From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.8 required=3.0 tests=BAYES_00, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,MAILING_LIST_MULTI,SPF_HELO_NONE,SPF_PASS, URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.0 Received: from mail.kernel.org (mail.kernel.org [198.145.29.99]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32AA0C4361A for ; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 17:50:47 +0000 (UTC) Received: from vger.kernel.org (vger.kernel.org [23.128.96.18]) by mail.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03FED23A34 for ; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 17:50:47 +0000 (UTC) Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1729388AbhANRun (ORCPT ); Thu, 14 Jan 2021 12:50:43 -0500 Received: from colin.muc.de ([193.149.48.1]:55445 "HELO mail.muc.de" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-FAIL) by vger.kernel.org with SMTP id S1726636AbhANRum (ORCPT ); Thu, 14 Jan 2021 12:50:42 -0500 X-Greylist: delayed 400 seconds by postgrey-1.27 at vger.kernel.org; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 12:50:41 EST Received: (qmail 59988 invoked by uid 3782); 14 Jan 2021 17:43:20 -0000 Received: from acm.muc.de (p4fe15b0e.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [79.225.91.14]) by colin.muc.de (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Thu, 14 Jan 2021 18:43:19 +0100 Received: (qmail 15554 invoked by uid 1000); 14 Jan 2021 17:43:19 -0000 Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2021 17:43:19 +0000 To: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Subject: Re: fbcon: remove soft scrollback code Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/1.1.12 (Macallan) From: Alan Mackenzie X-Primary-Address: acm@muc.de Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Hello, lkml. This is my first post to the list. From: Linus Torvalds <> Date: Fri, 8 Jan 2021 15:11:34 -0800 Subject:Re: fbcon: remove soft scrollback code (missing Doc. patch) >On Fri, Jan 8, 2021 at 11:13 AM Phillip Susi > wrote: >> > Could we pause this madness? Scrollback is still useful. I needed it >> > today... it was too small, so command results I was looking for >> > already scrolled away, but... life will be really painful with 0 >> > scrollback. >> > You'll need it, too... as soon as you get oops and will want to see >> > errors just prior to that oops. >> > If it means I get to maintain it... I'm not happy about it but that's >> > better than no scrollback. >> Amen! What self respecting admin installs a gui on servers? What do >> we have to do to get this back in? What was so buggy with this code >> that it needed to be removed? Why was it such a burden to just leave >> it be? I am an Emacs maintainer, and do all my text work on the Linux console. My distribution is Gentoo. Whilst it may be an exaggeration to say Linux will become unusable to me without this scrolling facility, it's not much of one. For the moment, I can get by by not upgrading my kernel, but that's not a long term solution. >It really was buggy, with security implications. And we have no >maintainers. The first I heard of these problems was yesterday, when somebody posted a heads-up in the Gentoo users' list. I'm disappointed not to have heard of this around the time the decision was taken. Perhaps the problems, and request for a maintainer, could have been more widely circulated. I would have offered to stand up then, just as I am offering to stand up now. I have as yet no experience in kernel hacking, though I did look closely at the console code a few years back, with a view to enhancing it to handle more than 256 glyphs and 16 colours. It struck me as code badly needing some love. >So the scroll-back code can't come back until we have a maintainer and a >cleaner and simpler implementation. I offer my services, just as others have done. >And no, maintaining it really doesn't mean "just get it back to the old >broken state". Is there a coherent description of the problems (including the security problems) anywhere? >So far I haven't actually seen any patches, which means that it's not >coming back. But with a few pertinent patches, it might come back, perhaps? [ .... ] Linus -- Alan Mackenzie (Nuremberg, Germany).