From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1751957AbdAaSvy (ORCPT ); Tue, 31 Jan 2017 13:51:54 -0500 Received: from mail-it0-f67.google.com ([209.85.214.67]:34184 "EHLO mail-it0-f67.google.com" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1751471AbdAaSvV (ORCPT ); Tue, 31 Jan 2017 13:51:21 -0500 Subject: Re: Dell XPS13: MCE (Hardware Error) reported To: Paul Menzel , Mario Limonciello , Borislav Petkov References: <20170104225546.wy36fu5t2jbow2dq@pd.tnic> <20170105011236.GA80100@otc-brkl-03> <662102c9-94da-3193-08c4-9fe75411cadb@molgen.mpg.de> <20170109192336.GA42856@otc-nc-03> <2714c370-d3ba-4522-a7ec-be30186181f0@molgen.mpg.de> <20170127171047.sbmxyleshp66s4zj@pd.tnic>

Cc: Ashok Raj , linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, Thorsten Leemhuis , Len Brown , Tony Luck From: "Austin S. Hemmelgarn" Message-ID: <3fb61bd2-f844-67ab-1036-8a577ad0ef43@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 31 Jan 2017 13:50:57 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.7.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org On 2017-01-31 10:29, Paul Menzel wrote: > Dear Borislav, dear Mario, > > > On 01/27/17 18:16, Mario.Limonciello@dell.com wrote: >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Borislav Petkov [mailto:bp@alien8.de] >>> Sent: Friday, January 27, 2017 11:11 AM >>> To: Paul Menzel >>> Cc: Ashok Raj ; Linux Kernel Mailing List >> kernel@vger.kernel.org>; Thorsten Leemhuis ; Len >>> Brown ; Tony Luck ; >>> Limonciello, Mario >>> Subject: Re: Dell XPS13: MCE (Hardware Error) reported >>> >>> On Fri, Jan 27, 2017 at 02:35:16PM +0100, Paul Menzel wrote: >>>> Thank you very much for your help. After wasting my time with the Dell >>>> support over Twitter [1], where they basically also make you jump >>>> through hoops, >>> >>> Fun read that twitter page. Especially the bit about not supporting >>> Linux but >>> but you did ship this laptop with ubuntu. LOOL. >>> >>> FWIW, this is not the first time I've heard vendors trying to get >>> away from >>> dealing with bugs by playing the "we-dont-support-Linux" card. > > I think, in this case it was an honest mistake from the support person, > which they corrected in a follow-up post. > > But the next conversion was a little disappointing as the problem was > already diagnosed out on the LKML. > > As Mario replied, the Twitter people do not seem to know the free > software world that well, that “normal” people actually are in contact > with the developers. > > What surprises me though is, that the change-log for the firmware seems > to be incomplete even for the Dell staff. > >>> Good to know when I go looking for a new laptop in the future. > > Unfortunately, there are not a lot of options. If you know a good > vendor, please share. > > Dell is one of the view “big” vendors selling laptops with a GNU/Linux > operating system installed. > > There are Google Chromebooks, which even have coreboot. Google’s > Chromium team does a great job and have a great quality assurance. On > par, or even better than Apple, I’d say. > > Some people need more powerful devices though. > > In Germany, I know of TUXEDO [1]. Also, Purism devices have GNU/Linux > installed [2]. > > TUXEDO does not build the devices themselves, and gets template > models(?) from Chinese manufactures. They only seem to start hiring the > expertise to do Linux kernel and OS work themselves [3]. Currently, it’s > mostly the stock Ubuntu for desktop with their artwork and some small > optimizations. When it comes to laptops, I've recently become a fan of System76 [1]. Linux runs pretty much flawlessly on all the systems I've ever encountered from them without needing any special configuration, and they offer some pretty high-end systems. Their Oryx Pro laptop is particularly impressive, it's got hardware on par with a desktop bearing a similar price-tag, which is rare even for systems that ship with Windows per-installed. They're based in the US, but I'm pretty certain they ship worldwide, and like most of the better manufacturers these days, the systems are made-to-order with quite a lot in the way of options (you can even get an NVMe boot drive in their higher-end systems if you're willing to shell out more than a third of the base cost for the system on it). They also do desktops and servers, but it's generally cheaper in my experience for anything but a laptop to just build it yourself. > >> Sorry you had that experience. I'll pass that on to get that messaging >> corrected. The team that does Linux support doesn't use twitter, they >> do phone and email support only. > > Thank you that’s good to know. > >> I'm glad you got things sorted moving to the next FW version. > > Me too. > > Mario, there are at least two more firmware bugs [4][5][6]. Having fast > suspend and resume says something about the quality of a device. If the > Dell XPS13 9360 is supposed to compete with Apple devices, and Google > Chromebooks, then this should be improved in my opinion. Do you have a > suggestion on how to best get this solved? Do you want me to contact the > support, or are there Dell employees with access to the Linux kernel > Bugzilla bug tracker? > > > Kind regards, > > Paul > > > [1] https://www.tuxedocomputers.com/ > [2] https://puri.sm/ > [3] > https://www.tuxedocomputers.com/Jobs-Karriere-Stellenausschreibungen.geek?x6a1ec=o8323ih26224vook9uu997r1a5 > > [4] https://github.molgen.mpg.de/mariux64/dell_xps13/ > [5] https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=185611 > [6] https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=185621 [1] https://system76.com/