From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.0 required=3.0 tests=BAYES_00,MAILING_LIST_MULTI, SPF_HELO_NONE,SPF_PASS,URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.0 Received: from mail.kernel.org (mail.kernel.org [198.145.29.99]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D487DC64E75 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:26 +0000 (UTC) Received: from vger.kernel.org (vger.kernel.org [23.128.96.18]) by mail.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90EC02080A for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:26 +0000 (UTC) Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S2387871AbgKWQZF (ORCPT ); Mon, 23 Nov 2020 11:25:05 -0500 Received: from mail-ot1-f68.google.com ([209.85.210.68]:35982 "EHLO mail-ot1-f68.google.com" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1729881AbgKWQZE (ORCPT ); Mon, 23 Nov 2020 11:25:04 -0500 Received: by mail-ot1-f68.google.com with SMTP id y24so10883659otk.3; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:25:03 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=SWzdE85KMSmQ5K6aYMgWVQjn8/tst2VI3dLUnv/55SM=; b=d0x9fulUFNti/Q3+p2aCc9Mj8vilJR5hSMDwfPMJkaMd/8KxtnNigLbLovUuRztxCP KeLToF9LZ7oUH0XS1cGw6j9pAP+ZtskwnZo5PnL5B5Y3O0oc+35Jg2HbKUvdqIUP7K/1 +qkrzgTnvD6THf/m6cQ0zAt0EbvRbP/RPaXzwzCap7igEVu4cbRqb3uS7A9iOXO1NPCc 3+ySAY+cU/5DeYMav0QUAMsiMlTryuJEGc+hzPSdaHA205ucZBwCdATfQ9TaL7lbrNTB htPmeY+sXfFJbCk1KgoKlFvVicivxaMBxOXrbwxr1Iz0mKw0ILDF5m7DKpDj1zKtfFgx wfyA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530whLoZvmihqHlmLSbmhu7BRoo6a44D7SSE/tHE0PVAML0gK6G5 Cs4NNTvUT+jqO6JlDsmbOFpm8ib8eDEBbskHJpE= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxW9u67TbnPp8ObIChv5a6F+ncd8SoV+BFvs894Bl4MJzyAX0TVAjkpawJr+z1OvIzzPyEcIsCefAg0WelXSFg= X-Received: by 2002:a9d:16f:: with SMTP id 102mr68959otu.206.1606148702991; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:25:02 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20201120105344.4345c14e@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011201129.B13FDB3C@keescook> <20201120115142.292999b2@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011220816.8B6591A@keescook> <9b57fd4914b46f38d54087d75e072d6e947cb56d.camel@HansenPartnership.com> <1c7d7fde126bc0acf825766de64bf2f9b888f216.camel@HansenPartnership.com> In-Reply-To: From: "Rafael J. Wysocki" Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2020 17:24:51 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [PATCH 000/141] Fix fall-through warnings for Clang To: James Bottomley Cc: Miguel Ojeda , Kees Cook , Jakub Kicinski , "Gustavo A. R. Silva" , linux-kernel , "moderated list:SOUND - SOC LAYER / DYNAMIC AUDIO POWER MANAGEM..." , amd-gfx list , bridge@lists.linux-foundation.org, ceph-devel@vger.kernel.org, cluster-devel@redhat.com, coreteam@netfilter.org, devel@driverdev.osuosl.org, dm-devel@redhat.com, drbd-dev@lists.linbit.com, dri-devel , GR-everest-linux-l2@marvell.com, GR-Linux-NIC-Dev@marvell.com, intel-gfx , intel-wired-lan@lists.osuosl.org, keyrings@vger.kernel.org, linux1394-devel@lists.sourceforge.net, ACPI Devel Maling List , linux-afs@lists.infradead.org, Linux ARM , linux-arm-msm , linux-atm-general@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-block@vger.kernel.org, linux-can@vger.kernel.org, linux-cifs@vger.kernel.org, Linux Crypto Mailing List , linux-decnet-user@lists.sourceforge.net, Ext4 Developers List , "open list:FRAMEBUFFER LAYER" , linux-geode@lists.infradead.org, linux-gpio@vger.kernel.org, linux-hams@vger.kernel.org, linux-hwmon@vger.kernel.org, linux-i3c@lists.infradead.org, "open list:LIBATA SUBSYSTEM (Serial and Parallel ATA drivers)" , linux-iio@vger.kernel.org, linux-input , linux-integrity@vger.kernel.org, "moderated list:ARM/Mediatek SoC..." , Linux Media Mailing List , linux-mmc , Linux-MM , linux-mtd@lists.infradead.org, linux-nfs@vger.kernel.org, linux-rdma@vger.kernel.org, Linux-Renesas , "open list:TARGET SUBSYSTEM" , linux-sctp@vger.kernel.org, linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org, linux-stm32@st-md-mailman.stormreply.com, "open list:ULTRA-WIDEBAND (UWB) SUBSYSTEM:" , linux-watchdog@vger.kernel.org, linux-wireless , Network Development , netfilter-devel@vger.kernel.org, nouveau , op-tee@lists.trustedfirmware.org, oss-drivers@netronome.com, patches@opensource.cirrus.com, rds-devel@oss.oracle.com, reiserfs-devel@vger.kernel.org, samba-technical@lists.samba.org, selinux@vger.kernel.org, target-devel@vger.kernel.org, tipc-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net, usb-storage@lists.one-eyed-alien.net, virtualization@lists.linux-foundation.org, wcn36xx@lists.infradead.org, "maintainer:X86 ARCHITECTURE (32-BIT AND 64-BIT)" , xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org, linux-hardening@vger.kernel.org, Nick Desaulniers , Nathan Chancellor , Miguel Ojeda , Joe Perches Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-wireless@vger.kernel.org On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 4:58 PM James Bottomley wrote: > > On Mon, 2020-11-23 at 15:19 +0100, Miguel Ojeda wrote: > > On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 11:36 PM James Bottomley > > wrote: [cut] > > > > Maintainers routinely review 1-line trivial patches, not to mention > > internal API changes, etc. > > We're also complaining about the inability to recruit maintainers: > > https://www.theregister.com/2020/06/30/hard_to_find_linux_maintainers_says_torvalds/ > > And burn out: > > http://antirez.com/news/129 Right. > The whole crux of your argument seems to be maintainers' time isn't > important so we should accept all trivial patches ... I'm pushing back > on that assumption in two places, firstly the valulessness of the time > and secondly that all trivial patches are valuable. > > > If some company does not want to pay for that, that's fine, but they > > don't get to be maintainers and claim `Supported`. > > What I'm actually trying to articulate is a way of measuring value of > the patch vs cost ... it has nothing really to do with who foots the > actual bill. > > One thesis I'm actually starting to formulate is that this continual > devaluing of maintainers is why we have so much difficulty keeping and > recruiting them. Absolutely. This is just one of the factors involved, but a significant one IMV. From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.0 required=3.0 tests=BAYES_00,MAILING_LIST_MULTI, SPF_HELO_NONE,SPF_PASS,URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.0 Received: from mail.kernel.org (mail.kernel.org [198.145.29.99]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1AEA0C56202 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:07 +0000 (UTC) Received: from kanga.kvack.org (kanga.kvack.org [205.233.56.17]) by mail.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A2BBE2083E for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:06 +0000 (UTC) DMARC-Filter: OpenDMARC Filter v1.3.2 mail.kernel.org A2BBE2083E Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; dmarc=fail (p=none dis=none) header.from=kernel.org Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=owner-linux-mm@kvack.org Received: by kanga.kvack.org (Postfix) id E404F6B00AE; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 11:25:05 -0500 (EST) Received: by kanga.kvack.org (Postfix, from userid 40) id DEEC56B00B0; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 11:25:05 -0500 (EST) X-Delivered-To: int-list-linux-mm@kvack.org Received: by kanga.kvack.org (Postfix, from userid 63042) id C90886B00B1; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 11:25:05 -0500 (EST) X-Delivered-To: linux-mm@kvack.org Received: from forelay.hostedemail.com (smtprelay0145.hostedemail.com [216.40.44.145]) by kanga.kvack.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9AD596B00AE for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 11:25:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtpin09.hostedemail.com (10.5.19.251.rfc1918.com [10.5.19.251]) by forelay02.hostedemail.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A88C33635 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:04 +0000 (UTC) X-FDA: 77516207328.09.bee15_281648127366 Received: from filter.hostedemail.com (10.5.16.251.rfc1918.com [10.5.16.251]) by smtpin09.hostedemail.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8194F180AD801 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:04 +0000 (UTC) X-HE-Tag: bee15_281648127366 X-Filterd-Recvd-Size: 7132 Received: from mail-ot1-f68.google.com (mail-ot1-f68.google.com [209.85.210.68]) by imf20.hostedemail.com (Postfix) with ESMTP for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:03 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-ot1-f68.google.com with SMTP id h19so3802619otr.1 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:25:03 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=SWzdE85KMSmQ5K6aYMgWVQjn8/tst2VI3dLUnv/55SM=; b=J6DhldjUZeS+q/+luaIPlSwSdspbxWubwbgP64KPPJ9dczZoX79YFNMzPYUcIScEhK SG0c04WUqBG2vBDoT1foYuwv494j4Z3VrV1mxraBO42Cr7uMXV3tWGAoBTllBVfaNnpO 1U1ZCMVWcyMXI1y9gWHShF0whJ2VQ2DY1j10Y9/kdAR+p13m622IuNxt5XZ9XYHHargw ASkFUH8y0/lnQUkQ0HmRxlPfnfaZJM/q5nZpujrcY3eFLf+xM5aJnUCGUxZs+NuXxDOq h5Iw5dsA+QSZCSoFRqMhQVQy/RkenaRdS3BztR9eVJ+qMes531m2vnCAw7GP4JHlrNMU 1njw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5303khGpNT/yg3M9UZjMbaebRzQzmbj3sb0+6vK2zjExwFTzbWOa 64SRGARwhLO88Ph+ZW2VwkmdmUsiPgngvrEIRMw= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxW9u67TbnPp8ObIChv5a6F+ncd8SoV+BFvs894Bl4MJzyAX0TVAjkpawJr+z1OvIzzPyEcIsCefAg0WelXSFg= X-Received: by 2002:a9d:16f:: with SMTP id 102mr68959otu.206.1606148702991; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:25:02 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20201120105344.4345c14e@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011201129.B13FDB3C@keescook> <20201120115142.292999b2@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011220816.8B6591A@keescook> <9b57fd4914b46f38d54087d75e072d6e947cb56d.camel@HansenPartnership.com> <1c7d7fde126bc0acf825766de64bf2f9b888f216.camel@HansenPartnership.com> In-Reply-To: From: "Rafael J. Wysocki" Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2020 17:24:51 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [PATCH 000/141] Fix fall-through warnings for Clang To: James Bottomley Cc: Miguel Ojeda , Kees Cook , Jakub Kicinski , "Gustavo A. R. Silva" , linux-kernel , "moderated list:SOUND - SOC LAYER / DYNAMIC AUDIO POWER MANAGEM..." , amd-gfx list , bridge@lists.linux-foundation.org, ceph-devel@vger.kernel.org, cluster-devel@redhat.com, coreteam@netfilter.org, devel@driverdev.osuosl.org, dm-devel@redhat.com, drbd-dev@lists.linbit.com, dri-devel , GR-everest-linux-l2@marvell.com, GR-Linux-NIC-Dev@marvell.com, intel-gfx , intel-wired-lan@lists.osuosl.org, keyrings@vger.kernel.org, linux1394-devel@lists.sourceforge.net, ACPI Devel Maling List , linux-afs@lists.infradead.org, Linux ARM , linux-arm-msm , linux-atm-general@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-block@vger.kernel.org, linux-can@vger.kernel.org, linux-cifs@vger.kernel.org, Linux Crypto Mailing List , linux-decnet-user@lists.sourceforge.net, Ext4 Developers List , "open list:FRAMEBUFFER LAYER" , linux-geode@lists.infradead.org, linux-gpio@vger.kernel.org, linux-hams@vger.kernel.org, linux-hwmon@vger.kernel.org, linux-i3c@lists.infradead.org, "open list:LIBATA SUBSYSTEM (Serial and Parallel ATA drivers)" , linux-iio@vger.kernel.org, linux-input , linux-integrity@vger.kernel.org, "moderated list:ARM/Mediatek SoC..." , Linux Media Mailing List , linux-mmc , Linux-MM , linux-mtd@lists.infradead.org, linux-nfs@vger.kernel.org, linux-rdma@vger.kernel.org, Linux-Renesas , "open list:TARGET SUBSYSTEM" , linux-sctp@vger.kernel.org, linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org, linux-stm32@st-md-mailman.stormreply.com, "open list:ULTRA-WIDEBAND (UWB) SUBSYSTEM:" , linux-watchdog@vger.kernel.org, linux-wireless , Network Development , netfilter-devel@vger.kernel.org, nouveau , op-tee@lists.trustedfirmware.org, oss-drivers@netronome.com, patches@opensource.cirrus.com, rds-devel@oss.oracle.com, reiserfs-devel@vger.kernel.org, samba-technical@lists.samba.org, selinux@vger.kernel.org, target-devel@vger.kernel.org, tipc-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net, usb-storage@lists.one-eyed-alien.net, virtualization@lists.linux-foundation.org, wcn36xx@lists.infradead.org, "maintainer:X86 ARCHITECTURE (32-BIT AND 64-BIT)" , xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org, linux-hardening@vger.kernel.org, Nick Desaulniers , Nathan Chancellor , Miguel Ojeda , Joe Perches Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Bogosity: Ham, tests=bogofilter, spamicity=0.000000, version=1.2.4 Sender: owner-linux-mm@kvack.org Precedence: bulk X-Loop: owner-majordomo@kvack.org List-ID: On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 4:58 PM James Bottomley wrote: > > On Mon, 2020-11-23 at 15:19 +0100, Miguel Ojeda wrote: > > On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 11:36 PM James Bottomley > > wrote: [cut] > > > > Maintainers routinely review 1-line trivial patches, not to mention > > internal API changes, etc. > > We're also complaining about the inability to recruit maintainers: > > https://www.theregister.com/2020/06/30/hard_to_find_linux_maintainers_says_torvalds/ > > And burn out: > > http://antirez.com/news/129 Right. > The whole crux of your argument seems to be maintainers' time isn't > important so we should accept all trivial patches ... I'm pushing back > on that assumption in two places, firstly the valulessness of the time > and secondly that all trivial patches are valuable. > > > If some company does not want to pay for that, that's fine, but they > > don't get to be maintainers and claim `Supported`. > > What I'm actually trying to articulate is a way of measuring value of > the patch vs cost ... it has nothing really to do with who foots the > actual bill. > > One thesis I'm actually starting to formulate is that this continual > devaluing of maintainers is why we have so much difficulty keeping and > recruiting them. Absolutely. This is just one of the factors involved, but a significant one IMV. From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.0 required=3.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED, DKIM_VALID,MAILING_LIST_MULTI,SPF_HELO_NONE,SPF_PASS,URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.0 Received: from mail.kernel.org (mail.kernel.org [198.145.29.99]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 76BD1C2D0E4 for ; Tue, 24 Nov 2020 17:15:31 +0000 (UTC) Received: from alsa0.perex.cz (alsa0.perex.cz [77.48.224.243]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A99FF206F7 for ; Tue, 24 Nov 2020 17:15:30 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=alsa-project.org header.i=@alsa-project.org header.b="fbH9WPzW" DMARC-Filter: OpenDMARC Filter v1.3.2 mail.kernel.org A99FF206F7 Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; dmarc=fail (p=none dis=none) header.from=kernel.org Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=alsa-devel-bounces@alsa-project.org Received: from alsa1.perex.cz (alsa1.perex.cz [207.180.221.201]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by alsa0.perex.cz (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E42F017F0; Tue, 24 Nov 2020 18:14:38 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.11.0 alsa0.perex.cz E42F017F0 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=alsa-project.org; s=default; t=1606238129; bh=SWzdE85KMSmQ5K6aYMgWVQjn8/tst2VI3dLUnv/55SM=; h=References:In-Reply-To:From:Date:Subject:To:Cc:List-Id: List-Unsubscribe:List-Archive:List-Post:List-Help:List-Subscribe: From; b=fbH9WPzWkSCxWfzNXDgSCmFwEz8tGmoW8I628UAiOiJCivvg1KEDuGh7o9OWRKdLq YZICBqTMd1rr4kjwuxc2qEis2eh+JnxqHIscI6bTY7BcWi1XSR97L7GAmHvtFhUTqA NI63RsESSgLK7i+yvLpnRTdN3UrM6bI3tYLfuTEY= Received: from alsa1.perex.cz (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by alsa1.perex.cz (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C097F805FF; Tue, 24 Nov 2020 17:58:50 +0100 (CET) Received: by alsa1.perex.cz (Postfix, from userid 50401) id 256AEF80255; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 17:25:16 +0100 (CET) Received: from mail-ot1-f67.google.com (mail-ot1-f67.google.com [209.85.210.67]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by alsa1.perex.cz (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D1F11F80128 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 17:25:04 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.11.0 alsa1.perex.cz D1F11F80128 Received: by mail-ot1-f67.google.com with SMTP id o3so16422865ota.8 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:25:04 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=SWzdE85KMSmQ5K6aYMgWVQjn8/tst2VI3dLUnv/55SM=; b=kV18Z4Uii1Y6ixVVi4PGb8jt4CWFd+Piw/XSNUQ8WaY6SLomRIz+ObXKsxBUVVfBRv PEgm8y7ZuFOL6vNPqDDY4pSUkZ871PFSARDXfgDZC8SmEynahH6LadUbuY6bFpp+yqWp YDP6TTZJlKCBRAgCsNVVKyw7QIh3gn4i4anwdhEA/y6oKQm4VELM4/TBCs0qLdkpCX/h adbLcN215/w6iBwjstHnrFMe3f5FsEeVkGf6G13LExzS8Msndu51wH5n/m4wLo9TllC5 jqMP2LuvRbNeqZOfzmaz8Nu5HQcKNmOW8tZRC/buZGTVWG7lSt6mbfaXgvZPMqIWfC0d h13A== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532beBiwz+71iyNZRBlzirKVniThU5mjReTQpVxejlgfJy7sqxo0 Jbaw5yjCeb3Uh2qYyNaafxy+igr+EQfqw6qQlTA= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxW9u67TbnPp8ObIChv5a6F+ncd8SoV+BFvs894Bl4MJzyAX0TVAjkpawJr+z1OvIzzPyEcIsCefAg0WelXSFg= X-Received: by 2002:a9d:16f:: with SMTP id 102mr68959otu.206.1606148702991; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:25:02 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20201120105344.4345c14e@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011201129.B13FDB3C@keescook> <20201120115142.292999b2@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011220816.8B6591A@keescook> <9b57fd4914b46f38d54087d75e072d6e947cb56d.camel@HansenPartnership.com> <1c7d7fde126bc0acf825766de64bf2f9b888f216.camel@HansenPartnership.com> In-Reply-To: From: "Rafael J. Wysocki" Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2020 17:24:51 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [PATCH 000/141] Fix fall-through warnings for Clang To: James Bottomley Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 24 Nov 2020 17:58:07 +0100 Cc: "moderated list:SOUND - SOC LAYER / DYNAMIC AUDIO POWER MANAGEM..." , linux-atm-general@lists.sourceforge.net, reiserfs-devel@vger.kernel.org, linux-iio@vger.kernel.org, linux-wireless , "open list:FRAMEBUFFER LAYER" , dri-devel , linux-kernel , Nathan Chancellor , "open list:LIBATA SUBSYSTEM \(Serial and Parallel ATA drivers\)" , dm-devel@redhat.com, keyrings@vger.kernel.org, linux-mtd@lists.infradead.org, GR-everest-linux-l2@marvell.com, wcn36xx@lists.infradead.org, samba-technical@lists.samba.org, linux-i3c@lists.infradead.org, linux1394-devel@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-afs@lists.infradead.org, usb-storage@lists.one-eyed-alien.net, drbd-dev@lists.linbit.com, devel@driverdev.osuosl.org, linux-cifs@vger.kernel.org, rds-devel@oss.oracle.com, Nick Desaulniers , "open list:TARGET SUBSYSTEM" , linux-rdma@vger.kernel.org, oss-drivers@netronome.com, bridge@lists.linux-foundation.org, linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org, amd-gfx list , linux-stm32@st-md-mailman.stormreply.com, cluster-devel@redhat.com, ACPI Devel Maling List , coreteam@netfilter.org, intel-wired-lan@lists.osuosl.org, linux-input , Miguel Ojeda , Jakub Kicinski , Ext4 Developers List , Linux Media Mailing List , Kees Cook , selinux@vger.kernel.org, linux-arm-msm , intel-gfx , linux-geode@lists.infradead.org, linux-can@vger.kernel.org, linux-block@vger.kernel.org, linux-gpio@vger.kernel.org, op-tee@lists.trustedfirmware.org, "moderated list:ARM/Mediatek SoC..." , xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org, nouveau , linux-hams@vger.kernel.org, ceph-devel@vger.kernel.org, virtualization@lists.linux-foundation.org, Linux ARM , linux-hwmon@vger.kernel.org, linux-watchdog@vger.kernel.org, linux-nfs@vger.kernel.org, GR-Linux-NIC-Dev@marvell.com, tipc-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net, Linux-MM , Network Development , linux-decnet-user@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-mmc , "Gustavo A. R. Silva" , "maintainer:X86 ARCHITECTURE \(32-BIT AND 64-BIT\)" , Linux-Renesas , Miguel Ojeda , linux-sctp@vger.kernel.org, "open list:ULTRA-WIDEBAND \(UWB\) SUBSYSTEM:" , netfilter-devel@vger.kernel.org, Linux Crypto Mailing List , patches@opensource.cirrus.com, Joe Perches , linux-integrity@vger.kernel.org, target-devel@vger.kernel.org, linux-hardening@vger.kernel.org X-BeenThere: alsa-devel@alsa-project.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Alsa-devel mailing list for ALSA developers - http://www.alsa-project.org" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: alsa-devel-bounces@alsa-project.org Sender: "Alsa-devel" On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 4:58 PM James Bottomley wrote: > > On Mon, 2020-11-23 at 15:19 +0100, Miguel Ojeda wrote: > > On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 11:36 PM James Bottomley > > wrote: [cut] > > > > Maintainers routinely review 1-line trivial patches, not to mention > > internal API changes, etc. > > We're also complaining about the inability to recruit maintainers: > > https://www.theregister.com/2020/06/30/hard_to_find_linux_maintainers_says_torvalds/ > > And burn out: > > http://antirez.com/news/129 Right. > The whole crux of your argument seems to be maintainers' time isn't > important so we should accept all trivial patches ... I'm pushing back > on that assumption in two places, firstly the valulessness of the time > and secondly that all trivial patches are valuable. > > > If some company does not want to pay for that, that's fine, but they > > don't get to be maintainers and claim `Supported`. > > What I'm actually trying to articulate is a way of measuring value of > the patch vs cost ... it has nothing really to do with who foots the > actual bill. > > One thesis I'm actually starting to formulate is that this continual > devaluing of maintainers is why we have so much difficulty keeping and > recruiting them. Absolutely. This is just one of the factors involved, but a significant one IMV. From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.0 required=3.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIMWL_WL_HIGH, DKIM_SIGNED,DKIM_VALID,MAILING_LIST_MULTI,SPF_HELO_NONE,SPF_PASS, URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.0 Received: from mail.kernel.org (mail.kernel.org [198.145.29.99]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE73CC2D0E4 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:26:09 +0000 (UTC) Received: from merlin.infradead.org (merlin.infradead.org [205.233.59.134]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6EBE82080A for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:26:09 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=lists.infradead.org header.i=@lists.infradead.org header.b="HYR+TyDg" DMARC-Filter: OpenDMARC Filter v1.3.2 mail.kernel.org 6EBE82080A Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; dmarc=fail (p=none dis=none) header.from=kernel.org Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; spf=none smtp.mailfrom=linux-mtd-bounces+linux-mtd=archiver.kernel.org@lists.infradead.org DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=lists.infradead.org; s=merlin.20170209; h=Sender:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-Type:Cc:List-Subscribe:List-Help:List-Post:List-Archive: List-Unsubscribe:List-Id:To:Subject:Message-ID:Date:From:In-Reply-To: References:MIME-Version:Reply-To:Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date: Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Owner; bh=g6SVVdjDrdujVKJe6v4usQmmgbjMMXtUSYbPfeWqQ+A=; b=HYR+TyDgRUZ94dU3uTkRE+x2G cs1MTSvt51UBM4KZoqluB1mu59jAqP+WL4qPLKBUmC3B5WL7G3I1CFJKrwQ0UjT8LmAh1kAN9hYY5 Ka5os+3JAham/7E0Dg5N++XRf2js/xJSH6jZifYvDLh021SHvTUjI8GbsfbyBMltD6PkIglSDNbXD XtNcO0VoCsXCY9LJZHfLDayQlrFMDMbWRBaPfSjZ28HKvf72dEaRz6D3+tI1elrlxRAj1j0FQUxIf sIeph2L6T35ZOsbCSodUOMTa77IKO8FpJZKKJl+y3MdY5ejajs6OzD/iU7X7NpfDIPU0x9hHJgW0c BZ2VfFJYA==; Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=merlin.infradead.org) by merlin.infradead.org with esmtp (Exim 4.92.3 #3 (Red Hat Linux)) id 1khEeP-0006T4-93; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:13 +0000 Received: from mail-ot1-f68.google.com ([209.85.210.68]) by merlin.infradead.org with esmtps (Exim 4.92.3 #3 (Red Hat Linux)) id 1khEeH-0006Ox-3w; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:06 +0000 Received: by mail-ot1-f68.google.com with SMTP id n12so12914981otk.0; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:25:03 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=SWzdE85KMSmQ5K6aYMgWVQjn8/tst2VI3dLUnv/55SM=; b=jDEjvEJtiSTwKWHClnRHJtASuPUXtO8lR6UX+a4N1BXZGIB952iIySFAJcB0jDyBuM NhRo1t8lQa7N3W7ouvgsh8IgV2YkdBb95NX1K/9jtOMYHGlVxAvgSBwKPgdCk5NJTrx2 uYcOjpM0bc28ZQlKoHSFfX9w4hp05Mt0kuLGG+fLXWwJgCYiiCmGfWeYX/7ztVQMaPks /LFPnpbaL9Ahwpms+y/auhqJs7dWr6exWznrag8LvdqM2Vo8VoeBZDpfYnpu6Y2Gg2wI TCspBd85QkOq+kSwfnH2bIcERput4mIgQCkdCqgH2Kuk7wxAmaO791KFfteuP1nA+rob Y8Pg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532wsjkeTqJOy+uBsGV2EshVnvRexTMjMlbRRTMn/Ko+g45O4zS2 2Lz7FHHt8x8IyfDuBHmmg1xWmguGKEBwhy07Tr8= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxW9u67TbnPp8ObIChv5a6F+ncd8SoV+BFvs894Bl4MJzyAX0TVAjkpawJr+z1OvIzzPyEcIsCefAg0WelXSFg= X-Received: by 2002:a9d:16f:: with SMTP id 102mr68959otu.206.1606148702991; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:25:02 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20201120105344.4345c14e@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011201129.B13FDB3C@keescook> <20201120115142.292999b2@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011220816.8B6591A@keescook> <9b57fd4914b46f38d54087d75e072d6e947cb56d.camel@HansenPartnership.com> <1c7d7fde126bc0acf825766de64bf2f9b888f216.camel@HansenPartnership.com> In-Reply-To: From: "Rafael J. Wysocki" Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2020 17:24:51 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [PATCH 000/141] Fix fall-through warnings for Clang To: James Bottomley X-CRM114-Version: 20100106-BlameMichelson ( TRE 0.8.0 (BSD) ) MR-646709E3 X-CRM114-CacheID: sfid-20201123_112505_466489_C9EF8A05 X-CRM114-Status: GOOD ( 17.69 ) X-BeenThere: linux-mtd@lists.infradead.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Linux MTD discussion mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: "moderated list:SOUND - SOC LAYER / DYNAMIC AUDIO POWER MANAGEM..." , linux-atm-general@lists.sourceforge.net, reiserfs-devel@vger.kernel.org, linux-iio@vger.kernel.org, linux-wireless , "open list:FRAMEBUFFER LAYER" , dri-devel , linux-kernel , Nathan Chancellor , "open list:LIBATA SUBSYSTEM \(Serial and Parallel ATA drivers\)" , dm-devel@redhat.com, keyrings@vger.kernel.org, linux-mtd@lists.infradead.org, GR-everest-linux-l2@marvell.com, wcn36xx@lists.infradead.org, samba-technical@lists.samba.org, linux-i3c@lists.infradead.org, linux1394-devel@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-afs@lists.infradead.org, usb-storage@lists.one-eyed-alien.net, drbd-dev@lists.linbit.com, devel@driverdev.osuosl.org, linux-cifs@vger.kernel.org, rds-devel@oss.oracle.com, Nick Desaulniers , "open list:TARGET SUBSYSTEM" , linux-rdma@vger.kernel.org, oss-drivers@netronome.com, bridge@lists.linux-foundation.org, linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org, amd-gfx list , linux-stm32@st-md-mailman.stormreply.com, cluster-devel@redhat.com, ACPI Devel Maling List , coreteam@netfilter.org, intel-wired-lan@lists.osuosl.org, linux-input , Miguel Ojeda , Jakub Kicinski , Ext4 Developers List , Linux Media Mailing List , Kees Cook , selinux@vger.kernel.org, linux-arm-msm , intel-gfx , linux-geode@lists.infradead.org, linux-can@vger.kernel.org, linux-block@vger.kernel.org, linux-gpio@vger.kernel.org, op-tee@lists.trustedfirmware.org, "moderated list:ARM/Mediatek SoC..." , xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org, nouveau , linux-hams@vger.kernel.org, ceph-devel@vger.kernel.org, virtualization@lists.linux-foundation.org, Linux ARM , linux-hwmon@vger.kernel.org, linux-watchdog@vger.kernel.org, linux-nfs@vger.kernel.org, GR-Linux-NIC-Dev@marvell.com, tipc-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net, Linux-MM , Network Development , linux-decnet-user@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-mmc , "Gustavo A. R. Silva" , "maintainer:X86 ARCHITECTURE \(32-BIT AND 64-BIT\)" , Linux-Renesas , Miguel Ojeda , linux-sctp@vger.kernel.org, "open list:ULTRA-WIDEBAND \(UWB\) SUBSYSTEM:" , netfilter-devel@vger.kernel.org, Linux Crypto Mailing List , patches@opensource.cirrus.com, Joe Perches , linux-integrity@vger.kernel.org, target-devel@vger.kernel.org, linux-hardening@vger.kernel.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: "linux-mtd" Errors-To: linux-mtd-bounces+linux-mtd=archiver.kernel.org@lists.infradead.org On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 4:58 PM James Bottomley wrote: > > On Mon, 2020-11-23 at 15:19 +0100, Miguel Ojeda wrote: > > On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 11:36 PM James Bottomley > > wrote: [cut] > > > > Maintainers routinely review 1-line trivial patches, not to mention > > internal API changes, etc. > > We're also complaining about the inability to recruit maintainers: > > https://www.theregister.com/2020/06/30/hard_to_find_linux_maintainers_says_torvalds/ > > And burn out: > > http://antirez.com/news/129 Right. > The whole crux of your argument seems to be maintainers' time isn't > important so we should accept all trivial patches ... I'm pushing back > on that assumption in two places, firstly the valulessness of the time > and secondly that all trivial patches are valuable. > > > If some company does not want to pay for that, that's fine, but they > > don't get to be maintainers and claim `Supported`. > > What I'm actually trying to articulate is a way of measuring value of > the patch vs cost ... it has nothing really to do with who foots the > actual bill. > > One thesis I'm actually starting to formulate is that this continual > devaluing of maintainers is why we have so much difficulty keeping and > recruiting them. Absolutely. This is just one of the factors involved, but a significant one IMV. ______________________________________________________ Linux MTD discussion mailing list http://lists.infradead.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-mtd/ From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.0 required=3.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIMWL_WL_HIGH, DKIM_SIGNED,DKIM_VALID,MAILING_LIST_MULTI,SPF_HELO_NONE,SPF_PASS, URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.0 Received: from mail.kernel.org (mail.kernel.org [198.145.29.99]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF66BC2D0E4 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:14 +0000 (UTC) Received: from merlin.infradead.org (merlin.infradead.org [205.233.59.134]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 42A102080A for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:14 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=lists.infradead.org header.i=@lists.infradead.org header.b="cavH4PAw" DMARC-Filter: OpenDMARC Filter v1.3.2 mail.kernel.org 42A102080A Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; dmarc=fail (p=none dis=none) header.from=kernel.org Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; spf=none smtp.mailfrom=linux-mediatek-bounces+linux-mediatek=archiver.kernel.org@lists.infradead.org DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=lists.infradead.org; s=merlin.20170209; h=Sender:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-Type:Cc:List-Subscribe:List-Help:List-Post:List-Archive: List-Unsubscribe:List-Id:To:Subject:Message-ID:Date:From:In-Reply-To: References:MIME-Version:Reply-To:Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date: Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Owner; bh=nUNUP7HP5rztUMkdrn4XPCy25YPIWAQSotravm0eokM=; b=cavH4PAwvr0S9QnA9lZNiIRu5 Oqe4Nh7MKUZW+xnD7t1SHpr/Ml1YetlHHq1LvnKiVPtKiAOWZ2DxWF46t4TvbblLtf22cvp6mgHWr kJwbsr2mn8WVfVCatePGlYZXIPSDutfopwn8GviGHFURwbSBCsADYuDl7c9gpELvUkLzT38p5Ob3h KPmxF1ykWDm/PZkvGi1+CAUwiauR7OcUcRq/M9bI8mpb2cv3YME3TididPMvUy6xVQK7pR6RZ9oPO KnGCT38PirPweAuoOgDX7mcqqxeFuDg/YD66LrM9uI++kHuU0q6q70LZLJOkvA6VSnnmNAEVmLMWe sHk0N0ERg==; Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=merlin.infradead.org) by merlin.infradead.org with esmtp (Exim 4.92.3 #3 (Red Hat Linux)) id 1khEeM-0006RG-5K; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:10 +0000 Received: from mail-ot1-f68.google.com ([209.85.210.68]) by merlin.infradead.org with esmtps (Exim 4.92.3 #3 (Red Hat Linux)) id 1khEeH-0006Ox-3w; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:06 +0000 Received: by mail-ot1-f68.google.com with SMTP id n12so12914981otk.0; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:25:03 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=SWzdE85KMSmQ5K6aYMgWVQjn8/tst2VI3dLUnv/55SM=; b=jDEjvEJtiSTwKWHClnRHJtASuPUXtO8lR6UX+a4N1BXZGIB952iIySFAJcB0jDyBuM NhRo1t8lQa7N3W7ouvgsh8IgV2YkdBb95NX1K/9jtOMYHGlVxAvgSBwKPgdCk5NJTrx2 uYcOjpM0bc28ZQlKoHSFfX9w4hp05Mt0kuLGG+fLXWwJgCYiiCmGfWeYX/7ztVQMaPks /LFPnpbaL9Ahwpms+y/auhqJs7dWr6exWznrag8LvdqM2Vo8VoeBZDpfYnpu6Y2Gg2wI TCspBd85QkOq+kSwfnH2bIcERput4mIgQCkdCqgH2Kuk7wxAmaO791KFfteuP1nA+rob Y8Pg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532wsjkeTqJOy+uBsGV2EshVnvRexTMjMlbRRTMn/Ko+g45O4zS2 2Lz7FHHt8x8IyfDuBHmmg1xWmguGKEBwhy07Tr8= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxW9u67TbnPp8ObIChv5a6F+ncd8SoV+BFvs894Bl4MJzyAX0TVAjkpawJr+z1OvIzzPyEcIsCefAg0WelXSFg= X-Received: by 2002:a9d:16f:: with SMTP id 102mr68959otu.206.1606148702991; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:25:02 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20201120105344.4345c14e@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011201129.B13FDB3C@keescook> <20201120115142.292999b2@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011220816.8B6591A@keescook> <9b57fd4914b46f38d54087d75e072d6e947cb56d.camel@HansenPartnership.com> <1c7d7fde126bc0acf825766de64bf2f9b888f216.camel@HansenPartnership.com> In-Reply-To: From: "Rafael J. Wysocki" Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2020 17:24:51 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [PATCH 000/141] Fix fall-through warnings for Clang To: James Bottomley X-CRM114-Version: 20100106-BlameMichelson ( TRE 0.8.0 (BSD) ) MR-646709E3 X-CRM114-CacheID: sfid-20201123_112505_466489_C9EF8A05 X-CRM114-Status: GOOD ( 17.69 ) X-BeenThere: linux-mediatek@lists.infradead.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: "moderated list:SOUND - SOC LAYER / DYNAMIC AUDIO POWER MANAGEM..." , linux-atm-general@lists.sourceforge.net, reiserfs-devel@vger.kernel.org, linux-iio@vger.kernel.org, linux-wireless , "open list:FRAMEBUFFER LAYER" , dri-devel , linux-kernel , Nathan Chancellor , "open list:LIBATA SUBSYSTEM \(Serial and Parallel ATA drivers\)" , dm-devel@redhat.com, keyrings@vger.kernel.org, linux-mtd@lists.infradead.org, GR-everest-linux-l2@marvell.com, wcn36xx@lists.infradead.org, samba-technical@lists.samba.org, linux-i3c@lists.infradead.org, linux1394-devel@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-afs@lists.infradead.org, usb-storage@lists.one-eyed-alien.net, drbd-dev@lists.linbit.com, devel@driverdev.osuosl.org, linux-cifs@vger.kernel.org, rds-devel@oss.oracle.com, Nick Desaulniers , "open list:TARGET SUBSYSTEM" , linux-rdma@vger.kernel.org, oss-drivers@netronome.com, bridge@lists.linux-foundation.org, linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org, amd-gfx list , linux-stm32@st-md-mailman.stormreply.com, cluster-devel@redhat.com, ACPI Devel Maling List , coreteam@netfilter.org, intel-wired-lan@lists.osuosl.org, linux-input , Miguel Ojeda , Jakub Kicinski , Ext4 Developers List , Linux Media Mailing List , Kees Cook , selinux@vger.kernel.org, linux-arm-msm , intel-gfx , linux-geode@lists.infradead.org, linux-can@vger.kernel.org, linux-block@vger.kernel.org, linux-gpio@vger.kernel.org, op-tee@lists.trustedfirmware.org, "moderated list:ARM/Mediatek SoC..." , xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org, nouveau , linux-hams@vger.kernel.org, ceph-devel@vger.kernel.org, virtualization@lists.linux-foundation.org, Linux ARM , linux-hwmon@vger.kernel.org, linux-watchdog@vger.kernel.org, linux-nfs@vger.kernel.org, GR-Linux-NIC-Dev@marvell.com, tipc-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net, Linux-MM , Network Development , linux-decnet-user@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-mmc , "Gustavo A. R. Silva" , "maintainer:X86 ARCHITECTURE \(32-BIT AND 64-BIT\)" , Linux-Renesas , Miguel Ojeda , linux-sctp@vger.kernel.org, "open list:ULTRA-WIDEBAND \(UWB\) SUBSYSTEM:" , netfilter-devel@vger.kernel.org, Linux Crypto Mailing List , patches@opensource.cirrus.com, Joe Perches , linux-integrity@vger.kernel.org, target-devel@vger.kernel.org, linux-hardening@vger.kernel.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: "Linux-mediatek" Errors-To: linux-mediatek-bounces+linux-mediatek=archiver.kernel.org@lists.infradead.org On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 4:58 PM James Bottomley wrote: > > On Mon, 2020-11-23 at 15:19 +0100, Miguel Ojeda wrote: > > On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 11:36 PM James Bottomley > > wrote: [cut] > > > > Maintainers routinely review 1-line trivial patches, not to mention > > internal API changes, etc. > > We're also complaining about the inability to recruit maintainers: > > https://www.theregister.com/2020/06/30/hard_to_find_linux_maintainers_says_torvalds/ > > And burn out: > > http://antirez.com/news/129 Right. > The whole crux of your argument seems to be maintainers' time isn't > important so we should accept all trivial patches ... I'm pushing back > on that assumption in two places, firstly the valulessness of the time > and secondly that all trivial patches are valuable. > > > If some company does not want to pay for that, that's fine, but they > > don't get to be maintainers and claim `Supported`. > > What I'm actually trying to articulate is a way of measuring value of > the patch vs cost ... it has nothing really to do with who foots the > actual bill. > > One thesis I'm actually starting to formulate is that this continual > devaluing of maintainers is why we have so much difficulty keeping and > recruiting them. Absolutely. This is just one of the factors involved, but a significant one IMV. _______________________________________________ Linux-mediatek mailing list Linux-mediatek@lists.infradead.org http://lists.infradead.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-mediatek From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.0 required=3.0 tests=BAYES_00,MAILING_LIST_MULTI, SPF_HELO_NONE,SPF_PASS,URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.0 Received: from mail.kernel.org (mail.kernel.org [198.145.29.99]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5520FC2D0E4 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:09 +0000 (UTC) Received: from fraxinus.osuosl.org (smtp4.osuosl.org [140.211.166.137]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C7F2C2083E for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:08 +0000 (UTC) DMARC-Filter: OpenDMARC Filter v1.3.2 mail.kernel.org C7F2C2083E Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; dmarc=fail (p=none dis=none) header.from=kernel.org Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=virtualization-bounces@lists.linux-foundation.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by fraxinus.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D18286031; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:08 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at osuosl.org Received: from fraxinus.osuosl.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (.osuosl.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id pY0WJhybdkRu; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:07 +0000 (UTC) Received: from lists.linuxfoundation.org (lf-lists.osuosl.org [140.211.9.56]) by fraxinus.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46273860C8; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:07 +0000 (UTC) Received: from lf-lists.osuosl.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lists.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 33FDCC163C; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:07 +0000 (UTC) Received: from fraxinus.osuosl.org (smtp4.osuosl.org [140.211.166.137]) by lists.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07FD0C0052; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:06 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by fraxinus.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01C4D860C1; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:06 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at osuosl.org Received: from fraxinus.osuosl.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (.osuosl.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id QmVny66VcjdX; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:03 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: domain auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.6 X-Greylist: domain auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.6 Received: from mail-ot1-f65.google.com (mail-ot1-f65.google.com [209.85.210.65]) by fraxinus.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C0B3586031; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:03 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-ot1-f65.google.com with SMTP id k3so16418610otp.12; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:25:03 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=SWzdE85KMSmQ5K6aYMgWVQjn8/tst2VI3dLUnv/55SM=; b=ZgWvCEBXOjeW19Zrl7R9/lYyyG8pwYB9xC05pBT+GhcG4LD/pef8qJJtfrKLcErttw lgqvu1EIfNtFHl/M9x9itYTXezM7UYOJ4oBE74fFWhy2jVUP8gHMvC58R1yGjba9tPPk OtlStBgmK6kREdc3u+zZ3gSRjgYgzVU8ycK+0OChW2W4aEGZxGnXJTlOq32nXFODIoJF 00ERBaacxqhQin4GBi4GKHkPtDHNcYaUqV0XxYJzyzHkDJap0u3kxAdCgOWKLInX0LXU qWpNVt/LCJEQBuRV9UDp0Ra8qlCCcEruec5vrg+/RdE3SvlbGJgB5h+IotfEUsF443hY RsQQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530j35MV//ueYH8/LHNg3/nZ5D+3F8e5UHemjSO+I4TRSXqNPROt XIcRY88Ib01J+V+5Zxfq0abnt0+8UXe8HQZSP6U= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxW9u67TbnPp8ObIChv5a6F+ncd8SoV+BFvs894Bl4MJzyAX0TVAjkpawJr+z1OvIzzPyEcIsCefAg0WelXSFg= X-Received: by 2002:a9d:16f:: with SMTP id 102mr68959otu.206.1606148702991; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:25:02 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20201120105344.4345c14e@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011201129.B13FDB3C@keescook> <20201120115142.292999b2@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011220816.8B6591A@keescook> <9b57fd4914b46f38d54087d75e072d6e947cb56d.camel@HansenPartnership.com> <1c7d7fde126bc0acf825766de64bf2f9b888f216.camel@HansenPartnership.com> In-Reply-To: From: "Rafael J. Wysocki" Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2020 17:24:51 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [PATCH 000/141] Fix fall-through warnings for Clang To: James Bottomley Cc: "moderated list:SOUND - SOC LAYER / DYNAMIC AUDIO POWER MANAGEM..." , linux-atm-general@lists.sourceforge.net, reiserfs-devel@vger.kernel.org, linux-iio@vger.kernel.org, linux-wireless , "open list:FRAMEBUFFER LAYER" , dri-devel , linux-kernel , Nathan Chancellor , "open list:LIBATA SUBSYSTEM \(Serial and Parallel ATA drivers\)" , dm-devel@redhat.com, keyrings@vger.kernel.org, linux-mtd@lists.infradead.org, GR-everest-linux-l2@marvell.com, wcn36xx@lists.infradead.org, samba-technical@lists.samba.org, linux-i3c@lists.infradead.org, linux1394-devel@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-afs@lists.infradead.org, usb-storage@lists.one-eyed-alien.net, drbd-dev@lists.linbit.com, devel@driverdev.osuosl.org, linux-cifs@vger.kernel.org, rds-devel@oss.oracle.com, Nick Desaulniers , "open list:TARGET SUBSYSTEM" , linux-rdma@vger.kernel.org, oss-drivers@netronome.com, bridge@lists.linux-foundation.org, linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org, amd-gfx list , linux-stm32@st-md-mailman.stormreply.com, cluster-devel@redhat.com, ACPI Devel Maling List , coreteam@netfilter.org, intel-wired-lan@lists.osuosl.org, linux-input , Miguel Ojeda , Jakub Kicinski , Ext4 Developers List , Linux Media Mailing List , Kees Cook , selinux@vger.kernel.org, linux-arm-msm , intel-gfx , linux-geode@lists.infradead.org, linux-can@vger.kernel.org, linux-block@vger.kernel.org, linux-gpio@vger.kernel.org, op-tee@lists.trustedfirmware.org, "moderated list:ARM/Mediatek SoC..." , xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org, nouveau , linux-hams@vger.kernel.org, ceph-devel@vger.kernel.org, virtualization@lists.linux-foundation.org, Linux ARM , linux-hwmon@vger.kernel.org, linux-watchdog@vger.kernel.org, linux-nfs@vger.kernel.org, GR-Linux-NIC-Dev@marvell.com, tipc-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net, Linux-MM , Network Development , linux-decnet-user@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-mmc , "Gustavo A. R. Silva" , "maintainer:X86 ARCHITECTURE \(32-BIT AND 64-BIT\)" , Linux-Renesas , Miguel Ojeda , linux-sctp@vger.kernel.org, "open list:ULTRA-WIDEBAND \(UWB\) SUBSYSTEM:" , netfilter-devel@vger.kernel.org, Linux Crypto Mailing List , patches@opensource.cirrus.com, Joe Perches , linux-integrity@vger.kernel.org, target-devel@vger.kernel.org, linux-hardening@vger.kernel.org X-BeenThere: virtualization@lists.linux-foundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Linux virtualization List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: virtualization-bounces@lists.linux-foundation.org Sender: "Virtualization" On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 4:58 PM James Bottomley wrote: > > On Mon, 2020-11-23 at 15:19 +0100, Miguel Ojeda wrote: > > On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 11:36 PM James Bottomley > > wrote: [cut] > > > > Maintainers routinely review 1-line trivial patches, not to mention > > internal API changes, etc. > > We're also complaining about the inability to recruit maintainers: > > https://www.theregister.com/2020/06/30/hard_to_find_linux_maintainers_says_torvalds/ > > And burn out: > > http://antirez.com/news/129 Right. > The whole crux of your argument seems to be maintainers' time isn't > important so we should accept all trivial patches ... I'm pushing back > on that assumption in two places, firstly the valulessness of the time > and secondly that all trivial patches are valuable. > > > If some company does not want to pay for that, that's fine, but they > > don't get to be maintainers and claim `Supported`. > > What I'm actually trying to articulate is a way of measuring value of > the patch vs cost ... it has nothing really to do with who foots the > actual bill. > > One thesis I'm actually starting to formulate is that this continual > devaluing of maintainers is why we have so much difficulty keeping and > recruiting them. Absolutely. This is just one of the factors involved, but a significant one IMV. _______________________________________________ Virtualization mailing list Virtualization@lists.linux-foundation.org https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/virtualization From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.0 required=3.0 tests=BAYES_00,MAILING_LIST_MULTI, SPF_HELO_NONE,SPF_PASS,URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.0 Received: from mail.kernel.org (mail.kernel.org [198.145.29.99]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3AC73C63697 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:07 +0000 (UTC) Received: from gabe.freedesktop.org (gabe.freedesktop.org [131.252.210.177]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E970E208DB for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:06 +0000 (UTC) DMARC-Filter: OpenDMARC Filter v1.3.2 mail.kernel.org E970E208DB Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; dmarc=fail (p=none dis=none) header.from=kernel.org Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; spf=none smtp.mailfrom=dri-devel-bounces@lists.freedesktop.org Received: from gabe.freedesktop.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by gabe.freedesktop.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B5D7A89F47; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:04 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-ot1-f65.google.com (mail-ot1-f65.google.com [209.85.210.65]) by gabe.freedesktop.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BB75489C80; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:03 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-ot1-f65.google.com with SMTP id l36so16441234ota.4; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:25:03 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=SWzdE85KMSmQ5K6aYMgWVQjn8/tst2VI3dLUnv/55SM=; b=RoSmYDLJZUek3Hqeo0q2s0N9gd1Fsv/sAigKVhqBo6DUTia1LdxPBotWq8TcU9893i xlJ6UUCow6YzrtkqvBJfgL/VexbnREQla6STgNeB5OCK4MsmIsP7uTGpq9RUap+xpYhZ rwLXf8wdvy734/VQqhRlGGEPA1mxKHZHrQWwChxXbCD+H4GzQBbuy4x2dZJHZNPPqeI7 i6IVSlYQ4NtU4BJKwk2wiVFiVHo2G/poCEMDwDRiSM8YWKzrVvsXvxJf4hY/1IiZ4EK6 97UvXUlo8dqkaVLIC5c9+5YtcfdKKjYg3rJUEXtluynx+uD+kIhbXEuI+g5/f6ouRy6z XOww== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531AbRE2zVFDrh3RkFV5ORMFWjA/8K7PKrBIkZsACmrlgLWcCjoW 5hX2HRA89br/Q/Q02Kz1zZYRTbT5tWHrBJ6rnWhKFoAqj8o= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxW9u67TbnPp8ObIChv5a6F+ncd8SoV+BFvs894Bl4MJzyAX0TVAjkpawJr+z1OvIzzPyEcIsCefAg0WelXSFg= X-Received: by 2002:a9d:16f:: with SMTP id 102mr68959otu.206.1606148702991; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:25:02 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20201120105344.4345c14e@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011201129.B13FDB3C@keescook> <20201120115142.292999b2@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011220816.8B6591A@keescook> <9b57fd4914b46f38d54087d75e072d6e947cb56d.camel@HansenPartnership.com> <1c7d7fde126bc0acf825766de64bf2f9b888f216.camel@HansenPartnership.com> In-Reply-To: From: "Rafael J. Wysocki" Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2020 17:24:51 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [PATCH 000/141] Fix fall-through warnings for Clang To: James Bottomley X-BeenThere: dri-devel@lists.freedesktop.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Direct Rendering Infrastructure - Development List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: "moderated list:SOUND - SOC LAYER / DYNAMIC AUDIO POWER MANAGEM..." , linux-atm-general@lists.sourceforge.net, reiserfs-devel@vger.kernel.org, linux-iio@vger.kernel.org, linux-wireless , "open list:FRAMEBUFFER LAYER" , dri-devel , linux-kernel , Nathan Chancellor , "open list:LIBATA SUBSYSTEM \(Serial and Parallel ATA drivers\)" , dm-devel@redhat.com, keyrings@vger.kernel.org, linux-mtd@lists.infradead.org, GR-everest-linux-l2@marvell.com, wcn36xx@lists.infradead.org, samba-technical@lists.samba.org, linux-i3c@lists.infradead.org, linux1394-devel@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-afs@lists.infradead.org, usb-storage@lists.one-eyed-alien.net, drbd-dev@lists.linbit.com, devel@driverdev.osuosl.org, linux-cifs@vger.kernel.org, rds-devel@oss.oracle.com, Nick Desaulniers , "open list:TARGET SUBSYSTEM" , linux-rdma@vger.kernel.org, oss-drivers@netronome.com, bridge@lists.linux-foundation.org, linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org, amd-gfx list , linux-stm32@st-md-mailman.stormreply.com, cluster-devel@redhat.com, ACPI Devel Maling List , coreteam@netfilter.org, intel-wired-lan@lists.osuosl.org, linux-input , Miguel Ojeda , Jakub Kicinski , Ext4 Developers List , Linux Media Mailing List , Kees Cook , selinux@vger.kernel.org, linux-arm-msm , intel-gfx , linux-geode@lists.infradead.org, linux-can@vger.kernel.org, linux-block@vger.kernel.org, linux-gpio@vger.kernel.org, op-tee@lists.trustedfirmware.org, "moderated list:ARM/Mediatek SoC..." , xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org, nouveau , linux-hams@vger.kernel.org, ceph-devel@vger.kernel.org, virtualization@lists.linux-foundation.org, target-devel@vger.kernel.org, Linux ARM , linux-hwmon@vger.kernel.org, linux-watchdog@vger.kernel.org, linux-nfs@vger.kernel.org, GR-Linux-NIC-Dev@marvell.com, tipc-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net, Linux-MM , Network Development , linux-decnet-user@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-mmc , "Gustavo A. R. Silva" , Linux-Renesas , Miguel Ojeda , linux-sctp@vger.kernel.org, "open list:ULTRA-WIDEBAND \(UWB\) SUBSYSTEM:" , netfilter-devel@vger.kernel.org, Linux Crypto Mailing List , patches@opensource.cirrus.com, Joe Perches , linux-integrity@vger.kernel.org, "maintainer:X86 ARCHITECTURE \(32-BIT AND 64-BIT\)" , linux-hardening@vger.kernel.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: dri-devel-bounces@lists.freedesktop.org Sender: "dri-devel" On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 4:58 PM James Bottomley wrote: > > On Mon, 2020-11-23 at 15:19 +0100, Miguel Ojeda wrote: > > On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 11:36 PM James Bottomley > > wrote: [cut] > > > > Maintainers routinely review 1-line trivial patches, not to mention > > internal API changes, etc. > > We're also complaining about the inability to recruit maintainers: > > https://www.theregister.com/2020/06/30/hard_to_find_linux_maintainers_says_torvalds/ > > And burn out: > > http://antirez.com/news/129 Right. > The whole crux of your argument seems to be maintainers' time isn't > important so we should accept all trivial patches ... I'm pushing back > on that assumption in two places, firstly the valulessness of the time > and secondly that all trivial patches are valuable. > > > If some company does not want to pay for that, that's fine, but they > > don't get to be maintainers and claim `Supported`. > > What I'm actually trying to articulate is a way of measuring value of > the patch vs cost ... it has nothing really to do with who foots the > actual bill. > > One thesis I'm actually starting to formulate is that this continual > devaluing of maintainers is why we have so much difficulty keeping and > recruiting them. Absolutely. This is just one of the factors involved, but a significant one IMV. _______________________________________________ dri-devel mailing list dri-devel@lists.freedesktop.org https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/dri-devel From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.0 required=3.0 tests=BAYES_00,MAILING_LIST_MULTI, SPF_HELO_NONE,SPF_PASS,URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.0 Received: from mail.kernel.org (mail.kernel.org [198.145.29.99]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A5CFC56201 for ; Tue, 24 Nov 2020 08:54:41 +0000 (UTC) Received: from us-smtp-delivery-124.mimecast.com (us-smtp-delivery-124.mimecast.com [216.205.24.124]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 806152073C for ; Tue, 24 Nov 2020 08:54:40 +0000 (UTC) DMARC-Filter: OpenDMARC Filter v1.3.2 mail.kernel.org 806152073C Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; dmarc=fail (p=none dis=none) header.from=kernel.org Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; spf=tempfail smtp.mailfrom=dm-devel-bounces@redhat.com Received: from mimecast-mx01.redhat.com (mimecast-mx01.redhat.com [209.132.183.4]) (Using TLS) by relay.mimecast.com with ESMTP id us-mta-27-HUNUVQj2MGmOuHF-dm4vPw-1; Tue, 24 Nov 2020 03:54:37 -0500 X-MC-Unique: HUNUVQj2MGmOuHF-dm4vPw-1 Received: from smtp.corp.redhat.com (int-mx05.intmail.prod.int.phx2.redhat.com [10.5.11.15]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mimecast-mx01.redhat.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1F8D9100C602; Tue, 24 Nov 2020 08:54:32 +0000 (UTC) Received: from colo-mx.corp.redhat.com (colo-mx01.intmail.prod.int.phx2.redhat.com [10.5.11.20]) by smtp.corp.redhat.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F2A715D705; Tue, 24 Nov 2020 08:54:31 +0000 (UTC) Received: from lists01.pubmisc.prod.ext.phx2.redhat.com (lists01.pubmisc.prod.ext.phx2.redhat.com [10.5.19.33]) by colo-mx.corp.redhat.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5FB21809CA4; Tue, 24 Nov 2020 08:54:31 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp.corp.redhat.com (int-mx03.intmail.prod.int.rdu2.redhat.com [10.11.54.3]) by lists01.pubmisc.prod.ext.phx2.redhat.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id 0ANGPBLZ019103 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 11:25:11 -0500 Received: by smtp.corp.redhat.com (Postfix) id E95ED112C261; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mimecast-mx02.redhat.com (mimecast06.extmail.prod.ext.rdu2.redhat.com [10.11.55.22]) by smtp.corp.redhat.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E5414112C243 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:08 +0000 (UTC) Received: from us-smtp-1.mimecast.com (us-smtp-2.mimecast.com [205.139.110.61]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mimecast-mx02.redhat.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9065C186E122 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:08 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-ot1-f66.google.com (mail-ot1-f66.google.com [209.85.210.66]) (Using TLS) by relay.mimecast.com with ESMTP id us-mta-410-rYguESr9Pf6GosfW0txP8w-1; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 11:25:03 -0500 X-MC-Unique: rYguESr9Pf6GosfW0txP8w-1 Received: by mail-ot1-f66.google.com with SMTP id h19so3802617otr.1; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:25:03 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=SWzdE85KMSmQ5K6aYMgWVQjn8/tst2VI3dLUnv/55SM=; b=hwe5DwryUAKXqogXOaM1Cm0R0d66x72VzToc/Cg4uWOBBVkM+7q6t58M4kCHR5nECq /hMEdt0lXCSNcinn9enL31a52iuEXc1XDhVXjWFbBGT4cO/+wndnwWBXBvtZ+KbnED/0 Uq2J0jhwuZjYM8w9x3d5a0VZVMguWc5JPd/3fUz70ORzvrGOPcHZeHXdflqKgLnhKyWk FOca3TUqKy6zWGs8SJPKx2y7TCuTjdVRnlsUEZtR4wU64/zFWoc+CCkemImR0OzBK4j6 OrJ+2+EC3GHYYf4kA38RP64YlfVpQN0GADURTQ8YMn5wTDSRuDxnL/pD69PCyaoc6ydm vT4Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533Ygts28/R4F6WalpW3kkTQ2CAm6HXOr/c/KVsOBB7Ojs1JDwaG pdmopY9A6gfAKY/GPhasZlc7z90geEeqiL7cDcQ= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxW9u67TbnPp8ObIChv5a6F+ncd8SoV+BFvs894Bl4MJzyAX0TVAjkpawJr+z1OvIzzPyEcIsCefAg0WelXSFg= X-Received: by 2002:a9d:16f:: with SMTP id 102mr68959otu.206.1606148702991; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:25:02 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20201120105344.4345c14e@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011201129.B13FDB3C@keescook> <20201120115142.292999b2@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011220816.8B6591A@keescook> <9b57fd4914b46f38d54087d75e072d6e947cb56d.camel@HansenPartnership.com> <1c7d7fde126bc0acf825766de64bf2f9b888f216.camel@HansenPartnership.com> In-Reply-To: From: "Rafael J. Wysocki" Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2020 17:24:51 +0100 Message-ID: To: James Bottomley X-Mimecast-Impersonation-Protect: Policy=CLT - Impersonation Protection Definition; Similar Internal Domain=false; Similar Monitored External Domain=false; Custom External Domain=false; Mimecast External Domain=false; Newly Observed Domain=false; Internal User Name=false; Custom Display Name List=false; Reply-to Address Mismatch=false; Targeted Threat Dictionary=false; Mimecast Threat Dictionary=false; Custom Threat Dictionary=false X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.78 on 10.11.54.3 X-loop: dm-devel@redhat.com X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 24 Nov 2020 03:53:49 -0500 Cc: "moderated list:SOUND - SOC LAYER / DYNAMIC AUDIO POWER MANAGEM..." , linux-atm-general@lists.sourceforge.net, reiserfs-devel@vger.kernel.org, nouveau , linux-iio@vger.kernel.org, linux-wireless , "open list:FRAMEBUFFER LAYER" , dri-devel , linux-kernel , Nathan Chancellor , "open list:LIBATA SUBSYSTEM \(Serial and Parallel ATA drivers\)" , dm-devel@redhat.com, keyrings@vger.kernel.org, linux-mtd@lists.infradead.org, GR-everest-linux-l2@marvell.com, wcn36xx@lists.infradead.org, samba-technical@lists.samba.org, linux-i3c@lists.infradead.org, linux1394-devel@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-afs@lists.infradead.org, usb-storage@lists.one-eyed-alien.net, linux-watchdog@vger.kernel.org, devel@driverdev.osuosl.org, linux-cifs@vger.kernel.org, rds-devel@oss.oracle.com, Nick Desaulniers , "open list:TARGET SUBSYSTEM" , linux-rdma@vger.kernel.org, oss-drivers@netronome.com, bridge@lists.linux-foundation.org, linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org, amd-gfx list , linux-stm32@st-md-mailman.stormreply.com, cluster-devel@redhat.com, ACPI Devel Maling List , coreteam@netfilter.org, intel-wired-lan@lists.osuosl.org, linux-input , Miguel Ojeda , Jakub Kicinski , Ext4 Developers List , Linux Media Mailing List , Kees Cook , selinux@vger.kernel.org, linux-arm-msm , intel-gfx , linux-geode@lists.infradead.org, linux-can@vger.kernel.org, linux-block@vger.kernel.org, linux-gpio@vger.kernel.org, op-tee@lists.trustedfirmware.org, "moderated list:ARM/Mediatek SoC..." , xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org, drbd-dev@tron.linbit.com, linux-hams@vger.kernel.org, ceph-devel@vger.kernel.org, virtualization@lists.linux-foundation.org, target-devel@vger.kernel.org, Linux ARM , linux-hwmon@vger.kernel.org, "maintainer:X86 ARCHITECTURE \(32-BIT AND 64-BIT\)" , linux-nfs@vger.kernel.org, GR-Linux-NIC-Dev@marvell.com, tipc-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net, Linux-MM , Network Development , linux-decnet-user@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-mmc , "Gustavo A. R. Silva" , Linux-Renesas , Miguel Ojeda , linux-sctp@vger.kernel.org, "open list:ULTRA-WIDEBAND \(UWB\) SUBSYSTEM:" , netfilter-devel@vger.kernel.org, Linux Crypto Mailing List , patches@opensource.cirrus.com, Joe Perches , linux-integrity@vger.kernel.org, linux-hardening@vger.kernel.org Subject: Re: [dm-devel] [PATCH 000/141] Fix fall-through warnings for Clang X-BeenThere: dm-devel@redhat.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: junk List-Id: device-mapper development List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: dm-devel-bounces@redhat.com Errors-To: dm-devel-bounces@redhat.com X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.79 on 10.5.11.15 Authentication-Results: relay.mimecast.com; auth=pass smtp.auth=CUSA124A263 smtp.mailfrom=dm-devel-bounces@redhat.com X-Mimecast-Spam-Score: 0 X-Mimecast-Originator: redhat.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 4:58 PM James Bottomley wrote: > > On Mon, 2020-11-23 at 15:19 +0100, Miguel Ojeda wrote: > > On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 11:36 PM James Bottomley > > wrote: [cut] > > > > Maintainers routinely review 1-line trivial patches, not to mention > > internal API changes, etc. > > We're also complaining about the inability to recruit maintainers: > > https://www.theregister.com/2020/06/30/hard_to_find_linux_maintainers_says_torvalds/ > > And burn out: > > http://antirez.com/news/129 Right. > The whole crux of your argument seems to be maintainers' time isn't > important so we should accept all trivial patches ... I'm pushing back > on that assumption in two places, firstly the valulessness of the time > and secondly that all trivial patches are valuable. > > > If some company does not want to pay for that, that's fine, but they > > don't get to be maintainers and claim `Supported`. > > What I'm actually trying to articulate is a way of measuring value of > the patch vs cost ... it has nothing really to do with who foots the > actual bill. > > One thesis I'm actually starting to formulate is that this continual > devaluing of maintainers is why we have so much difficulty keeping and > recruiting them. Absolutely. This is just one of the factors involved, but a significant one IMV. -- dm-devel mailing list dm-devel@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/dm-devel From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.0 required=3.0 tests=BAYES_00,MAILING_LIST_MULTI, SPF_HELO_NONE,SPF_PASS,URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.0 Received: from mail.kernel.org (mail.kernel.org [198.145.29.99]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 94AC7C56202 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: from gabe.freedesktop.org (gabe.freedesktop.org [131.252.210.177]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 27F622083E for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:10 +0000 (UTC) DMARC-Filter: OpenDMARC Filter v1.3.2 mail.kernel.org 27F622083E Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; dmarc=fail (p=none dis=none) header.from=kernel.org Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; spf=none smtp.mailfrom=intel-gfx-bounces@lists.freedesktop.org Received: from gabe.freedesktop.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by gabe.freedesktop.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA97B6E042; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:05 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-ot1-f65.google.com (mail-ot1-f65.google.com [209.85.210.65]) by gabe.freedesktop.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BB75489C80; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:03 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-ot1-f65.google.com with SMTP id l36so16441234ota.4; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:25:03 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=SWzdE85KMSmQ5K6aYMgWVQjn8/tst2VI3dLUnv/55SM=; b=RoSmYDLJZUek3Hqeo0q2s0N9gd1Fsv/sAigKVhqBo6DUTia1LdxPBotWq8TcU9893i xlJ6UUCow6YzrtkqvBJfgL/VexbnREQla6STgNeB5OCK4MsmIsP7uTGpq9RUap+xpYhZ rwLXf8wdvy734/VQqhRlGGEPA1mxKHZHrQWwChxXbCD+H4GzQBbuy4x2dZJHZNPPqeI7 i6IVSlYQ4NtU4BJKwk2wiVFiVHo2G/poCEMDwDRiSM8YWKzrVvsXvxJf4hY/1IiZ4EK6 97UvXUlo8dqkaVLIC5c9+5YtcfdKKjYg3rJUEXtluynx+uD+kIhbXEuI+g5/f6ouRy6z XOww== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531AbRE2zVFDrh3RkFV5ORMFWjA/8K7PKrBIkZsACmrlgLWcCjoW 5hX2HRA89br/Q/Q02Kz1zZYRTbT5tWHrBJ6rnWhKFoAqj8o= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxW9u67TbnPp8ObIChv5a6F+ncd8SoV+BFvs894Bl4MJzyAX0TVAjkpawJr+z1OvIzzPyEcIsCefAg0WelXSFg= X-Received: by 2002:a9d:16f:: with SMTP id 102mr68959otu.206.1606148702991; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:25:02 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20201120105344.4345c14e@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011201129.B13FDB3C@keescook> <20201120115142.292999b2@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011220816.8B6591A@keescook> <9b57fd4914b46f38d54087d75e072d6e947cb56d.camel@HansenPartnership.com> <1c7d7fde126bc0acf825766de64bf2f9b888f216.camel@HansenPartnership.com> In-Reply-To: From: "Rafael J. Wysocki" Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2020 17:24:51 +0100 Message-ID: To: James Bottomley Subject: Re: [Intel-gfx] [PATCH 000/141] Fix fall-through warnings for Clang X-BeenThere: intel-gfx@lists.freedesktop.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Intel graphics driver community testing & development List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: "moderated list:SOUND - SOC LAYER / DYNAMIC AUDIO POWER MANAGEM..." , linux-atm-general@lists.sourceforge.net, reiserfs-devel@vger.kernel.org, linux-iio@vger.kernel.org, linux-wireless , "open list:FRAMEBUFFER LAYER" , dri-devel , linux-kernel , Nathan Chancellor , "open list:LIBATA SUBSYSTEM \(Serial and Parallel ATA drivers\)" , dm-devel@redhat.com, keyrings@vger.kernel.org, linux-mtd@lists.infradead.org, GR-everest-linux-l2@marvell.com, wcn36xx@lists.infradead.org, samba-technical@lists.samba.org, linux-i3c@lists.infradead.org, linux1394-devel@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-afs@lists.infradead.org, usb-storage@lists.one-eyed-alien.net, drbd-dev@lists.linbit.com, devel@driverdev.osuosl.org, linux-cifs@vger.kernel.org, rds-devel@oss.oracle.com, Nick Desaulniers , "open list:TARGET SUBSYSTEM" , linux-rdma@vger.kernel.org, oss-drivers@netronome.com, bridge@lists.linux-foundation.org, linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org, amd-gfx list , linux-stm32@st-md-mailman.stormreply.com, cluster-devel@redhat.com, ACPI Devel Maling List , coreteam@netfilter.org, intel-wired-lan@lists.osuosl.org, linux-input , Miguel Ojeda , Jakub Kicinski , Ext4 Developers List , Linux Media Mailing List , Kees Cook , selinux@vger.kernel.org, linux-arm-msm , intel-gfx , linux-geode@lists.infradead.org, linux-can@vger.kernel.org, linux-block@vger.kernel.org, linux-gpio@vger.kernel.org, op-tee@lists.trustedfirmware.org, "moderated list:ARM/Mediatek SoC..." , xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org, nouveau , linux-hams@vger.kernel.org, ceph-devel@vger.kernel.org, virtualization@lists.linux-foundation.org, target-devel@vger.kernel.org, Linux ARM , linux-hwmon@vger.kernel.org, linux-watchdog@vger.kernel.org, linux-nfs@vger.kernel.org, GR-Linux-NIC-Dev@marvell.com, tipc-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net, Linux-MM , Network Development , linux-decnet-user@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-mmc , "Gustavo A. R. Silva" , Linux-Renesas , Miguel Ojeda , linux-sctp@vger.kernel.org, "open list:ULTRA-WIDEBAND \(UWB\) SUBSYSTEM:" , netfilter-devel@vger.kernel.org, Linux Crypto Mailing List , patches@opensource.cirrus.com, Joe Perches , linux-integrity@vger.kernel.org, "maintainer:X86 ARCHITECTURE \(32-BIT AND 64-BIT\)" , linux-hardening@vger.kernel.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: intel-gfx-bounces@lists.freedesktop.org Sender: "Intel-gfx" On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 4:58 PM James Bottomley wrote: > > On Mon, 2020-11-23 at 15:19 +0100, Miguel Ojeda wrote: > > On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 11:36 PM James Bottomley > > wrote: [cut] > > > > Maintainers routinely review 1-line trivial patches, not to mention > > internal API changes, etc. > > We're also complaining about the inability to recruit maintainers: > > https://www.theregister.com/2020/06/30/hard_to_find_linux_maintainers_says_torvalds/ > > And burn out: > > http://antirez.com/news/129 Right. > The whole crux of your argument seems to be maintainers' time isn't > important so we should accept all trivial patches ... I'm pushing back > on that assumption in two places, firstly the valulessness of the time > and secondly that all trivial patches are valuable. > > > If some company does not want to pay for that, that's fine, but they > > don't get to be maintainers and claim `Supported`. > > What I'm actually trying to articulate is a way of measuring value of > the patch vs cost ... it has nothing really to do with who foots the > actual bill. > > One thesis I'm actually starting to formulate is that this continual > devaluing of maintainers is why we have so much difficulty keeping and > recruiting them. Absolutely. This is just one of the factors involved, but a significant one IMV. _______________________________________________ Intel-gfx mailing list Intel-gfx@lists.freedesktop.org https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/intel-gfx From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.0 required=3.0 tests=BAYES_00,MAILING_LIST_MULTI, SPF_HELO_NONE,SPF_PASS,URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.0 Received: from mail.kernel.org (mail.kernel.org [198.145.29.99]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 84428C2D0E4 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:05 +0000 (UTC) Received: from gabe.freedesktop.org (gabe.freedesktop.org [131.252.210.177]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 24B1B208FE for ; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:04 +0000 (UTC) DMARC-Filter: OpenDMARC Filter v1.3.2 mail.kernel.org 24B1B208FE Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; dmarc=fail (p=none dis=none) header.from=kernel.org Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; spf=none smtp.mailfrom=amd-gfx-bounces@lists.freedesktop.org Received: from gabe.freedesktop.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by gabe.freedesktop.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7281789C80; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:04 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-ot1-f65.google.com (mail-ot1-f65.google.com [209.85.210.65]) by gabe.freedesktop.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BB75489C80; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:03 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-ot1-f65.google.com with SMTP id l36so16441234ota.4; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:25:03 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=SWzdE85KMSmQ5K6aYMgWVQjn8/tst2VI3dLUnv/55SM=; b=RoSmYDLJZUek3Hqeo0q2s0N9gd1Fsv/sAigKVhqBo6DUTia1LdxPBotWq8TcU9893i xlJ6UUCow6YzrtkqvBJfgL/VexbnREQla6STgNeB5OCK4MsmIsP7uTGpq9RUap+xpYhZ rwLXf8wdvy734/VQqhRlGGEPA1mxKHZHrQWwChxXbCD+H4GzQBbuy4x2dZJHZNPPqeI7 i6IVSlYQ4NtU4BJKwk2wiVFiVHo2G/poCEMDwDRiSM8YWKzrVvsXvxJf4hY/1IiZ4EK6 97UvXUlo8dqkaVLIC5c9+5YtcfdKKjYg3rJUEXtluynx+uD+kIhbXEuI+g5/f6ouRy6z XOww== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531AbRE2zVFDrh3RkFV5ORMFWjA/8K7PKrBIkZsACmrlgLWcCjoW 5hX2HRA89br/Q/Q02Kz1zZYRTbT5tWHrBJ6rnWhKFoAqj8o= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxW9u67TbnPp8ObIChv5a6F+ncd8SoV+BFvs894Bl4MJzyAX0TVAjkpawJr+z1OvIzzPyEcIsCefAg0WelXSFg= X-Received: by 2002:a9d:16f:: with SMTP id 102mr68959otu.206.1606148702991; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:25:02 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20201120105344.4345c14e@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011201129.B13FDB3C@keescook> <20201120115142.292999b2@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011220816.8B6591A@keescook> <9b57fd4914b46f38d54087d75e072d6e947cb56d.camel@HansenPartnership.com> <1c7d7fde126bc0acf825766de64bf2f9b888f216.camel@HansenPartnership.com> In-Reply-To: From: "Rafael J. Wysocki" Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2020 17:24:51 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [PATCH 000/141] Fix fall-through warnings for Clang To: James Bottomley X-BeenThere: amd-gfx@lists.freedesktop.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion list for AMD gfx List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: "moderated list:SOUND - SOC LAYER / DYNAMIC AUDIO POWER MANAGEM..." , linux-atm-general@lists.sourceforge.net, reiserfs-devel@vger.kernel.org, linux-iio@vger.kernel.org, linux-wireless , "open list:FRAMEBUFFER LAYER" , dri-devel , linux-kernel , Nathan Chancellor , "open list:LIBATA SUBSYSTEM \(Serial and Parallel ATA drivers\)" , dm-devel@redhat.com, keyrings@vger.kernel.org, linux-mtd@lists.infradead.org, GR-everest-linux-l2@marvell.com, wcn36xx@lists.infradead.org, samba-technical@lists.samba.org, linux-i3c@lists.infradead.org, linux1394-devel@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-afs@lists.infradead.org, usb-storage@lists.one-eyed-alien.net, drbd-dev@lists.linbit.com, devel@driverdev.osuosl.org, linux-cifs@vger.kernel.org, rds-devel@oss.oracle.com, Nick Desaulniers , "open list:TARGET SUBSYSTEM" , linux-rdma@vger.kernel.org, oss-drivers@netronome.com, bridge@lists.linux-foundation.org, linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org, amd-gfx list , linux-stm32@st-md-mailman.stormreply.com, cluster-devel@redhat.com, ACPI Devel Maling List , coreteam@netfilter.org, intel-wired-lan@lists.osuosl.org, linux-input , Miguel Ojeda , Jakub Kicinski , Ext4 Developers List , Linux Media Mailing List , Kees Cook , selinux@vger.kernel.org, linux-arm-msm , intel-gfx , linux-geode@lists.infradead.org, linux-can@vger.kernel.org, linux-block@vger.kernel.org, linux-gpio@vger.kernel.org, op-tee@lists.trustedfirmware.org, "moderated list:ARM/Mediatek SoC..." , xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org, nouveau , linux-hams@vger.kernel.org, ceph-devel@vger.kernel.org, virtualization@lists.linux-foundation.org, target-devel@vger.kernel.org, Linux ARM , linux-hwmon@vger.kernel.org, linux-watchdog@vger.kernel.org, linux-nfs@vger.kernel.org, GR-Linux-NIC-Dev@marvell.com, tipc-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net, Linux-MM , Network Development , linux-decnet-user@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-mmc , "Gustavo A. R. Silva" , Linux-Renesas , Miguel Ojeda , linux-sctp@vger.kernel.org, "open list:ULTRA-WIDEBAND \(UWB\) SUBSYSTEM:" , netfilter-devel@vger.kernel.org, Linux Crypto Mailing List , patches@opensource.cirrus.com, Joe Perches , linux-integrity@vger.kernel.org, "maintainer:X86 ARCHITECTURE \(32-BIT AND 64-BIT\)" , linux-hardening@vger.kernel.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: amd-gfx-bounces@lists.freedesktop.org Sender: "amd-gfx" On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 4:58 PM James Bottomley wrote: > > On Mon, 2020-11-23 at 15:19 +0100, Miguel Ojeda wrote: > > On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 11:36 PM James Bottomley > > wrote: [cut] > > > > Maintainers routinely review 1-line trivial patches, not to mention > > internal API changes, etc. > > We're also complaining about the inability to recruit maintainers: > > https://www.theregister.com/2020/06/30/hard_to_find_linux_maintainers_says_torvalds/ > > And burn out: > > http://antirez.com/news/129 Right. > The whole crux of your argument seems to be maintainers' time isn't > important so we should accept all trivial patches ... I'm pushing back > on that assumption in two places, firstly the valulessness of the time > and secondly that all trivial patches are valuable. > > > If some company does not want to pay for that, that's fine, but they > > don't get to be maintainers and claim `Supported`. > > What I'm actually trying to articulate is a way of measuring value of > the patch vs cost ... it has nothing really to do with who foots the > actual bill. > > One thesis I'm actually starting to formulate is that this continual > devaluing of maintainers is why we have so much difficulty keeping and > recruiting them. Absolutely. This is just one of the factors involved, but a significant one IMV. _______________________________________________ amd-gfx mailing list amd-gfx@lists.freedesktop.org https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/amd-gfx From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.0 required=3.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIMWL_WL_HIGH, DKIM_SIGNED,DKIM_VALID,MAILING_LIST_MULTI,SPF_HELO_NONE,SPF_PASS, URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.0 Received: from mail.kernel.org (mail.kernel.org [198.145.29.99]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 45A8FC6379D for ; Wed, 25 Nov 2020 09:57:09 +0000 (UTC) Received: from merlin.infradead.org (merlin.infradead.org [205.233.59.134]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CE9762083E for ; Wed, 25 Nov 2020 09:57:08 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=lists.infradead.org header.i=@lists.infradead.org header.b="3CIshRdU" DMARC-Filter: OpenDMARC Filter v1.3.2 mail.kernel.org CE9762083E Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; dmarc=fail (p=none dis=none) header.from=kernel.org Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; spf=none smtp.mailfrom=linux-i3c-bounces+linux-i3c=archiver.kernel.org@lists.infradead.org DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=lists.infradead.org; s=merlin.20170209; h=Sender:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-Type:Cc:List-Subscribe:List-Help:List-Post:List-Archive: List-Unsubscribe:List-Id:To:Subject:Message-ID:Date:From:In-Reply-To: References:MIME-Version:Reply-To:Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date: Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Owner; bh=yBoCCiQsOBinSoXpWEqwAW995iI3JavDoXGNStB5DG8=; b=3CIshRdUOwBaEN1hg+Gz98eUn 0/x7hM4d09LY7H2cirGwafWdwA3oSBjGoBPhO+6weVgJcP/uVmXJTtVKnVsGkyC208TlNFZtezqfw Tc/1+zqZ4TPUkA+JGQc3qK7S4N7hR0aJ9C9XLVO5i0L37++j+Hp4mhPyPzDT+QszSifKQP4JVsUSo knNz8Y3kZUhlTH8KunAKsatX1VqkMOxBfkA6xJdMrHSmv4hZV446bjCY05ech3eIkNjXQuoMLEPe3 KGXF3Pl5Fz2nHDa7rjoB943DmUGOJKexFYcNBVu2DH3IUa7h4teLlDrHUSsSGnMiNeU9IWVjRRAMD 1SKcMIVcQ==; Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=merlin.infradead.org) by merlin.infradead.org with esmtp (Exim 4.92.3 #3 (Red Hat Linux)) id 1khrXw-0006QA-1a; Wed, 25 Nov 2020 09:57:08 +0000 Received: from mail-ot1-f68.google.com ([209.85.210.68]) by merlin.infradead.org with esmtps (Exim 4.92.3 #3 (Red Hat Linux)) id 1khEeH-0006Ox-3w; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 16:25:06 +0000 Received: by mail-ot1-f68.google.com with SMTP id n12so12914981otk.0; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:25:03 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=SWzdE85KMSmQ5K6aYMgWVQjn8/tst2VI3dLUnv/55SM=; b=jDEjvEJtiSTwKWHClnRHJtASuPUXtO8lR6UX+a4N1BXZGIB952iIySFAJcB0jDyBuM NhRo1t8lQa7N3W7ouvgsh8IgV2YkdBb95NX1K/9jtOMYHGlVxAvgSBwKPgdCk5NJTrx2 uYcOjpM0bc28ZQlKoHSFfX9w4hp05Mt0kuLGG+fLXWwJgCYiiCmGfWeYX/7ztVQMaPks /LFPnpbaL9Ahwpms+y/auhqJs7dWr6exWznrag8LvdqM2Vo8VoeBZDpfYnpu6Y2Gg2wI TCspBd85QkOq+kSwfnH2bIcERput4mIgQCkdCqgH2Kuk7wxAmaO791KFfteuP1nA+rob Y8Pg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532wsjkeTqJOy+uBsGV2EshVnvRexTMjMlbRRTMn/Ko+g45O4zS2 2Lz7FHHt8x8IyfDuBHmmg1xWmguGKEBwhy07Tr8= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxW9u67TbnPp8ObIChv5a6F+ncd8SoV+BFvs894Bl4MJzyAX0TVAjkpawJr+z1OvIzzPyEcIsCefAg0WelXSFg= X-Received: by 2002:a9d:16f:: with SMTP id 102mr68959otu.206.1606148702991; Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:25:02 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20201120105344.4345c14e@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011201129.B13FDB3C@keescook> <20201120115142.292999b2@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011220816.8B6591A@keescook> <9b57fd4914b46f38d54087d75e072d6e947cb56d.camel@HansenPartnership.com> <1c7d7fde126bc0acf825766de64bf2f9b888f216.camel@HansenPartnership.com> In-Reply-To: From: "Rafael J. Wysocki" Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2020 17:24:51 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [PATCH 000/141] Fix fall-through warnings for Clang To: James Bottomley X-CRM114-Version: 20100106-BlameMichelson ( TRE 0.8.0 (BSD) ) MR-646709E3 X-CRM114-CacheID: sfid-20201123_112505_466489_C9EF8A05 X-CRM114-Status: GOOD ( 17.69 ) X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 25 Nov 2020 04:56:58 -0500 X-BeenThere: linux-i3c@lists.infradead.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: "moderated list:SOUND - SOC LAYER / DYNAMIC AUDIO POWER MANAGEM..." , linux-atm-general@lists.sourceforge.net, reiserfs-devel@vger.kernel.org, linux-iio@vger.kernel.org, linux-wireless , "open list:FRAMEBUFFER LAYER" , dri-devel , linux-kernel , Nathan Chancellor , "open list:LIBATA SUBSYSTEM \(Serial and Parallel ATA drivers\)" , dm-devel@redhat.com, keyrings@vger.kernel.org, linux-mtd@lists.infradead.org, GR-everest-linux-l2@marvell.com, wcn36xx@lists.infradead.org, samba-technical@lists.samba.org, linux-i3c@lists.infradead.org, linux1394-devel@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-afs@lists.infradead.org, usb-storage@lists.one-eyed-alien.net, drbd-dev@lists.linbit.com, devel@driverdev.osuosl.org, linux-cifs@vger.kernel.org, rds-devel@oss.oracle.com, Nick Desaulniers , "open list:TARGET SUBSYSTEM" , linux-rdma@vger.kernel.org, oss-drivers@netronome.com, bridge@lists.linux-foundation.org, linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org, amd-gfx list , linux-stm32@st-md-mailman.stormreply.com, cluster-devel@redhat.com, ACPI Devel Maling List , coreteam@netfilter.org, intel-wired-lan@lists.osuosl.org, linux-input , Miguel Ojeda , Jakub Kicinski , Ext4 Developers List , Linux Media Mailing List , Kees Cook , selinux@vger.kernel.org, linux-arm-msm , intel-gfx , linux-geode@lists.infradead.org, linux-can@vger.kernel.org, linux-block@vger.kernel.org, linux-gpio@vger.kernel.org, op-tee@lists.trustedfirmware.org, "moderated list:ARM/Mediatek SoC..." , xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org, nouveau , linux-hams@vger.kernel.org, ceph-devel@vger.kernel.org, virtualization@lists.linux-foundation.org, Linux ARM , linux-hwmon@vger.kernel.org, linux-watchdog@vger.kernel.org, linux-nfs@vger.kernel.org, GR-Linux-NIC-Dev@marvell.com, tipc-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net, Linux-MM , Network Development , linux-decnet-user@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-mmc , "Gustavo A. R. Silva" , "maintainer:X86 ARCHITECTURE \(32-BIT AND 64-BIT\)" , Linux-Renesas , Miguel Ojeda , linux-sctp@vger.kernel.org, "open list:ULTRA-WIDEBAND \(UWB\) SUBSYSTEM:" , netfilter-devel@vger.kernel.org, Linux Crypto Mailing List , patches@opensource.cirrus.com, Joe Perches , linux-integrity@vger.kernel.org, target-devel@vger.kernel.org, linux-hardening@vger.kernel.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: "linux-i3c" Errors-To: linux-i3c-bounces+linux-i3c=archiver.kernel.org@lists.infradead.org On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 4:58 PM James Bottomley wrote: > > On Mon, 2020-11-23 at 15:19 +0100, Miguel Ojeda wrote: > > On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 11:36 PM James Bottomley > > wrote: [cut] > > > > Maintainers routinely review 1-line trivial patches, not to mention > > internal API changes, etc. > > We're also complaining about the inability to recruit maintainers: > > https://www.theregister.com/2020/06/30/hard_to_find_linux_maintainers_says_torvalds/ > > And burn out: > > http://antirez.com/news/129 Right. > The whole crux of your argument seems to be maintainers' time isn't > important so we should accept all trivial patches ... I'm pushing back > on that assumption in two places, firstly the valulessness of the time > and secondly that all trivial patches are valuable. > > > If some company does not want to pay for that, that's fine, but they > > don't get to be maintainers and claim `Supported`. > > What I'm actually trying to articulate is a way of measuring value of > the patch vs cost ... it has nothing really to do with who foots the > actual bill. > > One thesis I'm actually starting to formulate is that this continual > devaluing of maintainers is why we have so much difficulty keeping and > recruiting them. Absolutely. This is just one of the factors involved, but a significant one IMV. -- linux-i3c mailing list linux-i3c@lists.infradead.org http://lists.infradead.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-i3c From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Rafael J. Wysocki Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2020 17:24:51 +0100 Subject: [Intel-wired-lan] [PATCH 000/141] Fix fall-through warnings for Clang In-Reply-To: References: <20201120105344.4345c14e@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011201129.B13FDB3C@keescook> <20201120115142.292999b2@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011220816.8B6591A@keescook> <9b57fd4914b46f38d54087d75e072d6e947cb56d.camel@HansenPartnership.com> <1c7d7fde126bc0acf825766de64bf2f9b888f216.camel@HansenPartnership.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: intel-wired-lan@osuosl.org List-ID: On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 4:58 PM James Bottomley wrote: > > On Mon, 2020-11-23 at 15:19 +0100, Miguel Ojeda wrote: > > On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 11:36 PM James Bottomley > > wrote: [cut] > > > > Maintainers routinely review 1-line trivial patches, not to mention > > internal API changes, etc. > > We're also complaining about the inability to recruit maintainers: > > https://www.theregister.com/2020/06/30/hard_to_find_linux_maintainers_says_torvalds/ > > And burn out: > > http://antirez.com/news/129 Right. > The whole crux of your argument seems to be maintainers' time isn't > important so we should accept all trivial patches ... I'm pushing back > on that assumption in two places, firstly the valulessness of the time > and secondly that all trivial patches are valuable. > > > If some company does not want to pay for that, that's fine, but they > > don't get to be maintainers and claim `Supported`. > > What I'm actually trying to articulate is a way of measuring value of > the patch vs cost ... it has nothing really to do with who foots the > actual bill. > > One thesis I'm actually starting to formulate is that this continual > devaluing of maintainers is why we have so much difficulty keeping and > recruiting them. Absolutely. This is just one of the factors involved, but a significant one IMV. From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Rafael J. Wysocki Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2020 17:24:51 +0100 Subject: [Cluster-devel] [PATCH 000/141] Fix fall-through warnings for Clang In-Reply-To: References: <20201120105344.4345c14e@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011201129.B13FDB3C@keescook> <20201120115142.292999b2@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011220816.8B6591A@keescook> <9b57fd4914b46f38d54087d75e072d6e947cb56d.camel@HansenPartnership.com> <1c7d7fde126bc0acf825766de64bf2f9b888f216.camel@HansenPartnership.com> Message-ID: List-Id: To: cluster-devel.redhat.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 4:58 PM James Bottomley wrote: > > On Mon, 2020-11-23 at 15:19 +0100, Miguel Ojeda wrote: > > On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 11:36 PM James Bottomley > > wrote: [cut] > > > > Maintainers routinely review 1-line trivial patches, not to mention > > internal API changes, etc. > > We're also complaining about the inability to recruit maintainers: > > https://www.theregister.com/2020/06/30/hard_to_find_linux_maintainers_says_torvalds/ > > And burn out: > > http://antirez.com/news/129 Right. > The whole crux of your argument seems to be maintainers' time isn't > important so we should accept all trivial patches ... I'm pushing back > on that assumption in two places, firstly the valulessness of the time > and secondly that all trivial patches are valuable. > > > If some company does not want to pay for that, that's fine, but they > > don't get to be maintainers and claim `Supported`. > > What I'm actually trying to articulate is a way of measuring value of > the patch vs cost ... it has nothing really to do with who foots the > actual bill. > > One thesis I'm actually starting to formulate is that this continual > devaluing of maintainers is why we have so much difficulty keeping and > recruiting them. Absolutely. This is just one of the factors involved, but a significant one IMV. From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20201120105344.4345c14e@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011201129.B13FDB3C@keescook> <20201120115142.292999b2@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <202011220816.8B6591A@keescook> <9b57fd4914b46f38d54087d75e072d6e947cb56d.camel@HansenPartnership.com> <1c7d7fde126bc0acf825766de64bf2f9b888f216.camel@HansenPartnership.com> In-Reply-To: From: "Rafael J. Wysocki" Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2020 17:24:51 +0100 Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Subject: Re: [Bridge] [PATCH 000/141] Fix fall-through warnings for Clang List-Id: Linux Ethernet Bridging List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , To: James Bottomley Cc: "moderated list:SOUND - SOC LAYER / DYNAMIC AUDIO POWER MANAGEM..." , linux-atm-general@lists.sourceforge.net, reiserfs-devel@vger.kernel.org, linux-iio@vger.kernel.org, linux-wireless , "open list:FRAMEBUFFER LAYER" , dri-devel , linux-kernel , Nathan Chancellor , "open list:LIBATA SUBSYSTEM (Serial and Parallel ATA drivers)" , dm-devel@redhat.com, keyrings@vger.kernel.org, linux-mtd@lists.infradead.org, GR-everest-linux-l2@marvell.com, wcn36xx@lists.infradead.org, samba-technical@lists.samba.org, linux-i3c@lists.infradead.org, linux1394-devel@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-afs@lists.infradead.org, usb-storage@lists.one-eyed-alien.net, drbd-dev@lists.linbit.com, devel@driverdev.osuosl.org, linux-cifs@vger.kernel.org, rds-devel@oss.oracle.com, Nick Desaulniers , "open list:TARGET SUBSYSTEM" , linux-rdma@vger.kernel.org, oss-drivers@netronome.com, bridge@lists.linux-foundation.org, linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org, amd-gfx list , linux-stm32@st-md-mailman.stormreply.com, cluster-devel@redhat.com, ACPI Devel Maling List , coreteam@netfilter.org, intel-wired-lan@lists.osuosl.org, linux-input , Miguel Ojeda , Jakub Kicinski , Ext4 Developers List , Linux Media Mailing List , Kees Cook , selinux@vger.kernel.org, linux-arm-msm , intel-gfx , linux-geode@lists.infradead.org, linux-can@vger.kernel.org, linux-block@vger.kernel.org, linux-gpio@vger.kernel.org, op-tee@lists.trustedfirmware.org, "moderated list:ARM/Mediatek SoC..." , xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org, nouveau , linux-hams@vger.kernel.org, ceph-devel@vger.kernel.org, virtualization@lists.linux-foundation.org, Linux ARM , linux-hwmon@vger.kernel.org, linux-watchdog@vger.kernel.org, linux-nfs@vger.kernel.org, GR-Linux-NIC-Dev@marvell.com, tipc-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net, Linux-MM , Network Development , linux-decnet-user@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-mmc , "Gustavo A. R. Silva" , "maintainer:X86 ARCHITECTURE (32-BIT AND 64-BIT)" , Linux-Renesas , Miguel Ojeda , linux-sctp@vger.kernel.org, "open list:ULTRA-WIDEBAND (UWB) SUBSYSTEM:" , netfilter-devel@vger.kernel.org, Linux Crypto Mailing List , patches@opensource.cirrus.com, Joe Perches , linux-integrity@vger.kernel.org, target-devel@vger.kernel.org, linux-hardening@vger.kernel.org On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 4:58 PM James Bottomley wrote: > > On Mon, 2020-11-23 at 15:19 +0100, Miguel Ojeda wrote: > > On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 11:36 PM James Bottomley > > wrote: [cut] > > > > Maintainers routinely review 1-line trivial patches, not to mention > > internal API changes, etc. > > We're also complaining about the inability to recruit maintainers: > > https://www.theregister.com/2020/06/30/hard_to_find_linux_maintainers_says_torvalds/ > > And burn out: > > http://antirez.com/news/129 Right. > The whole crux of your argument seems to be maintainers' time isn't > important so we should accept all trivial patches ... I'm pushing back > on that assumption in two places, firstly the valulessness of the time > and secondly that all trivial patches are valuable. > > > If some company does not want to pay for that, that's fine, but they > > don't get to be maintainers and claim `Supported`. > > What I'm actually trying to articulate is a way of measuring value of > the patch vs cost ... it has nothing really to do with who foots the > actual bill. > > One thesis I'm actually starting to formulate is that this continual > devaluing of maintainers is why we have so much difficulty keeping and > recruiting them. Absolutely. This is just one of the factors involved, but a significant one IMV.