guy Briggs
2021-05-26 17:22                       ` Jens Axboe
2021-05-26 17:22                         ` Jens Axboe
2021-05-27 17:27                         ` Richard Guy Briggs
2021-05-27 17:27                           ` Richard Guy Briggs
2021-05-26 15:49                     ` Victor Stewart
2021-05-26 15:49                       ` Victor Stewart
2021-05-26 16:38                       ` Casey Schaufler
2021-05-26 16:38                         ` Casey Schaufler
2021-05-26 17:15               ` Jens Axboe
2021-05-26 17:15                 ` Jens Axboe
2021-05-26 17:31                 ` Jens Axboe
2021-05-26 17:31                   ` Jens Axboe
2021-05-26 17:54                   ` Jens Axboe
2021-05-26 17:54                     ` Jens Axboe
2021-05-26 18:01                     ` Jens Axboe
2021-05-26 18:01                       ` Jens Axboe
2021-05-26 18:44                       ` Paul Moore
2021-05-26 18:44                         ` Paul Moore
2021-05-26 18:57                         ` Pavel Begunkov
2021-05-26 18:57                           ` Pavel Begunkov
2021-05-26 19:10                           ` Paul Moore
2021-05-26 19:10                             ` Paul Moore
2021-05-26 19:44                         ` Jens Axboe
2021-05-26 19:44                           ` Jens Axboe
2021-05-26 20:19                           ` Paul Moore
2021-05-26 20:19                             ` Paul Moore
2021-05-28 16:02                             ` Paul Moore
2021-05-28 16:02                               ` Paul Moore
2021-06-02  8:26                               ` Pavel Begunkov
2021-06-02  8:26                                 ` Pavel Begunkov
2021-06-02 15:46                                 ` Richard Guy Briggs
2021-06-02 15:46                                   ` Richard Guy Briggs
2021-06-03 10:39                                   ` Pavel Begunkov
2021-06-03 10:39                                     ` Pavel Begunkov
2021-06-02 19:46                                 ` Paul Moore
2021-06-02 19:46                                   ` Paul Moore
2021-06-03 10:51                                   ` Pavel Begunkov
2021-06-03 10:51                                     ` Pavel Begunkov
2021-06-03 15:54                                     ` Casey Schaufler
2021-06-03 15:54                                       ` Casey Schaufler
2021-06-03 15:54                               ` Jens Axboe
2021-06-03 15:54                                 ` Jens Axboe
2021-06-04  5:04                                 ` Paul Moore
2021-06-04  5:04                                   ` Paul Moore
2021-05-26 18:38                     ` Paul Moore
2021-05-26 18:38                       ` Paul Moore
2021-06-02 17:29   ` [RFC PATCH 2/9] audit, io_uring, io-wq: " Richard Guy Briggs
2021-06-02 17:29     ` Richard Guy Briggs
2021-06-02 20:46     ` Paul Moore
2021-06-02 20:46       ` Paul Moore
2021-08-25  1:21       ` Richard Guy Briggs
2021-08-25  1:21         ` Richard Guy Briggs
2021-08-25 19:41         ` Paul Moore
2021-08-25 19:41           ` Paul Moore
2021-05-21 21:50 ` [RFC PATCH 3/9] audit: dev/test patch to force io_uring auditing Paul Moore
2021-05-21 21:50   ` Paul Moore
2021-05-21 21:50 ` [RFC PATCH 4/9] audit: add filtering for io_uring records Paul Moore
2021-05-21 21:50   ` Paul Moore
2021-05-28 22:35   ` Richard Guy Briggs
2021-05-28 22:35     ` Richard Guy Briggs
2021-05-30 15:26     ` Paul Moore
2021-05-30 15:26       ` Paul Moore
2021-05-31 13:44       ` Richard Guy Briggs
2021-05-31 13:44         ` Richard Guy Briggs
2021-06-02  1:40         ` Paul Moore
2021-06-02  1:40           ` Paul Moore
2021-06-02 15:37           ` Richard Guy Briggs
2021-06-02 15:37             ` Richard Guy Briggs
2021-06-02 17:20             ` Paul Moore
2021-06-02 17:20               ` Paul Moore
2021-05-31 13:44       ` [PATCH 1/2] audit: add filtering for io_uring records, addendum Richard Guy Briggs
2021-05-31 13:44         ` Richard Guy Briggs
2021-05-31 16:08         ` kernel test robot
2021-05-31 16:08           ` kernel test robot
2021-05-31 16:08           ` kernel test robot
2021-05-31 17:38         ` kernel test robot
2021-05-31 17:38           ` kernel test robot
2021-05-31 17:38           ` kernel test robot
2021-06-07 23:15         ` Paul Moore
2021-06-07 23:15           ` Paul Moore
2021-06-08 12:55           ` Richard Guy Briggs
2021-06-08 12:55             ` Richard Guy Briggs
2021-06-09  2:45             ` Paul Moore
2021-06-09  2:45               ` Paul Moore
2021-05-31 13:44       ` [PATCH 2/2] audit: block PERM fields being used with io_uring filtering Richard Guy Briggs
2021-05-31 13:44         ` Richard Guy Briggs
2021-05-21 21:50 ` [RFC PATCH 5/9] fs: add anon_inode_getfile_secure() similar to anon_inode_getfd_secure() Paul Moore
2021-05-21 21:50   ` Paul Moore
2021-05-21 21:50 ` [RFC PATCH 6/9] io_uring: convert io_uring to the secure anon inode interface Paul Moore
2021-05-21 21:50   ` Paul Moore
2021-05-21 21:50 ` [RFC PATCH 7/9] lsm,io_uring: add LSM hooks to io_uring Paul Moore
2021-05-21 21:50   ` Paul Moore
2021-05-26 14:48   ` Stefan Metzmacher
2021-05-26 14:48     ` Stefan Metzmacher
2021-05-26 20:45     ` Paul Moore
2021-05-26 20:45       ` Paul Moore
2021-05-21 21:50 ` [RFC PATCH 8/9] selinux: add support for the io_uring access controls Paul Moore
2021-05-21 21:50   ` Paul Moore
2021-05-21 21:50 ` [RFC PATCH 9/9] Smack: Brutalist io_uring support with debug Paul Moore
2021-05-21 21:50   ` Paul Moore
2021-05-22  0:53 ` [RFC PATCH 0/9] Add LSM access controls and auditing to io_uring Tetsuo Handa
2021-05-22  0:53   ` Tetsuo Handa
2021-05-22  2:06   ` Paul Moore
2021-05-22  2:06     ` Paul Moore
2021-05-26 15:00 ` Jeff Moyer
2021-05-26 15:00   ` Jeff Moyer
2021-05-26 18:49   ` Paul Moore
2021-05-26 18:49     ` Paul Moore
2021-05-26 19:07     ` Jeff Moyer
2021-05-26 19:07       ` Jeff Moyer
2021-05-26 19:10       ` Paul Moore
2021-05-26 19:10         ` Paul Moore

Reply instructions:

You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:

* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
  and reply-to-all from there: mbox

  Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style

* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
  switches of git-send-email(1):

  git send-email \
    --in-reply-to=2197994.ElGaqSPkdT@x2 \
    --to=sgrubb@redhat.com \
    --cc=asml.silence@gmail.com \
    --cc=axboe@kernel.dk \
    --cc=io-uring@vger.kernel.org \
    --cc=linux-audit@redhat.com \
    --cc=linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org \
    --cc=linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org \
    --cc=memxor@gmail.com \
    --cc=paul@paul-moore.com \
    --cc=selinux@vger.kernel.org \
    --cc=viro@zeniv.linux.org.uk \
    /path/to/YOUR_REPLY

  https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html

* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
  via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line before the message body.
This is an external index of several public inboxes,
see mirroring instructions on how to clone and mirror
all data and code used by this external index.