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From: Markus Armbruster <armbru@redhat.com>
To: "Daniel P. Berrangé" <berrange@redhat.com>
Cc: "Eduardo Habkost" <ehabkost@redhat.com>,
	qemu-block@nongnu.org, "Juan Quintela" <quintela@redhat.com>,
	"Jason Wang" <jasowang@redhat.com>,
	"Michael S. Tsirkin" <mst@redhat.com>,
	qemu-devel@nongnu.org, "Yuval Shaia" <yuval.shaia.ml@gmail.com>,
	"Gerd Hoffmann" <kraxel@redhat.com>,
	"Andrea Bolognani" <abologna@redhat.com>,
	"Paolo Bonzini" <pbonzini@redhat.com>,
	"Marc-André Lureau" <marcandre.lureau@redhat.com>,
	"John Snow" <jsnow@redhat.com>,
	"Michael Roth" <mdroth@linux.vnet.ibm.com>,
	"Dr. David Alan Gilbert" <dgilbert@redhat.com>,
	"Stefan Berger" <stefanb@linux.ibm.com>
Subject: Re: [PATCH] schemas: Add vim modeline
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2020 13:51:10 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <87k0ylz0ep.fsf@dusky.pond.sub.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20200730093732.GB3477223@redhat.com> ("Daniel P. =?utf-8?Q?B?= =?utf-8?Q?errang=C3=A9=22's?= message of "Thu, 30 Jul 2020 10:37:32 +0100")

Daniel P. Berrangé <berrange@redhat.com> writes:

> On Thu, Jul 30, 2020 at 11:07:26AM +0200, Markus Armbruster wrote:
>> Andrea Bolognani <abologna@redhat.com> writes:
>> 
>> > The various schemas included in QEMU use a JSON-based format which
>> > is, however, strictly speaking not valid JSON.
>> >
>> > As a consequence, when vim tries to apply syntax highlight rules
>> > for JSON (as guessed from the file name), the result is an unreadable
>> > mess which mostly consist of red markers pointing out supposed errors
>> > in, well, pretty much everything.
>> >
>> > Using Python syntax highlighting produces much better results, and
>> > in fact these files already start with specially-formatted comments
>> > that instruct Emacs to process them as if they were Python files.
>> >
>> > This commit adds the equivalent special comments for vim.
>> >
>> > Signed-off-by: Andrea Bolognani <abologna@redhat.com>
>
> Given that we already have emacs mode-lines, I see no reason to
> not also have vim mode-lines, so regardless of the deeper discussion
> I think this is patch is fine to merge in the short term
>
>   Reviewed-by: Daniel P. Berrangé <berrange@redhat.com>
>
>
>> Naming QAPI schema files .json even though their contents isn't was a
>> mistake.  Correcting it would be a pain.  If we correct it, then the
>> sooner the better.
>> 
>> Renaming them to .py gives decent editor support out of the box.  Their
>> contents isn't quite Python, though: true vs. True, false vs. False.  Do
>> we care?  Only a few dozen occurences; they could be adjusted.
>> 
>> Renaming them to .qapi would perhaps be less confusing, for the price of
>> "out of the box".
>
> IMHO, the critical rule is that if you a pick a particular file extension
> associated with an existing language, you absolutely MUST BE compliant
> with that language.

Can't argue with that :)

> We fail at compliance with both JSON and Python because we're actually
> using our own DSL (domain specific language).
>
> IOW if we're going to stick with our current file format, then we should
> be naming them .qapi. We can still use an editor mode line if we want to
> claim we're approximately equiv to another language, but we can't be
> surprised if editors get upset.
>
>
> The bigger question is whether having our own DSL is justified ?
>
> I'm *really* sceptical that it is.

To be precise: our own DSL *syntax*.  Semantics is a separate question
to be skeptical about.

> We can't use JSON because it lacks comments. So we invented our own
> psuedo-JSON parser that supported comments, and used ' instead of "
> for some reason. We also needed to be able to parse a sequence of
> multiple JSON documents in one file. We should have just picked a 
> different language because JSON clearly didn't do what we eneeded.

JSON is a exceptionally poor choice for a DSL, or even a configuration
language.

Correcting our mistake involves a flag day and a re-learn.  We need to
weigh costs against benefits.

The QAPI schema language has two layers:

* JSON, with a lexical and a syntactical sub-layer (both in parser.py)

* QAPI, with a context-free and a context-dependend sub-layer (in
  expr.py and schema.py, respectively)

Replacing the JSON layer is possible as long as the replacement is
sufficiently expressive (not a tall order).

> You suggest naming them .py. If we do that, we must declare that they
> are literally Python code

Agree.

>                               modify them so that we can load the 
> files straight into the python intepretor as code, and not parse 
> them as data. I feel unhappy about treating data as code though.

Stress on *can* load.  Doesn't mean we should.

Ancient prior art: Lisp programs routinely use s-expressions as
configuration file syntax.  They don't load them as code, they read them
as data.

With Python, it's ast.parse(), I think.

> While JSON doesn't do what we need, its second-cousin YAML is a more
> flexible format. Taking one example
>
> ---
> ##
> # @ImageInfoSpecificQCow2:
> #
> # @compat: compatibility level
> #
> # ...snip...
> #
> # Since: 1.7
> ##
> struct: ImageInfoSpecificQCow2
> data:
>   compat: str
>   "*data-file": str
>   "*data-file-raw": bool
>   "*lazy-refcounts": bool
>   "*corrupt": bool
>   refcount-bits: int
>   "*encrypt": ImageInfoSpecificQCow2Encryption
>   "*bitmaps":
>     - Qcow2BitmapInfo
>   compression-type: Qcow2CompressionType
>
>
> Then we could use a regular off the shelf YAML parser in python.
>
> The uglyiness with quotes is due to the use of "*". Slightly less ugly
> if we simply declare that quotes are always used, even where they're
> not strictly required.

StrictYAML insists on quotes.

I hate having to quote identifiers.  There's a reason we don't write

    'int'
    'main'('int', 'argc', 'char' *'argv'[])
    {
        'printf'("hello world\n");
        return 0;
    }

> struct: ImageInfoSpecificQCow2
> data:
>   "compat": "str"
>   "*data-file": "str"
>   "*data-file-raw": "bool"
>   "*lazy-refcounts": "bool"
>   "*corrupt": "bool"
>   "refcount-bits": "int"
>   "*encrypt": "ImageInfoSpecificQCow2Encryption"
>   "*bitmaps":
>     - "Qcow2BitmapInfo"
>   "compression-type": "Qcow2CompressionType"
>
> With the use of "---" to denote the start of document, we have no trouble 
> parsing our files which would actually be a concatenation of multiple 
> documents. The python YAML library provides the easy yaml.load_all()
> method.

Required reading on YAML:
https://www.arp242.net/yaml-config.html

Some of the criticism there doesn't matter for our use case.



  reply	other threads:[~2020-07-30 11:52 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 85+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2020-07-29 18:50 [PATCH] schemas: Add vim modeline Andrea Bolognani
2020-07-30  9:07 ` Markus Armbruster
2020-07-30  9:37   ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2020-07-30 11:51     ` Markus Armbruster [this message]
2020-07-30 13:24       ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2020-07-31  6:45         ` John Snow
2020-07-31  9:21           ` Markus Armbruster
2020-07-31  9:32             ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2020-07-31 12:55         ` Markus Armbruster
2020-07-31 15:07           ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2020-07-31 15:26             ` John Snow
2020-07-31 15:44               ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2020-08-03  7:28                 ` Markus Armbruster
2020-08-03  8:41                 ` Paolo Bonzini
2020-08-03 11:24                   ` Markus Armbruster
2020-08-03 11:36                   ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2020-08-03 12:16                     ` Paolo Bonzini
2020-08-03 12:23                       ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2020-08-03 12:33                         ` Paolo Bonzini
2020-08-03 12:43                           ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2020-08-03 15:48                         ` Markus Armbruster
2020-08-03 21:02                         ` Nir Soffer
2020-07-31 16:35               ` Paolo Bonzini
2020-07-31 16:41                 ` Dr. David Alan Gilbert
2020-07-31 17:20                 ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2020-07-31 17:47                   ` Paolo Bonzini
2020-08-03  9:44                     ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2020-07-31 17:53                 ` John Snow
2020-07-31 18:01                   ` Paolo Bonzini
2020-08-03  7:45                     ` Markus Armbruster
2020-07-31 16:28             ` cleanups with long-term benefits (was Re: [PATCH] schemas: Add vim modeline) Paolo Bonzini
2020-07-31 17:05               ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2020-07-31 17:16                 ` Paolo Bonzini
2020-07-31 17:27                   ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2020-07-31 17:42                     ` Paolo Bonzini
2020-08-03  9:27                       ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2020-08-03  8:18               ` Markus Armbruster
2020-08-03  8:42                 ` Paolo Bonzini
2020-08-03 11:28                   ` Markus Armbruster
2020-08-03 12:01                     ` Paolo Bonzini
2020-08-03 16:03                       ` Markus Armbruster
2020-08-03 16:36                         ` Kevin Wolf
2020-08-04  7:28                           ` Markus Armbruster
2020-08-03 17:19                         ` Paolo Bonzini
2020-08-04  8:03                           ` Markus Armbruster
2020-08-04 18:24                             ` John Snow
2020-08-05  7:36                               ` Markus Armbruster
2020-08-05  8:25                                 ` Paolo Bonzini
2020-08-05  8:39                                   ` Dr. David Alan Gilbert
2020-08-05  8:49                                     ` Paolo Bonzini
2020-08-05  9:05                                       ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2020-08-05  9:11                                         ` cleanups with long-term benefits Cornelia Huck
2020-08-05 10:08                                           ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2020-08-05 10:24                                             ` Cornelia Huck
2020-08-05 16:23                                             ` Kevin Wolf
2020-08-05 16:46                                               ` Eduardo Habkost
2020-08-06  5:44                                                 ` Markus Armbruster
2020-08-05  8:47                                   ` Cornelia Huck
2020-08-05  8:56                                   ` cleanups with long-term benefits (was Re: [PATCH] schemas: Add vim modeline) Markus Armbruster
2020-08-05 10:15                                     ` Alex Bennée
2020-08-05 16:04                                 ` John Snow
2020-08-06  4:58                                   ` Markus Armbruster
2020-08-05  8:42                         ` Markus Armbruster
2020-08-03 18:10                       ` John Snow
2020-08-03 18:16                         ` Paolo Bonzini
2020-08-03 18:19                           ` John Snow
2020-08-03 19:54                             ` Nir Soffer
2020-08-03 20:48                               ` John Snow
2020-08-03  9:50                 ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2020-08-03 11:32                   ` Markus Armbruster
2020-07-31 16:39             ` [PATCH] schemas: Add vim modeline Kevin Wolf
2020-07-30 15:11       ` Eric Blake
2020-07-30 20:53         ` John Snow
2020-07-30 20:56         ` John Snow
2020-07-31  7:15         ` Kevin Wolf
2020-07-31  8:48           ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2020-07-31  9:01           ` Markus Armbruster
2020-07-31 11:26             ` Kevin Wolf
2020-08-03  8:51               ` Markus Armbruster
2020-07-31 23:12     ` Nir Soffer
2020-08-03 12:16       ` Paolo Bonzini
2020-08-04  7:28         ` Markus Armbruster
2020-08-04  8:29     ` Alex Bennée
2020-09-07 13:54   ` Markus Armbruster
2020-07-30 13:14 ` Markus Armbruster

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