From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-8.8 required=3.0 tests=BAYES_00, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,MAILING_LIST_MULTI,MENTIONS_GIT_HOSTING, SPF_HELO_NONE,SPF_PASS autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.0 Received: from mail.kernel.org (mail.kernel.org [198.145.29.99]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4FAC9C2B9F4 for ; Thu, 17 Jun 2021 16:36:41 +0000 (UTC) Received: from vger.kernel.org (vger.kernel.org [23.128.96.18]) by mail.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 552AF61400 for ; Thu, 17 Jun 2021 16:36:40 +0000 (UTC) Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S229671AbhFQQir (ORCPT ); Thu, 17 Jun 2021 12:38:47 -0400 Received: from mail-vs1-f46.google.com ([209.85.217.46]:38613 "EHLO mail-vs1-f46.google.com" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S229599AbhFQQiq (ORCPT ); Thu, 17 Jun 2021 12:38:46 -0400 Received: by mail-vs1-f46.google.com with SMTP id x8so3356012vso.5 for ; Thu, 17 Jun 2021 09:36:38 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=P3wHvkZCCq+CgodypF7rbvTYeyJsFpMK7ZMBECm/0x0=; b=U8Sgb6WebtfzTpyagRxsU+N5U8n6+czLNxYFGV598g+SLXt0z4QwAkp8yiKtrqqSo4 sV2VyO3CpMg0/qEBDK28X6e66qvWiu0sBej8huXLsA07Ome+Lv5sc9cGKJ8jcnSbH1Sj 2c4pH6GTvziE6w8tQpnccefx11UIn8oaifbuVfaQdYG/lAsOc4U3R6HDYTtOIPPJIO/E H29phAjemtVIvz+6udwn5Wwc3XVJppvjOEQop++lsHcvtzGnLSnT3jfVbyvjRpaG62/1 mBLLzDdUR90UHGDwiXdJXNw+4Bjzf9Tz9b7nzYv47fKz4R9fdg/a4nj+9e8pdSXZPBKQ iE7w== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5313gYbhmpY0T0QSqLXfDx846e1M01bBZPyxIEex7XeXLSibk/Yu TcsU+wplSYjsjvUS6Q/ucojsXTOeSiCO9xnNplY= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwQQVOvg+x24BPxGgZOLsHIxLg43R3/g3K2T61PVNLxNkbVqbcwyn+4Fz1qPIP9gbjPkCEgQsuLwDrCXxbP/h4= X-Received: by 2002:a67:efd6:: with SMTP id s22mr1589590vsp.3.1623947797075; Thu, 17 Jun 2021 09:36:37 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20210616171813.bwvu6mtl4ltotf7p@nitro.local> <20210617145728.nahkvtxapozccm6c@nitro.local> <20210617151659.GF5067@sirena.org.uk> In-Reply-To: From: Geert Uytterhoeven Date: Thu, 17 Jun 2021 18:36:24 +0200 Message-ID: Subject: Re: RFC: Github PR bot questions To: Laurent Pinchart Cc: Mark Brown , Konstantin Ryabitsev , Christoph Hellwig , Dmitry Vyukov , Jiri Kosina , users@linux.kernel.org, workflows@vger.kernel.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: workflows@vger.kernel.org Hi Laurent, On Thu, Jun 17, 2021 at 5:24 PM Laurent Pinchart wrote: > On Thu, Jun 17, 2021 at 04:16:59PM +0100, Mark Brown wrote: > > On Thu, Jun 17, 2021 at 10:57:28AM -0400, Konstantin Ryabitsev wrote: > > > On Thu, Jun 17, 2021 at 11:09:34AM +0100, Christoph Hellwig wrote: > > > > Because I don't waste my time on the kind of crap that comes from > > > > github. If you build a separate webinterface that allows anyone to send > > > > a proper series from a git tree that is all fine. But github is toxic. > > > > > Won't this just end up reimplementing a lot of stuff that we already get "for > > > free" from Github and other forges? Yes, I know Github is proprietary, but so > > > are many SMTP gateways used to send the patch series. I don't see how what > > > the GH bot would do is different from: > > > > I think part of the concern here is that people have some standard > > expectations for how projects they work with on Github are going to > > function so if people end up using Github to submit patches we may end > > up with some culture and process mismatches which could cause issues. > > There are some features (or lack thereof) of git..b that I suspect > actively decrease the quality of the hosted software. For instance, the > inability to comment on the commit messages during review can play a > role in the average low quality of those messages. Similarly, review is > often based on changes, not on individual commits, which results in > commits being badly split (or not split at all, it's common to see very > large commits with a "fix stuff" commit message). I thought so, too, until I received a first comment on an individual commit in a github PR yesterday[1]. > Developers who have only been exposed to those platforms are very likely > to never have learnt the importance of commit messages, and of proper > split of changes across commits. Those are issues that are inherent to > those platforms and that we will likely need to handle in an automated > way (at least to some extent) or maintainers will become crazy (I know > we already suffer from those issues with the mailing list-based > workflow, but I believe it would get worse, not better, and some of our > maintainers are already suffering way more than they should). That's definitely not a problem that originated on git..b. Been like that in the corporate world before. Guess what happened after switching from a more-forgiving VCS to git, and seeing Aborting commit due to empty commit message. ? ... Dummy commit messages, of course. [1] https://github.com/esmil/linux/commit/f5b077c3e80d85b1c2749999c9f74491f69a6ceb#comments Gr{oetje,eeting}s, Geert -- Geert Uytterhoeven -- There's lots of Linux beyond ia32 -- geert@linux-m68k.org In personal conversations with technical people, I call myself a hacker. But when I'm talking to journalists I just say "programmer" or something like that. -- Linus Torvalds