From: Kees Cook <keescook@chromium.org>
To: Topi Miettinen <toiwoton@gmail.com>
Cc: Mark Rutland <mark.rutland@arm.com>,
Salvatore Mesoraca <s.mesoraca16@gmail.com>,
systemd-devel@lists.freedesktop.org,
kernel-hardening@lists.openwall.com,
Szabolcs Nagy <szabolcs.nagy@arm.com>,
Catalin Marinas <Catalin.Marinas@arm.com>,
Will Deacon <will.deacon@arm.com>,
"linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org" <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
Jeremy Linton <jeremy.linton@arm.com>,
Mark Brown <broonie@kernel.org>,
linux-hardening@vger.kernel.org, libc-alpha@sourceware.org,
Dave Martin <dave.martin@arm.com>,
"linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org"
<linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org>
Subject: Re: BTI interaction between seccomp filters in systemd and glibc mprotect calls, causing service failures
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2020 13:02:18 -0700 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <202010221256.A4F95FD11@keescook> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <78464155-f459-773f-d0ee-c5bdbeb39e5d@gmail.com>
On Thu, Oct 22, 2020 at 01:39:07PM +0300, Topi Miettinen wrote:
> But I think SELinux has a more complete solution (execmem) which can track
> the pages better than is possible with seccomp solution which has a very
> narrow field of view. Maybe this facility could be made available to
> non-SELinux systems, for example with prctl()? Then the in-kernel MDWX could
> allow mprotect(PROT_EXEC | PROT_BTI) in case the backing file hasn't been
> modified, the source filesystem isn't writable for the calling process and
> the file descriptor isn't created with memfd_create().
Right. The problem here is that systemd is attempting to mediate a
state change using only syscall details (i.e. with seccomp) instead of
a stateful analysis. Using a MAC is likely the only sane way to do that.
SELinux is a bit difficult to adjust "on the fly" the way systemd would
like to do things, and the more dynamic approach seen with SARA[1] isn't
yet in the kernel. Trying to enforce memory W^X protection correctly
via seccomp isn't really going to work well, as far as I can see.
Regardless, it makes sense to me to have the kernel load the executable
itself with BTI enabled by default. I prefer gaining Catalin's suggested
patch[2]. :)
[1] https://lore.kernel.org/kernel-hardening/1562410493-8661-1-git-send-email-s.mesoraca16@gmail.com/
[2] https://lore.kernel.org/linux-arm-kernel/20201022093104.GB1229@gaia/
--
Kees Cook
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next prev parent reply other threads:[~2020-10-22 20:03 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 38+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
[not found] <8584c14f-5c28-9d70-c054-7c78127d84ea@arm.com>
2020-10-22 7:18 ` [systemd-devel] BTI interaction between seccomp filters in systemd and glibc mprotect calls, causing service failures Lennart Poettering
2020-10-22 7:54 ` Florian Weimer
2020-10-22 8:17 ` Topi Miettinen
2020-10-22 8:25 ` Florian Weimer
2020-10-22 8:29 ` Szabolcs Nagy
2020-10-22 8:38 ` Lennart Poettering
2020-10-22 9:31 ` Catalin Marinas
2020-10-22 10:12 ` Topi Miettinen
2020-10-22 10:27 ` Florian Weimer
2020-10-23 6:13 ` Szabolcs Nagy
2020-10-23 9:04 ` Catalin Marinas
2020-10-22 10:03 ` Topi Miettinen
2020-10-22 8:05 ` Szabolcs Nagy
2020-10-22 8:31 ` Lennart Poettering
[not found] ` <20201022075447.GO3819@arm.com>
2020-10-22 10:39 ` Topi Miettinen
2020-10-22 20:02 ` Kees Cook [this message]
2020-10-22 22:24 ` Topi Miettinen
2020-10-23 17:52 ` Salvatore Mesoraca
2020-10-24 11:34 ` Topi Miettinen
2020-10-24 14:12 ` Salvatore Mesoraca
2020-10-25 13:42 ` Jordan Glover
2020-10-23 9:02 ` Catalin Marinas
2020-10-24 11:01 ` Topi Miettinen
2020-10-26 14:52 ` Catalin Marinas
2020-10-26 15:56 ` Dave Martin
2020-10-26 16:51 ` Mark Brown
2020-10-26 16:31 ` Topi Miettinen
2020-10-26 16:24 ` Dave Martin
2020-10-26 16:39 ` Topi Miettinen
2020-10-26 16:45 ` Florian Weimer
2020-10-27 14:22 ` Dave Martin
2020-10-27 14:41 ` Florian Weimer
2020-10-26 16:57 ` Szabolcs Nagy
2020-10-26 17:52 ` Dave Martin
2020-10-26 22:39 ` Jeremy Linton
2020-10-27 14:15 ` Dave Martin
2020-10-29 11:02 ` Catalin Marinas
2020-11-04 12:18 ` Dave Martin
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