From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org Received: from vger.kernel.org (vger.kernel.org [23.128.96.18]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 72E4BC433FE for ; Tue, 4 Jan 2022 17:52:16 +0000 (UTC) Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S235962AbiADRwP (ORCPT ); Tue, 4 Jan 2022 12:52:15 -0500 Received: from mout.kundenserver.de ([217.72.192.73]:45375 "EHLO mout.kundenserver.de" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S234406AbiADRwM (ORCPT ); Tue, 4 Jan 2022 12:52:12 -0500 Received: from mail-wr1-f47.google.com ([209.85.221.47]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (mreue106 [213.165.67.113]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1Mo7if-1mcwHx3A6t-00pbYT; Tue, 04 Jan 2022 18:52:10 +0100 Received: by mail-wr1-f47.google.com with SMTP id i22so77719258wrb.13; Tue, 04 Jan 2022 09:52:10 -0800 (PST) X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533Xaq/dN5RspR7u4blMmt+syCRcqS7vtF7oXBenV3dJuD59ZkIP tLKjaD5hrU8EQeCJC9JCb4AyQ0bW3az82AJ4Vb8= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJygcoXdlSo0oycRivZs0eEBsO9AOv959rN79bo0Wm/YZAp96RFkt5Mdy0ey7wu8b3j99e/n9n66hIx1SDBwIQ4= X-Received: by 2002:a5d:6d0e:: with SMTP id e14mr45146863wrq.407.1641318730354; Tue, 04 Jan 2022 09:52:10 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Arnd Bergmann Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2022 12:51:56 -0500 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: [PATCH 0000/2297] [ANNOUNCE, RFC] "Fast Kernel Headers" Tree -v1: Eliminate the Linux kernel's "Dependency Hell" To: Ingo Molnar Cc: Greg Kroah-Hartman , Linus Torvalds , Linux Kernel Mailing List , linux-arch , Andrew Morton , Peter Zijlstra , Thomas Gleixner , "David S. Miller" , Ard Biesheuvel , Josh Poimboeuf , Jonathan Corbet , Al Viro Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:qRTzS+/kEBhbTFyZMvrFIWz9fWjSV6QXwddBZvvw0dnDNZcYuAe cv5fjH3elkHdFzwOcAkwatEm+oA0HtPZ4f8Rftf4O4olDKY7z8sKuLl/znIDh2dvl6w7iIh JwdEd5gMh3EynUBDwR0ziJL8FqwQsn2Rcc608Eq9rT1OByPXhy9NosHV8hkucq21f3m3D+Q bXfL1fkU9HsYyOagcD3aQ== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:3U68u6PHqCM=:dPKRX8LVcPTjJdPheCWELg gOiFDst0opVaPZlLrE6WOBzXVCTf9UfdIA0p9S3NQKxuppA3P2IKiDWfHEmmSNk4sFyK3K1/w i0lCq+kmGCQnzT/swXWr+psDyZMWlk0QrYCFq37Rf/AYClLpbFQnmXEhY7AjszxPZhl2C301H vIMuuAIcG+MZN2MNZDCHctQnuh5n8FUcp2kRQswvEf8KOf9baIIZq/tw0+F6RhjsUof2DJjVa 9JeYdHT7RUwlh2UkCjA6E88yeQqTj96RS/Y8RWWtzqZw2s9270HcqZpuAle4Hn/4ZrxpIHrvG MftCV+NgyWETUhWRUj433xQBJKU334kYuS1nT0tLVRLotYbykQsWcnfIdrqR6KSxUdJnZEYm6 8N/zbFWsgz4xtJOXUiSXjN27KYfV7SvSgYCP/DrZhTQfG9QHQs90GNm16YAFHRPVatFpJ7J7T G8wqCdOrBPsDycWKAdn5yWwVTb2HU/Bdzcz+BIbIFZVctlY5ewIbBRY7k6oB6877Y1azlYbCb plqtP/A52qbIF6/GXihf3LNYFf6hSvQRLCJcgn6qIU6en/ydmx+8USyxhHzCV8n/TPaMNhAsX oS3JkDpBN+HvkuB1oTlnzrpczI31d2WRpoYUD7Gzhcz1jXcyxQMvparTHpuVhXykDoNK9PQq0 VXQQ8gTiw7GW3GrWOQ0OmOZBa+3SEgXxIokevpdA8DxcKXUW5tSZdv9LMeNsYAwVZitrVE65W 6c/hBQZ2AOnQGKLGWG5TO7rP/XcpFzi5YpYSWh1lyIPURgjXoKXU9BW+cV5uvWPGD8CgHXAdf dhS3urLAXtF7qOgcW6X5YwOeNr2o6tY+WNOfb8/O9nnHOsH1hM= Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org On Mon, Jan 3, 2022 at 6:12 AM Ingo Molnar wrote: > * Greg Kroah-Hartman wrote: > > > Before going into details about how this tree solves 'dependency hell' > > > exactly, here's the current kernel build performance gain with > > > CONFIG_FAST_HEADERS=y enabled, (and with CONFIG_KALLSYMS_FAST=y enabled as > > > well - see below), using a stock x86 Linux distribution's .config with all > > > modules built into the vmlinux: > > > > > > # > > > # Performance counter stats for 'make -j96 vmlinux' (3 runs): > > > # > > > # (Elapsed time in seconds): > > > # > > > > > > v5.16-rc7: 231.34 +- 0.60 secs, 15.5 builds/hour # [ vanilla baseline ] > > > -fast-headers-v1: 129.97 +- 0.51 secs, 27.7 builds/hour # +78.0% improvement > > > > > > Or in terms of CPU time utilized: > > > > > > v5.16-rc7: 11,474,982.05 msec cpu-clock # 49.601 CPUs utilized > > > -fast-headers-v1: 7,100,730.37 msec cpu-clock # 54.635 CPUs utilized # +61.6% improvement > > > > Speed up is very impressive, nice job! > > Thanks! :-) I've done some work in this area in the past, didn't quite take it enough of the way to get this far. The best I saw was 30% improvement with clang, which tends to be more sensitive than gcc towards header file bloat, as it does more detailed syntax checking before eliminating dead code. Did you try both gcc and clang for this? > > That issue aside, I took a glance at the tree, and overall it looks like > > a lot of nice cleanups. Most of these can probably go through the > > various subsystem trees, after you split them out, for the "major" .h > > cleanups. Is that something you are going to be planning on doing? > > Yeah, I absolutely plan on doing that too: > > - About ~70% of the commits can be split up & parallelized through > maintainer trees. > > - With the exception of the untangling of sched.h, per_task and the > "Optimize Headers" series, where a lot of patches are dependent on each > other. These are actually needed to get any measurable benefits from this > tree (!). We can do these through the scheduler tree, or through the > dedicated headers tree I posted. > > The latter monolithic series is pretty much unavoidable, it's the result of > 30 years of coupling a lot of kernel subsystems to task_struct via embedded > structs & other complex types, that needed quite a bit of effort to > untangle, and that untangling needed to happen in-order. > > Do these plans this sound good to you? I haven't had a chance to look at your tree yet, I'm still on vacation without access to my normal workstation. I would like to run my own scripts for analyzing the header dependencies on it after I get back next week. >From what I could tell, linux/sched.h was not the only such problem, but I saw similarly bad issues with linux/fs.h (which is what I posted about in November/December), linux/mm.h and linux/netdevice.h on the high level, in low-level headers there are huge issues with linux/atomic.h, linux/mutex.h, linux/pgtable.h etc. I expect that you have addressed these as well, but I'd like to make sure that your changes are reasonably complete on arm32 and arm64 to avoid having to do the big cleanup more than once. My approach to the large mid-level headers is somewhat different: rather than completely avoiding them from getting included, I would like to split up the structure definitions from the inline functions. Linus didn't really like my approach, but I suspect he'll have similar concerns about your solution for linux/sched.h, especially if we end up applying the same hack to other commonly used structures (sk_buff, mm_struct, super_block) in the end. I should be able to come up with a less handwavy reply after I've actually studied your approach better. Most of the patches should be the same either way (adding back missing includes to drivers, and doing cleanups to commonly included headers to avoid the deep nesting), the interesting bit will be how to properly define the larger structures without pulling in the rest of the world. Arnd