From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-9.8 required=3.0 tests=DKIM_SIGNED,DKIM_VALID, DKIM_VALID_AU,HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,INCLUDES_PATCH,MAILING_LIST_MULTI, SIGNED_OFF_BY,SPF_HELO_NONE,SPF_PASS,URIBL_BLOCKED,USER_AGENT_GIT autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no version=3.4.0 Received: from mail.kernel.org (mail.kernel.org [198.145.29.99]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 35E46C433E1 for ; Thu, 9 Jul 2020 12:33:54 +0000 (UTC) Received: from vger.kernel.org (vger.kernel.org [23.128.96.18]) by mail.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 102A020708 for ; Thu, 9 Jul 2020 12:33:54 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=ffwll.ch header.i=@ffwll.ch header.b="FT1zeqK0" Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1726460AbgGIMdx (ORCPT ); Thu, 9 Jul 2020 08:33:53 -0400 Received: from lindbergh.monkeyblade.net ([23.128.96.19]:56970 "EHLO lindbergh.monkeyblade.net" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1726347AbgGIMdw (ORCPT ); Thu, 9 Jul 2020 08:33:52 -0400 Received: from mail-wm1-x344.google.com (mail-wm1-x344.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::344]) by lindbergh.monkeyblade.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3A5D0C08C5CE for ; Thu, 9 Jul 2020 05:33:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm1-x344.google.com with SMTP id l17so1615986wmj.0 for ; Thu, 09 Jul 2020 05:33:52 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ffwll.ch; s=google; h=from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=9ml7yu61orPGiyeLHj7KPJdBGRuwIj4VGf7RIdg6+6E=; b=FT1zeqK0F6re7x3hxU6WuwKnuhLdZTTGsE6uj0ZmBrbf9TVkVqTK3LOGBYbBEjYddX UQxsmufvcNCR+EiwLcPUmPYWFaC5pZ5CGfGNvzGthBXT2lli8Ur+GfzSgeLxXbdC//jm w7Dqku33+bwbEzRQvB6e/WItr0k784kTvA0/0= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:in-reply-to :references:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=9ml7yu61orPGiyeLHj7KPJdBGRuwIj4VGf7RIdg6+6E=; b=VL180ZaIa5x9cLOwoO/saZKVpyACzJHHH+zolC0njwc4UOaecC2oIvaf3l7vd49c9D AA6jzGqha+oSIO5U/KZS/cvP4Tpgsw2pFcFJ9WSIlC2FklL57JiSP4I58IDhuw0bLSpJ 74ffMzNCm5Xg7ADCSn6Z/tc58V8SVfR1Lj+QfV1cBhJ7kwdMBP8obyO+8pAEJT23GWAb aY5Nm1AacuJ32DyUDjA1/kolCntmAqCa+6kZ9tYC4V0fscud0FTcxmafJdMbV5MFOKbg eCHZ6jmLI0eeuYm+zm+d70DuirXWvkvM4Y8Vha7IEhWo48XQWgU740wnZbw7HK1bcZku dSOA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533NNUh3dK59CokCkbvjgYzwk6ZZ+5RMxFmVIQ6b6i96yqgIB8LV oarwlyI3SZaR8DD6lMHJtd33oQ== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyW1X39siqvN1tXyO+a5xJDhtYxZB7qgF8t/3W1eiXrhQsMLgXCOAKI1Lx9mgsJn2P0+ZV+SQ== X-Received: by 2002:a7b:c313:: with SMTP id k19mr14181981wmj.67.1594298030902; Thu, 09 Jul 2020 05:33:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phenom.ffwll.local ([2a02:168:57f4:0:efd0:b9e5:5ae6:c2fa]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id o205sm4925347wme.24.2020.07.09.05.33.49 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Thu, 09 Jul 2020 05:33:50 -0700 (PDT) From: Daniel Vetter To: DRI Development Cc: Intel Graphics Development , linux-rdma@vger.kernel.org, Daniel Vetter , =?UTF-8?q?Christian=20K=C3=B6nig?= , Daniel Stone , Jesse Natalie , Steve Pronovost , Jason Ekstrand , Felix Kuehling , Mika Kuoppala , Thomas Hellstrom , linux-media@vger.kernel.org, linaro-mm-sig@lists.linaro.org, amd-gfx@lists.freedesktop.org, Chris Wilson , Maarten Lankhorst , Daniel Vetter Subject: [PATCH 1/2] dma-buf.rst: Document why indefinite fences are a bad idea Date: Thu, 9 Jul 2020 14:33:38 +0200 Message-Id: <20200709123339.547390-1-daniel.vetter@ffwll.ch> X-Mailer: git-send-email 2.27.0 In-Reply-To: <20200707201229.472834-4-daniel.vetter@ffwll.ch> References: <20200707201229.472834-4-daniel.vetter@ffwll.ch> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: linux-rdma-owner@vger.kernel.org Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-rdma@vger.kernel.org Comes up every few years, gets somewhat tedious to discuss, let's write this down once and for all. What I'm not sure about is whether the text should be more explicit in flat out mandating the amdkfd eviction fences for long running compute workloads or workloads where userspace fencing is allowed. v2: Now with dot graph! v3: Typo (Dave Airlie) Acked-by: Christian König Acked-by: Daniel Stone Cc: Jesse Natalie Cc: Steve Pronovost Cc: Jason Ekstrand Cc: Felix Kuehling Cc: Mika Kuoppala Cc: Thomas Hellstrom Cc: linux-media@vger.kernel.org Cc: linaro-mm-sig@lists.linaro.org Cc: linux-rdma@vger.kernel.org Cc: amd-gfx@lists.freedesktop.org Cc: intel-gfx@lists.freedesktop.org Cc: Chris Wilson Cc: Maarten Lankhorst Cc: Christian König Signed-off-by: Daniel Vetter --- Documentation/driver-api/dma-buf.rst | 70 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 1 file changed, 70 insertions(+) diff --git a/Documentation/driver-api/dma-buf.rst b/Documentation/driver-api/dma-buf.rst index f8f6decde359..100bfd227265 100644 --- a/Documentation/driver-api/dma-buf.rst +++ b/Documentation/driver-api/dma-buf.rst @@ -178,3 +178,73 @@ DMA Fence uABI/Sync File .. kernel-doc:: include/linux/sync_file.h :internal: +Indefinite DMA Fences +~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ + +At various times &dma_fence with an indefinite time until dma_fence_wait() +finishes have been proposed. Examples include: + +* Future fences, used in HWC1 to signal when a buffer isn't used by the display + any longer, and created with the screen update that makes the buffer visible. + The time this fence completes is entirely under userspace's control. + +* Proxy fences, proposed to handle &drm_syncobj for which the fence has not yet + been set. Used to asynchronously delay command submission. + +* Userspace fences or gpu futexes, fine-grained locking within a command buffer + that userspace uses for synchronization across engines or with the CPU, which + are then imported as a DMA fence for integration into existing winsys + protocols. + +* Long-running compute command buffers, while still using traditional end of + batch DMA fences for memory management instead of context preemption DMA + fences which get reattached when the compute job is rescheduled. + +Common to all these schemes is that userspace controls the dependencies of these +fences and controls when they fire. Mixing indefinite fences with normal +in-kernel DMA fences does not work, even when a fallback timeout is included to +protect against malicious userspace: + +* Only the kernel knows about all DMA fence dependencies, userspace is not aware + of dependencies injected due to memory management or scheduler decisions. + +* Only userspace knows about all dependencies in indefinite fences and when + exactly they will complete, the kernel has no visibility. + +Furthermore the kernel has to be able to hold up userspace command submission +for memory management needs, which means we must support indefinite fences being +dependent upon DMA fences. If the kernel also support indefinite fences in the +kernel like a DMA fence, like any of the above proposal would, there is the +potential for deadlocks. + +.. kernel-render:: DOT + :alt: Indefinite Fencing Dependency Cycle + :caption: Indefinite Fencing Dependency Cycle + + digraph "Fencing Cycle" { + node [shape=box bgcolor=grey style=filled] + kernel [label="Kernel DMA Fences"] + userspace [label="userspace controlled fences"] + kernel -> userspace [label="memory management"] + userspace -> kernel [label="Future fence, fence proxy, ..."] + + { rank=same; kernel userspace } + } + +This means that the kernel might accidentally create deadlocks +through memory management dependencies which userspace is unaware of, which +randomly hangs workloads until the timeout kicks in. Workloads, which from +userspace's perspective, do not contain a deadlock. In such a mixed fencing +architecture there is no single entity with knowledge of all dependencies. +Thefore preventing such deadlocks from within the kernel is not possible. + +The only solution to avoid dependencies loops is by not allowing indefinite +fences in the kernel. This means: + +* No future fences, proxy fences or userspace fences imported as DMA fences, + with or without a timeout. + +* No DMA fences that signal end of batchbuffer for command submission where + userspace is allowed to use userspace fencing or long running compute + workloads. This also means no implicit fencing for shared buffers in these + cases. -- 2.27.0