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From: Casey Schaufler <casey@schaufler-ca.com>
To: Tetsuo Handa <penguin-kernel@I-love.SAKURA.ne.jp>,
	casey.schaufler@intel.com, paul@paul-moore.com,
	linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org
Cc: john.johansen@canonical.com, keescook@chromium.org,
	selinux@vger.kernel.org, jmorris@namei.org,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, linux-audit@redhat.com
Subject: Re: [PATCH v38 04/39] LSM: Maintain a table of LSM attribute data
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 2022 10:20:29 -0700	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <1a92299f-2f0d-02d1-75ee-72de80e1a091@schaufler-ca.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <280c313e-c826-3b9c-a074-2ead3cf4107f@I-love.SAKURA.ne.jp>

On 10/23/2022 3:10 AM, Tetsuo Handa wrote:
> On 2022/10/23 16:27, Tetsuo Handa wrote:
>> On 2022/10/21 8:42, Casey Schaufler wrote:
>>> I will, on the other hand, listen to compelling arguments. It is not the
>>> intention of this code to lock out loadable modules. If I thought it would
>>> I would not have proposed it.
>> This code is exactly for locking out loadable modules.
>>
> Imagine a situation where two individuals independently develop their own
> web applications using the same identifier, and then their web applications
> started working together with other web applications using that identifier.
> When they published their web applications for public and wider use, a problem
> that both web applications are already using the same identifier arises.
> It is too late to reassign the identifier.
>
> The same trouble can happen with loadable LSM modules. Unless the upstream kernel
> behaves as if a DNS registerer that assigns a unique domainname for whatever web
> sites (regardless of whether a web site is for public or not), defining a permanent
> constant for LSM module is a way towards locking out loadable LSM modules. And it
> is well possible that a loadable LSM module wants to run on older kernels which
> do not have LSM id defined yet.
>
> This "define LSM id as userspace visible constant" is more dangerous than just
> reserving some space for future use. You are trying to control all IP addresses
> for the sake of only in-tree LSM modules. No, no, no, please don't do that...

It's really no more dangerous than using the LSM name. What if two developers
implement modules and both name it "belllapadula"? User space won't be able to
tell the difference if they base behavior on the module name. That's one thing
that a loadable module mechanism is going to need to address that a built-in
mechanism doesn't. 

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  reply	other threads:[~2022-10-23 17:20 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 68+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
     [not found] <20220927195421.14713-1-casey.ref@schaufler-ca.com>
2022-09-27 19:53 ` [PATCH v38 00/39] LSM: Module stacking for AppArmor Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:53   ` [PATCH v38 01/39] LSM: Identify modules by more than name Casey Schaufler
2022-10-12 21:14     ` Mickaël Salaün
2023-03-03 15:17     ` Georgia Garcia
2023-03-03 16:52       ` Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:53   ` [PATCH v38 02/39] LSM: Add an LSM identifier for external use Casey Schaufler
2022-10-12 21:14     ` Mickaël Salaün
2022-10-20 22:47       ` Casey Schaufler
2023-03-03 17:14     ` Georgia Garcia
2022-09-27 19:53   ` [PATCH v38 03/39] LSM: Identify the process attributes for each module Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:53   ` [PATCH v38 04/39] LSM: Maintain a table of LSM attribute data Casey Schaufler
2022-10-13 10:04     ` Tetsuo Handa
2022-10-20 23:42       ` Casey Schaufler
2022-10-23  7:27         ` Tetsuo Handa
2022-10-23 10:10           ` Tetsuo Handa
2022-10-23 17:20             ` Casey Schaufler [this message]
2022-10-23 17:13           ` Casey Schaufler
2022-10-24 15:13             ` Tetsuo Handa
2022-10-24 16:37               ` Casey Schaufler
2022-10-25  9:59                 ` Tetsuo Handa
2022-09-27 19:53   ` [PATCH v38 05/39] proc: Use lsmids instead of lsm names for attrs Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:53   ` [PATCH v38 06/39] LSM: lsm_self_attr syscall for LSM self attributes Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 22:45     ` kernel test robot
2022-09-28 11:04     ` kernel test robot
2022-10-12 21:16     ` Mickaël Salaün
2022-10-20 15:44     ` Paul Moore
2022-10-20 16:13       ` Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:53   ` [PATCH v38 07/39] integrity: disassociate ima_filter_rule from security_audit_rule Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:53   ` [PATCH v38 08/39] LSM: Infrastructure management of the sock security Casey Schaufler
2022-10-12 21:17     ` Mickaël Salaün
2022-09-27 19:53   ` [PATCH v38 09/39] LSM: Add the lsmblob data structure Casey Schaufler
2022-10-12 21:18     ` Mickaël Salaün
2022-09-27 19:53   ` [PATCH v38 10/39] LSM: provide lsm name and id slot mappings Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:53   ` [PATCH v38 11/39] IMA: avoid label collisions with stacked LSMs Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:53   ` [PATCH v38 12/39] LSM: Use lsmblob in security_audit_rule_match Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:53   ` [PATCH v38 13/39] LSM: Use lsmblob in security_kernel_act_as Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:53   ` [PATCH v38 14/39] LSM: Use lsmblob in security_secctx_to_secid Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:53   ` [PATCH v38 15/39] LSM: Use lsmblob in security_secid_to_secctx Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:53   ` [PATCH v38 16/39] LSM: Use lsmblob in security_ipc_getsecid Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:53   ` [PATCH v38 17/39] LSM: Use lsmblob in security_current_getsecid Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:54   ` [PATCH v38 18/39] LSM: Use lsmblob in security_inode_getsecid Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:54   ` [PATCH v38 19/39] LSM: Use lsmblob in security_cred_getsecid Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:54   ` [PATCH v38 20/39] LSM: Specify which LSM to display Casey Schaufler
2022-10-12 21:19     ` Mickaël Salaün
2022-09-27 19:54   ` [PATCH v38 21/39] LSM: Ensure the correct LSM context releaser Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:54   ` [PATCH v38 22/39] LSM: Use lsmcontext in security_secid_to_secctx Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:54   ` [PATCH v38 23/39] LSM: Use lsmcontext in security_inode_getsecctx Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:54   ` [PATCH v38 24/39] Use lsmcontext in security_dentry_init_security Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:54   ` [PATCH v38 25/39] LSM: security_secid_to_secctx in netlink netfilter Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:54   ` [PATCH v38 26/39] NET: Store LSM netlabel data in a lsmblob Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:54   ` [PATCH v38 27/39] binder: Pass LSM identifier for confirmation Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:54   ` [PATCH v38 28/39] LSM: security_secid_to_secctx module selection Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:54   ` [PATCH v38 29/39] Audit: Keep multiple LSM data in audit_names Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:54   ` [PATCH v38 30/39] Audit: Create audit_stamp structure Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:54   ` [PATCH v38 31/39] LSM: Add a function to report multiple LSMs Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:54   ` [PATCH v38 32/39] Audit: Allow multiple records in an audit_buffer Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:54   ` [PATCH v38 33/39] Audit: Add record for multiple task security contexts Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:54   ` [PATCH v38 34/39] audit: multiple subject lsm values for netlabel Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:54   ` [PATCH v38 35/39] Audit: Add record for multiple object contexts Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:54   ` [PATCH v38 36/39] netlabel: Use a struct lsmblob in audit data Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:54   ` [PATCH v38 37/39] LSM: Removed scaffolding function lsmcontext_init Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 19:54   ` [PATCH v38 38/39] AppArmor: Remove the exclusive flag Casey Schaufler
2022-09-27 20:31   ` [PATCH v38 39/39] LSM: Create lsm_module_list system call Casey Schaufler
2022-09-28 14:27     ` kernel test robot
2022-10-12 21:19     ` Mickaël Salaün
2022-10-20 20:28       ` Casey Schaufler
2022-10-12 22:04     ` Kees Cook
2022-10-25  0:39       ` Casey Schaufler

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