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From: Doug Anderson <dianders@chromium.org>
To: Joel Fernandes <joelaf@google.com>
Cc: Barret Rhoden <brho@google.com>,
	ksummit <ksummit-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org>,
	Greg Kroah-Hartman <gregkh@linuxfoundation.org>,
	Jonathan Nieder <jrn@google.com>,
	Tomasz Figa <tfiga@chromium.org>,
	Han-Wen Nienhuys <hanwen@google.com>,
	Theodore Tso <tytso@google.com>,
	David Rientjes <rientjes@google.com>,
	Dmitry Torokhov <dtor@chromium.org>,
	Dmitry Vyukov <dvyukov@google.com>
Subject: Re: [Ksummit-discuss] Allowing something Change-Id (or something like it) in kernel commits
Date: Sat, 24 Aug 2019 09:53:14 -0700
Message-ID: <CAD=FV=XogaeyrU1QitsiO6US-QYHNT7gAN6xFSat=r8jyx+uFQ@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAJWu+or4Lur_q65yTtPQmh8wX2A7EaXaOWXmCnOq3ThRpnN=Tg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

On Fri, Aug 23, 2019 at 12:08 PM Joel Fernandes <joelaf@google.com> wrote:
>
> On Fri, Aug 23, 2019 at 2:00 PM Doug Anderson <dianders@chromium.org> wrote:
> [snip]
> > > On Fri, Aug 23, 2019 at 12:45 PM Doug Anderson <dianders@chromium.org> wrote:
> > > [snip]
> > > > Sure, if a given patch in the series is totally wrong and I re-write
> > > > it (but still want the re-write to be considered a new version of the
> > > > previous patch) then I have to manually copy the Change-Id for a
> > > > gerrit upload.  ...but I'd also be OK if people just get a new
> > > > Change-Id in this case.
> > >
> > > Sometimes it is not "totally wrong" but just "done in a different
> > > away" and is a new series. This happens a lot since upstream
> > > development can be evolutionary. So your v1 may look nothing like v2
> > > and is a whole new series. Yet the history linking the 2 series is
> > > important. And no amount of automated commit ID generation can link
> > > them. This is the scenario I was talking about. I know the git hook
> > > works, but sometimes the Change-Id has to be manually copied. That's
> > > not automatable. May be we are slightly on different tracks, but this
> > > is the scenario that would be useful to trace IMO.
> >
> > Agreed that it would be useful and (personally) I'd do it.  Maybe
> > others who are used to the gerrit workflow would also do it.  ...but
> > what I like is that the fallback for those that don't try to hard
> > isn't that terrible.  Yes they'd end up with a new Change-Id in some
> > cases, but presumably it still wouldn't be that hard for tools to help
> > you.  Namely, if you have a series:
> >
> > Patch v1 1/3 - Add a frob - Change-Id A
> > Patch v1 2/3 - Add a larb - Change-Id B
> > Patch v1 3/3 - Use the frob to tweak the larb - Change-Id C
> >
> > ...and you decide that you should be tweaking a sneech instead of a
> > larb, you might end up with this if someone isn't careful to copy
> > Change-Ids and their workflow is to throw away the old patch #2 and #3
> > instead of amending.
> >
> > Patch v2 1/3 - Add a frob - Change-Id A
> > Patch v2 2/3 - Add a sneech - Change-Id D
> > Patch v2 3/3 - Use the frob to tweak the sneech - Change-Id E
> >
> > So you can't find v1 of patch #2 directly from v2 of patch #2.
> > ...but, a good tool could still help you here.  It would see that at
> > least one patch in this series had the same Change-Id and it should
> > help you find the whole v1 series.
> >
> > If all 3 patches were all totally new and lost Change IDs then I guess
> > you're SOL, but maybe in that case it really should be considered a
> > new series anyway?
>
> Maybe it should be. It is hard to generalize it to work all the time.
> But I agree with you the above flow is better than nothing.
>
> It does seem people need more convincing here though, that inserting a
> unique ID into a commit message is acceptable.
>
> Another thing that could be done is, have the git hook insert the
> whatever-ID into the discardable part of the patch. The archive will
> then have it even if the commit doesn't. Then something email2git or
> patchwork can connect different patches in the archive with a
> particular commit. I think Thomas Gleixner or someone else also
> proposed something similar in this thread.  What's wrong with that
> idea?

Right.  The thread is hard to follow, but earlier in the thread I said
I would be happy (ish) with this.  If there is no resolution to this
topic then I will likely start doing this myself and point to this
thread when I get yelled at for it.  ;-)  Unless someone tells me that
this would absolutely not be OK.

The reason that Change-Id after-the-cut is slightly less optimal is
that this whole thing only becomes useful if patch submitters actually
do it.  ...and patch submitters are VERY hard to train.  Patch
submitters are already (accidentally) leaving the Change-Id before the
cut because they already have a commit hook that puts it there for
them.  Thus we have a built-in set of people for whom no training is
needed and no new tools are needed.  That is a huge benefit.  There
are others that already have the Change-Id and (today) have to
manually remove it.  Presumably those people wouldn't need much
training or convincing.

...so I guess I'll still leave a little hope that people will accept
Change-Id as part of the commit message now that I've responded to the
outstanding feedback and showed the benefits...

Please know that I'm not trying to advance a hidden agenda to take
over the world or make gerrit the one true tool or get rid of existing
email workflows.  I'm just trying to get a tag to be allowed that
seems to be genuinely useful.

-Doug

  parent reply index

Thread overview: 105+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2019-08-22 23:39 Doug Anderson
2019-08-23  0:03 ` Brendan Higgins
2019-08-23  0:17 ` Linus Torvalds
2019-08-23  0:30   ` Olof Johansson
2019-08-23  0:43     ` Guenter Roeck
2019-08-23  0:45       ` Olof Johansson
2019-08-23  1:05         ` Olof Johansson
2019-08-23  1:09           ` Dmitry Torokhov
2019-08-23  1:36         ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2019-08-23  2:58           ` Linus Torvalds
2019-08-23  3:03             ` Linus Torvalds
2019-08-23 13:15               ` Sean Paul
2019-08-23 15:18                 ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2019-08-23 15:31                   ` Sean Paul
2019-08-23 15:48                     ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-23 16:19                       ` Dmitry Torokhov
2019-08-23 16:35                         ` Joel Fernandes
2019-08-23 16:45                           ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-23 16:54                             ` Joel Fernandes
2019-08-23 18:00                               ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-23 19:08                                 ` Joel Fernandes
2019-08-23 19:15                                   ` Joel Fernandes
2019-08-23 19:23                                     ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-23 19:31                                       ` Joel Fernandes
2019-08-24 16:53                                   ` Doug Anderson [this message]
2019-08-23 16:46                           ` Dmitry Torokhov
2019-08-23 19:17                             ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-23 19:38                               ` Laurent Pinchart
2019-08-23 21:15                                 ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-23 21:25                                   ` Mark Brown
2019-08-24 23:13                                   ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2019-08-25  7:09                                     ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-26 22:05                                       ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-28  8:50                                         ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-23 20:02                               ` Christian Brauner
2019-08-24 16:34                                 ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-24 18:11                                   ` Linus Torvalds
2019-08-24 23:04                                     ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2019-08-25  3:11                                       ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2019-08-27 10:51                                         ` Mark Brown
2019-09-09  8:14                                           ` Michael Ellerman
2019-09-09 12:09                                             ` Mark Brown
2019-08-26 17:13                                     ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-26 17:30                                       ` Joel Fernandes
2019-08-26 21:35                                         ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-26 21:51                                           ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-26 22:06                                             ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-26 22:19                                               ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-26 23:02                                           ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2019-08-26 23:11                                             ` Doug Anderson
2019-09-16 14:11                                               ` Christian Brauner
2019-09-16 17:43                                               ` Al Viro
2019-09-16 18:05                                                 ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-26 23:43                                             ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-28 12:34                                               ` Christian Brauner
2019-08-27  0:29                                             ` Dmitry Vyukov
2019-08-27  6:06                                               ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-27 13:24                                                 ` Dmitry Vyukov
2019-08-27 13:48                                                   ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2019-08-27 14:01                                                     ` Guenter Roeck
2019-08-27 14:09                                                       ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-27 15:33                                                         ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2019-08-27 15:42                                                           ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-27 18:55                                                           ` Konstantin Ryabitsev
2019-08-27 19:53                                                             ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2019-08-27 21:34                                                               ` Joel Fernandes
2019-08-27 21:38                                                                 ` Joel Fernandes
2019-08-28  9:08                                                                 ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2019-08-28  9:25                                                                   ` Jani Nikula
2019-08-28 10:04                                                                   ` Martin K. Petersen
2019-08-28 10:53                                                                     ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-28 12:46                                                                       ` Martin K. Petersen
2019-08-28 10:42                                                                   ` Mark Brown
2019-08-28 11:41                                                                     ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2019-08-28 12:22                                                                   ` Christian Brauner
2019-08-28 12:38                                                                   ` Joel Fernandes
2019-08-28 13:58                                                                     ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2019-08-28 20:39                                                                       ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-28 20:46                                                                         ` Johannes Berg
2019-08-28 21:00                                                                           ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-28 22:15                                                                         ` Rob Herring
2019-08-27 17:34                                                       ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2019-08-27 18:50                                                         ` Guenter Roeck
2019-08-27 14:06                                                   ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-27  7:33                                               ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2019-08-27 13:30                                                 ` Dmitry Vyukov
2019-08-27 14:28                                                   ` Paul E. McKenney
2019-08-27 15:06                                                     ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-27 15:25                                                       ` Paul E. McKenney
2019-08-28  8:57                                                         ` Dan Carpenter
2019-08-23 15:49                     ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-23 15:54                       ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-23 15:59                         ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-23 16:38                           ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-23 16:50                             ` Andrew Lunn
2019-08-23 17:50                               ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-23 18:10               ` Konstantin Ryabitsev
2019-08-26 22:19               ` Paul Mackerras
2019-08-27  7:02                 ` Stephen Rothwell
2019-08-23  9:09             ` Vlastimil Babka
2019-08-23 12:48               ` Bhaskar Chowdhury
2019-08-23  1:01   ` Dmitry Torokhov
2019-08-23  1:07   ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-23  1:18     ` Joel Fernandes
2019-09-05  8:12 ` Eric Wong

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