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From: Stefan Hajnoczi <stefanha@gmail.com>
To: Gerd Hoffmann <kraxel@redhat.com>
Cc: geoff@hostfission.com, virtio-dev@lists.oasis-open.org,
	"Alex Lau" <alexlau@chromium.org>,
	"Daniel Vetter" <daniel@ffwll.ch>,
	"Alexandre Courbot" <acourbot@chromium.org>,
	qemu-devel <qemu-devel@nongnu.org>,
	"Tomasz Figa" <tfiga@chromium.org>,
	"Keiichi Watanabe" <keiichiw@chromium.org>,
	"David Stevens" <stevensd@chromium.org>,
	"Hans Verkuil" <hverkuil@xs4all.nl>,
	"Stéphane Marchesin" <marcheu@chromium.org>,
	"Dylan Reid" <dgreid@chromium.org>,
	"Gurchetan Singh" <gurchetansingh@chromium.org>,
	"Dmitry Morozov" <dmitry.morozov@opensynergy.com>,
	"Pawel Osciak" <posciak@chromium.org>,
	"Linux Media Mailing List" <linux-media@vger.kernel.org>
Subject: Re: guest / host buffer sharing ...
Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2019 08:35:44 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <CAJSP0QWZc=z56CHEKa8WVe9Cw2-EhDFU+7NeGgL+g-Go5q3K5Q@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20191108072210.ywyneaoc2y4slth6@sirius.home.kraxel.org>

On Fri, Nov 8, 2019 at 8:22 AM Gerd Hoffmann <kraxel@redhat.com> wrote:
> > > Adding a list of common properties to the spec certainly makes sense,
> > > so everybody uses the same names.  Adding struct-ed properties for
> > > common use cases might be useful too.
> >
> > Why not define VIRTIO devices for wayland and friends?
>
> There is an out-of-tree implementation of that, so yes, that surely is
> an option.
>
> Wayland needs (a) shared buffers, mostly for gfx data, and (b) a stream
> pipe as control channel.  Pretty much the same for X11, except that
> shared buffers are optional because the X protocol can also squeeze all
> display updates through the stream pipe.
>
> So, if you want allow guests talk to the host display server you can run
> the stream pipe over vsock.  But there is nothing for the shared
> buffers ...
>
> We could replicate vsock functionality elsewhere.  I think that happened
> in the out-of-tree virtio-wayland implementation.  There also was some
> discussion about adding streams to virtio-gpu, slightly pimped up so you
> can easily pass around virtio-gpu resource references for buffer
> sharing.  But given that getting vsock right isn't exactly trivial
> (consider all the fairness issues when multiplexing multiple streams
> over a virtqueue for example) I don't think this is a good plan.

I also think vsock isn't the right fit.

Defining a virtio-wayland device makes sense to me: you get the guest
RAM access via virtqueues, plus the VIRTIO infrastructure (device IDs,
configuration space, feature bits, and existing reusable
kernel/userspace/QEMU code).

Stefan

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Stefan Hajnoczi <stefanha@gmail.com>
To: Gerd Hoffmann <kraxel@redhat.com>
Cc: geoff@hostfission.com, virtio-dev@lists.oasis-open.org,
	"Alex Lau" <alexlau@chromium.org>,
	"Alexandre Courbot" <acourbot@chromium.org>,
	qemu-devel <qemu-devel@nongnu.org>,
	"Tomasz Figa" <tfiga@chromium.org>,
	"Keiichi Watanabe" <keiichiw@chromium.org>,
	"David Stevens" <stevensd@chromium.org>,
	"Daniel Vetter" <daniel@ffwll.ch>,
	"Stéphane Marchesin" <marcheu@chromium.org>,
	"Dylan Reid" <dgreid@chromium.org>,
	"Gurchetan Singh" <gurchetansingh@chromium.org>,
	"Hans Verkuil" <hverkuil@xs4all.nl>,
	"Dmitry Morozov" <dmitry.morozov@opensynergy.com>,
	"Pawel Osciak" <posciak@chromium.org>,
	"Linux Media Mailing List" <linux-media@vger.kernel.org>
Subject: Re: guest / host buffer sharing ...
Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2019 08:35:44 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <CAJSP0QWZc=z56CHEKa8WVe9Cw2-EhDFU+7NeGgL+g-Go5q3K5Q@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20191108072210.ywyneaoc2y4slth6@sirius.home.kraxel.org>

On Fri, Nov 8, 2019 at 8:22 AM Gerd Hoffmann <kraxel@redhat.com> wrote:
> > > Adding a list of common properties to the spec certainly makes sense,
> > > so everybody uses the same names.  Adding struct-ed properties for
> > > common use cases might be useful too.
> >
> > Why not define VIRTIO devices for wayland and friends?
>
> There is an out-of-tree implementation of that, so yes, that surely is
> an option.
>
> Wayland needs (a) shared buffers, mostly for gfx data, and (b) a stream
> pipe as control channel.  Pretty much the same for X11, except that
> shared buffers are optional because the X protocol can also squeeze all
> display updates through the stream pipe.
>
> So, if you want allow guests talk to the host display server you can run
> the stream pipe over vsock.  But there is nothing for the shared
> buffers ...
>
> We could replicate vsock functionality elsewhere.  I think that happened
> in the out-of-tree virtio-wayland implementation.  There also was some
> discussion about adding streams to virtio-gpu, slightly pimped up so you
> can easily pass around virtio-gpu resource references for buffer
> sharing.  But given that getting vsock right isn't exactly trivial
> (consider all the fairness issues when multiplexing multiple streams
> over a virtqueue for example) I don't think this is a good plan.

I also think vsock isn't the right fit.

Defining a virtio-wayland device makes sense to me: you get the guest
RAM access via virtqueues, plus the VIRTIO infrastructure (device IDs,
configuration space, feature bits, and existing reusable
kernel/userspace/QEMU code).

Stefan


  reply	other threads:[~2019-11-08  7:35 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 139+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2019-11-05 10:54 guest / host buffer sharing Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-05 10:54 ` [virtio-dev] " Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-05 10:54 ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-05 11:35 ` Geoffrey McRae
2019-11-06  6:24   ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-06  6:24     ` [virtio-dev] " Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-06  6:24     ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-06  8:36 ` David Stevens
2019-11-06  8:36   ` [virtio-dev] " David Stevens
2019-11-06  8:36   ` David Stevens
2019-11-06 12:41   ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-06 12:41     ` [virtio-dev] " Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-06 12:41     ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-06 22:28     ` Geoffrey McRae
2019-11-07  6:48       ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-07  6:48         ` [virtio-dev] " Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-07  6:48         ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-20 12:13       ` Tomasz Figa
2019-11-20 12:13         ` [virtio-dev] " Tomasz Figa
2019-11-20 12:13         ` Tomasz Figa
2019-11-20 21:41         ` Geoffrey McRae
2019-11-21  5:51           ` Tomasz Figa
2019-11-21  5:51             ` [virtio-dev] " Tomasz Figa
2019-11-21  5:51             ` Tomasz Figa
2019-12-04 22:22             ` Dylan Reid
2019-12-04 22:22               ` Dylan Reid
2019-12-11  5:08               ` David Stevens
2019-12-11  5:08                 ` [virtio-dev] " David Stevens
2019-12-11  5:08                 ` David Stevens
2019-12-11  9:26                 ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-12-11  9:26                   ` [virtio-dev] " Gerd Hoffmann
2019-12-11  9:26                   ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-12-11 16:05                   ` [virtio-dev] " Enrico Granata
2019-12-11 16:05                     ` Enrico Granata
2019-12-12  6:40                   ` David Stevens
2019-12-12  6:40                     ` David Stevens
2019-12-12  6:40                     ` David Stevens
2019-12-12  9:41                     ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-12-12  9:41                       ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-12-12  9:41                       ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-12-12 12:26                       ` David Stevens
2019-12-12 12:26                         ` David Stevens
2019-12-12 12:26                         ` David Stevens
2019-12-12 13:30                         ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-12-12 13:30                           ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-12-12 13:30                           ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-12-13  3:21                           ` David Stevens
2019-12-13  3:21                             ` David Stevens
2019-12-13  3:21                             ` David Stevens
2019-12-16 13:47                             ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-12-16 13:47                               ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-12-16 13:47                               ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-12-17 12:59                               ` David Stevens
2019-12-17 12:59                                 ` David Stevens
2019-12-17 12:59                                 ` David Stevens
2019-11-06  8:43 ` Stefan Hajnoczi
2019-11-06  8:43   ` Stefan Hajnoczi
2019-11-06  9:51   ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-06  9:51     ` [virtio-dev] " Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-06  9:51     ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-06 10:10     ` [virtio-dev] " Dr. David Alan Gilbert
2019-11-06 10:10       ` Dr. David Alan Gilbert
2019-11-06 10:10       ` Dr. David Alan Gilbert
2019-11-07 11:11       ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-07 11:11         ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-07 11:11         ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-07 11:16         ` Dr. David Alan Gilbert
2019-11-07 11:16           ` Dr. David Alan Gilbert
2019-11-07 11:16           ` Dr. David Alan Gilbert
2019-11-08  6:45           ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-08  6:45             ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-08  6:45             ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-06 11:46     ` Stefan Hajnoczi
2019-11-06 11:46       ` Stefan Hajnoczi
2019-11-06 12:50       ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-06 12:50         ` [virtio-dev] " Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-06 12:50         ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-07 12:10         ` Stefan Hajnoczi
2019-11-07 12:10           ` Stefan Hajnoczi
2019-11-07 15:10           ` Frank Yang
2019-11-07 15:10             ` [virtio-dev] " Frank Yang
2019-11-20 11:58             ` Tomasz Figa
2019-11-20 11:58               ` [virtio-dev] " Tomasz Figa
2019-11-20 11:58               ` Tomasz Figa
2019-11-08  7:22           ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-08  7:22             ` [virtio-dev] " Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-08  7:22             ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-08  7:35             ` Stefan Hajnoczi [this message]
2019-11-08  7:35               ` Stefan Hajnoczi
2019-11-09  1:41               ` Stéphane Marchesin
2019-11-09  1:41                 ` Stéphane Marchesin
2019-11-09 10:12                 ` Stefan Hajnoczi
2019-11-09 10:12                   ` Stefan Hajnoczi
2019-11-09 11:16                   ` Tomasz Figa
2019-11-09 11:16                     ` [virtio-dev] " Tomasz Figa
2019-11-09 11:16                     ` Tomasz Figa
2019-11-09 12:08                     ` Stefan Hajnoczi
2019-11-09 12:08                       ` Stefan Hajnoczi
2019-11-09 15:12                       ` Tomasz Figa
2019-11-09 15:12                         ` [virtio-dev] " Tomasz Figa
2019-11-09 15:12                         ` Tomasz Figa
2019-11-18 10:20                         ` Stefan Hajnoczi
2019-11-18 10:20                           ` Stefan Hajnoczi
2019-11-20 10:11                           ` Tomasz Figa
2019-11-20 10:11                             ` [virtio-dev] " Tomasz Figa
2019-11-20 10:11                             ` Tomasz Figa
2019-11-20 12:11     ` Tomasz Figa
2019-11-20 12:11       ` [virtio-dev] " Tomasz Figa
2019-11-20 12:11       ` Tomasz Figa
2019-11-11  3:04   ` David Stevens
2019-11-11  3:04     ` [virtio-dev] " David Stevens
2019-11-11  3:04     ` David Stevens
2019-11-11 15:36     ` [virtio-dev] " Liam Girdwood
2019-11-11 15:36       ` Liam Girdwood
2019-11-11 15:36       ` Liam Girdwood
2019-11-12  0:54       ` Gurchetan Singh
2019-11-12  0:54         ` Gurchetan Singh
2019-11-12  0:54         ` Gurchetan Singh
2019-11-12 13:56         ` Liam Girdwood
2019-11-12 13:56           ` Liam Girdwood
2019-11-12 13:56           ` Liam Girdwood
2019-11-12 22:55           ` Gurchetan Singh
2019-11-12 22:55             ` Gurchetan Singh
2019-11-12 22:55             ` Gurchetan Singh
2019-11-19 15:31             ` Liam Girdwood
2019-11-19 15:31               ` Liam Girdwood
2019-11-19 15:31               ` Liam Girdwood
2019-11-20  0:42               ` Gurchetan Singh
2019-11-20  0:42                 ` Gurchetan Singh
2019-11-20  0:42                 ` Gurchetan Singh
2019-11-20  9:53               ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-20  9:53                 ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-20  9:53                 ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-25 16:46                 ` Liam Girdwood
2019-11-25 16:46                   ` Liam Girdwood
2019-11-25 16:46                   ` Liam Girdwood
2019-11-27  7:58                   ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-27  7:58                     ` Gerd Hoffmann
2019-11-27  7:58                     ` Gerd Hoffmann

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