From: "Theodore Ts'o" <tytso@mit.edu>
To: "Maciej W. Rozycki" <macro@orcam.me.uk>
Cc: Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>,
Tom Stellard <tstellar@redhat.com>,
Nick Desaulniers <ndesaulniers@google.com>,
Masahiro Yamada <masahiroy@kernel.org>,
Nathan Chancellor <nathan@kernel.org>,
Linux Kernel Mailing List <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
clang-built-linux <clang-built-linux@googlegroups.com>,
Fangrui Song <maskray@google.com>,
Serge Guelton <sguelton@redhat.com>,
Sylvestre Ledru <sylvestre@mozilla.com>
Subject: Re: Very slow clang kernel config ..
Date: Mon, 3 May 2021 10:54:35 -0400 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <YJAOq9CD72EWaF8P@mit.edu> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <YJAK1C1uLknYGYrH@mit.edu>
On Mon, May 03, 2021 at 10:38:12AM -0400, Theodore Ts'o wrote:
> On Mon, May 03, 2021 at 03:03:31AM +0200, Maciej W. Rozycki wrote:
> >
> > People went through great efforts to support shared libraries, sacrificed
> > performance for it even back then when the computing power was much lower
> > than nowadays.
>
> That was because memory was *incredibly* restrictive in those days.
> My first Linux server had one gig of memory, and so shared libraries
> provided a huge performance boost --- because otherwise systems would
> be swapping or paging their brains out.
Correction. My bad, my first Linux machine had 16 megs of memory....
- Ted
>
> However, these days, many if not most developers aren't capable of the
> discpline needed to maintained the ABI stability needed for shared
> libraries to work well. I can think several packages where if you
> used shared libraries, the major version number would need to be
> bumped at every releases, because people don't know how to spell ABI,
> never mind be able to *preserve* ABI. Heck, it's the same reason that
> we don't promise kernel ABI compatibility for kernel modules!
>
> https://www.kernel.org/doc/Documentation/process/stable-api-nonsense.rst
>
> And in the case of Debian, use of shared libraries means that every
> time you release a new version of, say, f2fs-tools, things can get
> stalled for months or in one case, over a year, due to the new package
> review process (a shared library version bump means a new binary
> package, and that in turn requires a full review of the entire source
> package for GPL compliance from scratch, and f2fs-tools has bumped
> their shared library major version *every* *single* *release*) ---
> during which time, security bug fixes were being held up due to the
> new package review tarpit.
>
> If people could actually guarantee stable ABI's, then shared libraries
> might make sense. E2fsprogs hasn't had a major version bump in shared
> libraries for over a decade (although some developers whine and
> complain about how I reject function signature changes in the
> libext2fs library to provide that ABI stability). But how many
> userspace packages can make that claim?
>
> - Ted
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2021-05-03 14:54 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 47+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2021-04-29 21:53 Very slow clang kernel config Linus Torvalds
2021-04-30 0:19 ` Nick Desaulniers
2021-04-30 2:22 ` Nick Desaulniers
2021-05-01 0:19 ` Nick Desaulniers
2021-05-01 0:23 ` Nick Desaulniers
2021-05-01 0:25 ` Nick Desaulniers
2021-05-01 0:40 ` Nick Desaulniers
2021-05-01 1:22 ` Linus Torvalds
2021-05-01 1:48 ` Nick Desaulniers
2021-05-01 2:16 ` Fangrui Song
2021-05-01 3:32 ` Tom Stellard
2021-05-01 16:32 ` Linus Torvalds
2021-05-01 19:57 ` Serge Guelton
2021-05-01 22:39 ` Linus Torvalds
2021-05-01 23:55 ` Fangrui Song
2021-05-01 21:58 ` David Laight
2021-05-02 9:31 ` Adrian Bunk
2021-05-02 11:35 ` David Laight
2021-05-02 16:12 ` Linus Torvalds
2021-05-02 16:45 ` Adrian Bunk
2021-05-02 16:49 ` Linus Torvalds
2021-05-02 17:55 ` Adrian Bunk
2021-05-02 17:59 ` Linus Torvalds
2021-05-02 21:48 ` Adrian Bunk
2021-05-04 22:02 ` Miguel Ojeda
2021-05-05 0:58 ` Theodore Ts'o
2021-05-05 17:21 ` Miguel Ojeda
2021-05-04 21:32 ` Miguel Ojeda
2021-05-05 11:05 ` David Laight
2021-05-05 13:53 ` Miguel Ojeda
2021-05-05 14:13 ` David Laight
2021-05-05 16:06 ` Miguel Ojeda
2021-05-05 16:25 ` David Laight
2021-05-05 17:55 ` Miguel Ojeda
2021-05-03 1:03 ` Maciej W. Rozycki
2021-05-03 14:38 ` Theodore Ts'o
2021-05-03 14:54 ` Theodore Ts'o [this message]
2021-05-03 17:14 ` Maciej W. Rozycki
2021-05-03 16:09 ` David Laight
2021-05-04 23:04 ` Greg Stark
2021-05-05 0:55 ` Theodore Ts'o
2021-05-01 23:37 ` Mike Hommey
2021-05-02 5:19 ` Dan Aloni
2021-05-03 16:48 ` Tom Stellard
2021-05-03 19:00 ` Fangrui Song
2021-04-30 0:52 ` Nathan Chancellor
2021-04-30 2:21 ` Nick Desaulniers
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