From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-path: Received: from mail2.candelatech.com ([208.74.158.173]:38572 "EHLO mail2.candelatech.com" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1752962AbcKGOSm (ORCPT ); Mon, 7 Nov 2016 09:18:42 -0500 Message-ID: <58208D40.8070406@candelatech.com> (sfid-20161107_151846_284172_3CEA6D06) Date: Mon, 07 Nov 2016 06:18:40 -0800 From: Ben Greear MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Ashok Raj Nagarajan CC: Johannes Berg , Ashok Raj Nagarajan , linux-wireless@vger.kernel.org, ath10k@lists.infradead.org Subject: Re: [PATCH 1/2] cfg80211: Add support to set tx power for a station associated References: <1465926256-6463-1-git-send-email-arnagara@qti.qualcomm.com> <1467110918.2493.9.camel@sipsolutions.net> <1cb3e2cc49b433fe5ed834a33adf64b6@codeaurora.org> <1470043740.3389.10.camel@sipsolutions.net> <579F4E4E.80103@candelatech.com> <8908f6e7bb8ca043fbeb07ee8b004e8f@codeaurora.org> In-Reply-To: <8908f6e7bb8ca043fbeb07ee8b004e8f@codeaurora.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Sender: linux-wireless-owner@vger.kernel.org List-ID: On 11/07/2016 06:10 AM, Ashok Raj Nagarajan wrote: > On 2016-08-01 18:57, Ben Greear wrote: >> On 08/01/2016 02:29 AM, Johannes Berg wrote: >>> >>>> Sure.. First use case will be to help with the problem of legacy >>>> client devices that roam across multiple APs. It is a classic >>>> enterprise Wi-Fi AP problem, often managed by a "network controller" >>>> unit that is connected to all the APs. >>>> The problem is how to handle seamless handoff of clients between >>>> multiple APs while maximizing the client throughput and minimizing >>>> disruption of IP application services like VoIP calls and video >>>> streaming. A legacy client will often hold onto an AP association, >>>> even down to 1 Mbps as it roams away. Instead, if the AP can >>>> recognise that the client RSSI (and therefore throughput) is poor, it >>>> can "drop" the Tx power significantly (just to that client) such that >>>> it forcesthe client to look for a better, closer, and therefore >>>> higher-throughputassociation. It would "give it a kick" without >>>> blacklisting it. It just needsto hold the power low for the small >>>> amount of time it takes to convince it to go away. >>> >>> Not sure that *works* since implementations may just compare beacon >>> signal strength and hold on to the AP based on that, but it does seem >>> like a reasonable use case. >> >> How is that better than just kicking the station deliberately and/or >> refusing to send frames to it at all? >> > > Ben, deliberately kicking out the station can potentially cause the black > listing behaviour on the client side and results in connection failures. Each > client handles the kickout logic differently. Reducing the tx power, causes the > station to trigger its roaming algorithm. We tested some phones a year or so ago, and used a variable attenuator to decrease the signal of one AP while ramping up signal of a second AP. They did not roam until they lost connection, and since we were not using an isolation chamber, we could not get the AP signal less than around -75 DB, so in our test, the phones often did not roam at all. http://www.candelatech.com/cookbook.php?vol=wifire&book=Emulating+Station+Motion+with+Programmable+Attenuator So, I am not sure you can assume much about scanning behaviour either. Maybe newer phones are better... Thanks, Ben -- Ben Greear Candela Technologies Inc http://www.candelatech.com From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-path: Received: from mail2.candelatech.com ([208.74.158.173]) by merlin.infradead.org with esmtp (Exim 4.85_2 #1 (Red Hat Linux)) id 1c3klf-0004WA-R9 for ath10k@lists.infradead.org; Mon, 07 Nov 2016 14:19:24 +0000 Message-ID: <58208D40.8070406@candelatech.com> Date: Mon, 07 Nov 2016 06:18:40 -0800 From: Ben Greear MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [PATCH 1/2] cfg80211: Add support to set tx power for a station associated References: <1465926256-6463-1-git-send-email-arnagara@qti.qualcomm.com> <1467110918.2493.9.camel@sipsolutions.net> <1cb3e2cc49b433fe5ed834a33adf64b6@codeaurora.org> <1470043740.3389.10.camel@sipsolutions.net> <579F4E4E.80103@candelatech.com> <8908f6e7bb8ca043fbeb07ee8b004e8f@codeaurora.org> In-Reply-To: <8908f6e7bb8ca043fbeb07ee8b004e8f@codeaurora.org> List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Sender: "ath10k" Errors-To: ath10k-bounces+kvalo=adurom.com@lists.infradead.org To: Ashok Raj Nagarajan Cc: linux-wireless@vger.kernel.org, Johannes Berg , Ashok Raj Nagarajan , ath10k@lists.infradead.org On 11/07/2016 06:10 AM, Ashok Raj Nagarajan wrote: > On 2016-08-01 18:57, Ben Greear wrote: >> On 08/01/2016 02:29 AM, Johannes Berg wrote: >>> >>>> Sure.. First use case will be to help with the problem of legacy >>>> client devices that roam across multiple APs. It is a classic >>>> enterprise Wi-Fi AP problem, often managed by a "network controller" >>>> unit that is connected to all the APs. >>>> The problem is how to handle seamless handoff of clients between >>>> multiple APs while maximizing the client throughput and minimizing >>>> disruption of IP application services like VoIP calls and video >>>> streaming. A legacy client will often hold onto an AP association, >>>> even down to 1 Mbps as it roams away. Instead, if the AP can >>>> recognise that the client RSSI (and therefore throughput) is poor, it >>>> can "drop" the Tx power significantly (just to that client) such that >>>> it forcesthe client to look for a better, closer, and therefore >>>> higher-throughputassociation. It would "give it a kick" without >>>> blacklisting it. It just needsto hold the power low for the small >>>> amount of time it takes to convince it to go away. >>> >>> Not sure that *works* since implementations may just compare beacon >>> signal strength and hold on to the AP based on that, but it does seem >>> like a reasonable use case. >> >> How is that better than just kicking the station deliberately and/or >> refusing to send frames to it at all? >> > > Ben, deliberately kicking out the station can potentially cause the black > listing behaviour on the client side and results in connection failures. Each > client handles the kickout logic differently. Reducing the tx power, causes the > station to trigger its roaming algorithm. We tested some phones a year or so ago, and used a variable attenuator to decrease the signal of one AP while ramping up signal of a second AP. They did not roam until they lost connection, and since we were not using an isolation chamber, we could not get the AP signal less than around -75 DB, so in our test, the phones often did not roam at all. http://www.candelatech.com/cookbook.php?vol=wifire&book=Emulating+Station+Motion+with+Programmable+Attenuator So, I am not sure you can assume much about scanning behaviour either. Maybe newer phones are better... Thanks, Ben -- Ben Greear Candela Technologies Inc http://www.candelatech.com _______________________________________________ ath10k mailing list ath10k@lists.infradead.org http://lists.infradead.org/mailman/listinfo/ath10k