From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.9 required=3.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIMWL_WL_HIGH, DKIM_SIGNED,DKIM_VALID,DKIM_VALID_AU,HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS, MAILING_LIST_MULTI,SPF_HELO_NONE,SPF_PASS,URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.0 Received: from mail.kernel.org (mail.kernel.org [198.145.29.99]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 072D0C48BDF for ; Thu, 10 Jun 2021 20:13:51 +0000 (UTC) Received: from vger.kernel.org (vger.kernel.org [23.128.96.18]) by mail.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D169E613FF for ; Thu, 10 Jun 2021 20:13:50 +0000 (UTC) Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S230190AbhFJUPq (ORCPT ); Thu, 10 Jun 2021 16:15:46 -0400 Received: from mail-qk1-f182.google.com ([209.85.222.182]:33778 "EHLO mail-qk1-f182.google.com" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S229941AbhFJUPp (ORCPT ); Thu, 10 Jun 2021 16:15:45 -0400 Received: by mail-qk1-f182.google.com with SMTP id c9so2356036qkm.0 for ; Thu, 10 Jun 2021 13:13:39 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=linuxfoundation.org; s=google; h=date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:references:mime-version :content-disposition:in-reply-to; bh=KND7DoY/09NzlHDGlCKkV1pirvEJ2hmpAejnVKY3Dhc=; b=a+kj5hpoDoIiocT8sQb4ui2hitct/vz3LCP0HlE1h6aTQr3F/X6y/t5I6nME0j9QIX BkMnFIY3Y3zcXUGpx9lxPm62SPk6b9/C67aYWoB4kHQ3D+7VAAeNFSLICUOOGXF3iEcv ESIwss4AW/PpYGkSdtOfey1/zCc5sY9k/3Row= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:references :mime-version:content-disposition:in-reply-to; bh=KND7DoY/09NzlHDGlCKkV1pirvEJ2hmpAejnVKY3Dhc=; b=KzBNF8VuUAR8uP6An2yUO6YTEvNCzJSrN27W+2AzNlk7W2R5kl206lwSopQR6VeWbu itXdv6MR6s+b5Vk92qNUhsKEASdjwcJbv2FceHxVEeE9o018qxbN20Dk9J6LfpTjO9O4 bQ8vkCOobs6E1mU5PhATXLGUKWErVfJOJvPhWW8W2GAd+ZynCWu4I3p4cpUajkLZmHhh nO2WmivzufArz6wvniH5CusNaJKNR2TnyXRdnXYK6u5tB9r7vPCxX7lUKAXupdnoybWI mgdSGE2DBjtnAhVxGKe15N05XnjXtAIGWO3IJ58DHt3KGR85kcYQPfHPhW7t5PWKV3lY FuqQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530Ig/a5D98bRwNuHc/EWi1j2eTF9NhoWBHfO4CAbJ99FIZFBnap 0NnEVR8QcVGNqPVXvJvanX9134i789t8Y19+ X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwmGpJRpwbiikCRaxnDlsqqyl8jr1T1WEDZKeq7K9RKTwXiT2bBsg2nxY13t+OmoaiRlW9D4Q== X-Received: by 2002:a05:620a:1113:: with SMTP id o19mr347803qkk.229.1623355958654; Thu, 10 Jun 2021 13:12:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nitro.local ([89.36.78.230]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id e128sm2890894qkd.127.2021.06.10.13.12.38 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Thu, 10 Jun 2021 13:12:38 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 16:12:36 -0400 From: Konstantin Ryabitsev To: Laurent Pinchart Cc: ksummit@lists.linux.dev, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Subject: Re: Maintainers / Kernel Summit 2021 planning kick-off Message-ID: <20210610201236.gvxxmgl6ubjsbc3h@nitro.local> References: <5038827c-463f-232d-4dec-da56c71089bd@metux.net> <20210610182318.jrxe3avfhkqq7xqn@nitro.local> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org (Trimming the huge CC list) On Thu, Jun 10, 2021 at 09:39:49PM +0300, Laurent Pinchart wrote: > The topic of how to best organize hybrid events to maximize > inclusiveness for remote participants is more interesting to me. LPC did > an amazing job last year with the fully remote setup, but a hybrid setup > brings new challenges. One issue I've previously experienced in hybrid > setups, especially for brainstorming-type discussions, was that on-site > attendees can very quickly break out conversations in small groups (it's > an issue for fully on-site events too). As a (high-functioning) introvert, I'd say that a lot of it depends not so much on the on-site/off-site nature of participation, but on individual communication preferences. I've presented quite a bit at conferences, and, to me, "brainstorming-type discussions" never really happen post-presentation, largely because being in a spotlight makes me uncomfortable and I generally try to slink away. I suggest that something that would help is providing information on where to ask questions in an informal setting. For example, add the following on the last slide of your presentation: Thank you! Join the discussion: 1. Mailing list: foo@lists.example.com 2. IRC: #foochan on exampleirc.com 3. Matrix: #foochan:example.com 4. My email: foo@example.com This gives enough options for folks to ask questions whether they are in the real-life audience or attending online. Listing both your individual email and a group chat option will help bridge many cultural divides -- some people will feel intimidated asking a question directly (especially if you are a luminary in your field) and will prefer to address a group. Others will feel intimidated addressing a group (what if my question is stupid) and will prefer to address you directly. > Session leads should be aware of the need to ensure even more than usual > that all speakers use microphones. I don't think we need to go as far as > specific training on these topics, but emphasizing the importance of > moderation would be useful in my opinion. I think with most sessions being recorded, people are already well conditioned to use microphones. I try to at least always repeat the question being asked if I notice that the person asking it isn't using a mic. > There will always be more informal discussions between on-site participants. > After all, this is one of the benefits of conferences, by being all together > we can easily organize ad-hoc discussions. This is traditionally done by > finding a not too noisy corner in the conference center, would it be useful > to have more break-out rooms with A/V equipment than usual ? I'm generally of the opinion that we should split conferences from hackathons, anyway. - conferences are great for finding about cool new things happening in your field, and work great online where there is no limit on how many people can join the stream; if the presentation is not what you thought it was going to be, switching to a different video stream is dramatically cheaper than getting out of the dark room to find a different presentation. - hackathons are great for getting things done and meeting up with folks you rarely get to see in real life -- and they work well as on-site, multi-site or hybrid events. For example, the maintainer summit is a "hackathon", even if there is no actual code hacking done. The thing being hackathoned is the development process itself and general direction of things. The LinuxCon is for sure a conference and generally has little tangible value other than a pretext to get your employer to pay for the trip. :) So, perhaps more frequent but smaller events around narrower topics as opposed to huge colocated events? I do appreciate that this is more difficult for organizers, but perhaps it would result in more tangible benefits? -K