From: Sargun Dhillon <sargun@sargun.me>
To: Lennart Poettering <lennart@poettering.net>
Cc: "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com>,
"Christian Brauner" <christian.brauner@ubuntu.com>,
"Alexander Viro" <viro@zeniv.linux.org.uk>,
"Christoph Hellwig" <hch@infradead.org>,
linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org,
"John Johansen" <john.johansen@canonical.com>,
"James Morris" <jmorris@namei.org>,
"Mimi Zohar" <zohar@linux.ibm.com>,
"Dmitry Kasatkin" <dmitry.kasatkin@gmail.com>,
"Stephen Smalley" <stephen.smalley.work@gmail.com>,
"Casey Schaufler" <casey@schaufler-ca.com>,
"Arnd Bergmann" <arnd@arndb.de>,
"Andreas Dilger" <adilger.kernel@dilger.ca>,
"OGAWA Hirofumi" <hirofumi@mail.parknet.co.jp>,
"Geoffrey Thomas" <geofft@ldpreload.com>,
"Mrunal Patel" <mpatel@redhat.com>,
"Josh Triplett" <josh@joshtriplett.org>,
"Andy Lutomirski" <luto@kernel.org>,
"Amir Goldstein" <amir73il@gmail.com>,
"Miklos Szeredi" <miklos@szeredi.hu>,
"Theodore Tso" <tytso@mit.edu>, "Alban Crequy" <alban@kinvolk.io>,
"Tycho Andersen" <tycho@tycho.ws>,
"David Howells" <dhowells@redhat.com>,
"James Bottomley" <James.Bottomley@hansenpartnership.com>,
"Jann Horn" <jannh@google.com>,
"Seth Forshee" <seth.forshee@canonical.com>,
"Stéphane Graber" <stgraber@ubuntu.com>,
"Aleksa Sarai" <cyphar@cyphar.com>,
smbarber@chromium.org, "Phil Estes" <estesp@gmail.com>,
"Serge Hallyn" <serge@hallyn.com>,
"Kees Cook" <keescook@chromium.org>,
"Todd Kjos" <tkjos@google.com>,
"Jonathan Corbet" <corbet@lwn.net>,
containers@lists.linux-foundation.org,
linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org, linux-api@vger.kernel.org,
linux-ext4@vger.kernel.org, linux-unionfs@vger.kernel.org,
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selinux@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: [PATCH 00/34] fs: idmapped mounts
Date: Thu, 29 Oct 2020 16:36:13 +0000 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <20201029163612.GA15275@ircssh-2.c.rugged-nimbus-611.internal> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20201029160502.GA333141@gardel-login>
On Thu, Oct 29, 2020 at 05:05:02PM +0100, Lennart Poettering wrote:
> On Do, 29.10.20 10:47, Eric W. Biederman (ebiederm@xmission.com) wrote:
>
> > Is that the use case you are looking at removing the need for
> > systemd-homed to avoid chowning after lugging encrypted home directories
> > from one system to another? Why would it be desirable to avoid the
> > chown?
>
> Yes, I am very interested in seeing Christian's work succeed, for the
> usecase in systemd-homed. In systemd-homed each user gets their own
> private file system, and these fs shall be owned by the user's local
> UID, regardless in which system it is used. The UID should be an
> artifact of the local, individual system in this model, and thus
> the UID on of the same user/home on system A might be picked as 1010
> and on another as 1543, and on a third as 1323, and it shouldn't
> matter. This way, home directories become migratable without having to
> universially sync UID assignments: it doesn't matter anymore what the
> local UID is.
>
> Right now we do a recursive chown() at login time to ensure the home
> dir is properly owned. This has two disadvantages:
>
> 1. It's slow. In particular on large home dirs, it takes a while to go
> through the whole user's homedir tree and chown/adjust ACLs for
> everything.
>
> 2. Because it is so slow we take a shortcut right now: if the
> top-level home dir inode itself is owned by the correct user, we
> skip the recursive chowning. This means in the typical case where a
> user uses the same system most of the time, and thus the UID is
> stable we can avoid the slowness. But this comes at a drawback: if
> the user for some reason ends up with files in their homedir owned
> by an unrelated user, then we'll never notice or readjust.
>
> > If the goal is to solve fragmented administration of uid assignment I
> > suggest that it might be better to solve the administration problem so
> > that all of the uids of interest get assigned the same way on all of the
> > systems of interest.
>
> Well, the goal is to make things simple and be able to use the home
> dir everywhere without any prior preparation, without central UID
> assignment authority.
>
> The goal is to have a scheme that requires no administration, by
> making the UID management problem go away. Hence, if you suggest
> solving this by having a central administrative authority: this is
> exactly what the model wants to get away from.
>
> Or to say this differently: just because I personally use three
> different computers, I certainly don't want to set up LDAP or sync
> UIDs manually.
>
> Lennart
>
> --
> Lennart Poettering, Berlin
Can you help me understand systemd-homed a little bit?
In the man page it says:
systemd-homed is a system service that may be used to create, remove, change or
inspect home areas (directories and network mounts and real or loopback block
devices with a filesystem, optionally encrypted).
It seems that the "underlay?" (If you'll call it that, maybe there is a better
term) can either be a standalone block device (this sounds close to systemd
machined?), a btrfs subvolume (which receives its own superblock (IIRC?, I might
be wrong. It's been a while since I've used btrfs), or just be a directory
that's mapped?
What decides whether it's just a directory and bind-mounted (or a similar
vfsmount), or an actual superblock?
How is the mapping of "real UIDs" to "namespace UIDs" works when it's just a
bind mount? From the perspective of multiple user namespaces, are all
"underlying" UIDs mapped through, or if I try to look at another user's
home directory will they not show up?
Is there a reason you can't / don't / wont use overlayfs instead of bind mounts?
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2020-10-29 16:36 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 68+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2020-10-29 0:32 [PATCH 00/34] fs: idmapped mounts Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 01/34] namespace: take lock_mount_hash() directly when changing flags Christian Brauner
2020-11-01 14:41 ` Christoph Hellwig
2020-11-02 13:33 ` Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 02/34] namespace: only take read lock in do_reconfigure_mnt() Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 03/34] fs: add mount_setattr() Christian Brauner
2020-11-01 14:42 ` Christoph Hellwig
2020-11-02 13:34 ` Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 04/34] tests: add mount_setattr() selftests Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 05/34] fs: introduce MOUNT_ATTR_IDMAP Christian Brauner
2020-11-01 14:45 ` Christoph Hellwig
2020-11-02 13:29 ` Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 06/34] fs: add id translation helpers Christian Brauner
2020-11-01 14:46 ` Christoph Hellwig
2020-11-02 13:25 ` Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 07/34] capability: handle idmapped mounts Christian Brauner
2020-11-01 14:48 ` Christoph Hellwig
2020-11-02 13:23 ` Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 08/34] namei: add idmapped mount aware permission helpers Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 09/34] inode: add idmapped mount aware init and " Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 10/34] attr: handle idmapped mounts Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 11/34] acl: " Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 12/34] xattr: " Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 13/34] selftests: add idmapped mounts xattr selftest Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 14/34] commoncap: handle idmapped mounts Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 15/34] stat: add mapped_generic_fillattr() Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 16/34] namei: handle idmapped mounts in may_*() helpers Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 17/34] namei: introduce struct renamedata Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 18/34] namei: prepare for idmapped mounts Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 19/34] namei: add lookup helpers with idmapped mounts aware permission checking Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 20/34] open: handle idmapped mounts in do_truncate() Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 21/34] open: handle idmapped mounts Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 22/34] af_unix: " Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 23/34] utimes: " Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 24/34] would_dump: " Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 25/34] exec: " Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 26/34] fs: add helpers for idmap mounts Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 27/34] apparmor: handle idmapped mounts Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 28/34] audit: " Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 29/34] ima: " Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 30/34] ext4: support " Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 31/34] expfs: handle " Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 32/34] overlayfs: handle idmapped lower directories Christian Brauner
2020-10-30 11:10 ` Amir Goldstein
2020-10-30 11:52 ` Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 33/34] overlayfs: handle idmapped merged mounts Christian Brauner
2020-10-30 9:57 ` Amir Goldstein
2020-10-29 0:32 ` [PATCH 34/34] fat: handle idmapped mounts Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 2:27 ` [PATCH 00/34] fs: " Dave Chinner
2020-10-29 16:19 ` Christian Brauner
2020-10-29 7:20 ` Sargun Dhillon
2020-10-29 15:47 ` Eric W. Biederman
2020-10-29 15:51 ` Aleksa Sarai
2020-10-29 16:37 ` Eric W. Biederman
2020-10-30 2:18 ` Serge E. Hallyn
2020-10-30 15:07 ` Seth Forshee
2020-10-30 16:03 ` Serge E. Hallyn
2020-11-03 14:10 ` Alban Crequy
2020-10-29 16:05 ` Lennart Poettering
2020-10-29 16:36 ` Sargun Dhillon [this message]
2020-10-29 16:54 ` Eric W. Biederman
[not found] ` <20201029161231.GA108315@cisco>
2020-10-29 16:23 ` Serge E. Hallyn
2020-10-29 16:44 ` Eric W. Biederman
2020-10-29 18:04 ` Stéphane Graber
2020-10-29 21:58 ` Andy Lutomirski
2020-10-30 12:01 ` Christian Brauner
2020-10-30 16:17 ` Serge E. Hallyn
2020-10-31 17:43 ` Andy Lutomirski
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