From: Joel Fernandes <joelaf@google.com>
To: Doug Anderson <dianders@chromium.org>
Cc: Barret Rhoden <brho@google.com>,
Dmitry Torokhov <dtor@chromium.org>,
ksummit <ksummit-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org>,
Greg Kroah-Hartman <gregkh@linuxfoundation.org>,
Jonathan Nieder <jrn@google.com>,
Tomasz Figa <tfiga@chromium.org>,
Han-Wen Nienhuys <hanwen@google.com>,
Theodore Tso <tytso@google.com>,
Dmitry Vyukov <dvyukov@google.com>,
David Rientjes <rientjes@google.com>
Subject: Re: [Ksummit-discuss] Allowing something Change-Id (or something like it) in kernel commits
Date: Mon, 26 Aug 2019 13:30:57 -0400 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <CAJWu+op476JWYqbT_dLaW7THqiJUvHPbOjeC=PUT5rzkGv4O1A@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAD=FV=VJt4+XRj59h6tmma5LfU52E_6QOSQVjh3T3M+1V=eMsQ@mail.gmail.com>
On Mon, Aug 26, 2019 at 1:13 PM Doug Anderson <dianders@chromium.org> wrote:
> On Sat, Aug 24, 2019 at 11:11 AM Linus Torvalds
> <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> wrote:
> >
> > On Sat, Aug 24, 2019 at 9:35 AM Doug Anderson <dianders@chromium.org> wrote:
> > >
> > > I have no gerrit server involved when I submit patches to the list. I do:
> > >
> > > 1. Write patch on my local machine.
> > > 2. Post v1 to mailing list.
> > > 3. Make changes.
> > > 4. Post v2 to mailing list.
> > > 5. Make changes.
> > > 5. Post v3 to mailing list.
> > >
> > > I have never uploaded to a gerrit in this process. THERE IS NO GERRIT LINK!
> >
> > First off, there *is* a link - just use the mailing list email link
> > (preferably for the cover letter - so that a whole series has _one_
> > ID, not separate ID's for every patch) just like everybody else does,
> > which also means that you get the history of actual other developers
> > replying to it (including after it has been committed).
> >
> > The first time it gets magically and reliably created for you without
> > you having to do a single thing. The second time, you just look it up.
>
> The key problem here is that it requires the committer to look
> something up and perform a manual step. IMO this means that the
> adoption rate will be near to zero. The reason that Change-Id
> _doesn't_ require a manual step is that it's in your local commit
> message and thus automatically stays there. Thus inaction (leaving
> the Change-Id alone as you spin the patch) produces the ideal
> behavior.
Sure, but..
> >
> > So stop arguing for UUID's. They are fundamentally a bad idea.
> >
> > The *only* actual valid reason I have ever seen for UUID's (and yes,
> > this is not the first time they've been brought up, which is why I
> > hate them with a passion) is to use it as a magic link inside some
> > vendors private database when that vendor doesn't want to expose any
> > actual real information.
>
> What I see here is:
>
> 1. A valid reason to have a UUID is to help a machine that's
> processing data. Specifically UUIDs are well-formed and easy for a
> machine to understand (unlike a link which could point to anything).
I don't think a "link could point to anything" is a good argument
against links. A link to lore.kernel.org/r/<message-id> should point
to only one thing.
> 2. In the past you don't like UUIDs because the machines making sense
> of them are private.
>
> In this thread I am trying to argue that if we allow UUIDs in the
> public email lists that anyone will be able to create a useful and
> public database linking patch versions together.
Did you read all the emails that said these can be inserted into the
discardable part of a patch? Enforcing it on everyone in the community
is impossible.
> > In other words: UUID's are bad and pointless. Their only "valid" use
> > is explicitly against the whole point of open development.
> >
> > Use an actual open standard instead: a web link. It can be anything.
>
> The "It can be anything" is the problem with links. Computers trying
I think he meant it can be any link. But what a link points to
(lore.kernel.org/r/<message-id>) largely should not change.
> NOTE: from reading all of this, one thing that I should probably be
> able to do myself is:
>
> 1. Keep having Change-Id in my patches on my local computer.
>
> 2. Have the scripts I use to post upstream (which strips Change-Id out
> before posting) encode the Change-Id into the Message-Id in a way that
> it could be recovered, like:
>
> Message-Id: Ic3e54798e4aeaa862b2e8eebcbbcef4e51ccae19-2018-1231-235959-1
Why not just put whatever-ID in the discardable part of your patch as
others have also pointed, and move on?
thanks,
- Joel
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2019-08-26 17:31 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 105+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2019-08-22 23:39 [Ksummit-discuss] Allowing something Change-Id (or something like it) in kernel commits Doug Anderson
2019-08-23 0:03 ` Brendan Higgins
2019-08-23 0:17 ` Linus Torvalds
2019-08-23 0:30 ` Olof Johansson
2019-08-23 0:43 ` Guenter Roeck
2019-08-23 0:45 ` Olof Johansson
2019-08-23 1:05 ` Olof Johansson
2019-08-23 1:09 ` Dmitry Torokhov
2019-08-23 1:36 ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2019-08-23 2:58 ` Linus Torvalds
2019-08-23 3:03 ` Linus Torvalds
2019-08-23 13:15 ` Sean Paul
2019-08-23 15:18 ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2019-08-23 15:31 ` Sean Paul
2019-08-23 15:48 ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-23 16:19 ` Dmitry Torokhov
2019-08-23 16:35 ` Joel Fernandes
2019-08-23 16:45 ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-23 16:54 ` Joel Fernandes
2019-08-23 18:00 ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-23 19:08 ` Joel Fernandes
2019-08-23 19:15 ` Joel Fernandes
2019-08-23 19:23 ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-23 19:31 ` Joel Fernandes
2019-08-24 16:53 ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-23 16:46 ` Dmitry Torokhov
2019-08-23 19:17 ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-23 19:38 ` Laurent Pinchart
2019-08-23 21:15 ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-23 21:25 ` Mark Brown
2019-08-24 23:13 ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2019-08-25 7:09 ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-26 22:05 ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-28 8:50 ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-23 20:02 ` Christian Brauner
2019-08-24 16:34 ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-24 18:11 ` Linus Torvalds
2019-08-24 23:04 ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2019-08-25 3:11 ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2019-08-27 10:51 ` Mark Brown
2019-09-09 8:14 ` Michael Ellerman
2019-09-09 12:09 ` Mark Brown
2019-08-26 17:13 ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-26 17:30 ` Joel Fernandes [this message]
2019-08-26 21:35 ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-26 21:51 ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-26 22:06 ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-26 22:19 ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-26 23:02 ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2019-08-26 23:11 ` Doug Anderson
2019-09-16 14:11 ` Christian Brauner
2019-09-16 17:43 ` Al Viro
2019-09-16 18:05 ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-26 23:43 ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-28 12:34 ` Christian Brauner
2019-08-27 0:29 ` Dmitry Vyukov
2019-08-27 6:06 ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-27 13:24 ` Dmitry Vyukov
2019-08-27 13:48 ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2019-08-27 14:01 ` Guenter Roeck
2019-08-27 14:09 ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-27 15:33 ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2019-08-27 15:42 ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-27 18:55 ` Konstantin Ryabitsev
2019-08-27 19:53 ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2019-08-27 21:34 ` Joel Fernandes
2019-08-27 21:38 ` Joel Fernandes
2019-08-28 9:08 ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2019-08-28 9:25 ` Jani Nikula
2019-08-28 10:04 ` Martin K. Petersen
2019-08-28 10:53 ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-28 12:46 ` Martin K. Petersen
2019-08-28 10:42 ` Mark Brown
2019-08-28 11:41 ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2019-08-28 12:22 ` Christian Brauner
2019-08-28 12:38 ` Joel Fernandes
2019-08-28 13:58 ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2019-08-28 20:39 ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-28 20:46 ` Johannes Berg
2019-08-28 21:00 ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-28 22:15 ` Rob Herring
2019-08-27 17:34 ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2019-08-27 18:50 ` Guenter Roeck
2019-08-27 14:06 ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-27 7:33 ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2019-08-27 13:30 ` Dmitry Vyukov
2019-08-27 14:28 ` Paul E. McKenney
2019-08-27 15:06 ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-27 15:25 ` Paul E. McKenney
2019-08-28 8:57 ` Dan Carpenter
2019-08-23 15:49 ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-23 15:54 ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-23 15:59 ` Thomas Gleixner
2019-08-23 16:38 ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-23 16:50 ` Andrew Lunn
2019-08-23 17:50 ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-23 18:10 ` Konstantin Ryabitsev
2019-08-26 22:19 ` Paul Mackerras
2019-08-27 7:02 ` Stephen Rothwell
2019-08-23 9:09 ` Vlastimil Babka
2019-08-23 12:48 ` Bhaskar Chowdhury
2019-08-23 1:01 ` Dmitry Torokhov
2019-08-23 1:07 ` Doug Anderson
2019-08-23 1:18 ` Joel Fernandes
2019-09-05 8:12 ` Eric Wong
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