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From: Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>
To: Nadav Amit <nadav.amit@gmail.com>
Cc: Peter Zijlstra <peterz@infradead.org>,
	Jann Horn <jannh@google.com>, John Hubbard <jhubbard@nvidia.com>,
	X86 ML <x86@kernel.org>, Matthew Wilcox <willy@infradead.org>,
	Andrew Morton <akpm@linux-foundation.org>,
	kernel list <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	Linux-MM <linux-mm@kvack.org>,
	Andrea Arcangeli <aarcange@redhat.com>,
	"Kirill A . Shutemov" <kirill.shutemov@linux.intel.com>,
	jroedel@suse.de, ubizjak@gmail.com,
	Alistair Popple <apopple@nvidia.com>
Subject: Re: [PATCH 01/13] mm: Update ptep_get_lockless()s comment
Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2022 11:19:36 -0700	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <CAHk-=wjX_P78xoNcGDTjhkgffs-Bhzcwp-mdsE1maeF57Sh0MA@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <140B437E-B994-45B7-8DAC-E9B66885BEEF@gmail.com>

On Sat, Oct 29, 2022 at 7:17 PM Nadav Amit <nadav.amit@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Running the PoC on Linux 6.0.6 with these patches caused the following splat
> on the following line:
>
>         WARN_ON_ONCE(!folio_test_locked(folio) && !folio_test_dirty(folio));

Yeah, this is a sign of that "folio_mkclean() serializes with
folio_mark_dirty using rmap and the page table lock".

And page_remove_rmap() could *almost* be called later, but it does
have code that also depends on the page table lock, although it looks
like realistically that's just because it "knows" that means that
preemption is disabled, so it uses non-atomic statistics update.

I say "knows" in quotes, because that's what the comment says, but it
turns out that __mod_node_page_state() has to deal with CONFIG_RT
anyway and does that

        preempt_disable_nested();
        ...
        preempt_enable_nested();

thing.

And then it wants to see the vma, although that's actually only to see
if it's 'mlock'ed, so we could just squirrel that away.

So we *could* move page_remove_rmap() later into the TLB flush region,
but then we would have lost the page table lock anyway, so then
folio_mkclean() can come in regardless.

So that doesn't even help.

End result: we do want to do the page_set_dirty() and the
remove_rmap() under the paeg table lock, because it's what serializes
folio_mkclean().

And we'd _like_ to do the TLB flush before the remove_rmap(), but we
*really* don't want to do that for every page.

So my current gut feel is that we should just say that if you do
"MADV_DONTNEED or do a munmap() (which includes the "re-mmap() over
the area", while some other thread is still writing to that memory
region, you may lose writes.

IOW, just accept the behavior that Nadav's test-program tries to show,
and say "look, you're doing insane things, we've never given you any
other semantics, it's your problem" to any user program that does
that.

If a user program does MADV_DONTNEED on an area that it is actively
using at the same time in another thread, that sounds really really
bogus. Same goes doubly for 'munmap()' or over-mapping.

              Linus

  reply	other threads:[~2022-10-30 18:20 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 148+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2022-10-22 11:14 [PATCH 00/13] Clean up pmd_get_atomic() and i386-PAE Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-22 11:14 ` [PATCH 01/13] mm: Update ptep_get_lockless()s comment Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-24  5:42   ` John Hubbard
2022-10-24  8:00     ` Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-24 19:58       ` Jann Horn
2022-10-24 20:19         ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-24 20:23           ` Jann Horn
2022-10-24 20:36             ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-25  3:21             ` Matthew Wilcox
2022-10-25  7:54               ` Alistair Popple
2022-10-25 13:33                 ` Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-25 13:44                 ` Jann Horn
2022-10-26  0:45                   ` Alistair Popple
2022-10-25 14:02         ` Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-25 14:18           ` Jann Horn
2022-10-25 15:06             ` Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-26 16:45               ` Jann Horn
2022-10-27  7:08                 ` Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-27 18:13                   ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-27 19:35                     ` Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-27 19:43                       ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-27 20:15                     ` Nadav Amit
2022-10-27 20:31                       ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-27 21:44                         ` Nadav Amit
2022-10-28 23:57                           ` Nadav Amit
2022-10-29  0:42                             ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-29 18:05                               ` Nadav Amit
2022-10-29 18:36                                 ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-29 18:58                                   ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-29 19:14                                     ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-29 19:28                                       ` Nadav Amit
2022-10-30  0:18                                       ` Nadav Amit
2022-10-30  2:17                                     ` Nadav Amit
2022-10-30 18:19                                       ` Linus Torvalds [this message]
2022-10-30 18:51                                         ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-30 22:47                                           ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-31  1:47                                             ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-31  4:09                                               ` Nadav Amit
2022-10-31  4:55                                                 ` Nadav Amit
2022-10-31  5:00                                                 ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-31 15:43                                                   ` Nadav Amit
2022-10-31 17:32                                                     ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-31  9:36                                               ` Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-31 17:28                                                 ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-31 18:43                                                   ` mm: delay rmap removal until after TLB flush Linus Torvalds
2022-11-02  9:14                                                     ` Christian Borntraeger
2022-11-02  9:23                                                       ` Christian Borntraeger
2022-11-02 17:55                                                       ` Linus Torvalds
2022-11-02 18:28                                                         ` Linus Torvalds
2022-11-02 22:29                                                         ` Gerald Schaefer
2022-11-02 12:45                                                     ` Peter Zijlstra
2022-11-02 22:31                                                     ` Gerald Schaefer
2022-11-02 23:13                                                       ` Linus Torvalds
2022-11-03  9:52                                                     ` David Hildenbrand
2022-11-03 16:54                                                       ` Linus Torvalds
2022-11-03 17:09                                                         ` Linus Torvalds
2022-11-03 17:36                                                           ` David Hildenbrand
2022-11-04  6:33                                                     ` Alexander Gordeev
2022-11-04 17:35                                                       ` Linus Torvalds
2022-11-06 21:06                                                         ` Hugh Dickins
2022-11-06 22:34                                                           ` Linus Torvalds
2022-11-06 23:14                                                             ` Andrew Morton
2022-11-07  0:06                                                               ` Stephen Rothwell
2022-11-07 16:19                                                               ` Linus Torvalds
2022-11-07 23:02                                                                 ` Andrew Morton
2022-11-07 23:44                                                                   ` Stephen Rothwell
2022-11-07  9:12                                                           ` Peter Zijlstra
2022-11-07 20:07                                                           ` Johannes Weiner
2022-11-07 20:29                                                             ` Linus Torvalds
2022-11-07 23:47                                                               ` Linus Torvalds
2022-11-08  4:28                                                                 ` Linus Torvalds
2022-11-08 19:56                                                                   ` Linus Torvalds
2022-11-08 20:03                                                                     ` Konstantin Ryabitsev
2022-11-08 20:18                                                                       ` Linus Torvalds
2022-11-08 19:41                                                                 ` [PATCH 1/4] mm: introduce 'encoded' page pointers with embedded extra bits Linus Torvalds
2022-11-08 20:37                                                                   ` Nadav Amit
2022-11-08 20:46                                                                     ` Linus Torvalds
2022-11-09  6:36                                                                   ` Alexander Gordeev
2022-11-09 18:00                                                                     ` Linus Torvalds
2022-11-09 20:02                                                                       ` Linus Torvalds
2022-11-08 19:41                                                                 ` [PATCH 2/4] mm: teach release_pages() to take an array of encoded page pointers too Linus Torvalds
2022-11-08 19:41                                                                 ` [PATCH 3/4] mm: mmu_gather: prepare to gather encoded page pointers with flags Linus Torvalds
2022-11-08 19:41                                                                 ` [PATCH 4/4] mm: delay page_remove_rmap() until after the TLB has been flushed Linus Torvalds
2022-11-08 20:48                                                                   ` [lkp] [+115 bytes kernel size regression] [i386-tinyconfig] [0309f16088] " kernel test robot
2022-11-08 21:01                                                                     ` Linus Torvalds
2022-11-08 21:05                                                                   ` [PATCH 4/4] " Nadav Amit
2022-11-09 15:53                                                                   ` Johannes Weiner
2022-11-09 19:31                                                                     ` Hugh Dickins
2022-10-31  9:39                                               ` [PATCH 01/13] mm: Update ptep_get_lockless()s comment Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-31 17:22                                                 ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-31  9:46                                               ` Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-31  9:28                                             ` Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-31 17:19                                               ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-30 19:34                                         ` Nadav Amit
2022-10-29 19:39                                   ` John Hubbard
2022-10-29 20:15                                     ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-29 20:30                                       ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-29 20:42                                         ` John Hubbard
2022-10-29 20:56                                       ` Nadav Amit
2022-10-29 21:03                                         ` Nadav Amit
2022-10-29 21:12                                         ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-29 20:59                                       ` Theodore Ts'o
2022-10-26 19:43               ` Nadav Amit
2022-10-27  7:27                 ` Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-27 17:30                   ` Nadav Amit
2022-10-22 11:14 ` [PATCH 02/13] x86/mm/pae: Make pmd_t similar to pte_t Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-22 11:14 ` [PATCH 03/13] sh/mm: " Peter Zijlstra
2022-12-21 13:54   ` Guenter Roeck
2022-10-22 11:14 ` [PATCH 04/13] mm: Fix pmd_read_atomic() Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-22 17:30   ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-24  8:09     ` Peter Zijlstra
2022-11-01 12:41     ` Peter Zijlstra
2022-11-01 17:42       ` Linus Torvalds
2022-11-02  9:12       ` [tip: x86/mm] mm: Convert __HAVE_ARCH_P..P_GET to the new style tip-bot2 for Peter Zijlstra
2022-11-03 21:15       ` tip-bot2 for Peter Zijlstra
2022-12-17 18:55       ` tip-bot2 for Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-22 11:14 ` [PATCH 05/13] mm: Rename GUP_GET_PTE_LOW_HIGH Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-22 11:14 ` [PATCH 06/13] mm: Rename pmd_read_atomic() Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-22 11:14 ` [PATCH 07/13] mm/gup: Fix the lockless PMD access Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-23  0:42   ` Hugh Dickins
2022-10-24  7:42     ` Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-25  3:58       ` Hugh Dickins
2022-10-22 11:14 ` [PATCH 08/13] x86/mm/pae: Dont (ab)use atomic64 Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-22 11:14 ` [PATCH 09/13] x86/mm/pae: Use WRITE_ONCE() Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-22 17:42   ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-24 10:21     ` Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-22 11:14 ` [PATCH 10/13] x86/mm/pae: Be consistent with pXXp_get_and_clear() Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-22 17:53   ` Linus Torvalds
2022-10-24 11:13     ` Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-22 11:14 ` [PATCH 11/13] x86_64: Remove pointless set_64bit() usage Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-22 17:55   ` Linus Torvalds
2022-11-03 19:09   ` Nathan Chancellor
2022-11-03 19:23     ` Uros Bizjak
2022-11-03 19:35       ` Nathan Chancellor
2022-11-03 20:39         ` Linus Torvalds
2022-11-03 21:06           ` Peter Zijlstra
2022-11-04 16:01           ` Peter Zijlstra
2022-11-04 17:15             ` Linus Torvalds
2022-11-05 13:29               ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-11-05 15:14                 ` Peter Zijlstra
2022-11-05 20:54                   ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-11-07  9:14                   ` David Laight
2022-12-19 15:44               ` Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-22 11:14 ` [PATCH 12/13] x86/mm/pae: Get rid of set_64bit() Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-22 11:14 ` [PATCH 13/13] mm: Remove pointless barrier() after pmdp_get_lockless() Peter Zijlstra
2022-10-22 19:59   ` Yu Zhao
2022-10-22 17:57 ` [PATCH 00/13] Clean up pmd_get_atomic() and i386-PAE Linus Torvalds
2022-10-29 12:21 ` Peter Zijlstra

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