From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.2 required=3.0 tests=HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS, MAILING_LIST_MULTI,SPF_HELO_NONE,SPF_PASS,USER_AGENT_SANE_1 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.0 Received: from mail.kernel.org (mail.kernel.org [198.145.29.99]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A6AD5C433E3 for ; Wed, 8 Jul 2020 16:54:20 +0000 (UTC) Received: from vger.kernel.org (vger.kernel.org [23.128.96.18]) by mail.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 80D002063A for ; Wed, 8 Jul 2020 16:54:20 +0000 (UTC) Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1730595AbgGHQyT (ORCPT ); Wed, 8 Jul 2020 12:54:19 -0400 Received: from verein.lst.de ([213.95.11.211]:36202 "EHLO verein.lst.de" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1730299AbgGHQyS (ORCPT ); Wed, 8 Jul 2020 12:54:18 -0400 Received: by verein.lst.de (Postfix, from userid 2407) id 74C6168B05; Wed, 8 Jul 2020 18:54:13 +0200 (CEST) Date: Wed, 8 Jul 2020 18:54:12 +0200 From: Christoph Hellwig To: Matthew Wilcox Cc: Dave Chinner , Christoph Hellwig , Goldwyn Rodrigues , linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org, linux-btrfs@vger.kernel.org, fdmanana@gmail.com, dsterba@suse.cz, darrick.wong@oracle.com, cluster-devel@redhat.com, linux-ext4@vger.kernel.org, linux-xfs@vger.kernel.org Subject: Re: always fall back to buffered I/O after invalidation failures, was: Re: [PATCH 2/6] iomap: IOMAP_DIO_RWF_NO_STALE_PAGECACHE return if page invalidation fails Message-ID: <20200708165412.GA637@lst.de> References: <20200629192353.20841-1-rgoldwyn@suse.de> <20200629192353.20841-3-rgoldwyn@suse.de> <20200701075310.GB29884@lst.de> <20200707124346.xnr5gtcysuzehejq@fiona> <20200707125705.GK25523@casper.infradead.org> <20200707130030.GA13870@lst.de> <20200708065127.GM2005@dread.disaster.area> <20200708135437.GP25523@casper.infradead.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20200708135437.GP25523@casper.infradead.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.17 (2007-11-01) Sender: linux-fsdevel-owner@vger.kernel.org Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org On Wed, Jul 08, 2020 at 02:54:37PM +0100, Matthew Wilcox wrote: > Direct I/O isn't deterministic though. If the file isn't shared, then > it works great, but as soon as you get mixed buffered and direct I/O, > everything is already terrible. Direct I/Os perform pagecache lookups > already, but instead of using the data that we found in the cache, we > (if it's dirty) write it back, wait for the write to complete, remove > the page from the pagecache and then perform another I/O to get the data > that we just wrote out! And then the app that's using buffered I/O has > to read it back in again. Mostly agreed. That being said I suspect invalidating clean cache might still be a good idea. The original idea was mostly on how to deal with invalidation failures of any kind, but falling back for any kind of dirty cache also makes at least some sense. > I have had an objection raised off-list. In a scenario with a block > device shared between two systems and an application which does direct > I/O, everything is normally fine. If one of the systems uses tar to > back up the contents of the block device then the application on that > system will no longer see the writes from the other system because > there's nothing to invalidate the pagecache on the first system. Err, WTF? If someone access shared block devices with random applications all bets are off anyway. > > Unfortunately, this is in direct conflict with the performance > problem caused by some little arsewipe deciding to do: > > $ while true; do dd if=/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libc-2.30.so iflag=direct of=/dev/null; done > > ... doesn't hurt me because my root filesystem is on ext4 which doesn't > purge the cache. But anything using iomap gets all the pages for libc > kicked out of the cache, and that's a lot of fun. ext4 uses iomap..