From: ebiederm@xmission.com (Eric W. Biederman)
To: Abraham vd Merwe <abraham@2d3d.co.za>
Cc: Linux Kernel Development <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
Felix von Leitner <leitner@fefe.de>
Subject: Re: kernel headers & userland
Date: 06 Aug 2001 09:20:16 -0600 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <m1wv4husen.fsf@frodo.biederman.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20010806095638.A5638@crystal.2d3d.co.za> <m166c1wj66.fsf@frodo.biederman.org> <20010806130924.A14167@crystal.2d3d.co.za>
In-Reply-To: <20010806130924.A14167@crystal.2d3d.co.za>
Abraham vd Merwe <abraham@2d3d.co.za> writes:
> Hi Eric!
>
> > > Apparently Linus told Felix von Leitner (the author of dietlibc - a small,
> > > no nonsense glibc replacement C library) a while ago _not_ to include any
> > > linux kernel headers in userland (i.e. the C library headers in this case).
> > >
> > > This imho is obviously wrong since there are definitely a need for including
>
> > > kernel headers on a linux platform.
> >
> > ??? Necessity no. Are there practical benefits yes.
> >
> > The policy of the kernel developers in general is that if your apps
> > includes kernel headers and it breaks, it is a kernel problem.
> >
> > As for ioctl it is a giant mess that needs to be taken out and shot.
> >
> > And yes there are places where even the mighty glibc is in the wrong.
>
> Just acknowledging that it is a problem doesn't solve the problem though.
> The question remains how you approach the kernel headers issue at the moment?
>
> My guess is the only way is by including the kernel headers for now and
> change it one day when someone decides to clean up the mess.
Well. I'm not certain which mess you are refering too. A normal
user space program should never include kernel headers period. If it
does it should get fixed. At minimum ``cp include/linux/xx.h . ''
And probably something similiar for libc.
The problem is not that it is evil to include kernel headers but
instead that it is a maintenance nightmare from both the glibc and
the kernel to have one set of headers that satisfy both their.
purposes. Perhaps if someone built a set of headers with that in mind
it could work.
Eric
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2001-08-06 15:27 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 5+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2001-08-06 7:56 kernel headers & userland Abraham vd Merwe
2001-08-06 10:56 ` Eric W. Biederman
2001-08-06 11:09 ` Abraham vd Merwe
2001-08-06 15:20 ` Eric W. Biederman [this message]
2001-08-06 12:41 ` Alan Cox
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