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From: Steven Rostedt <rostedt@goodmis.org>
To: Peter Zijlstra <peterz@infradead.org>
Cc: Alexei Starovoitov <alexei.starovoitov@gmail.com>,
	Masami Hiramatsu <mhiramat@kernel.org>,
	Nikolay Borisov <nborisov@suse.com>,
	LKML <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	Alexei Starovoitov <ast@kernel.org>, bpf <bpf@vger.kernel.org>,
	Josh Poimboeuf <jpoimboe@redhat.com>
Subject: Re: kprobes broken since 0d00449c7a28 ("x86: Replace ist_enter() with nmi_enter()")
Date: Tue, 2 Feb 2021 11:56:23 -0500
Message-ID: <20210202115623.08e8164d@gandalf.local.home> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <YBmBu0c24RjNYFet@hirez.programming.kicks-ass.net>

On Tue, 2 Feb 2021 17:45:47 +0100
Peter Zijlstra <peterz@infradead.org> wrote:

> On Tue, Feb 02, 2021 at 09:52:49AM -0500, Steven Rostedt wrote:
> 
> > But from a handler, you could do:
> > 
> > 	if (in_nmi())
> > 		return;
> > 	local_irq_save(flags);
> > 	/* Now you are safe from being re-entrant. */  
> 
> But that's an utter crap thing to do. That's like saying I don't care
> about my events, at which point you might as well not bother at all.
> 
> And you can still do that, you just get less coverage today than you
> used to. You used to throw things under the bus, now you throw more
> under the bus. If you didn't care, I can't seem to find myself caring
> either.

NMIs are special, and they always have been. They shouldn't be doing much
anyway. If they are, then that's a problem.

But if you want to make the stack tracer work on all contexts, I'm happy to
take patches. I don't have time to work on it today.

> 
> > Where as there's no equivalent in a NMI handler. That's what makes
> > kprobe/ftrace handlers different than NMI handlers.  
> 
> I don't see how.
> 
> > > Also, given how everything can nest, it had better all be lockless
> > > anyway. You can get your regular function trace interrupted, which can
> > > hit a #DB, which can function trace, which can #BP which can function
> > > trace again which can get #NMI etc.. Many wonderfun nestings possible.  
> > 
> > I would call #DB an #BP handlers very special.  
> 
> They are, just like NMI is special, which is why they're classed
> together.
> 
> > Question: Do #DB and #BP set "in_interrupt()"? Because the function tracer
> > has infrastructure to prevent recursion in the same context.  
> 
> Sure we _could_ do that, but then we get into the 'fun' problem of
> getting a breakpoint/int3 at random places and calling random code and
> having deadlocks because they take the same lock.

My question wasn't to have them do it, I was simply asking if they do. I
was assuming that they do not.

> 
> There was very little that stopped that from happening.
> 
> > That is, a
> > ftrace handler calls something that gets traced, the recursion protection
> > will detect that and prevent the handler from being called again. But the
> > recursion protection is interrupt context aware and lets the handler get
> > called again if the recursion happens from a different context:  
> 
> > If #DB and #BP do not change the in_interrupt() context, then the above
> > still will protect the ftrace handlers from recursion due to them.  
> 
> But it doesn't help with:
> 
> 	spin_lock_irq(&foo); // task context
> 	#DB
> 	  spin_lock_irq(&foo); // interrupt context per your above

The statement above said:

 "If #DB and #BP do not change the in_interrupt() context"

Which would make the above be in the same context and the handler would
not be called for the #DB case.

> 
> All you need to do is put a breakpoint on a piece of code that holds a
> spinlock and a handler that takes the same spinlock.
> 
> There was very little from stopping that.
> 
> > That would require refactoring all the code that's been around since 2008.  
> 
> Because I couldn't tell why/if any of that was correct at all. #DB/#BP
> don't play by the normal rules. They're _far_ more NMI-like than they're
> IRQ-like due to ignoring IF.

I'm fine with #DB and #BP being a "in_nmi()", as they are probably even
more special than NMIs.

-- Steve


  reply index

Thread overview: 37+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
     [not found] <25cd2608-03c2-94b8-7760-9de9935fde64@suse.com>
     [not found] ` <20210128001353.66e7171b395473ef992d6991@kernel.org>
     [not found]   ` <20210128002452.a79714c236b69ab9acfa986c@kernel.org>
     [not found]     ` <a35a6f15-9ab1-917c-d443-23d3e78f2d73@suse.com>
     [not found]       ` <20210128103415.d90be51ec607bb6123b2843c@kernel.org>
2021-01-28  3:38         ` Masami Hiramatsu
2021-01-28  7:11           ` Nikolay Borisov
2021-01-28 16:12           ` Nikolay Borisov
2021-01-28 16:45             ` Nikolay Borisov
2021-01-28 16:50               ` Josh Poimboeuf
2021-01-28 21:52                 ` [PATCH] x86: Disable CET instrumentation in the kernel Josh Poimboeuf
2021-01-29  6:23                   ` Nikolay Borisov
2021-01-29 10:21                   ` Borislav Petkov
     [not found]                     ` <20210129151034.iba4eaa2fuxsipqa@treble>
2021-01-29 16:30                       ` Borislav Petkov
2021-01-29 16:49                         ` Josh Poimboeuf
2021-01-29 16:54                           ` Nikolay Borisov
2021-01-29 17:03                             ` Josh Poimboeuf
2021-01-29 17:07                               ` Borislav Petkov
2021-01-29 17:58                                 ` Seth Forshee
2021-01-28 18:24               ` kprobes broken since 0d00449c7a28 ("x86: Replace ist_enter() with nmi_enter()") Peter Zijlstra
2021-01-29  1:34                 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2021-01-29  6:36                   ` Nikolay Borisov
     [not found]                   ` <YBPNyRyrkzw2echi@hirez.programming.kicks-ass.net>
     [not found]                     ` <20210129224011.81bcdb3eba1227c414e69e1f@kernel.org>
     [not found]                       ` <20210129105952.74dc8464@gandalf.local.home>
2021-01-29 16:24                         ` Peter Zijlstra
2021-01-29 17:45                           ` Alexei Starovoitov
2021-01-29 17:59                             ` Peter Zijlstra
2021-01-29 19:01                               ` Steven Rostedt
2021-01-29 21:05                                 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2021-01-30  1:41                                   ` Masami Hiramatsu
2021-01-29 21:24                                 ` Steven Rostedt
2021-01-30  8:28                                   ` Peter Zijlstra
2021-01-30 12:44                                     ` Steven Rostedt
2021-02-02 10:45                                       ` Peter Zijlstra
2021-02-02 14:52                                         ` Steven Rostedt
2021-02-02 16:45                                           ` Peter Zijlstra
2021-02-02 16:56                                             ` Steven Rostedt [this message]
2021-02-02 18:30                                               ` Peter Zijlstra
2021-02-02 21:05                                                 ` Steven Rostedt
2021-02-03 13:33                                                   ` Masami Hiramatsu
2021-02-03 13:52                                                     ` Steven Rostedt
2021-01-30  2:02                               ` Masami Hiramatsu
2021-01-30  3:08                                 ` Alexei Starovoitov
2021-01-30 12:10                                   ` Masami Hiramatsu

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