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Sun, 30 Jan 2022 17:15:06 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2022 17:14:43 -0500 From: Demi Marie Obenour To: LVM general discussion and development Message-ID: References: <6da8a7fc-4ca4-9c1d-c547-dcba827c5c99@gmail.com> <4bb347f0-b63b-d6f6-d501-1318053d0e56@gmail.com> <30ba3f0683afb9c3b60d96ac0019ced4ce9bb5b8.camel@gathman.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <30ba3f0683afb9c3b60d96ac0019ced4ce9bb5b8.camel@gathman.org> X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.78 on 10.11.54.4 X-loop: linux-lvm@redhat.com Cc: Marek =?iso-8859-1?Q?Marczykowski-G=F3recki?= , Zdenek Kabelac Subject: Re: [linux-lvm] LVM performance vs direct dm-thin X-BeenThere: linux-lvm@redhat.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: junk Reply-To: LVM general discussion and development List-Id: LVM general discussion and development List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1153918871539087807==" Sender: linux-lvm-bounces@redhat.com Errors-To: linux-lvm-bounces@redhat.com X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.84 on 10.5.11.22 --===============1153918871539087807== Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="+RkTSzL1O5DYGGOI" Content-Disposition: inline --+RkTSzL1O5DYGGOI Content-Type: text/plain; protected-headers=v1; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2022 17:14:43 -0500 From: Demi Marie Obenour To: LVM general discussion and development Cc: Zdenek Kabelac , Marek =?iso-8859-1?Q?Marczykowski-G=F3recki?= Subject: Re: [linux-lvm] LVM performance vs direct dm-thin On Sun, Jan 30, 2022 at 04:39:30PM -0500, Stuart D. Gathman wrote: > On Sun, 2022-01-30 at 11:45 -0500, Demi Marie Obenour wrote: > > On Sun, Jan 30, 2022 at 11:52:52AM +0100, Zdenek Kabelac wrote: > > >=20 > >=20 > > > Since you mentioned ZFS - you might want focus on using 'ZFS-only' > > > solution. > > > Combining=A0 ZFS or Btrfs with lvm2 is always going to be a painful > > > way as > > > those filesystems have their own volume management. > >=20 > > Absolutely!=A0 That said, I do wonder what your thoughts on using loop > > devices for VM storage are.=A0 I know they are slower than thin > > volumes, > > but they are also much easier to manage, since they are just ordinary > > disk files.=A0 Any filesystem with reflink can provide the needed > > copy-on-write support. >=20 > I use loop devices for test cases - especially with simulated IO > errors. Devs really appreciate having an easy reproducer for > database/filesystem bugs (which often involve handling of IO errors).=20 > But not for production VMs. >=20 > I use LVM as flexible partitions (i.e. only classic LVs, no thin pool). > Classic LVs perform like partitions, literally using the same driver > (device mapper) with a small number of extents, and are if anything > more recoverable than partition tables. We used to put LVM on bare > drives (like AIX did) - who needs a partition table? But on Wintel, > you need a partition table for EFI and so that alien operating systems > know there is something already on a disk. >=20 > Your VM usage is different from ours - you seem to need to clone and > activate a VM quickly (like a vps provider might need to do). We > generally have to buy more RAM to add a new VM :-), so performance of > creating a new LV is the least of our worries. To put it mildly, yes :). Ideally we could get VM boot time down to 100ms or lower. --=20 Sincerely, Demi Marie Obenour (she/her/hers) Invisible Things Lab --+RkTSzL1O5DYGGOI Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCAAdFiEEdodNnxM2uiJZBxxxsoi1X/+cIsEFAmH3DegACgkQsoi1X/+c IsF9sBAAxxnvXpXgGY2CyBx6+/CpEXxfE8usC8a1zRlt8dYd+CUpAqAAMADCN4HV 0zTjGd0rTluIXE6EdvHilaS8yAEcb3ztTcYAcRn9BBDQVu+wPolkipy6FuB1ER3J 6qmHWBZuu8pJJ1VfdITSLvrUbqZqe5DYAlk0CC0OBaBoszs9OxIRbdPkUaw+EkgO 1vxBobEwHOHK2Gr4UavQwEo8nyaVuu/d3c5EBMzHidHASbsmk7dcdMZpYmHMgzcz S4DmdjlGeH2O5MWRy0zdYvw2Xe+Fzz+6V9fRnne37bl8kOU5Pje6v+wHcgh32YG+ I2CYi+4GxYTqAwoyc1zCkOlVfnG76Nop2jzR6K3ZoxCgX+jnO0z0/Td/TLOA1DHp Y9JN5CYMCFn9wtgqTRjLuqqoIbSMnwW8xx8NJ6DR4ZR3zqYxp3KzUk6zO1VGIX3D pAXZSGxnWYeN864paB50yThiagQolXAfDSdCCss/6n6FWlGX5g0qMbbNzjWJ/EjC dkOQn0RYzB2Ak/h3tEnHO/FhjedDqF5S5aMv3JVzbTb7rOlwcpQWCvwSoJn1UVo/ Y1U9qSW9srPkPv1JNiUr5Jts4MSbWGXi71iKKMRQY2oyhlRiKpgXyQQPSSTyI/gW BHbeMii1r9wu+3THsAMe+5bVlZQmewSIa85FEu+dWLFVKyZYVOw= =qpHS -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --+RkTSzL1O5DYGGOI-- --===============1153918871539087807== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ linux-lvm mailing list linux-lvm@redhat.com https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/linux-lvm read the LVM HOW-TO at http://tldp.org/HOWTO/LVM-HOWTO/ --===============1153918871539087807==--