From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org Received: from vger.kernel.org (vger.kernel.org [23.128.96.18]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B058EC43334 for ; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 16:18:44 +0000 (UTC) Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S235824AbiGMQSo (ORCPT ); Wed, 13 Jul 2022 12:18:44 -0400 Received: from lindbergh.monkeyblade.net ([23.128.96.19]:52718 "EHLO lindbergh.monkeyblade.net" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S229797AbiGMQSm (ORCPT ); Wed, 13 Jul 2022 12:18:42 -0400 Received: from pb-smtp2.pobox.com (pb-smtp2.pobox.com [64.147.108.71]) by lindbergh.monkeyblade.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 197B82724 for ; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 09:18:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pb-smtp2.pobox.com (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by pb-smtp2.pobox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BCAF14446F; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 12:18:36 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from junio@pobox.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed; d=pobox.com; h=from:to:cc :subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version :content-type; s=sasl; bh=RG1Rmn4/4OURIfrfFrLYvwKx1IpvrRwpa3UVhV afaKg=; b=yJRunvIhGV2+sABM+Y98ERVIe2rPLGxRVgzCgrm9eBwk1dKiA5Boes 2PbtL+cHMYgDiT+Bz+8a1UpBXmwtLfRdRhLI+PNldZbRbhe6KjVPxGUqAnNRdaEM riCdqHMvqjx/DTnlk4mkwQcYYy9c7303MvkIdlY9hlscS52FCY3ko= Received: from pb-smtp2.nyi.icgroup.com (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by pb-smtp2.pobox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4315414446E; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 12:18:36 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from junio@pobox.com) Received: from pobox.com (unknown [34.83.92.57]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by pb-smtp2.pobox.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id AB59814446D; Wed, 13 Jul 2022 12:18:35 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from junio@pobox.com) From: Junio C Hamano To: "Derrick Stolee via GitGitGadget" Cc: git@vger.kernel.org, johannes.schindelin@gmx.de, Derrick Stolee Subject: Re: [PATCH 0/3] Use "allowlist" and "denylist" tree-wide References: Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2022 09:18:34 -0700 In-Reply-To: (Derrick Stolee via GitGitGadget's message of "Wed, 13 Jul 2022 13:20:47 +0000") Message-ID: User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.2 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Pobox-Relay-ID: 7245148A-02C7-11ED-8F3B-CB998F0A682E-77302942!pb-smtp2.pobox.com Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: git@vger.kernel.org "Derrick Stolee via GitGitGadget" writes: > The terms "allowlist" and "denylist" are self-defining. One "allows" things > while the other "denies" things. > > These are better terms over "whitelist" and "blacklist" which require prior > knowledge of the terms or cultural expectations around what each color > "means". Half Devil's advocate mode on, as I got up on the wrong side of the bed this morning. I am very much for consistent uses of allow/deny and I think it is a good idea to review and apply this series. But I'd prefer to see us more honest to ourselves. Like it or not, the code comment and documentation are targetted toward those who can read English, and when you say something is whitelisted in English, you know exactly what it means, due to shared knowledge of historical use of the word. We are doing this change in the name of inclusion. I find it intellectually dishonest to avoid saying that true reason, and instead say the allow/deny pair is more "precise". They are not more precise. In fact, the fact why you have to choose between deny and block and defend deny over block shows that these words are less precise. People who use white/black do not have to choose between black and other colors and say "white/red may be OK but we choose black because..." to defend the choice of their words. The reason we do this change is because the project thinks that it is the right thing to encourage the adoption of these more inclusive words, together with other projects that did the same. In addition, they are words more widely accepted in today's world, and new folks are more likely to be educated with these words. As time goes by, the historical white/black will be less understood, so it makes it a future-proofing change, as well.