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[204.195.22.127]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id i37sm1935829pgl.68.2020.06.09.10.19.44 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Tue, 09 Jun 2020 10:19:44 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 9 Jun 2020 10:19:35 -0700 From: Stephen Hemminger To: David Miller Cc: o.rempel@pengutronix.de, andrew@lunn.ch, f.fainelli@gmail.com, hkallweit1@gmail.com, kuba@kernel.org, corbet@lwn.net, mkubecek@suse.cz, linville@tuxdriver.com, david@protonic.nl, kernel@pengutronix.de, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, netdev@vger.kernel.org, linux@armlinux.org.uk, mkl@pengutronix.de, marex@denx.de, christian.herber@nxp.com, amitc@mellanox.com, petrm@mellanox.com Subject: Re: [PATCH ethtool v1] netlink: add master/slave configuration support Message-ID: <20200609101935.5716b3bd@hermes.lan> In-Reply-To: <20200607.164532.964293508393444353.davem@davemloft.net> References: <20200526091025.25243-1-o.rempel@pengutronix.de> <20200607153019.3c8d6650@hermes.lan> <20200607.164532.964293508393444353.davem@davemloft.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: netdev-owner@vger.kernel.org Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: netdev@vger.kernel.org On Sun, 07 Jun 2020 16:45:32 -0700 (PDT) David Miller wrote: > From: Stephen Hemminger > Date: Sun, 7 Jun 2020 15:30:19 -0700 > > > Open source projects have been working hard to remove the terms master and slave > > in API's and documentation. Apparently, Linux hasn't gotten the message. > > It would make sense not to introduce new instances. > > Would you also be against, for example, the use of the terminology > expressing the "death" of allocated registers in a compiler backend, > for example? > > How far do you plan take this resistence of terminology when it > clearly has a well defined usage and meaning in a specific technical > realm which is entirely disconnected to what the terms might imply, > meaning wise, in other realms? > > And if you are going to say not to use this terminology, you must > suggest a reasonable (and I do mean _reasonable_) well understood > and _specific_ replacement. > > Thank you. How many times have you or Linus argued about variable naming. Yes, words do matter and convey a lot of implied connotation and meaning. Most projects and standards bodies are taking a stance on fixing the language. The IETF is has proposed making changes as well. There are a very specific set of trigger words and terms that should be fixed. Most of these terms do have better alternatives. A common example is that master/slave is unclear and would be clearer as primary/secondary or active/backup or controller/worker. Most of networking is based on standards. When the standards wording changes (and it will happen soon); then Linux should also change the wording in the source, api and documentation. See: [0] - , [1] - [2] - [3] - , [4] - [5] - [6] - https://mail.gnome.org/archives/desktop-devel-list/2019-April/msg00049.html [7] - https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-knodel-terminology-01.txt