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From: Daniel Vetter <daniel.vetter@ffwll.ch>
To: Chris Wilson <chris@chris-wilson.co.uk>
Cc: linux-rdma <linux-rdma@vger.kernel.org>,
	"Thomas Hellström" <thomas_os@shipmail.org>,
	LKML <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	"amd-gfx list" <amd-gfx@lists.freedesktop.org>,
	"Christian König" <christian.koenig@amd.com>,
	"moderated list:DMA BUFFER SHARING FRAMEWORK"
	<linaro-mm-sig@lists.linaro.org>,
	"Thomas Hellstrom" <thomas.hellstrom@intel.com>,
	"DRI Development" <dri-devel@lists.freedesktop.org>,
	"Daniel Vetter" <daniel.vetter@intel.com>,
	"open list:DMA BUFFER SHARING FRAMEWORK"
	<linux-media@vger.kernel.org>,
	"Intel Graphics Development" <intel-gfx@lists.freedesktop.org>,
	"Mika Kuoppala" <mika.kuoppala@intel.com>
Subject: Re: [Intel-gfx] [PATCH 03/18] dma-fence: basic lockdep annotations
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 2020 11:36:24 +0200
Message-ID: <CAKMK7uHOcH+rWhor7zzqqcjCUtxz_-5stLAOVD=4_ED+QjN8oQ@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <159126281827.25109.3992161193069793005@build.alporthouse.com>

On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 at 11:27 AM Chris Wilson <chris@chris-wilson.co.uk> wrote:
>
> Quoting Daniel Vetter (2020-06-04 10:21:46)
> > On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 at 10:57 AM Thomas Hellström (Intel)
> > <thomas_os@shipmail.org> wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > On 6/4/20 10:12 AM, Daniel Vetter wrote:
> > > ...
> > > > Thread A:
> > > >
> > > >       mutex_lock(A);
> > > >       mutex_unlock(A);
> > > >
> > > >       dma_fence_signal();
> > > >
> > > > Thread B:
> > > >
> > > >       mutex_lock(A);
> > > >       dma_fence_wait();
> > > >       mutex_unlock(A);
> > > >
> > > > Thread B is blocked on A signalling the fence, but A never gets around
> > > > to that because it cannot acquire the lock A.
> > > >
> > > > Note that dma_fence_wait() is allowed to be nested within
> > > > dma_fence_begin/end_signalling sections. To allow this to happen the
> > > > read lock needs to be upgraded to a write lock, which means that any
> > > > other lock is acquired between the dma_fence_begin_signalling() call and
> > > > the call to dma_fence_wait(), and still held, this will result in an
> > > > immediate lockdep complaint. The only other option would be to not
> > > > annotate such calls, defeating the point. Therefore these annotations
> > > > cannot be sprinkled over the code entirely mindless to avoid false
> > > > positives.
> > >
> > > Just realized, isn't that example actually a true positive, or at least
> > > a great candidate for a true positive, since if another thread reenters
> > > that signaling path, it will block on that mutex, and the fence would
> > > never be signaled unless there is another signaling path?
> >
> > Not sure I understand fully, but I think the answer is "it's complicated".
>
> See cd8084f91c02 ("locking/lockdep: Apply crossrelease to completions")
>
> dma_fence usage here is nothing but another name for a completion.

Quoting from my previous cover letter:

"I've dragged my feet for years on this, hoping that cross-release lockdep
would do this for us, but well that never really happened unfortunately.
So here we are."

I discussed this with Peter, cross-release not getting in is pretty
final it seems. The trouble is false positives without explicit
begin/end annotations reviewed by humans - ime from just these few
examples you just can't guess this stuff by computeres, you need real
brains thinking about all the edge cases, and where exactly the
critical section starts and ends. Without that you're just going to
drown in a sea of false positives and yuck.

So yeah I had hopes for cross-release too, unfortunately that was
entirely in vain and a distraction.

Now I guess it would be nice if there's a per-class
completion_begin/end annotation for the more generic problem. But then
also most people don't have a cross-driver completion api contract
like dma_fence is, with some of the most ridiculous over the top
constraints of what's possible and what's not possible on each side of
the cross-release. We do have a bit an outsized benefit (in pain
reduction) vs cost ratio here.
-Daniel
-- 
Daniel Vetter
Software Engineer, Intel Corporation
+41 (0) 79 365 57 48 - http://blog.ffwll.ch
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  reply index

Thread overview: 106+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2020-06-04  8:12 [PATCH 00/18] dma-fence lockdep annotations, round 2 Daniel Vetter
2020-06-04  8:12 ` [PATCH 01/18] mm: Track mmu notifiers in fs_reclaim_acquire/release Daniel Vetter
2020-06-10 12:01   ` Thomas Hellström (Intel)
2020-06-10 12:25     ` [Intel-gfx] " Daniel Vetter
2020-06-10 19:41   ` [PATCH] " Daniel Vetter
2020-06-11 14:29     ` Jason Gunthorpe
2020-06-21 17:42     ` Qian Cai
2020-06-21 18:07       ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-21 20:01         ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-21 22:09           ` Qian Cai
2020-06-23 16:17           ` Qian Cai
2020-06-23 22:13             ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-23 22:29               ` Qian Cai
2020-06-23 22:31       ` Dave Chinner
2020-06-23 22:36         ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-21 17:00   ` [PATCH 01/18] " Qian Cai
2020-06-21 17:28     ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-21 17:46       ` Qian Cai
2020-06-04  8:12 ` [PATCH 02/18] dma-buf: minor doc touch-ups Daniel Vetter
2020-06-10 13:07   ` Thomas Hellström (Intel)
2020-06-04  8:12 ` [PATCH 03/18] dma-fence: basic lockdep annotations Daniel Vetter
2020-06-04  8:57   ` Thomas Hellström (Intel)
2020-06-04  9:21     ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-04  9:26       ` Chris Wilson
2020-06-04  9:36         ` Daniel Vetter [this message]
2020-06-05 13:29   ` [PATCH] " Daniel Vetter
2020-06-05 14:30     ` Thomas Hellström (Intel)
2020-06-11  9:57     ` Maarten Lankhorst
2020-06-10 14:21   ` [Intel-gfx] [PATCH 03/18] " Tvrtko Ursulin
2020-06-10 15:17     ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-11 10:36       ` Tvrtko Ursulin
2020-06-11 11:29         ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-11 14:29           ` Tvrtko Ursulin
2020-06-11 15:03             ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-11  8:00   ` Chris Wilson
2020-06-11  8:44     ` Dave Airlie
2020-06-11  9:01       ` [Intel-gfx] " Daniel Stone
2020-06-19  8:25         ` Chris Wilson
2020-06-19  8:51           ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-19  9:13             ` Chris Wilson
2020-06-19  9:43               ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-19 13:12                 ` Chris Wilson
2020-06-22  9:16                   ` Daniel Vetter
2020-07-09  7:29                 ` Daniel Stone
2020-07-09  8:01                   ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-12  7:06   ` [PATCH] " Daniel Vetter
2020-06-04  8:12 ` [PATCH 04/18] dma-fence: prime " Daniel Vetter
2020-06-11  7:30   ` [Linaro-mm-sig] " Thomas Hellström (Intel)
2020-06-11  8:34     ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-11 14:15       ` Jason Gunthorpe
2020-06-11 23:35         ` Felix Kuehling
2020-06-12  5:11           ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-19 18:13           ` Jerome Glisse
2020-06-23  7:39           ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-23 18:44             ` Felix Kuehling
2020-06-23 19:02               ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-16 12:07         ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-16 14:53           ` Jason Gunthorpe
2020-06-17  7:57             ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-17 15:29               ` Jason Gunthorpe
2020-06-18 14:42                 ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-17  6:48           ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-17 15:28             ` Jason Gunthorpe
2020-06-18 15:00               ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-18 17:23                 ` Jason Gunthorpe
2020-06-19  7:22                   ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-19 11:39                     ` Jason Gunthorpe
2020-06-19 15:06                       ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-19 15:15                         ` Jason Gunthorpe
2020-06-19 16:19                           ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-19 17:23                             ` Jason Gunthorpe
2020-06-19 18:09                               ` Jerome Glisse
2020-06-19 18:18                                 ` Jason Gunthorpe
2020-06-19 19:48                                   ` Felix Kuehling
2020-06-19 19:55                                     ` Jason Gunthorpe
2020-06-19 20:03                                       ` Felix Kuehling
2020-06-19 20:31                                       ` Jerome Glisse
2020-06-22 11:46                                         ` Jason Gunthorpe
2020-06-22 20:15                                           ` Jerome Glisse
2020-06-23  0:02                                             ` Jason Gunthorpe
2020-06-19 20:10                                   ` Jerome Glisse
2020-06-19 20:43                                     ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-19 20:59                                       ` Jerome Glisse
2020-06-23  0:05                                     ` Jason Gunthorpe
2020-06-19 19:11                                 ` Alex Deucher
2020-06-19 19:30                                   ` Felix Kuehling
2020-06-19 19:40                                     ` Jerome Glisse
2020-06-19 19:51                                     ` Jason Gunthorpe
2020-06-12  7:01   ` [PATCH] " Daniel Vetter
2020-06-04  8:12 ` [PATCH 05/18] drm/vkms: Annotate vblank timer Daniel Vetter
2020-06-04  8:12 ` [PATCH 06/18] drm/vblank: Annotate with dma-fence signalling section Daniel Vetter
2020-06-04  8:12 ` [PATCH 07/18] drm/atomic-helper: Add dma-fence annotations Daniel Vetter
2020-06-04  8:12 ` [PATCH 08/18] drm/amdgpu: add dma-fence annotations to atomic commit path Daniel Vetter
2020-06-23 10:51   ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-04  8:12 ` [PATCH 09/18] drm/scheduler: use dma-fence annotations in main thread Daniel Vetter
2020-06-04  8:12 ` [PATCH 10/18] drm/amdgpu: use dma-fence annotations in cs_submit() Daniel Vetter
2020-06-04  8:12 ` [PATCH 11/18] drm/amdgpu: s/GFP_KERNEL/GFP_ATOMIC in scheduler code Daniel Vetter
2020-06-04  8:12 ` [PATCH 12/18] drm/amdgpu: DC also loves to allocate stuff where it shouldn't Daniel Vetter
2020-06-04  8:12 ` [PATCH 13/18] drm/amdgpu/dc: Stop dma_resv_lock inversion in commit_tail Daniel Vetter
2020-06-05  8:30   ` Pierre-Eric Pelloux-Prayer
2020-06-05 12:41     ` Daniel Vetter
2020-06-04  8:12 ` [PATCH 14/18] drm/scheduler: use dma-fence annotations in tdr work Daniel Vetter
2020-06-04  8:12 ` [PATCH 15/18] drm/amdgpu: use dma-fence annotations for gpu reset code Daniel Vetter
2020-06-04  8:12 ` [PATCH 16/18] Revert "drm/amdgpu: add fbdev suspend/resume on gpu reset" Daniel Vetter
2020-06-04  8:12 ` [PATCH 17/18] drm/amdgpu: gpu recovery does full modesets Daniel Vetter
2020-06-04  8:12 ` [PATCH 18/18] drm/i915: Annotate dma_fence_work Daniel Vetter

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