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From: Jiri Kosina <jikos@kernel.org>
To: Tim Chen <tim.c.chen@linux.intel.com>
Cc: Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>,
	Thomas Gleixner <tglx@linutronix.de>,
	Linux List Kernel Mailing <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	the arch/x86 maintainers <x86@kernel.org>,
	Peter Zijlstra <peterz@infradead.org>,
	Andrew Lutomirski <luto@kernel.org>,
	thomas.lendacky@amd.com, Josh Poimboeuf <jpoimboe@redhat.com>,
	Andrea Arcangeli <aarcange@redhat.com>,
	David Woodhouse <dwmw@amazon.co.uk>,
	Andi Kleen <ak@linux.intel.com>,
	dave.hansen@intel.com,
	Casey Schaufler <casey.schaufler@intel.com>,
	"Mallick, Asit K" <asit.k.mallick@intel.com>,
	"Van De Ven, Arjan" <arjan@linux.intel.com>,
	jcm@redhat.com, longman9394@gmail.com,
	Greg KH <gregkh@linuxfoundation.org>,
	david.c.stewart@intel.com, Kees Cook <keescook@chromium.org>,
	Jason Brandt <jason.w.brandt@intel.com>
Subject: Re: [patch V2 27/28] x86/speculation: Add seccomp Spectre v2 user space protection mode
Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2018 09:39:27 +0100 (CET)	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <nycvar.YFH.7.76.1812040937440.17216@cbobk.fhfr.pm> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <f4b903ef-828c-0b05-29c6-6f71677d120d@linux.intel.com>

On Mon, 3 Dec 2018, Tim Chen wrote:

> > Can we please just fix this stupid lie?
> > 
> > Yes, Intel calls it "STIBP" and tries to make it out to be about the
> > indirect branch predictor being per-SMT thread.
> > 
> > But the reason it is unacceptable is apparently because in reality it just
> > disables indirect branch prediction entirely. So yes, *technically* it's
> > true that that limits indirect branch prediction to just a single SMT
> > core, but in reality it is just a "go really slow" mode.
> > 
> > If STIBP had actually just keyed off the logical SMT thread, we wouldn't
> > need to have worried about it in the first place.
> > 
> > So let's document reality rather than Intel's Pollyanna world-view.
> > 
> > Reality matters. It's why we had to go all this. Lying about things
> > and making it appear like it's not a big deal was why the original
> > patch made it through without people noticing.
> > 
> 
> 
> To make the usage of STIBP and its working principles clear,
> here are some additional explanations of STIBP from our Intel
> HW architects.  This should also help answer some of the questions
> from Thomas and others on STIBP's usages with IBPB and IBRS.

Thanks a lot, this indeed does shed some light.

I have one question though:

[ ... snip ... ]
> On processors with enhanced IBRS support, we recommend setting IBRS to 1
> and left set. 

Then why doesn't CPU with EIBRS support acutally *default* to '1', with 
opt-out possibility for OS?

Thanks,

-- 
Jiri Kosina
SUSE Labs


  reply	other threads:[~2018-12-04  8:39 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 112+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2018-11-25 18:33 [patch V2 00/28] x86/speculation: Remedy the STIBP/IBPB overhead Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 01/28] x86/speculation: Update the TIF_SSBD comment Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-28 14:20   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Tim Chen
2018-11-29 14:27   ` [patch V2 01/28] " Konrad Rzeszutek Wilk
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 02/28] x86/speculation: Clean up spectre_v2_parse_cmdline() Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-28 14:20   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Tim Chen
2018-11-29 14:28   ` [patch V2 02/28] " Konrad Rzeszutek Wilk
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 03/28] x86/speculation: Remove unnecessary ret variable in cpu_show_common() Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-28 14:21   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Tim Chen
2018-11-29 14:28   ` [patch V2 03/28] " Konrad Rzeszutek Wilk
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 04/28] x86/speculation: Reorganize cpu_show_common() Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-26 15:08   ` Borislav Petkov
2018-11-28 14:22   ` [tip:x86/pti] x86/speculation: Move STIPB/IBPB string conditionals out of cpu_show_common() tip-bot for Tim Chen
2018-11-29 14:29   ` [patch V2 04/28] x86/speculation: Reorganize cpu_show_common() Konrad Rzeszutek Wilk
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 05/28] x86/speculation: Disable STIBP when enhanced IBRS is in use Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-28 14:22   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Tim Chen
2018-11-29 14:35   ` [patch V2 05/28] " Konrad Rzeszutek Wilk
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 06/28] x86/speculation: Rename SSBD update functions Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-26 15:24   ` Borislav Petkov
2018-11-28 14:23   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-29 14:37   ` [patch V2 06/28] " Konrad Rzeszutek Wilk
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 07/28] x86/speculation: Reorganize speculation control MSRs update Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-26 15:47   ` Borislav Petkov
2018-11-28 14:23   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Tim Chen
2018-11-29 14:41   ` [patch V2 07/28] " Konrad Rzeszutek Wilk
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 08/28] sched/smt: Make sched_smt_present track topology Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-28 14:24   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Peter Zijlstra (Intel)
2018-11-29 14:42   ` [patch V2 08/28] " Konrad Rzeszutek Wilk
2018-11-29 14:50     ` Konrad Rzeszutek Wilk
2018-11-29 15:48       ` Peter Zijlstra
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 09/28] x86/Kconfig: Select SCHED_SMT if SMP enabled Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-28 14:24   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-29 14:44   ` [patch V2 09/28] " Konrad Rzeszutek Wilk
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 10/28] sched/smt: Expose sched_smt_present static key Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-28 14:25   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-29 14:44   ` [patch V2 10/28] " Konrad Rzeszutek Wilk
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 11/28] x86/speculation: Rework SMT state change Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-28 14:26   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 12/28] x86/l1tf: Show actual SMT state Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-28 14:26   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 13/28] x86/speculation: Reorder the spec_v2 code Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-26 22:21   ` Borislav Petkov
2018-11-28 14:27   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 14/28] x86/speculation: Mark string arrays const correctly Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-28 14:27   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 15/28] x86/speculataion: Mark command line parser data __initdata Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-28 14:28   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 16/28] x86/speculation: Unify conditional spectre v2 print functions Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-28 14:29   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 17/28] x86/speculation: Add command line control for indirect branch speculation Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-28 14:29   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 18/28] x86/speculation: Prepare for per task indirect branch speculation control Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-27 17:25   ` Lendacky, Thomas
2018-11-27 19:51     ` Tim Chen
2018-11-28  9:39       ` Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-27 20:39     ` Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-27 20:42       ` Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-27 21:52         ` Lendacky, Thomas
2018-11-28 14:30   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Tim Chen
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 19/28] x86/process: Consolidate and simplify switch_to_xtra() code Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-26 18:30   ` Borislav Petkov
2018-11-28 14:30   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 20/28] x86/speculation: Avoid __switch_to_xtra() calls Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-28 14:31   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 21/28] x86/speculation: Prepare for conditional IBPB in switch_mm() Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-25 19:11   ` Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-25 20:53   ` Andi Kleen
2018-11-25 22:20     ` Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-25 23:04       ` Andy Lutomirski
2018-11-26  7:10         ` Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-26 13:36           ` Ingo Molnar
2018-11-26  3:07       ` Andi Kleen
2018-11-26  6:50         ` Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-28 14:31   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 22/28] ptrace: Remove unused ptrace_may_access_sched() and MODE_IBRS Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-28 14:32   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 23/28] x86/speculation: Split out TIF update Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-28 14:33   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 24/28] x86/speculation: Prepare arch_smt_update() for PRCTL mode Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-27 20:18   ` Lendacky, Thomas
2018-11-27 20:30     ` Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-27 21:20       ` Lendacky, Thomas
2018-11-28 14:34   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 25/28] x86/speculation: Add prctl() control for indirect branch speculation Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-28 14:34   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 26/28] x86/speculation: Enable prctl mode for spectre_v2_user Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-26  7:56   ` Dominik Brodowski
2018-11-28 14:35   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 27/28] x86/speculation: Add seccomp Spectre v2 user space protection mode Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-25 19:35   ` Randy Dunlap
2018-11-25 20:40   ` Linus Torvalds
2018-11-25 20:52     ` Jiri Kosina
2018-11-25 22:28     ` Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-26 13:30       ` Ingo Molnar
2018-11-26 20:48       ` Andrea Arcangeli
2018-11-26 20:58         ` Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-26 21:52           ` Lendacky, Thomas
2018-11-27  0:37             ` Tim Chen
2018-12-04  1:38     ` Tim Chen
2018-12-04  8:39       ` Jiri Kosina [this message]
2018-12-04  9:43         ` Arjan van de Ven
2018-12-04  9:46         ` Arjan van de Ven
2018-12-04 17:20       ` Linus Torvalds
2018-12-04 18:58         ` Tim Chen
2018-11-28 14:35   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Thomas Gleixner
2018-12-04 18:45   ` [patch V2 27/28] " Dave Hansen
2018-11-25 18:33 ` [patch V2 28/28] x86/speculation: Provide IBPB always command line options Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-28 14:36   ` [tip:x86/pti] " tip-bot for Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-26 13:37 ` [patch V2 00/28] x86/speculation: Remedy the STIBP/IBPB overhead Ingo Molnar
2018-11-28 14:24 ` Thomas Gleixner
2018-11-29 19:02   ` Tim Chen
2018-12-10 23:43 ` Pavel Machek

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