From: Max Reitz <mreitz@redhat.com>
To: Kevin Wolf <kwolf@redhat.com>
Cc: Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy <vsementsov@virtuozzo.com>,
qemu-devel@nongnu.org, qemu-block@nongnu.org
Subject: Re: [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 04/42] block: Add child access functions
Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2019 14:59:08 +0200 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <fa2bf3a5-a440-bc89-1896-87f0802e974d@redhat.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20190910124805.GF4446@localhost.localdomain>
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On 10.09.19 14:48, Kevin Wolf wrote:
> Am 10.09.2019 um 13:36 hat Max Reitz geschrieben:
>> On 10.09.19 12:47, Kevin Wolf wrote:
>>> Am 10.09.2019 um 11:14 hat Max Reitz geschrieben:
>>>> Maybe we should stop declaring Quorum a filter and then rename the
>>>> bdrv_recurse_is_first_non_filter() to, I don’t know,
>>>> bdrv_recurse_can_be_replaced_by_mirror()?
>>>
>>> Why not.
>>
>> It feels difficult to do in this series because this is a whole new can
>> of worms.
>>
>> In patch 35, I actually replace the mirror use case by
>> is_filtered_child(). So it looks to me as if that should not be done,
>> because I should instead fix bdrv_recurse_is_first_non_filter() (and
>> rename it), because quorum does allow replacing its children by mirror,
>> even if it does not act as a filter for them.
>>
>> OTOH, there are other users of bdrv_is_first_non_filter(). Those are
>> qmp_block_resize() and external_snapshot_prepare(), who throw an error
>> if that returns false.
>>
>> I think that’s just wrong. First of all, I don’t even know why we have
>> that restriction anymore (I can imagine why it used to make sense before
>> the permission system). qmp_block_resize() should always work as long
>> as it can get BLK_PERM_RESIZE; and I don’t know why the parents of some
>> node would care if you take a snapshot of their child.
>
> Hm, doesn't it make sense in a way for qmp_block_resize() at least? It
> means that you can't resize just a filter, but you need to resize the
> image that actually provides the data for the filter.
Filters generally implement .bdrv_truncate() by passing it through, so
it should be fine.
> Of course, there is no reason for it to be the _first_ non-filter as
> long as BLK_PERM_RESIZE is shared, but just some non-filter node.
>
> Two more random observations:
>
> * quorum uses bdrv_filter_default_perms(), which allows BLK_PERM_RESIZE.
> I think this is wrong and quorum should make sure that all children are
> always the same size because otherwise it can't tell what its own size
> is. (Or vote on size...? :-/) Probably not a problem in practice as
> long as we check bdrv_is_first_non_filter().
(“Quorum is broken” seems to be a recurring observation.)
I agree, it shouldn’t share that permission.
> * child_file and child_backing don't implement .resize. So if you resize
> a non-top-level image, parents (in particular filters) don't get their
> size adjusted. This is probably a bug, too, but one that isn't
> prevented by bdrv_is_first_non_filter() and should be visible today.
Hm. :-/
The good news is that I can try to fix this independently of this series.
[...]
>> We have come to two results, as far as I can see:
>>
>> First, naming COW backing nodes “COW filtered children” clashes with our
>> existing use of ”filter”. There is no point in forcing the ”filter”
>> label on everything. We can just keep calling (R/W) filters filters and
>> COW backing children COW children. The names are succinct enough.
>>
>> In some cases, we don’t care whether something is a COW or filtered
>> child, in such a case a caller can be bothered to use the slightly
>> longer bdrv_cow_or_filtered_child().
>
> Aye.
>
>> Second, most of the time we want a filter node to have a clear and
>> unique path to go down. This is the important property of filters: That
>> you can skip them and go to the node that actually has the data.
>>
>> Quorum breaks this by having multiple children, and nobody knows which
>> of them has the data we will see on the next read operation.
>>
>> All “filters” who could have multiple children would have this problem.
>> Hence a filter must always have a single unique data child. I think.
>
> I agree, and this is the condition that I mentioned somewhere above, but
> failed to actually find guaranteed somewhere. We should probably make
> this explicit.
>
> Of course, quorum and similar things intend all their children to
> provide the same data, but the whole point of the driver is that this is
> not always guaranteed, so they aren't actually filters.
OK, great, I’ll get cracking then.
Max
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next prev parent reply other threads:[~2019-09-10 13:04 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 136+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2019-08-09 16:13 [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 00/42] block: Deal with filters Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 01/42] block: Mark commit and mirror as filter drivers Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 02/42] copy-on-read: Support compressed writes Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 03/42] throttle: " Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 04/42] block: Add child access functions Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:56 ` Eric Blake
2019-09-04 16:16 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-09-09 7:56 ` Max Reitz
2019-09-09 9:36 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-09-09 14:04 ` Max Reitz
2019-09-09 16:13 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-09-10 9:14 ` Max Reitz
2019-09-10 10:47 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-09-10 11:36 ` Max Reitz
2019-09-10 12:48 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-09-10 12:59 ` Max Reitz [this message]
2019-09-10 13:10 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 05/42] block: Add chain helper functions Max Reitz
2019-08-09 17:01 ` Eric Blake
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 06/42] qcow2: Implement .bdrv_storage_child() Max Reitz
2019-08-09 17:07 ` Eric Blake
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 07/42] block: *filtered_cow_child() for *has_zero_init() Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 08/42] block: bdrv_set_backing_hd() is about bs->backing Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 09/42] block: Include filters when freezing backing chain Max Reitz
2019-08-10 13:32 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-08-12 12:56 ` Max Reitz
2019-09-05 13:05 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-09-09 8:02 ` Max Reitz
2019-09-09 9:40 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 10/42] block: Drop bdrv_is_encrypted() Max Reitz
2019-08-10 13:42 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 11/42] block: Add bdrv_supports_compressed_writes() Max Reitz
2019-09-05 13:11 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-09-09 8:09 ` Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 12/42] block: Use bdrv_filtered_rw* where obvious Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 13/42] block: Use CAFs in block status functions Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 14/42] block: Use CAFs when working with backing chains Max Reitz
2019-08-10 15:19 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-09-05 14:05 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-09-09 8:25 ` Max Reitz
2019-09-09 9:55 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-09-09 14:08 ` Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 15/42] block: Re-evaluate backing file handling in reopen Max Reitz
2019-08-10 16:05 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 16/42] block: Flush all children in generic code Max Reitz
2019-08-10 15:36 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-08-12 12:58 ` Max Reitz
2019-09-05 16:24 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-09-09 8:31 ` Max Reitz
2019-09-09 10:01 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-09-09 14:15 ` Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 17/42] block: Use CAFs in bdrv_refresh_limits() Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 18/42] block: Use CAFs in bdrv_refresh_filename() Max Reitz
2019-08-10 16:22 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 19/42] block: Use CAF in bdrv_co_rw_vmstate() Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 20/42] block/snapshot: Fix fallback Max Reitz
2019-08-10 16:34 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-08-12 13:06 ` Max Reitz
2019-09-10 11:56 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-09-10 12:04 ` Max Reitz
2019-09-10 12:49 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-09-10 13:06 ` Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 21/42] block: Use CAFs for debug breakpoints Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 22/42] block: Fix bdrv_get_allocated_file_size's fallback Max Reitz
2019-08-10 16:41 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-08-12 13:09 ` Max Reitz
2019-08-12 17:14 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-08-12 19:15 ` Max Reitz
2019-09-10 14:52 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-09-11 6:20 ` Max Reitz
2019-09-11 6:55 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-09-11 7:37 ` Max Reitz
2019-09-11 8:27 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-09-11 10:00 ` Max Reitz
2019-09-11 10:31 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-09-11 11:00 ` Max Reitz
2019-09-12 10:34 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-11-14 13:11 ` Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 23/42] blockdev: Use CAF in external_snapshot_prepare() Max Reitz
2019-09-10 15:02 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-09-11 6:21 ` Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 24/42] block: Use child access functions for QAPI queries Max Reitz
2019-08-10 16:57 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 25/42] mirror: Deal with filters Max Reitz
2019-08-12 11:09 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-08-12 13:26 ` Max Reitz
2019-08-14 15:17 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-08-31 9:57 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-09-02 14:35 ` Max Reitz
2019-09-03 8:32 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-09-09 7:41 ` Max Reitz
2019-09-13 12:55 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-09-16 10:26 ` Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 26/42] backup: " Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 27/42] commit: " Max Reitz
2019-08-31 10:44 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-09-02 14:55 ` Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 28/42] stream: " Max Reitz
2019-08-12 11:55 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-09-13 14:16 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-09-16 9:52 ` Max Reitz
2019-09-16 14:47 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-12-11 12:52 ` Max Reitz
2019-12-11 15:52 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-12-11 16:12 ` Max Reitz
2019-12-11 16:35 ` Kevin Wolf
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 29/42] nbd: Use CAF when looking for dirty bitmap Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 30/42] qemu-img: Use child access functions Max Reitz
2019-08-12 12:14 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-08-12 13:28 ` Max Reitz
2019-08-14 16:04 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 31/42] block: Drop backing_bs() Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 32/42] block: Make bdrv_get_cumulative_perm() public Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 33/42] blockdev: Fix active commit choice Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:13 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 34/42] block: Inline bdrv_co_block_status_from_*() Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:14 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 35/42] block: Fix check_to_replace_node() Max Reitz
2019-08-15 15:21 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-08-15 17:01 ` Max Reitz
2019-08-16 11:01 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-08-16 13:30 ` Max Reitz
2019-08-16 14:24 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-08-09 16:14 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 36/42] iotests: Add tests for mirror @replaces loops Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:14 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 37/42] block: Leave BDS.backing_file constant Max Reitz
2019-08-16 16:16 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-08-09 16:14 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 38/42] iotests: Let complete_and_wait() work with commit Max Reitz
2019-08-23 5:59 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-08-09 16:14 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 39/42] iotests: Add filter commit test cases Max Reitz
2019-08-31 11:41 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-09-02 15:06 ` Max Reitz
2019-08-31 12:35 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-09-02 15:09 ` Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:14 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 40/42] iotests: Add filter mirror " Max Reitz
2019-08-31 12:35 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
2019-08-09 16:14 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 41/42] iotests: Add test for commit in sub directory Max Reitz
2019-08-09 16:14 ` [Qemu-devel] [PATCH v6 42/42] iotests: Test committing to overridden backing Max Reitz
2019-09-03 9:18 ` Vladimir Sementsov-Ogievskiy
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