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From: Marc Gonzalez <marc.w.gonzalez@free.fr>
To: Arnd Bergmann <arnd@kernel.org>, Mans Rullgard <mans@mansr.com>
Cc: Linux ARM <linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org>,
	LKML <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>
Subject: Re: Old platforms: bring out your dead
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 14:13:27 +0100
Message-ID: <034ff035-9c58-336d-c8f5-80bf40ad2fc1@free.fr> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAK8P3a2VW8T+yYUG1pn1yR-5eU4jJXe1+M_ot6DAvfr2KyXCzQ@mail.gmail.com>

[ Dropping maintainers of other platforms ]

On 08/01/2021 23:55, Arnd Bergmann wrote:

> After v5.10 was officially declared an LTS kernel, I had a look around
> the Arm platforms that look like they have not seen any patches from
> their maintainers or users that are actually running the hardware for
> at least five years (2015 or earlier). I made some statistics and lists
> for my lwn.net article last year [1], so I'd thought I'd share a summary
> here for discussion about what we should remove. As I found three
> years ago when I removed several CPU architectures, it makes sense
> to do this in bulk, to simplify a scripted search for device drivers, header
> files and Kconfig options that become unused in the process.
> 
> This is probably a mix of platforms that are completely unused and
> those that just work, but I have no good way of knowing which one
> it is. Without hearing back about these, I'd propose removing all of
> these:
> 
> * asm9260 -- added in 2014, no notable changes after 2015
> * axxia -- added in 2014, no notable changes after 2015
> * bcm/kona -- added in 2013, no notable changes after 2014
> * digicolor -- added in 2014, no notable changes after 2015
> * dove -- added in 2009, obsoleted by mach-mvebu in 2015
> * efm32 -- added in 2011, first Cortex-M, no notable changes after 2013
> * nspire -- added in 2013, no notable changes after 2015
> * picoxcell -- added in 2011, already queued for removal
> * prima2 -- added in 20111, no notable changes since 2015
> * spear -- added in 2010, no notable changes since 2015
> * tango -- added in 2015, sporadic changes until 2017, but abandoned
> * u300 -- added in 2009, no notable changes since 2013
> * vt8500 -- added in 2010, no notable changes since 2014
> * zx --added in 2015 for both 32, 2017 for 64 bit, no notable changes
> 
> If any of the above are not dead yet[2], please let me know,
> and we'll keep them.
> 
> Then there are ARM platforms that are old but have still seen some work
> in the past years. If I hear nothing, these will all stay, but if maintainers
> may want to drop them anyway, I can help with that:
> 
> * clps711x -- prehistoric, converted to multiplatform+DT in 2016, no
> changes since
> * cns3xxx -- added in 2010, last fixed in 2019, probably no users left
> * ep93xx -- added in 2006, LinusW still working on it, any users left?
> * footbridge -- added in prehistory, stable since ~2013, rmk and LinusW have one
> * gemini -- added in 2009, LinusW still working on it
> * hisi (hip01/hip05) -- servers added in 2013, replaced with arm64 in 2016
> * highbank -- added in 2011, no changes after 2015, but Andre still uses it
> * iop32x -- added in 2006, no notable changes other than my cleanup, but
>   I think there are still users
> * ixp4xx -- prehistoric, but LinusW and I are still working on it
> * lpc18xx -- added in 2015, new dts in 2018, but few other changes
> * lpc32xx -- added in 2010, multiplatform 2019, hardware is EOL
> * mmp -- added in 2009, DT support is active, but board files might go
> * moxart -- added in 2013, last Tested-by in 2017
> * mv78xx0 -- added in 2008, mostly stale but still users
>   (https://github.com/1000001101000/Debian_on_Buffalo)
> * nomadik -- added in 2009, LinusW keeps fixing it, probably no other users
> * oxnas -- added in 2016, but already old then, few changes later
> * pxa -- prehistoric, but a few boards may still have users
> * rpc -- prehistoric, but I think Russell still uses his machine
> * sa1100 -- prehistoric, but rmk and LinusW sporadically working in it
> 
> I also looked at non-ARM platforms while preparing for my article. Some of
> these look like they are no longer actively maintained or used, but I'm not
> doing anything about those unless the maintainers would like me to:
> 
> * h8300: Steven Rostedt has repeatedly asked about it to be removed
>    or fixed in 2020 with no reply. This was killed before in 2013, added back
>    in 2015 but has been mostly stale again since 2016
> * c6x: Added in 2011, this has seen very few updates since, but
>     Mark still Acks patches when they come. Like most other DSP platforms,
>     the model of running Linux on a DSP appears to have been obsoleted
>     by using Linux on ARM with on-chip DSP cores running bare-metal code.
> * sparc/sun4m: A patch for removing 32-bit Sun sparc support (not LEON)
>    is currently under review
> * powerpc/cell: I'm the maintainer and I promised to send a patch to remove it.
>    it's in my backlog but I will get to it. This is separate from PS3,
> which is actively
>    maintained and used; spufs will move to ps3
> * powerpc/chrp (32-bit rs6000, pegasos2): last updated in 2009
> * powerpc/amigaone: last updated in 2009
> * powerpc/maple: last updated in 2011
> * m68k/{apollo,hp300,sun3,q40} these are all presumably dead and have not
>    seen updates in many years (atari/amiga/mac and coldfire are very much
>    alive)
> * mips/jazz: last updated in 2007
> * mips/cobalt: last updated in 2010
> 
> There might be some value in dropping old CPU support on architectures
> and platforms that are almost exclusively used with more modern CPUs.
> If there are only few users, those can still keep using v5.10 or v5.4 stable
> kernels for a few more years. Again, I'm not doing anything about them,
> except mention them since I did the research.
> These are the oldest one by architecture, and they may have reached
> their best-served-by-date:
> 
> * 80486SX/DX: 80386 CPUs were dropped in 2012, and there are
>   indications that 486 have no users either on recent kernels.
>   There is still the Vortex86 family of SoCs, and the oldest of those were
>   486SX-class, but all the modern ones are 586-class.
> * Alpha 2106x: First generation that lacks some of the later features.
>   Since all Alphas are ancient by now, it's hard to tell whether these have
>   any fewer users.
> * IA64 Merced: first generation Itanium (2001) was quickly replaced by
>   Itanium II in 2002.
> * MIPS R3000/TX39xx: 32-bit MIPS-II generation, mostly superseded by
>   64-bit MIPS-III (R4000 and higher) starting in 1991. arch/mips still
>   supports these in DECstation and Toshiba Txx9, but it appears that most
>   of those machines are of the 64-bit kind. Later MIPS32 such as 4Kc and
>   later are rather different and widely used.
> * PowerPC 601 (from 1992) just got removed, later 60x, 4xx, 8xx etc
>   are apparently all still used.
> * SuperH SH-2: We discussed removing SH-2 (not J2 or SH-4)
>   support in the past, I don't think there were any objections, but
>   nobody submitted a patch.
> * 68000/68328 (Dragonball): these are less capable than the
>   68020+ or the Coldfire MCF5xxx line and similar to the 68360
>   that was removed in 2016.
> 
>         Arnd
> 
> [1] https://lwn.net/Articles/838807/
> [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jdf5EXo6I68

I didn't see Mans in the CC list. Not sure he's seen this message.

As far as tango is concerned, I didn't keep any boards.

Mans might have some tango3 and tango4 boards.

Waiting for his take on the matter.

I can point out some device-specific drivers that would become
useless if tango support were dropped.

Regards.

  parent reply index

Thread overview: 121+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2021-01-08 22:55 Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-08 23:32 ` Steven Rostedt
2021-01-09 22:04   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-08 23:44 ` Thomas Bogendoerfer
2021-01-09  0:16 ` Linus Walleij
2021-01-09 17:32   ` Florian Fainelli
2021-01-09 21:59   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-09  5:56 ` Willy Tarreau
2021-01-09 21:52   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-10  6:21     ` Willy Tarreau
2021-01-10 10:44       ` Russell King - ARM Linux admin
2021-01-11  9:50     ` David Laight
2021-01-13 10:27       ` Andy Shevchenko
2021-01-13 12:02         ` Linus Walleij
2021-01-13 12:17           ` Andy Shevchenko
2021-01-13 12:21             ` Andy Shevchenko
2021-01-15  0:03               ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2021-01-15  0:24                 ` William Breathitt Gray
2021-01-15  8:59                   ` David Laight
2021-01-13 12:30           ` William Breathitt Gray
2021-01-13 12:56             ` William Breathitt Gray
2021-01-13 13:44           ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-02-04 21:01         ` Pavel Machek
2021-02-05  9:13           ` David Laight
2021-02-05  9:29             ` Pavel Machek
2021-01-09 17:34 ` Florian Fainelli
2021-01-09 21:18   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-09 17:43 ` Russell King - ARM Linux admin
2021-01-09 21:34   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-11 20:09     ` Russell King - ARM Linux admin
2021-01-09 20:19 ` Baruch Siach
2021-01-09 21:19   ` Arnd Bergmann
     [not found] ` <67171E13-6786-4B44-A8C2-3302963B055F@gmail.com>
2021-01-09 22:20   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-10 18:12     ` Fabian Vogt
2021-01-10 19:20       ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-10 21:33       ` Linus Walleij
2021-01-11  0:33         ` Russell King - ARM Linux admin
2021-01-11 12:32           ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-11 12:36             ` Russell King - ARM Linux admin
2021-01-09 23:12 ` Andrew Lunn
2021-01-10  8:45   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-10 16:46     ` Andrew Lunn
2021-01-10 17:27       ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-10 19:51         ` Andrew Lunn
2021-01-10 15:51 ` Neil Armstrong
2021-01-10 15:56   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-10 17:35 ` John Paul Adrian Glaubitz
2021-01-10 21:46   ` Sam Ravnborg
2021-01-11  8:05     ` John Paul Adrian Glaubitz
2021-01-11 14:55       ` chase rayfield
2021-01-12  0:26         ` Rob Landley
2021-01-12  0:50           ` chase rayfield
2021-01-12 14:37         ` John Paul Adrian Glaubitz
2021-01-11 18:09     ` Rob Landley
2021-01-11 15:04   ` Gerhard Pircher
2021-01-12 14:44     ` John Paul Adrian Glaubitz
2021-01-12 22:46       ` Linus Walleij
2021-01-13  8:09         ` Rob Landley
2021-01-13  8:21           ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2021-01-13 13:25             ` Rob Landley
2021-01-13 12:02           ` Andy Shevchenko
2021-01-13  8:15         ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2021-01-13 10:39         ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-14  3:54           ` New platforms: bring out your dead, was " Finn Thain
2021-01-14  9:41         ` John Paul Adrian Glaubitz
2021-01-14  9:48           ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2021-01-14 21:21           ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-14 22:54             ` Undesirable code, was Re: Old platforms etc Finn Thain
2021-01-14 23:09             ` Old platforms: bring out your dead Max Filippov
2021-01-15  8:31               ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-13  0:12       ` Old platforms never die, was " Finn Thain
2021-01-16  6:54         ` Rob Landley
2021-01-16 23:22           ` Finn Thain
2021-01-13 11:47       ` Andy Shevchenko
2021-01-11  1:39 ` Daniel Palmer
2021-01-11  9:15   ` John Paul Adrian Glaubitz
2021-01-11  9:20     ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2021-01-11  9:26       ` John Paul Adrian Glaubitz
2021-01-11  9:36         ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2021-01-11  9:50           ` Greg Ungerer
2021-01-11  9:42     ` Daniel Palmer
2021-01-11 10:13   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-11  8:19 ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2021-01-11  8:59   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-11  9:16     ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2021-01-11 10:28       ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2021-01-11 10:37         ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-11  9:40     ` Thomas Bogendoerfer
2021-01-11 10:34       ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-11  8:40 ` efm32 is dead [Was: Old platforms: bring out your dead] Uwe Kleine-König
2021-01-11 11:10 ` Old platforms: bring out your dead Viresh Kumar
2021-01-11 19:59   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-11 21:15     ` Mattias Wallin
2021-01-11 21:47       ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-11 13:13 ` Marc Gonzalez [this message]
2021-01-11 17:29   ` Måns Rullgård
2021-01-11 21:50     ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-12  8:23       ` Marc Gonzalez
2021-01-11 14:22 ` Mark Salter
2021-01-11 15:00   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-11 14:44 ` Alexander Shiyan
2021-01-11 14:58   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-11 16:23 ` Sylvain Lemieux
2021-01-11 22:17   ` Alexandre Belloni
2021-01-11 19:58 ` Thomas Petazzoni
2021-01-11 20:10   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-11 20:25 ` Song Bao Hua (Barry Song)
2021-01-12  8:41   ` Marc Gonzalez
2021-01-13 10:30 ` Andy Shevchenko
2021-01-13 11:02   ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-13 16:14 ` [v2] " Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-13 19:00   ` Krzysztof Hałasa
2021-01-14  8:51     ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-15  7:08   ` Wei Xu
2021-01-15  9:26     ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-15 11:09       ` Leizhen (ThunderTown)
2021-01-15 12:04         ` Arnd Bergmann
2021-01-18 10:46           ` Wei Xu
2021-01-13 22:27 ` Richard Z
2021-02-05 13:37 ` Alexander Lobakin
2021-01-12  2:05 tedheadster

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