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[157.230.128.187]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id a142sm7175101pfa.6.2020.05.22.14.51.46 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Fri, 22 May 2020 14:51:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 42.do-not-panic.com (Postfix, from userid 1000) id CEDDD40321; Fri, 22 May 2020 21:51:45 +0000 (UTC) Date: Fri, 22 May 2020 21:51:45 +0000 From: Luis Chamberlain To: Johannes Berg Cc: Jakub Kicinski , derosier@gmail.com, greearb@candelatech.com, jeyu@kernel.org, akpm@linux-foundation.org, arnd@arndb.de, rostedt@goodmis.org, mingo@redhat.com, aquini@redhat.com, cai@lca.pw, dyoung@redhat.com, bhe@redhat.com, peterz@infradead.org, tglx@linutronix.de, gpiccoli@canonical.com, pmladek@suse.com, tiwai@suse.de, schlad@suse.de, andriy.shevchenko@linux.intel.com, keescook@chromium.org, daniel.vetter@ffwll.ch, will@kernel.org, mchehab+samsung@kernel.org, kvalo@codeaurora.org, davem@davemloft.net, netdev@vger.kernel.org, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, linux-wireless@vger.kernel.org, ath10k@lists.infradead.org, jiri@resnulli.us, briannorris@chromium.org Subject: Re: [RFC 1/2] devlink: add simple fw crash helpers Message-ID: <20200522215145.GC11244@42.do-not-panic.com> References: <20200519010530.GS11244@42.do-not-panic.com> <20200519211531.3702593-1-kuba@kernel.org> <20200522052046.GY11244@42.do-not-panic.com> <20200522101738.1495f4cc@kicinski-fedora-pc1c0hjn.dhcp.thefacebook.com> <2e5199edb433c217c7974ef7408ff8c7253145b6.camel@sipsolutions.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <2e5199edb433c217c7974ef7408ff8c7253145b6.camel@sipsolutions.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.10.1 (2018-07-13) Sender: netdev-owner@vger.kernel.org Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: netdev@vger.kernel.org On Fri, May 22, 2020 at 10:46:07PM +0200, Johannes Berg wrote: > FWIW, I still completely disagree on that taint. You (Luis) obviously > have been running into a bug in that driver, I doubt the firmware > actually managed to wedge the hardware. This hasn't happened just once, its happed many times sporadically now, once a week or two weeks I'd say. And the system isn't being moved around. > But even if it did, that's still not really a kernel taint. The kernel > itself isn't in any way affected by this. Of course it is, a full reboot is required. > Yes, the system is in a weird state now. But that's *not* equivalent to > "kernel tainted". Requiring a full reboot is a dire situation to be in, and loosing connectivity to the point this is not recoverable likewise. You guys are making out a taint to be the end of the world. We have a taint even for a kernel warning, and as others have mentioned mac80211 already produces these. What exactly is the opposition to a taint to clarify that a device firmware has crashed and your system requires a full reboot? Luis