From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: olof@lixom.net (Olof Johansson) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2018 10:02:53 -0800 Subject: [sw-dev] SBI extension proposal v2 In-Reply-To: References: <4aef7216-726c-f565-5c0f-cebd2aefb46d@wdc.com> <2e5329eff04e2b0bc2433b5d974bf10f@mailhost.ics.forth.gr> Message-ID: To: linux-riscv@lists.infradead.org List-Id: linux-riscv.lists.infradead.org On Sat, Nov 10, 2018 at 9:47 AM Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote: > > On Sat, Nov 10, 2018 at 5:42 PM Olof Johansson wrote: > > > The case of console is in this case pretty simple: It's intended for > > early boot for very simplistic environments (before the rest of the > > kernel is up, etc). Keeping the SBI console around beyond early boot, > > and somehow trying to optimize for it for those use cases is a > > misdirected effort; that's what native drivers are for. > > spike (which is only around 7,000 lines of code) doesn't have native > drivers, and qemu is too heavy-duty to consider adding custom > extensions and experimental research onto. > > with nothing in spike *other* than the serial console, it's the only > way in and out. I'll repeat myself: "trying to optimize for those use cases is a misdirected effort". Trying to optimize your experience on spike at the cost of simplicity for everybody else is the wrong thing to do. -Olof From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=3.0 tests=DKIMWL_WL_HIGH,DKIM_SIGNED, DKIM_VALID,HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,MAILING_LIST_MULTI,SPF_PASS, URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.0 Received: from mail.kernel.org (mail.kernel.org [198.145.29.99]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D436C43441 for ; Sat, 10 Nov 2018 18:03:20 +0000 (UTC) Received: from bombadil.infradead.org (bombadil.infradead.org [198.137.202.133]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 60E5E20840 for ; Sat, 10 Nov 2018 18:03:20 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=lists.infradead.org header.i=@lists.infradead.org header.b="rlJupP+p"; dkim=fail reason="signature verification failed" (2048-bit key) header.d=lixom-net.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.i=@lixom-net.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.b="PxXMKJzi" DMARC-Filter: OpenDMARC Filter v1.3.2 mail.kernel.org 60E5E20840 Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; dmarc=none (p=none dis=none) header.from=lixom.net Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; spf=none smtp.mailfrom=linux-riscv-bounces+infradead-linux-riscv=archiver.kernel.org@lists.infradead.org DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=lists.infradead.org; s=bombadil.20170209; h=Sender: Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-Type:Cc:List-Subscribe:List-Help:List-Post: List-Archive:List-Unsubscribe:List-Id:To:Subject:Message-ID:Date:From: In-Reply-To:References:MIME-Version:Reply-To:Content-ID:Content-Description: Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID: List-Owner; bh=1JYBhDrMyP+JHymWoyUXlAMaDRGfhvmhkBV//54J37g=; b=rlJupP+pOHbrC7 9pH21dVy8Ju1E255L8RW5kX76LYH0L0UiJ8ogvoz06Kk7ciZZs+D+/vimdGqx5A/40z95Z7MtYEYn HWrccKZGx/9Wj3+QrDMvmaLKtQksc4y3UXjPj81+6lQIxgt39dkUEH7gDwDfbOmiD4QTfxd222dwJ O9aH9cjFoym4vTA4A7T8TaYLdQer0bqLRxRRYiKobRLIIAlcDfZTG8ttHrKqjrkbxn3Wo145p329z Or3Wo/zSvK6GUe8kp+XVft1YYDJCXAhIQjPc1Zue7lZxi6sfqSWYlIoJYUH5GMSUP7LGbWCe/sK5/ SYTnrpham6HAARR5FGQA==; Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=bombadil.infradead.org) by bombadil.infradead.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1 #2 (Red Hat Linux)) id 1gLXbL-0004ra-Ne; Sat, 10 Nov 2018 18:03:19 +0000 Received: from mail-it1-x142.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::142]) by bombadil.infradead.org with esmtps (Exim 4.90_1 #2 (Red Hat Linux)) id 1gLXbI-0004qw-PA for linux-riscv@lists.infradead.org; Sat, 10 Nov 2018 18:03:18 +0000 Received: by mail-it1-x142.google.com with SMTP id p11-v6so7116014itf.0 for ; Sat, 10 Nov 2018 10:03:06 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=lixom-net.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=02hbfiqyzj3si0jEa+BiQxfX+8CzkjezNbWr91jpwdY=; b=PxXMKJzideJIvct5k1ZHxnKT1h2MpcC7L9cWRZOSuk8KrgxOoONCP/p7zaqISrGN7v 7wuh9i94A7+McqUbWYEYbp4UKMcsmc7ataPzPE7PzU6EfEDfrv9C/oyr3KGNn90Cp27s b9pD4awGI7Iz1rLooIDnu2zl4arwcmFx52YNSGXgtxSggD15T2FqgZddhBeWb5tcPqnq eiq8xukSU+rXCd1N23uSjGRt8ZiJFdikC67kCy3efEVOT3UyGtxcRYzwC8wczZqtpfgD ePYhx+qgDFCaLDpTbubrbOgXaOelWnPub8IXNH5ACXokuop3Sg7vlha8qocsR19FIdbf JpJg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=02hbfiqyzj3si0jEa+BiQxfX+8CzkjezNbWr91jpwdY=; b=RfjHeWb//C41EfTw6ni1zQwDMIE5VDLkFSqCO33yyvenru0zFBWRnnIiG6i6/GIyQy e0lV/e6Hy1m9ZFjrbau49lTHi1iy0kaJDBavgXWi5ldGcEAaOw+Zkg44lEotVUmHDIXl 4oTlDJzoGqDl077ApJ0TM2texpzttHom4yOzDNiDuMuEYolI2HC6q3Pi80rbZO9AGnJP 7SYIFC3jtgJKF0btb8qhlgbjQj/igz5IFSSbEbzBt8A0AlqHQY20jd2tqpfmuf+csb6b lj3b5ogcwyvgWhrqVr3J0A2zSQPEL7ZatRxVlVm9+Kf8ZSz3WtAmyKw3kOgqfvrIlBc0 +TGg== X-Gm-Message-State: AGRZ1gJAa9fldXQVsXM94ISEs9gPP6bvFOh3p73NDTs9/o/0yaMNAE+a zmYQYXXg/EOiNZlCT73aeNbOSfVdGGwZJQ+Edv1sgA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AJdET5d8zzD2H86lbr9OHOJeOombyHa3kQAqkOtR3JUz5fOiiHO1CuPbNQqQ4PFwvTL8Ox1GuiKFcggMH5OoSNbiLrE= X-Received: by 2002:a24:39d8:: with SMTP id l207-v6mr6085633ita.103.1541872985736; Sat, 10 Nov 2018 10:03:05 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <4aef7216-726c-f565-5c0f-cebd2aefb46d@wdc.com> <2e5329eff04e2b0bc2433b5d974bf10f@mailhost.ics.forth.gr> In-Reply-To: From: Olof Johansson Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2018 10:02:53 -0800 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [sw-dev] SBI extension proposal v2 To: lkcl@lkcl.net X-CRM114-Version: 20100106-BlameMichelson ( TRE 0.8.0 (BSD) ) MR-646709E3 X-CRM114-CacheID: sfid-20181110_100316_817107_CC874AB1 X-CRM114-Status: GOOD ( 10.46 ) X-BeenThere: linux-riscv@lists.infradead.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: Mark Rutland , Christoph Hellwig , Damien.LeMoal@wdc.com, olof johansson , alankao@andestech.com, abner.chang@hpe.com, atish.patra@wdc.com, Anup Patel , Palmer Dabbelt , Alexander Graf , zong@andestech.com, rminnich@gmail.com, sw-dev@groups.riscv.org, paul.walmsley@sifive.com, mick@ics.forth.gr, Alistair.Francis@wdc.com, linux-riscv@lists.infradead.org, Andrew Waterman Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: "linux-riscv" Errors-To: linux-riscv-bounces+infradead-linux-riscv=archiver.kernel.org@lists.infradead.org Message-ID: <20181110180253.7kn6xhdKfUjhcLziKo0ECOsPuov0y8ts23jmXjPxpvs@z> On Sat, Nov 10, 2018 at 9:47 AM Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote: > > On Sat, Nov 10, 2018 at 5:42 PM Olof Johansson wrote: > > > The case of console is in this case pretty simple: It's intended for > > early boot for very simplistic environments (before the rest of the > > kernel is up, etc). Keeping the SBI console around beyond early boot, > > and somehow trying to optimize for it for those use cases is a > > misdirected effort; that's what native drivers are for. > > spike (which is only around 7,000 lines of code) doesn't have native > drivers, and qemu is too heavy-duty to consider adding custom > extensions and experimental research onto. > > with nothing in spike *other* than the serial console, it's the only > way in and out. I'll repeat myself: "trying to optimize for those use cases is a misdirected effort". Trying to optimize your experience on spike at the cost of simplicity for everybody else is the wrong thing to do. -Olof _______________________________________________ linux-riscv mailing list linux-riscv@lists.infradead.org http://lists.infradead.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-riscv