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Sun, 5 Jul 2020 00:10:49 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by silver.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 70D4722658; Sun, 5 Jul 2020 00:10:49 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at osuosl.org Received: from silver.osuosl.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (.osuosl.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0l3eg-1pgcUZ; Sun, 5 Jul 2020 00:10:47 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: domain auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.6 X-Greylist: domain auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.6 Received: from mail-ot1-f43.google.com (mail-ot1-f43.google.com [209.85.210.43]) by silver.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4CEC32262E; Sun, 5 Jul 2020 00:10:47 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-ot1-f43.google.com with SMTP id 95so18484734otw.10; Sat, 04 Jul 2020 17:10:47 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=AAfvD7eVUzykpqTaydQQI48xJpTAV1lbxBxPht4H96U=; b=QUj/PKjNgozBmv2sAuPUPnOlMX/emem4MsXvBMPpj7opOz960SIeDY55KmJvUnEdMI 0DCfxdAo+ZUPGZb5xGL6Pw5A04K14pXnxR+IOJNSEQLA/7+9krrk4ctECZSv3HhoqAt+ Y8xBAv2qiA7jbXOptaVcmK2c5xtTtAzLl0P8vxy81sKxDee8M3sywC6Q2ss4nvaoIFLr gvhIJi8dlNkppW8RFqxn1xNP7HwQu/LZXcV4ClADkbpLhb/5zum9sDtSBTErONNRspGu LGimdttxOUYQjAedcAGCuvU8hiHk5FYWZXNYMdqWYMMWVpCPX11YV2hZnglbZE8rF3Ze SSbg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=AAfvD7eVUzykpqTaydQQI48xJpTAV1lbxBxPht4H96U=; b=Y8WHl5U1CXLDhclEnipNvybpi+CVwdT6pCzDcCA6MLUHTJggTcJ+CW0phSahJnWitc Z0oHehA3zkAg/hzDwsi6f9XYARzhxC86d6bBB7H/ckrp0EGFp4ic8Zkbdg0sN6gjrRMe o/YtNfTTITzIzsEFaenMq3e+FVkRL6Pwre24cTUdpxamxBxtC5zo5DywCDKikhCgtYTF s/Njzx4oInjWXxrgV+G5OHUHDTt9Hx8Pks8FzMjfXuZdDZHomP61tsOoJSOPc5GKHeZS 30PahneZWz7Yi3EcJRho0O+E+JEFS18/+fFMOx1BA5zQe1/Jk0pRang9I0BNoNjq/5u4 17MA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532U9N+DcArFV8eHrxcP7WLkAaaqgn2qfTWVRQr8AFF3ysvScaDr 8iAD+gSjNtX/nJHsWMtQLX7wYbnHkiphfNvcUhE= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJx4P9xmjxbshaRZ038bQLfWtJruGUTpuYqvvf/NdpzL1WljsizMm2LPGPUMc1qfAJqlQysj/qLd+xMieg17ssg= X-Received: by 2002:a9d:424:: with SMTP id 33mr19473364otc.76.1593907846387; Sat, 04 Jul 2020 17:10:46 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <159389297140.2210796.13590142254668787525.stgit@dwillia2-desk3.amr.corp.intel.com> <920e6dc0-628b-9bad-926a-d1238a373cda@infradead.org> In-Reply-To: From: Matthew Wilcox Date: Sat, 4 Jul 2020 20:10:33 -0400 Message-ID: To: Dave Airlie Cc: ksummit , Greg Kroah-Hartman , LKML , tech-board-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org, Chris Mason Subject: Re: [Ksummit-discuss] [PATCH] CodingStyle: Inclusive Terminology X-BeenThere: ksummit-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============5092817359549992651==" Errors-To: ksummit-discuss-bounces@lists.linuxfoundation.org Sender: "Ksummit-discuss" --===============5092817359549992651== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000fd19d205a9a696ba" --000000000000fd19d205a9a696ba Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Erm, red-black trees don't have a derivation from gambling terminology either. The wikipedia article says: In a 1978 paper, "A Dichromatic Framework for Balanced Trees",[6] Leonidas J. Guibas and Robert Sedgewick derived the red-black tree from the symmetric binary B-tree.[7] The color "red" was chosen because it was the best-looking color produced by the color laser printer available to the authors while working at Xerox PARC.[8] Another response from Guibas states that it was because of the red and black pens available to them to draw the trees.[9] Left-right tree makes no sense. It doesn't distinguish the rbtree from its predecessor the avl tree. I don't think it's helpful to rename a standard piece of computing terminology unless it's actually hurting us to have it. Obviously if it were called a "master-slave" tree, I would be in favour of renaming it. On Sat., Jul. 4, 2020, 19:42 Dave Airlie, wrote: > '. Colors to represent a policy requires an indirection. The > > > > how about: > > Using colors to represent a policy requires an indirection. > > I'd totally submit that red/black trees while in no way racist, are a > horrible indirection, as it means nothing if you've never interacted > with gambling culture, (and maybe James Bond movies). > > left/right trees make naturally more sense and translate into more > languages, so yes I think removal of color naming is a good thing even > for non-racist reasonings. > > Dave. > _______________________________________________ > Ksummit-discuss mailing list > Ksummit-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ksummit-discuss > --000000000000fd19d205a9a696ba Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Erm, red-black trees don't have a derivation from gam= bling terminology either. The wikipedia article says:

=
In a 1978 paper, "A Dichromatic Framework for = Balanced Trees",[6] Leonidas J. Guibas and Robert Sedgewick derived th= e red-black tree from the symmetric binary B-tree.[7] The color "red&q= uot; was chosen because it was the best-looking color produced by the color= laser printer available to the authors while working at Xerox PARC.[8] Ano= ther response from Guibas states that it was because of the red and black p= ens available to them to draw the trees.[9]

=
Left-right tree makes no sense. It doesn't dist= inguish the rbtree from its predecessor the avl tree.=C2=A0 I don't thi= nk it's helpful to rename a standard piece of computing terminology unl= ess it's actually hurting us to have it. Obviously if it were called a = "master-slave" tree, I would be in favour of renaming it.

On= Sat., Jul. 4, 2020, 19:42 Dave Airlie, <airlied@gmail.com> wrote:
'. Colors to represent a policy requires an indirection. The
>
> how about:
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Using colors to = represent a policy requires an indirection.

I'd totally submit that red/black trees while in no way racist, are a horrible indirection, as it means nothing if you've never interacted with gambling culture, (and maybe James Bond movies).

left/right trees make naturally more sense and translate into more
languages, so yes I think removal of color naming is a good thing even
for non-racist reasonings.

Dave.
_______________________________________________
Ksummit-discuss mailing list
Ksummit-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org
https://lists.linuxfoun= dation.org/mailman/listinfo/ksummit-discuss
--000000000000fd19d205a9a696ba-- --===============5092817359549992651== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Ksummit-discuss mailing list Ksummit-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ksummit-discuss --===============5092817359549992651==-- From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=AAfvD7eVUzykpqTaydQQI48xJpTAV1lbxBxPht4H96U=; b=QUj/PKjNgozBmv2sAuPUPnOlMX/emem4MsXvBMPpj7opOz960SIeDY55KmJvUnEdMI 0DCfxdAo+ZUPGZb5xGL6Pw5A04K14pXnxR+IOJNSEQLA/7+9krrk4ctECZSv3HhoqAt+ Y8xBAv2qiA7jbXOptaVcmK2c5xtTtAzLl0P8vxy81sKxDee8M3sywC6Q2ss4nvaoIFLr gvhIJi8dlNkppW8RFqxn1xNP7HwQu/LZXcV4ClADkbpLhb/5zum9sDtSBTErONNRspGu LGimdttxOUYQjAedcAGCuvU8hiHk5FYWZXNYMdqWYMMWVpCPX11YV2hZnglbZE8rF3Ze SSbg== MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <159389297140.2210796.13590142254668787525.stgit@dwillia2-desk3.amr.corp.intel.com> <920e6dc0-628b-9bad-926a-d1238a373cda@infradead.org> In-Reply-To: From: Matthew Wilcox Date: Sat, 4 Jul 2020 20:10:33 -0400 Message-ID: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000fd19d205a9a696ba" Subject: Re: [Tech-board-discuss] [Ksummit-discuss] [PATCH] CodingStyle: Inclusive Terminology List-Id: Public TAB discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , To: Dave Airlie Cc: ksummit , Greg Kroah-Hartman , Randy Dunlap , LKML , tech-board-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org, Chris Mason --000000000000fd19d205a9a696ba Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Erm, red-black trees don't have a derivation from gambling terminology either. The wikipedia article says: In a 1978 paper, "A Dichromatic Framework for Balanced Trees",[6] Leonidas J. Guibas and Robert Sedgewick derived the red-black tree from the symmetric binary B-tree.[7] The color "red" was chosen because it was the best-looking color produced by the color laser printer available to the authors while working at Xerox PARC.[8] Another response from Guibas states that it was because of the red and black pens available to them to draw the trees.[9] Left-right tree makes no sense. It doesn't distinguish the rbtree from its predecessor the avl tree. I don't think it's helpful to rename a standard piece of computing terminology unless it's actually hurting us to have it. Obviously if it were called a "master-slave" tree, I would be in favour of renaming it. On Sat., Jul. 4, 2020, 19:42 Dave Airlie, wrote: > '. Colors to represent a policy requires an indirection. The > > > > how about: > > Using colors to represent a policy requires an indirection. > > I'd totally submit that red/black trees while in no way racist, are a > horrible indirection, as it means nothing if you've never interacted > with gambling culture, (and maybe James Bond movies). > > left/right trees make naturally more sense and translate into more > languages, so yes I think removal of color naming is a good thing even > for non-racist reasonings. > > Dave. > _______________________________________________ > Ksummit-discuss mailing list > Ksummit-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ksummit-discuss > --000000000000fd19d205a9a696ba Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Erm, red-black trees don't have a derivation from gam= bling terminology either. The wikipedia article says:

=
In a 1978 paper, "A Dichromatic Framework for = Balanced Trees",[6] Leonidas J. Guibas and Robert Sedgewick derived th= e red-black tree from the symmetric binary B-tree.[7] The color "red&q= uot; was chosen because it was the best-looking color produced by the color= laser printer available to the authors while working at Xerox PARC.[8] Ano= ther response from Guibas states that it was because of the red and black p= ens available to them to draw the trees.[9]

=
Left-right tree makes no sense. It doesn't dist= inguish the rbtree from its predecessor the avl tree.=C2=A0 I don't thi= nk it's helpful to rename a standard piece of computing terminology unl= ess it's actually hurting us to have it. Obviously if it were called a = "master-slave" tree, I would be in favour of renaming it.

On= Sat., Jul. 4, 2020, 19:42 Dave Airlie, <airlied@gmail.com> wrote:
'. Colors to represent a policy requires an indirection. The
>
> how about:
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Using colors to = represent a policy requires an indirection.

I'd totally submit that red/black trees while in no way racist, are a horrible indirection, as it means nothing if you've never interacted with gambling culture, (and maybe James Bond movies).

left/right trees make naturally more sense and translate into more
languages, so yes I think removal of color naming is a good thing even
for non-racist reasonings.

Dave.
_______________________________________________
Ksummit-discuss mailing list
Ksummit-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org
https://lists.linuxfoun= dation.org/mailman/listinfo/ksummit-discuss
--000000000000fd19d205a9a696ba--