From: Dmitry Vyukov <dvyukov@google.com>
To: Peter Zijlstra <peterz@infradead.org>
Cc: Ingo Molnar <mingo@redhat.com>,
Arnaldo Carvalho de Melo <acme@kernel.org>,
Mark Rutland <mark.rutland@arm.com>,
Alexander Shishkin <alexander.shishkin@linux.intel.com>,
Jiri Olsa <jolsa@redhat.com>, Namhyung Kim <namhyung@kernel.org>,
Will Deacon <will@kernel.org>,
LKML <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
Matt Morehouse <mascasa@google.com>
Subject: Re: Process-wide watchpoints
Date: Thu, 4 Feb 2021 10:54:42 +0100 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <CACT4Y+ZLSyVMkPfh3PftEWKC1kC+o1XLxo_o6i4BiyRuPig27g@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <YBvAsku9OWM7KUno@hirez.programming.kicks-ass.net>
On Thu, Feb 4, 2021 at 10:39 AM Peter Zijlstra <peterz@infradead.org> wrote:
>
> On Thu, Feb 04, 2021 at 09:10:11AM +0100, Dmitry Vyukov wrote:
> > On Wed, Feb 3, 2021 at 2:37 PM Peter Zijlstra <peterz@infradead.org> wrote:
>
> > > Letting perf send a signal to the monitored task is intrusive.. let me
> > > think on that.
> >
> > I was thinking of something very similar to that bpf_send_signal that
> > delays sending to exit from irq:
> > https://elixir.bootlin.com/linux/latest/source/kernel/trace/bpf_trace.c#L1091
>
> Oh, making code to do it isn't the problem. The problem stems from the
> fact that perf is supposed to be observant only. The exception is when
> you monitor yourself, in that case you can send signals to yourself,
> because you know what you're doing (supposedly ;-).
>
> But if you go send signals to the task you're monitoring, you're
> actually changing their code-flow, you're an active participant instead
> of an observer.
>
> Also, they might not be able to handle the signal, in which case you're
> not changing the program but terminating it entirely.
>
> That's a big conceptual shift.
>
> OTOH, we're using ptrace permission checks, and ptrace() can inject
> signals just fine. But it's a fairly big departure from what perf set
> out to be.
Oh, I see, I did not think about this.
FWIW it's doable today by attaching a BPF program.
Will it help if this mode is restricted to monitoring the current
process? Sending signals indeed usually requires cooperation, so doing
it for the current process looks like a reasonable restriction.
This may be not a fundamental restriction, but rather "we don't have
any use cases and are not sure about implications, so this is a
precaution measure, may be relaxed in future".
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2021-02-04 9:55 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 23+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2020-11-12 7:46 Process-wide watchpoints Dmitry Vyukov
2020-11-12 10:31 ` Peter Zijlstra
2020-11-12 10:43 ` Dmitry Vyukov
[not found] ` <CACT4Y+bW1gpv8bz0vswaVUt-OB07oJ3NBeTi+vchAe8TTWK+mg@mail.gmail.com>
[not found] ` <CACT4Y+ZsKXfAxrzJGQc5mJ+QiP5sAw7zKWtciS+07qZzSf33mw@mail.gmail.com>
2021-02-01 8:50 ` Dmitry Vyukov
2021-02-03 12:29 ` Peter Zijlstra
2021-02-03 12:49 ` Dmitry Vyukov
2021-02-03 12:50 ` Dmitry Vyukov
2021-02-03 13:37 ` Peter Zijlstra
2021-02-04 8:10 ` Dmitry Vyukov
2021-02-04 9:38 ` Peter Zijlstra
2021-02-04 9:54 ` Dmitry Vyukov [this message]
2021-02-04 12:09 ` Peter Zijlstra
2021-02-04 12:53 ` Dmitry Vyukov
2021-02-04 13:10 ` Peter Zijlstra
2021-02-04 13:35 ` Dmitry Vyukov
2021-02-04 13:45 ` Peter Zijlstra
2021-02-04 14:59 ` Peter Zijlstra
2021-02-04 13:33 ` Peter Zijlstra
2021-02-04 13:37 ` Dmitry Vyukov
2021-02-04 13:06 ` Peter Zijlstra
2021-02-03 5:38 ` Namhyung Kim
2021-02-04 8:10 ` Dmitry Vyukov
2021-02-03 12:22 ` Peter Zijlstra
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