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* [Buildroot] [PATCH] package/netperf: move SITE so s.b.n
@ 2021-05-27 12:50 Baruch Siach
  2021-06-01 20:15 ` Arnout Vandecappelle
                   ` (2 more replies)
  0 siblings, 3 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: Baruch Siach @ 2021-05-27 12:50 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: buildroot

The original site is gone.

Fixes:
http://autobuild.buildroot.net/results/8d4a2ef5a7f50ea21b844d6cf806bb83016ae17b/

Signed-off-by: Baruch Siach <baruch@tkos.co.il>
---
 package/netperf/netperf.mk | 2 +-
 1 file changed, 1 insertion(+), 1 deletion(-)

diff --git a/package/netperf/netperf.mk b/package/netperf/netperf.mk
index 8b2280830f3c..0c423249c4c9 100644
--- a/package/netperf/netperf.mk
+++ b/package/netperf/netperf.mk
@@ -5,7 +5,7 @@
 ################################################################################
 
 NETPERF_VERSION = 2.7.0
-NETPERF_SITE = ftp://ftp.netperf.org/netperf
+NETPERF_SITE = http://sources.buildroot.net/netperf
 NETPERF_SOURCE = netperf-$(NETPERF_VERSION).tar.bz2
 # gcc 5+ defaults to gnu99 which breaks netperf
 NETPERF_CONF_ENV = \
-- 
2.30.2

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread

* [Buildroot] [PATCH] package/netperf: move SITE so s.b.n
  2021-05-27 12:50 [Buildroot] [PATCH] package/netperf: move SITE so s.b.n Baruch Siach
@ 2021-06-01 20:15 ` Arnout Vandecappelle
  2021-06-02 17:27   ` Baruch Siach
  2021-06-02 17:34 ` Arnout Vandecappelle
  2021-06-10 20:10 ` Peter Korsgaard
  2 siblings, 1 reply; 13+ messages in thread
From: Arnout Vandecappelle @ 2021-06-01 20:15 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: buildroot



On 27/05/2021 14:50, Baruch Siach wrote:
> The original site is gone.
> 
> Fixes:
> http://autobuild.buildroot.net/results/8d4a2ef5a7f50ea21b844d6cf806bb83016ae17b/
> 
> Signed-off-by: Baruch Siach <baruch@tkos.co.il>
> ---
>  package/netperf/netperf.mk | 2 +-
>  1 file changed, 1 insertion(+), 1 deletion(-)
> 
> diff --git a/package/netperf/netperf.mk b/package/netperf/netperf.mk
> index 8b2280830f3c..0c423249c4c9 100644
> --- a/package/netperf/netperf.mk
> +++ b/package/netperf/netperf.mk
> @@ -5,7 +5,7 @@
>  ################################################################################
>  
>  NETPERF_VERSION = 2.7.0
> -NETPERF_SITE = ftp://ftp.netperf.org/netperf
> +NETPERF_SITE = http://sources.buildroot.net/netperf

 I believe upstream moved to https://hewlettpackard.github.io/netperf/

 That one *does* have a configure script. Still need to check if the tarball has
the same contents though. The hash doesn't match, that's for sure.

 Marked as changes requested.

 Regards,
 Arnout

>  NETPERF_SOURCE = netperf-$(NETPERF_VERSION).tar.bz2
>  # gcc 5+ defaults to gnu99 which breaks netperf
>  NETPERF_CONF_ENV = \
> 

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread

* [Buildroot] [PATCH] package/netperf: move SITE so s.b.n
  2021-06-01 20:15 ` Arnout Vandecappelle
@ 2021-06-02 17:27   ` Baruch Siach
  2021-06-02 17:30     ` Arnout Vandecappelle
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 13+ messages in thread
From: Baruch Siach @ 2021-06-02 17:27 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: buildroot

Hi Arnout,

On Tue, Jun 01 2021, Arnout Vandecappelle wrote:
> On 27/05/2021 14:50, Baruch Siach wrote:
>> The original site is gone.
>> 
>> Fixes:
>> http://autobuild.buildroot.net/results/8d4a2ef5a7f50ea21b844d6cf806bb83016ae17b/
>> 
>> Signed-off-by: Baruch Siach <baruch@tkos.co.il>
>> ---
>>  package/netperf/netperf.mk | 2 +-
>>  1 file changed, 1 insertion(+), 1 deletion(-)
>> 
>> diff --git a/package/netperf/netperf.mk b/package/netperf/netperf.mk
>> index 8b2280830f3c..0c423249c4c9 100644
>> --- a/package/netperf/netperf.mk
>> +++ b/package/netperf/netperf.mk
>> @@ -5,7 +5,7 @@
>>  ################################################################################
>>  
>>  NETPERF_VERSION = 2.7.0
>> -NETPERF_SITE = ftp://ftp.netperf.org/netperf
>> +NETPERF_SITE = http://sources.buildroot.net/netperf
>
>  I believe upstream moved to https://hewlettpackard.github.io/netperf/
>
>  That one *does* have a configure script. Still need to check if the tarball has
> the same contents though. The hash doesn't match, that's for sure.

So what is the right fix here? The new upstream website does not carry
the tarball we use.

baruch

>
>  Marked as changes requested.
>
>  Regards,
>  Arnout
>
>>  NETPERF_SOURCE = netperf-$(NETPERF_VERSION).tar.bz2
>>  # gcc 5+ defaults to gnu99 which breaks netperf
>>  NETPERF_CONF_ENV = \
>> 


-- 
                                                     ~. .~   Tk Open Systems
=}------------------------------------------------ooO--U--Ooo------------{=
   - baruch at tkos.co.il - tel: +972.52.368.4656, http://www.tkos.co.il -

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread

* [Buildroot] [PATCH] package/netperf: move SITE so s.b.n
  2021-06-02 17:27   ` Baruch Siach
@ 2021-06-02 17:30     ` Arnout Vandecappelle
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: Arnout Vandecappelle @ 2021-06-02 17:30 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: buildroot



On 02/06/2021 19:27, Baruch Siach wrote:
> Hi Arnout,
> 
> On Tue, Jun 01 2021, Arnout Vandecappelle wrote:
>> On 27/05/2021 14:50, Baruch Siach wrote:
>>> The original site is gone.
>>>
>>> Fixes:
>>> http://autobuild.buildroot.net/results/8d4a2ef5a7f50ea21b844d6cf806bb83016ae17b/
>>>
>>> Signed-off-by: Baruch Siach <baruch@tkos.co.il>
>>> ---
>>>  package/netperf/netperf.mk | 2 +-
>>>  1 file changed, 1 insertion(+), 1 deletion(-)
>>>
>>> diff --git a/package/netperf/netperf.mk b/package/netperf/netperf.mk
>>> index 8b2280830f3c..0c423249c4c9 100644
>>> --- a/package/netperf/netperf.mk
>>> +++ b/package/netperf/netperf.mk
>>> @@ -5,7 +5,7 @@
>>>  ################################################################################
>>>  
>>>  NETPERF_VERSION = 2.7.0
>>> -NETPERF_SITE = ftp://ftp.netperf.org/netperf
>>> +NETPERF_SITE = http://sources.buildroot.net/netperf
>>
>>  I believe upstream moved to https://hewlettpackard.github.io/netperf/
>>
>>  That one *does* have a configure script. Still need to check if the tarball has
>> the same contents though. The hash doesn't match, that's for sure.
> 
> So what is the right fix here? The new upstream website does not carry
> the tarball we use.

 If the contents is the same (i.e. extract both tarballs and diff -ru them) then
just update the hash.

 NO silly me, that doesn't work, because the hash on s.b.o will be different...
I'll just apply this patch as is then. Sorry for the noise.

 Regards,
 Arnout

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread

* [Buildroot] [PATCH] package/netperf: move SITE so s.b.n
  2021-05-27 12:50 [Buildroot] [PATCH] package/netperf: move SITE so s.b.n Baruch Siach
  2021-06-01 20:15 ` Arnout Vandecappelle
@ 2021-06-02 17:34 ` Arnout Vandecappelle
  2021-06-02 17:35   ` Arnout Vandecappelle
  2021-06-10 20:10 ` Peter Korsgaard
  2 siblings, 1 reply; 13+ messages in thread
From: Arnout Vandecappelle @ 2021-06-02 17:34 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: buildroot



On 27/05/2021 14:50, Baruch Siach wrote:
> The original site is gone.
> 
> Fixes:
> http://autobuild.buildroot.net/results/8d4a2ef5a7f50ea21b844d6cf806bb83016ae17b/
> 
> Signed-off-by: Baruch Siach <baruch@tkos.co.il>

 Applied to master, thanks.

 Regards,
 Arnout

> ---
>  package/netperf/netperf.mk | 2 +-
>  1 file changed, 1 insertion(+), 1 deletion(-)
> 
> diff --git a/package/netperf/netperf.mk b/package/netperf/netperf.mk
> index 8b2280830f3c..0c423249c4c9 100644
> --- a/package/netperf/netperf.mk
> +++ b/package/netperf/netperf.mk
> @@ -5,7 +5,7 @@
>  ################################################################################
>  
>  NETPERF_VERSION = 2.7.0
> -NETPERF_SITE = ftp://ftp.netperf.org/netperf
> +NETPERF_SITE = http://sources.buildroot.net/netperf
>  NETPERF_SOURCE = netperf-$(NETPERF_VERSION).tar.bz2
>  # gcc 5+ defaults to gnu99 which breaks netperf
>  NETPERF_CONF_ENV = \
> 

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread

* [Buildroot] [PATCH] package/netperf: move SITE so s.b.n
  2021-06-02 17:34 ` Arnout Vandecappelle
@ 2021-06-02 17:35   ` Arnout Vandecappelle
  2021-06-02 17:50     ` Baruch Siach
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 13+ messages in thread
From: Arnout Vandecappelle @ 2021-06-02 17:35 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: buildroot

 Gaah, I hit send too soon...

On 02/06/2021 19:34, Arnout Vandecappelle wrote:
> 
> 
> On 27/05/2021 14:50, Baruch Siach wrote:
>> The original site is gone.
>>
>> Fixes:
>> http://autobuild.buildroot.net/results/8d4a2ef5a7f50ea21b844d6cf806bb83016ae17b/
>>
>> Signed-off-by: Baruch Siach <baruch@tkos.co.il>
> 
>  Applied to master, thanks.
> 
>  Regards,
>  Arnout
> 
>> ---
>>  package/netperf/netperf.mk | 2 +-
>>  1 file changed, 1 insertion(+), 1 deletion(-)
>>
>> diff --git a/package/netperf/netperf.mk b/package/netperf/netperf.mk
>> index 8b2280830f3c..0c423249c4c9 100644
>> --- a/package/netperf/netperf.mk
>> +++ b/package/netperf/netperf.mk
>> @@ -5,7 +5,7 @@
>>  ################################################################################
>>  
>>  NETPERF_VERSION = 2.7.0
>> -NETPERF_SITE = ftp://ftp.netperf.org/netperf
>> +NETPERF_SITE = http://sources.buildroot.net/netperf

 We prefer buildroot.org over buildroot.net nowadays, so I changed that.

 Regards,
 Arnout

>>  NETPERF_SOURCE = netperf-$(NETPERF_VERSION).tar.bz2
>>  # gcc 5+ defaults to gnu99 which breaks netperf
>>  NETPERF_CONF_ENV = \
>>

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread

* [Buildroot] [PATCH] package/netperf: move SITE so s.b.n
  2021-06-02 17:35   ` Arnout Vandecappelle
@ 2021-06-02 17:50     ` Baruch Siach
  2021-06-02 20:33       ` Arnout Vandecappelle
  2021-06-06  7:21       ` Peter Korsgaard
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: Baruch Siach @ 2021-06-02 17:50 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: buildroot

Hi Arnout,

On Wed, Jun 02 2021, Arnout Vandecappelle wrote:
>>> -NETPERF_SITE = ftp://ftp.netperf.org/netperf
>>> +NETPERF_SITE = http://sources.buildroot.net/netperf
>
>  We prefer buildroot.org over buildroot.net nowadays, so I changed that.

BR2_BACKUP_SITE still defaults to "http://sources.buildroot.net". Should
we change that?

baruch

-- 
                                                     ~. .~   Tk Open Systems
=}------------------------------------------------ooO--U--Ooo------------{=
   - baruch at tkos.co.il - tel: +972.52.368.4656, http://www.tkos.co.il -

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread

* [Buildroot] [PATCH] package/netperf: move SITE so s.b.n
  2021-06-02 17:50     ` Baruch Siach
@ 2021-06-02 20:33       ` Arnout Vandecappelle
  2021-06-06  7:21       ` Peter Korsgaard
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: Arnout Vandecappelle @ 2021-06-02 20:33 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: buildroot



On 02/06/2021 19:50, Baruch Siach wrote:
> Hi Arnout,
> 
> On Wed, Jun 02 2021, Arnout Vandecappelle wrote:
>>>> -NETPERF_SITE = ftp://ftp.netperf.org/netperf
>>>> +NETPERF_SITE = http://sources.buildroot.net/netperf
>>
>>  We prefer buildroot.org over buildroot.net nowadays, so I changed that.
> 
> BR2_BACKUP_SITE still defaults to "http://sources.buildroot.net". Should
> we change that?

 It's just a nice-to-have. I applied your other patch with buildroot.net.

 Regards,
 Arnout

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread

* [Buildroot] [PATCH] package/netperf: move SITE so s.b.n
  2021-06-02 17:50     ` Baruch Siach
  2021-06-02 20:33       ` Arnout Vandecappelle
@ 2021-06-06  7:21       ` Peter Korsgaard
  2021-06-07 19:00         ` Arnout Vandecappelle
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 13+ messages in thread
From: Peter Korsgaard @ 2021-06-06  7:21 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: buildroot

>>>>> "Baruch" == Baruch Siach <baruch@tkos.co.il> writes:

 > Hi Arnout,
 > On Wed, Jun 02 2021, Arnout Vandecappelle wrote:
 >>>> -NETPERF_SITE = ftp://ftp.netperf.org/netperf
 >>>> +NETPERF_SITE = http://sources.buildroot.net/netperf
 >> 
 >> We prefer buildroot.org over buildroot.net nowadays, so I changed that.

 > BR2_BACKUP_SITE still defaults to "http://sources.buildroot.net". Should
 > we change that?

There is a fairly important difference between .net and .org, .net is
though the cloudflare cache, but .org goes straight to our upstream
server.

Given the extra bandwidth and availibility of Cloudflare, I would prefer
we use .net.

-- 
Bye, Peter Korsgaard

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread

* [Buildroot] [PATCH] package/netperf: move SITE so s.b.n
  2021-06-06  7:21       ` Peter Korsgaard
@ 2021-06-07 19:00         ` Arnout Vandecappelle
  2021-06-07 20:22           ` Peter Korsgaard
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 13+ messages in thread
From: Arnout Vandecappelle @ 2021-06-07 19:00 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: buildroot



On 06/06/2021 09:21, Peter Korsgaard wrote:
>>>>>> "Baruch" == Baruch Siach <baruch@tkos.co.il> writes:
> 
>  > Hi Arnout,
>  > On Wed, Jun 02 2021, Arnout Vandecappelle wrote:
>  >>>> -NETPERF_SITE = ftp://ftp.netperf.org/netperf
>  >>>> +NETPERF_SITE = http://sources.buildroot.net/netperf
>  >> 
>  >> We prefer buildroot.org over buildroot.net nowadays, so I changed that.
> 
>  > BR2_BACKUP_SITE still defaults to "http://sources.buildroot.net". Should
>  > we change that?
> 
> There is a fairly important difference between .net and .org, .net is
> though the cloudflare cache, but .org goes straight to our upstream
> server.
> 
> Given the extra bandwidth and availibility of Cloudflare, I would prefer
> we use .net.

 Wouldn't it be possible to route sources.buildroot.org through cloudflare as well?


 Regards,
 Arnout

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread

* [Buildroot] [PATCH] package/netperf: move SITE so s.b.n
  2021-06-07 19:00         ` Arnout Vandecappelle
@ 2021-06-07 20:22           ` Peter Korsgaard
  2021-06-08 16:36             ` Yann E. MORIN
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 13+ messages in thread
From: Peter Korsgaard @ 2021-06-07 20:22 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: buildroot

>>>>> "Arnout" == Arnout Vandecappelle <arnout@mind.be> writes:

Hi,

 >> >> We prefer buildroot.org over buildroot.net nowadays, so I changed that.
 >> 
 >> > BR2_BACKUP_SITE still defaults to "http://sources.buildroot.net". Should
 >> > we change that?
 >> 
 >> There is a fairly important difference between .net and .org, .net is
 >> though the cloudflare cache, but .org goes straight to our upstream
 >> server.
 >> 
 >> Given the extra bandwidth and availibility of Cloudflare, I would prefer
 >> we use .net.

 >  Wouldn't it be possible to route sources.buildroot.org through cloudflare as well?

It would, but there were some complications back when we set it up,
E.G. you need to use cloudflares DNS servers and we didn't originally
have control of the buildroot.org.

Only having cloudflare on one of the domains was also quite handy for
comparing behaviour when debugging in the beginning.

But yeah, we should probably use the same setup for both domains now. We
originally put Cloudflare in front because of bandwidth/latency issues
with s.b.o for some users. Given that Cloudflare is a bit controversial,
it is maybe worth checking if we should keep on using it or drop it.

According to the Cloudflare stats, ~45% of the requests are cached,
saving ~1TB traffic/month.

Thomas, I think you had performance issues in the beginning, can you
compare speed again?

-- 
Bye, Peter Korsgaard

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread

* [Buildroot] [PATCH] package/netperf: move SITE so s.b.n
  2021-06-07 20:22           ` Peter Korsgaard
@ 2021-06-08 16:36             ` Yann E. MORIN
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: Yann E. MORIN @ 2021-06-08 16:36 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: buildroot

Peter, All,

On 2021-06-07 22:22 +0200, Peter Korsgaard spake thusly:
> >>>>> "Arnout" == Arnout Vandecappelle <arnout@mind.be> writes:
>  >  Wouldn't it be possible to route sources.buildroot.org through cloudflare as well?
> It would, but there were some complications back when we set it up,
> E.G. you need to use cloudflares DNS servers and we didn't originally
> have control of the buildroot.org.
> 
> Only having cloudflare on one of the domains was also quite handy for
> comparing behaviour when debugging in the beginning.
> 
> But yeah, we should probably use the same setup for both domains now. We
> originally put Cloudflare in front because of bandwidth/latency issues
> with s.b.o for some users. Given that Cloudflare is a bit controversial,
> it is maybe worth checking if we should keep on using it or drop it.

I think we should keep s.b.n, and that we should keep it as the default
in all our settings: backup mirror, _SOURCES...

Also, I think we should keep s.b.o as uncached, so that we have a
fallback.

> According to the Cloudflare stats, ~45% of the requests are cached,
> saving ~1TB traffic/month.

I have really no idea whether a less-than-half cache-hit ratio is good
or not, especially for our use-case.

However, is this 45% ratio a hit ratio, or a volume ratio?

Also, how much of those are due to our autobuilders? To packages without
_SOURCES pointing to sbn (i.e. actual fallbacks)?

> Thomas, I think you had performance issues in the beginning, can you
> compare speed again?

Here are a few totally non-scientific tests, done on a machine that has
no caching proxy, and a direct 1Gbps connection to the internet; both
URLs where downloaded using wget:

http://sources.buildroot.net/linux/linux-cip-4.19.98-cip19-rt7.tar.gz (CDN)
  - first run (uncached?):  2021-06-08 18:21:12 (6.08 MB/s) - ?linux-cip-4.19.98-cip19-rt7.tar.gz? saved [161511299/161511299]
  - second run (cached?):   2021-06-08 18:21:20 (88.5 MB/s) - ?linux-cip-4.19.98-cip19-rt7.tar.gz? saved [161511299/161511299]

http://sources.buildroot.org/linux/linux-cip-4.19.98-cip19-rt7.tar.gz (direct)
  - first run (uncached?):  2021-06-08 18:22:40 (4.36 MB/s) - ?linux-cip-4.19.98-cip19-rt7.tar.gz? saved [161511299/161511299]
  - second run (cached?):   2021-06-08 18:23:00 (16.0 MB/s) - ?linux-cip-4.19.98-cip19-rt7.tar.gz? saved [161511299/161511299]
  - third run (cached?):    2021-06-08 18:24:00 (17.2 MB/s) - ?linux-cip-4.19.98-cip19-rt7.tar.gz? saved [161511299/161511299]

http://sources.buildroot.net/linux/linux-cip-4.19.98-cip19-rt7.tar.gz (CDN, again)
  - third run (cached?):    2021-06-08 18:24:17 (92.1 MB/s) - ?linux-cip-4.19.98-cip19-rt7.tar.gz? saved [161511299/161511299]

So, basically, the unseeded s.b.n is ~50% faster than unseeded s.b.o.
But once seeded s.b.n is ~20 times faster than unseeded s.b.o, and even
~6 times faster than seeded s.b.o.

So the CDN (s.b.n) does have a positive impact.

Regards,
Yann E. MORIN.

-- 
.-----------------.--------------------.------------------.--------------------.
|  Yann E. MORIN  | Real-Time Embedded | /"\ ASCII RIBBON | Erics' conspiracy: |
| +33 662 376 056 | Software  Designer | \ / CAMPAIGN     |  ___               |
| +33 561 099 427 `------------.-------:  X  AGAINST      |  \e/  There is no  |
| http://ymorin.is-a-geek.org/ | _/*\_ | / \ HTML MAIL    |   v   conspiracy.  |
'------------------------------^-------^------------------^--------------------'

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread

* [Buildroot] [PATCH] package/netperf: move SITE so s.b.n
  2021-05-27 12:50 [Buildroot] [PATCH] package/netperf: move SITE so s.b.n Baruch Siach
  2021-06-01 20:15 ` Arnout Vandecappelle
  2021-06-02 17:34 ` Arnout Vandecappelle
@ 2021-06-10 20:10 ` Peter Korsgaard
  2 siblings, 0 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: Peter Korsgaard @ 2021-06-10 20:10 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: buildroot

>>>>> "Baruch" == Baruch Siach <baruch@tkos.co.il> writes:

 > The original site is gone.
 > Fixes:
 > http://autobuild.buildroot.net/results/8d4a2ef5a7f50ea21b844d6cf806bb83016ae17b/

 > Signed-off-by: Baruch Siach <baruch@tkos.co.il>

Committed to 2021.02.x, thanks.

-- 
Bye, Peter Korsgaard

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread

end of thread, other threads:[~2021-06-10 20:10 UTC | newest]

Thread overview: 13+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2021-05-27 12:50 [Buildroot] [PATCH] package/netperf: move SITE so s.b.n Baruch Siach
2021-06-01 20:15 ` Arnout Vandecappelle
2021-06-02 17:27   ` Baruch Siach
2021-06-02 17:30     ` Arnout Vandecappelle
2021-06-02 17:34 ` Arnout Vandecappelle
2021-06-02 17:35   ` Arnout Vandecappelle
2021-06-02 17:50     ` Baruch Siach
2021-06-02 20:33       ` Arnout Vandecappelle
2021-06-06  7:21       ` Peter Korsgaard
2021-06-07 19:00         ` Arnout Vandecappelle
2021-06-07 20:22           ` Peter Korsgaard
2021-06-08 16:36             ` Yann E. MORIN
2021-06-10 20:10 ` Peter Korsgaard

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