From: Joe Perches <joe@perches.com> To: James Bottomley <James.Bottomley@HansenPartnership.com>, Miguel Ojeda <miguel.ojeda.sandonis@gmail.com> Cc: Kees Cook <keescook@chromium.org>, Jakub Kicinski <kuba@kernel.org>, "Gustavo A. R. Silva" <gustavoars@kernel.org>, linux-kernel <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>, alsa-devel@alsa-project.org, amd-gfx@lists.freedesktop.org, bridge@lists.linux-foundation.org, ceph-devel@vger.kernel.org, cluster-devel@redhat.com, coreteam@netfilter.org, devel@driverdev.osuosl.org, dm-devel@redhat.com, drbd-dev@lists.linbit.com, dri-devel@lists.freedesktop.org, GR-everest-linux-l2@marvell.com, GR-Linux-NIC-Dev@marvell.com, intel-gfx@lists.freedesktop.org, intel-wired-lan@lists.osuosl.org, keyrings@vger.kernel.org, linux1394-devel@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-acpi@vger.kernel.org, linux-afs@lists.infradead.org, Linux ARM <linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org>, linux-arm-msm@vger.kernel.org, linux-atm-general@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-block@vger.kernel.org, linux-can@vger.kernel.org, linux-cifs@vger.kernel.org, Linux Crypto Mailing List <linux-crypto@vger.kernel.org>, linux-decnet-user@lists.sourceforge.net, Ext4 Developers List <linux-ext4@vger.kernel.org>, linux-fbdev@vger.kernel.org, linux-geode@lists.infradead.org, linux-gpio@vger.kernel.org, linux-hams@vger.kernel.org, linux-hwmon@vger.kernel.org, linux-i3c@lists.infradead.org, linux-ide@vger.kernel.org, linux-iio@vger.kernel.org, linux-input <linux-input@vger.kernel.org>, linux-integrity@vger.kernel.org, linux-mediatek@lists.infradead.org, Linux Media Mailing List <linux-media@vger.kernel.org>, linux-mmc@vger.kernel.org, Linux-MM <linux-mm@kvack.org>, linux-mtd@lists.infradead.org, linux-nfs@vger.kernel.org, linux-rdma@vger.kernel.org, linux-renesas-soc@vger.kernel.org, linux-scsi@vger.kernel.org, linux-sctp@vger.kernel.org, linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org, linux-stm32@st-md-mailman.stormreply.com, linux-usb@vger.kernel.org, linux-watchdog@vger.kernel.org, linux-wireless <linux-wireless@vger.kernel.org>, Network Development <netdev@vger.kernel.org>, netfilter-devel@vger.kernel.org, nouveau@lists.freedesktop.org, op-tee@lists.trustedfirmware.org, oss-drivers@netronome.com, patches@opensource.cirrus.com, rds-devel@oss.oracle.com, reiserfs-devel@vger.kernel.org, samba-technical@lists.samba.org, selinux@vger.kernel.org, target-devel@vger.kernel.org, tipc-discussion@lists.sourceforge.net, usb-storage@lists.one-eyed-alien.net, virtualization@lists.linux-foundation.org, wcn36xx@lists.infradead.org, "maintainer:X86 ARCHITECTURE (32-BIT AND 64-BIT)" <x86@kernel.org>, xen-devel@lists.xenproject.org, linux-hardening@vger.kernel.org, Nick Desaulniers <ndesaulniers@google.com>, Nathan Chancellor <natechancellor@gmail.com>, Miguel Ojeda <ojeda@kernel.org> Subject: Re: [PATCH 000/141] Fix fall-through warnings for Clang Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2020 08:32:41 -0800 Message-ID: <32dc7423124b51da4e144e931bf099a368ab50a8.camel@perches.com> (raw) In-Reply-To: <fc45750b6d0277c401015b7aa11e16cd15f32ab2.camel@HansenPartnership.com> On Mon, 2020-11-23 at 07:58 -0800, James Bottomley wrote: > We're also complaining about the inability to recruit maintainers: > > https://www.theregister.com/2020/06/30/hard_to_find_linux_maintainers_says_torvalds/ > > And burn out: > > http://antirez.com/news/129 https://www.wired.com/story/open-source-coders-few-tired/ > What I'm actually trying to articulate is a way of measuring value of > the patch vs cost ... it has nothing really to do with who foots the > actual bill. It's unclear how to measure value in consistency. But one way that costs can be reduced is by automation and _not_ involving maintainers when the patch itself is provably correct. > One thesis I'm actually starting to formulate is that this continual > devaluing of maintainers is why we have so much difficulty keeping and > recruiting them. The linux kernel has something like 1500 different maintainers listed in the MAINTAINERS file. That's not a trivial number. $ git grep '^M:' MAINTAINERS | sort | uniq -c | wc -l 1543 $ git grep '^M:' MAINTAINERS| cut -f1 -d'<' | sort | uniq -c | wc -l 1446 I think the question you are asking is about trust and how it effects development. And back to that wired story, the actual number of what you might be considering to be maintainers is likely less than 10% of the listed numbers above.
next prev parent reply index Thread overview: 65+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top 2020-11-20 18:21 Gustavo A. R. Silva 2020-11-20 18:28 ` Joe Perches 2020-11-20 19:02 ` Gustavo A. R. Silva 2020-11-20 18:32 ` [PATCH 054/141] target: " Gustavo A. R. Silva 2020-11-20 18:53 ` [PATCH 000/141] " Jakub Kicinski 2020-11-20 19:04 ` Gustavo A. R. Silva 2020-11-20 19:30 ` Kees Cook 2020-11-20 19:51 ` Jakub Kicinski 2020-11-20 20:48 ` Kees Cook 2020-11-22 16:17 ` Kees Cook 2020-11-22 18:21 ` James Bottomley 2020-11-22 18:25 ` Joe Perches 2020-11-22 19:12 ` James Bottomley 2020-11-22 19:22 ` Joe Perches 2020-11-22 19:53 ` James Bottomley 2020-11-23 13:03 ` [Intel-wired-lan] " Gustavo A. R. Silva 2020-11-23 16:31 ` James Bottomley 2020-11-24 21:32 ` Kees Cook 2020-11-24 22:24 ` Finn Thain 2020-11-24 23:15 ` Miguel Ojeda 2020-11-24 23:53 ` Finn Thain 2020-11-25 1:05 ` Miguel Ojeda 2020-11-25 7:05 ` James Bottomley 2020-11-25 12:24 ` Nick Desaulniers 2020-11-25 21:33 ` Finn Thain 2020-11-25 22:09 ` Nick Desaulniers 2020-11-25 23:21 ` Finn Thain 2020-11-26 0:30 ` Finn Thain 2020-11-25 21:10 ` Kees Cook 2020-11-22 20:35 ` Miguel Ojeda 2020-11-22 22:36 ` James Bottomley 2020-11-23 14:19 ` Miguel Ojeda 2020-11-23 15:58 ` James Bottomley 2020-11-23 16:24 ` Rafael J. Wysocki 2020-11-23 16:32 ` Joe Perches [this message] 2020-11-23 18:56 ` Miguel Ojeda 2020-11-23 20:37 ` James Bottomley 2020-11-25 0:32 ` Miguel Ojeda 2020-11-25 22:44 ` Edward Cree 2020-11-26 14:53 ` Miguel Ojeda 2020-11-26 15:28 ` Geert Uytterhoeven 2020-11-26 16:18 ` Karol Herbst 2020-11-26 17:05 ` Miguel Ojeda 2020-11-25 10:38 ` Andy Shevchenko 2020-11-25 9:01 ` Sean Young 2020-11-22 22:54 ` Finn Thain 2020-11-22 23:04 ` James Bottomley 2020-11-23 14:05 ` Miguel Ojeda 2020-11-24 0:58 ` Finn Thain 2020-11-24 1:05 ` Joe Perches 2020-11-24 2:48 ` Finn Thain 2020-11-24 23:46 ` Miguel Ojeda 2020-11-22 22:10 ` Sam Ravnborg 2020-11-24 1:32 ` Nick Desaulniers 2020-11-24 21:25 ` Kees Cook 2020-11-25 23:02 ` Edward Cree 2020-12-01 14:08 ` Dan Carpenter 2020-12-01 14:04 ` Dan Carpenter 2020-11-20 22:21 ` Miguel Ojeda 2020-11-23 20:03 ` Jason Gunthorpe 2020-11-24 14:47 ` Gustavo A. R. Silva [not found] ` <160616392671.21180.16517492185091399884.b4-ty@kernel.org> 2020-11-24 14:47 ` Gustavo A. R. Silva 2020-12-01 5:52 ` Martin K. Petersen 2020-12-01 8:20 ` Gustavo A. R. Silva 2020-12-08 4:52 ` (subset) " Martin K. Petersen
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