Geo-replication with RBD

Geo-replication with RBD

[Skowron Sławomir]

I make new thread, because i think it's a diffrent case.

We have managed async geo-replication of s3 service, beetwen two ceph clusters in two DC's, and to amazon s3 as third. All this via s3 API. I love to see native RGW geo-replication with described features in another thread.

There is another case. What about RBD replication ?? It's much more complicated, and for disaster recovery much more important, just like in enterprise storage arrays.
One cluster in two DC's, not solving problem, because we need security in data consistency, and isolation. 
Do you thinking about this case ?? 

Regards
Slawomir Skowron

Re: Geo-replication with RBD

[Gandalf Corvotempesta]

2013/1/31 Skowron Sławomir <slawomir.skowron@grupaonet.pl>:
> We have managed async geo-replication of s3 service, beetwen two ceph clusters in two DC's, and to amazon s3 as third. All this via s3 API. I love to see native RGW geo-replication with described features in another thread.

how did you do this?
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Re: Geo-replication with RBD

[Sławomir Skowron]

We are using nginx, on top of rgw. In nginx we manage to create logic,
for using a AMQP, and async operations via queues. Then workers, on
every side getiing data from own queue, and then coping data from
source, to destination in s3 API. Works for PUT/DELETE, and work
automatic when production goes on another location.

On Thu, Jan 31, 2013 at 9:25 AM, Gandalf Corvotempesta
<gandalf.corvotempesta@gmail.com> wrote:
> 2013/1/31 Skowron Sławomir <slawomir.skowron@grupaonet.pl>:
>> We have managed async geo-replication of s3 service, beetwen two ceph clusters in two DC's, and to amazon s3 as third. All this via s3 API. I love to see native RGW geo-replication with described features in another thread.
>
> how did you do this?
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Re: Geo-replication with RBD

[Gandalf Corvotempesta]

2013/1/31 Sławomir Skowron <szibis@gmail.com>:
> We are using nginx, on top of rgw. In nginx we manage to create logic, for
> using a AMQP, and async operations via queues. Then workers, on every side
> getiing data from own queue, and then coping data from source, to
> destination in s3 API. Works for PUT/DELETE, and work automatic when
> production goes on another location.

I don't know much about messaging, are you able to share some
configuration or more details ?
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Re: Geo-replication with RBD

[Neil Levine]

Skowron,

Can you go into a bit more detail on your specific use-case? What type
of data are you storing in rbd (type, volume)?

Neil

On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 10:42 PM, Skowron Sławomir
<slawomir.skowron@grupaonet.pl> wrote:
> I make new thread, because i think it's a diffrent case.
>
> We have managed async geo-replication of s3 service, beetwen two ceph clusters in two DC's, and to amazon s3 as third. All this via s3 API. I love to see native RGW geo-replication with described features in another thread.
>
> There is another case. What about RBD replication ?? It's much more complicated, and for disaster recovery much more important, just like in enterprise storage arrays.
> One cluster in two DC's, not solving problem, because we need security in data consistency, and isolation.
> Do you thinking about this case ??
>
> Regards
> Slawomir Skowron--
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Re: Geo-replication with RBD

[Sławomir Skowron]

Hi, now i can response, after i was sick.

Nginx is compiled with perl/or lua support. Inside nginx configuration
is hook, for a perl code, or lua code, as you prefer. This code have a
inline functionality. We have testing this from logs, but it's not a
good idea.Now in line option, have advantage, because, we can reject
PUT's if AMQP is not working, and we don't need to resync, all
requests. If it took long, than, wee can't disable queue, and go
direct, without AMQP, and resync offline, from logs, by a simple admin
tool.

This in line functionality, working only on DELETE, PUT, and rest are
skipped, Every DELETE, PUT, have a own queue, with own priorities, and
custom info in header, for calculating, a time, of synchronization.
This nginx functionality, only putting data into queues, and every
data, are going into our, S3 (ceph), and Amazon s3, via nginx, with
almost same configuration, distributed by puppet.

On every DataCenter, we have a bunch of workers, getting data from
queues, dedicated for a location, and then, they are getting data
syncing, from source to destination. If data can't be get from source,
than info is going into error queue, and this queue is re-checked, for
some time.

I am in middle of writing some article, about this, but my sickness,
have slow down this process slightly.


On Thu, Jan 31, 2013 at 10:50 AM, Gandalf Corvotempesta
<gandalf.corvotempesta@gmail.com> wrote:
> 2013/1/31 Sławomir Skowron <szibis@gmail.com>:
>> We are using nginx, on top of rgw. In nginx we manage to create logic, for
>> using a AMQP, and async operations via queues. Then workers, on every side
>> getiing data from own queue, and then coping data from source, to
>> destination in s3 API. Works for PUT/DELETE, and work automatic when
>> production goes on another location.
>
> I don't know much about messaging, are you able to share some
> configuration or more details ?



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Sławek "sZiBis" Skowron

On Thu, Jan 31, 2013 at 10:50 AM, Gandalf Corvotempesta
<gandalf.corvotempesta@gmail.com> wrote:
> 2013/1/31 Sławomir Skowron <szibis@gmail.com>:
>> We are using nginx, on top of rgw. In nginx we manage to create logic, for
>> using a AMQP, and async operations via queues. Then workers, on every side
>> getiing data from own queue, and then coping data from source, to
>> destination in s3 API. Works for PUT/DELETE, and work automatic when
>> production goes on another location.
>
> I don't know much about messaging, are you able to share some
> configuration or more details ?



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Re: Geo-replication with RBD

[Sławomir Skowron]

Hi, Sorry for very late response, but i was sick.

Our case is to make a failover rbd instance in another cluster. We are
storing block device images, for some services like Database. We need
to have a two clusters, synchronized, for a quick failover, if first
cluster goes down, or for upgrade with restart, or many other cases.

Volumes are in many sizes: 1-500GB
external block device for kvm vm, like EBS.

On Mon, Feb 18, 2013 at 3:07 PM, Sławomir Skowron <szibis@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi, Sorry for very late response, but i was sick.
>
> Our case is to make a failover rbd instance in another cluster. We are
> storing block device images, for some services like Database. We need to
> have a two clusters, synchronized, for a quick failover, if first cluster
> goes down, or for upgrade with restart, or many other cases.
>
> Volumes are in many sizes: 1-500GB
> external block device for kvm vm, like EBS.
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 1, 2013 at 12:27 AM, Neil Levine <neil.levine@inktank.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> Skowron,
>>
>> Can you go into a bit more detail on your specific use-case? What type
>> of data are you storing in rbd (type, volume)?
>>
>> Neil
>>
>> On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 10:42 PM, Skowron Sławomir
>> <slawomir.skowron@grupaonet.pl> wrote:
>> > I make new thread, because i think it's a diffrent case.
>> >
>> > We have managed async geo-replication of s3 service, beetwen two ceph
>> > clusters in two DC's, and to amazon s3 as third. All this via s3 API. I love
>> > to see native RGW geo-replication with described features in another thread.
>> >
>> > There is another case. What about RBD replication ?? It's much more
>> > complicated, and for disaster recovery much more important, just like in
>> > enterprise storage arrays.
>> > One cluster in two DC's, not solving problem, because we need security
>> > in data consistency, and isolation.
>> > Do you thinking about this case ??
>> >
>> > Regards
>> > Slawomir Skowron--
>> > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
>> > the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
>> > More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
>> --
>> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
>> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
>> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
>
>
>
>
> --
> -----
> Pozdrawiam
>
> Sławek "sZiBis" Skowron



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Re: Geo-replication with RBD

[Sébastien Han]

Hi,

For of all, I have some questions about your setup:

* What are your requirements?
* Are the DCs far from each others?

If they are reasonably close to each others, you can setup a single
cluster, with replicas across both DCs and manage the RBD devices with
pacemaker.

Cheers.

--
Regards,
Sébastien Han.


On Mon, Feb 18, 2013 at 3:20 PM, Sławomir Skowron <szibis@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi, Sorry for very late response, but i was sick.
>
> Our case is to make a failover rbd instance in another cluster. We are
> storing block device images, for some services like Database. We need
> to have a two clusters, synchronized, for a quick failover, if first
> cluster goes down, or for upgrade with restart, or many other cases.
>
> Volumes are in many sizes: 1-500GB
> external block device for kvm vm, like EBS.
>
> On Mon, Feb 18, 2013 at 3:07 PM, Sławomir Skowron <szibis@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi, Sorry for very late response, but i was sick.
>>
>> Our case is to make a failover rbd instance in another cluster. We are
>> storing block device images, for some services like Database. We need to
>> have a two clusters, synchronized, for a quick failover, if first cluster
>> goes down, or for upgrade with restart, or many other cases.
>>
>> Volumes are in many sizes: 1-500GB
>> external block device for kvm vm, like EBS.
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 1, 2013 at 12:27 AM, Neil Levine <neil.levine@inktank.com>
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Skowron,
>>>
>>> Can you go into a bit more detail on your specific use-case? What type
>>> of data are you storing in rbd (type, volume)?
>>>
>>> Neil
>>>
>>> On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 10:42 PM, Skowron Sławomir
>>> <slawomir.skowron@grupaonet.pl> wrote:
>>> > I make new thread, because i think it's a diffrent case.
>>> >
>>> > We have managed async geo-replication of s3 service, beetwen two ceph
>>> > clusters in two DC's, and to amazon s3 as third. All this via s3 API. I love
>>> > to see native RGW geo-replication with described features in another thread.
>>> >
>>> > There is another case. What about RBD replication ?? It's much more
>>> > complicated, and for disaster recovery much more important, just like in
>>> > enterprise storage arrays.
>>> > One cluster in two DC's, not solving problem, because we need security
>>> > in data consistency, and isolation.
>>> > Do you thinking about this case ??
>>> >
>>> > Regards
>>> > Slawomir Skowron--
>>> > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
>>> > the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
>>> > More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
>>> --
>>> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
>>> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
>>> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> -----
>> Pozdrawiam
>>
>> Sławek "sZiBis" Skowron
>
>
>
> --
> -----
> Pozdrawiam
>
> Sławek "sZiBis" Skowron
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Re: Geo-replication with RBD

[Sławomir Skowron]

My requirement is to have full disaster recovery, buisness continuity,
and failover of automatet services on second Datacenter, and not on
same ceph cluster.
Datacenters have 10GE dedicated link, for communication, and there is
option to expand cluster into two DataCenters, but it is not what i
mean.
There are advantages of this option like fast snapshots, and fast
switch of services, but there are some problems.

When we talk about disaster recovery i mean that whole storage cluster
have problems, not only services at top of storage. I am thinking
about bug, or mistake of admin, that makes cluster not accessible in
any copy, or a upgrade that makes data corruption, or upgrade that is
disruptive for services - auto failover services into another DC,
before upgrade cluster.

If cluster have a solution to replicate data in rbd images to next
cluster, than, only data are migrated, and when disaster comes, than
there is no need to work on last imported snapshot (there can be
constantly imported snapshot with minutes, or hour, before last
production), but work on data from now. And when we have automated
solution to recover DB (one of app service on top of rbd) clusters in
new datacenter infrastructure, than we have a real disaster recovery
solution.

That's why we made, a s3 api layer synchronization to another DC, and
Amazon, and only RBD is left.

Dnia 19 lut 2013 o godz. 10:23 "Sébastien Han"
<han.sebastien@gmail.com> napisał(a):

> Hi,
>
> For of all, I have some questions about your setup:
>
> * What are your requirements?
> * Are the DCs far from each others?
>
> If they are reasonably close to each others, you can setup a single
> cluster, with replicas across both DCs and manage the RBD devices with
> pacemaker.
>
> Cheers.
>
> --
> Regards,
> Sébastien Han.
>
>
> On Mon, Feb 18, 2013 at 3:20 PM, Sławomir Skowron <szibis@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi, Sorry for very late response, but i was sick.
>>
>> Our case is to make a failover rbd instance in another cluster. We are
>> storing block device images, for some services like Database. We need
>> to have a two clusters, synchronized, for a quick failover, if first
>> cluster goes down, or for upgrade with restart, or many other cases.
>>
>> Volumes are in many sizes: 1-500GB
>> external block device for kvm vm, like EBS.
>>
>> On Mon, Feb 18, 2013 at 3:07 PM, Sławomir Skowron <szibis@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Hi, Sorry for very late response, but i was sick.
>>>
>>> Our case is to make a failover rbd instance in another cluster. We are
>>> storing block device images, for some services like Database. We need to
>>> have a two clusters, synchronized, for a quick failover, if first cluster
>>> goes down, or for upgrade with restart, or many other cases.
>>>
>>> Volumes are in many sizes: 1-500GB
>>> external block device for kvm vm, like EBS.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Feb 1, 2013 at 12:27 AM, Neil Levine <neil.levine@inktank.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Skowron,
>>>>
>>>> Can you go into a bit more detail on your specific use-case? What type
>>>> of data are you storing in rbd (type, volume)?
>>>>
>>>> Neil
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 10:42 PM, Skowron Sławomir
>>>> <slawomir.skowron@grupaonet.pl> wrote:
>>>>> I make new thread, because i think it's a diffrent case.
>>>>>
>>>>> We have managed async geo-replication of s3 service, beetwen two ceph
>>>>> clusters in two DC's, and to amazon s3 as third. All this via s3 API. I love
>>>>> to see native RGW geo-replication with described features in another thread.
>>>>>
>>>>> There is another case. What about RBD replication ?? It's much more
>>>>> complicated, and for disaster recovery much more important, just like in
>>>>> enterprise storage arrays.
>>>>> One cluster in two DC's, not solving problem, because we need security
>>>>> in data consistency, and isolation.
>>>>> Do you thinking about this case ??
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards
>>>>> Slawomir Skowron--
>>>>> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
>>>>> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
>>>>> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
>>>> --
>>>> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
>>>> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
>>>> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> -----
>>> Pozdrawiam
>>>
>>> Sławek "sZiBis" Skowron
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> -----
>> Pozdrawiam
>>
>> Sławek "sZiBis" Skowron
>> --
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Re: Geo-replication with RBD

[Sage Weil]

On Wed, 20 Feb 2013, S?awomir Skowron wrote:
> My requirement is to have full disaster recovery, buisness continuity,
> and failover of automatet services on second Datacenter, and not on
> same ceph cluster.
> Datacenters have 10GE dedicated link, for communication, and there is
> option to expand cluster into two DataCenters, but it is not what i
> mean.
> There are advantages of this option like fast snapshots, and fast
> switch of services, but there are some problems.
> 
> When we talk about disaster recovery i mean that whole storage cluster
> have problems, not only services at top of storage. I am thinking
> about bug, or mistake of admin, that makes cluster not accessible in
> any copy, or a upgrade that makes data corruption, or upgrade that is
> disruptive for services - auto failover services into another DC,
> before upgrade cluster.
> 
> If cluster have a solution to replicate data in rbd images to next
> cluster, than, only data are migrated, and when disaster comes, than
> there is no need to work on last imported snapshot (there can be
> constantly imported snapshot with minutes, or hour, before last
> production), but work on data from now. And when we have automated
> solution to recover DB (one of app service on top of rbd) clusters in
> new datacenter infrastructure, than we have a real disaster recovery
> solution.
> 
> That's why we made, a s3 api layer synchronization to another DC, and
> Amazon, and only RBD is left.

Have you read the thread from Jens last week, 'snapshot, clone and mount a 
VM-Image'?  Would this type of capability capture you're requirements?

sage

> 
> Dnia 19 lut 2013 o godz. 10:23 "S?bastien Han"
> <han.sebastien@gmail.com> napisa?(a):
> 
> > Hi,
> >
> > For of all, I have some questions about your setup:
> >
> > * What are your requirements?
> > * Are the DCs far from each others?
> >
> > If they are reasonably close to each others, you can setup a single
> > cluster, with replicas across both DCs and manage the RBD devices with
> > pacemaker.
> >
> > Cheers.
> >
> > --
> > Regards,
> > S?bastien Han.
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Feb 18, 2013 at 3:20 PM, S?awomir Skowron <szibis@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> Hi, Sorry for very late response, but i was sick.
> >>
> >> Our case is to make a failover rbd instance in another cluster. We are
> >> storing block device images, for some services like Database. We need
> >> to have a two clusters, synchronized, for a quick failover, if first
> >> cluster goes down, or for upgrade with restart, or many other cases.
> >>
> >> Volumes are in many sizes: 1-500GB
> >> external block device for kvm vm, like EBS.
> >>
> >> On Mon, Feb 18, 2013 at 3:07 PM, S?awomir Skowron <szibis@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>> Hi, Sorry for very late response, but i was sick.
> >>>
> >>> Our case is to make a failover rbd instance in another cluster. We are
> >>> storing block device images, for some services like Database. We need to
> >>> have a two clusters, synchronized, for a quick failover, if first cluster
> >>> goes down, or for upgrade with restart, or many other cases.
> >>>
> >>> Volumes are in many sizes: 1-500GB
> >>> external block device for kvm vm, like EBS.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Fri, Feb 1, 2013 at 12:27 AM, Neil Levine <neil.levine@inktank.com>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> Skowron,
> >>>>
> >>>> Can you go into a bit more detail on your specific use-case? What type
> >>>> of data are you storing in rbd (type, volume)?
> >>>>
> >>>> Neil
> >>>>
> >>>> On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 10:42 PM, Skowron S?awomir
> >>>> <slawomir.skowron@grupaonet.pl> wrote:
> >>>>> I make new thread, because i think it's a diffrent case.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> We have managed async geo-replication of s3 service, beetwen two ceph
> >>>>> clusters in two DC's, and to amazon s3 as third. All this via s3 API. I love
> >>>>> to see native RGW geo-replication with described features in another thread.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> There is another case. What about RBD replication ?? It's much more
> >>>>> complicated, and for disaster recovery much more important, just like in
> >>>>> enterprise storage arrays.
> >>>>> One cluster in two DC's, not solving problem, because we need security
> >>>>> in data consistency, and isolation.
> >>>>> Do you thinking about this case ??
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Regards
> >>>>> Slawomir Skowron--
> >>>>> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
> >>>>> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> >>>>> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> >>>> --
> >>>> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
> >>>> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> >>>> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> -----
> >>> Pozdrawiam
> >>>
> >>> S?awek "sZiBis" Skowron
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> -----
> >> Pozdrawiam
> >>
> >> S?awek "sZiBis" Skowron
> >> --
> >> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
> >> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> >> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> --
> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
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> 
> 

Re: Geo-replication with RBD

[Sławomir Skowron]

Like i say, yes. Now it is only option, to migrate data from one
cluster to other, and now it must be enough, with some auto features.

But is there any timeline, or any brainstorming in ceph internal
meetings, about any possible replication in block level, or something
like that ??

On 20 lut 2013, at 17:33, Sage Weil <sage@inktank.com> wrote:

> On Wed, 20 Feb 2013, S?awomir Skowron wrote:
>> My requirement is to have full disaster recovery, buisness continuity,
>> and failover of automatet services on second Datacenter, and not on
>> same ceph cluster.
>> Datacenters have 10GE dedicated link, for communication, and there is
>> option to expand cluster into two DataCenters, but it is not what i
>> mean.
>> There are advantages of this option like fast snapshots, and fast
>> switch of services, but there are some problems.
>>
>> When we talk about disaster recovery i mean that whole storage cluster
>> have problems, not only services at top of storage. I am thinking
>> about bug, or mistake of admin, that makes cluster not accessible in
>> any copy, or a upgrade that makes data corruption, or upgrade that is
>> disruptive for services - auto failover services into another DC,
>> before upgrade cluster.
>>
>> If cluster have a solution to replicate data in rbd images to next
>> cluster, than, only data are migrated, and when disaster comes, than
>> there is no need to work on last imported snapshot (there can be
>> constantly imported snapshot with minutes, or hour, before last
>> production), but work on data from now. And when we have automated
>> solution to recover DB (one of app service on top of rbd) clusters in
>> new datacenter infrastructure, than we have a real disaster recovery
>> solution.
>>
>> That's why we made, a s3 api layer synchronization to another DC, and
>> Amazon, and only RBD is left.
>
> Have you read the thread from Jens last week, 'snapshot, clone and mount a
> VM-Image'?  Would this type of capability capture you're requirements?
>
> sage
>
>>
>> Dnia 19 lut 2013 o godz. 10:23 "S?bastien Han"
>> <han.sebastien@gmail.com> napisa?(a):
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> For of all, I have some questions about your setup:
>>>
>>> * What are your requirements?
>>> * Are the DCs far from each others?
>>>
>>> If they are reasonably close to each others, you can setup a single
>>> cluster, with replicas across both DCs and manage the RBD devices with
>>> pacemaker.
>>>
>>> Cheers.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Regards,
>>> S?bastien Han.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, Feb 18, 2013 at 3:20 PM, S?awomir Skowron <szibis@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Hi, Sorry for very late response, but i was sick.
>>>>
>>>> Our case is to make a failover rbd instance in another cluster. We are
>>>> storing block device images, for some services like Database. We need
>>>> to have a two clusters, synchronized, for a quick failover, if first
>>>> cluster goes down, or for upgrade with restart, or many other cases.
>>>>
>>>> Volumes are in many sizes: 1-500GB
>>>> external block device for kvm vm, like EBS.
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Feb 18, 2013 at 3:07 PM, S?awomir Skowron <szibis@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> Hi, Sorry for very late response, but i was sick.
>>>>>
>>>>> Our case is to make a failover rbd instance in another cluster. We are
>>>>> storing block device images, for some services like Database. We need to
>>>>> have a two clusters, synchronized, for a quick failover, if first cluster
>>>>> goes down, or for upgrade with restart, or many other cases.
>>>>>
>>>>> Volumes are in many sizes: 1-500GB
>>>>> external block device for kvm vm, like EBS.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, Feb 1, 2013 at 12:27 AM, Neil Levine <neil.levine@inktank.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Skowron,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Can you go into a bit more detail on your specific use-case? What type
>>>>>> of data are you storing in rbd (type, volume)?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Neil
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 10:42 PM, Skowron S?awomir
>>>>>> <slawomir.skowron@grupaonet.pl> wrote:
>>>>>>> I make new thread, because i think it's a diffrent case.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> We have managed async geo-replication of s3 service, beetwen two ceph
>>>>>>> clusters in two DC's, and to amazon s3 as third. All this via s3 API. I love
>>>>>>> to see native RGW geo-replication with described features in another thread.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> There is another case. What about RBD replication ?? It's much more
>>>>>>> complicated, and for disaster recovery much more important, just like in
>>>>>>> enterprise storage arrays.
>>>>>>> One cluster in two DC's, not solving problem, because we need security
>>>>>>> in data consistency, and isolation.
>>>>>>> Do you thinking about this case ??
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Regards
>>>>>>> Slawomir Skowron--
>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
>>>>>>> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
>>>>>>> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
>>>>>> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
>>>>>> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> -----
>>>>> Pozdrawiam
>>>>>
>>>>> S?awek "sZiBis" Skowron
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> -----
>>>> Pozdrawiam
>>>>
>>>> S?awek "sZiBis" Skowron
>>>> --
>>>> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
>>>> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
>>>> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
>> --
>> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
>> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
>> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
>>
>>

Re: Geo-replication with RBD

[Sage Weil]

On Wed, 20 Feb 2013, S?awomir Skowron wrote:
> Like i say, yes. Now it is only option, to migrate data from one
> cluster to other, and now it must be enough, with some auto features.
> 
> But is there any timeline, or any brainstorming in ceph internal
> meetings, about any possible replication in block level, or something
> like that ??

I would like to get this in for cuttlefish (0.61).  See #4207 for the 
underlying rados bits.  We also need to settle the file format discussion; 
any input there would be appreciated!

sage


> 
> On 20 lut 2013, at 17:33, Sage Weil <sage@inktank.com> wrote:
> 
> > On Wed, 20 Feb 2013, S?awomir Skowron wrote:
> >> My requirement is to have full disaster recovery, buisness continuity,
> >> and failover of automatet services on second Datacenter, and not on
> >> same ceph cluster.
> >> Datacenters have 10GE dedicated link, for communication, and there is
> >> option to expand cluster into two DataCenters, but it is not what i
> >> mean.
> >> There are advantages of this option like fast snapshots, and fast
> >> switch of services, but there are some problems.
> >>
> >> When we talk about disaster recovery i mean that whole storage cluster
> >> have problems, not only services at top of storage. I am thinking
> >> about bug, or mistake of admin, that makes cluster not accessible in
> >> any copy, or a upgrade that makes data corruption, or upgrade that is
> >> disruptive for services - auto failover services into another DC,
> >> before upgrade cluster.
> >>
> >> If cluster have a solution to replicate data in rbd images to next
> >> cluster, than, only data are migrated, and when disaster comes, than
> >> there is no need to work on last imported snapshot (there can be
> >> constantly imported snapshot with minutes, or hour, before last
> >> production), but work on data from now. And when we have automated
> >> solution to recover DB (one of app service on top of rbd) clusters in
> >> new datacenter infrastructure, than we have a real disaster recovery
> >> solution.
> >>
> >> That's why we made, a s3 api layer synchronization to another DC, and
> >> Amazon, and only RBD is left.
> >
> > Have you read the thread from Jens last week, 'snapshot, clone and mount a
> > VM-Image'?  Would this type of capability capture you're requirements?
> >
> > sage
> >
> >>
> >> Dnia 19 lut 2013 o godz. 10:23 "S?bastien Han"
> >> <han.sebastien@gmail.com> napisa?(a):
> >>
> >>> Hi,
> >>>
> >>> For of all, I have some questions about your setup:
> >>>
> >>> * What are your requirements?
> >>> * Are the DCs far from each others?
> >>>
> >>> If they are reasonably close to each others, you can setup a single
> >>> cluster, with replicas across both DCs and manage the RBD devices with
> >>> pacemaker.
> >>>
> >>> Cheers.
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Regards,
> >>> S?bastien Han.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Mon, Feb 18, 2013 at 3:20 PM, S?awomir Skowron <szibis@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>> Hi, Sorry for very late response, but i was sick.
> >>>>
> >>>> Our case is to make a failover rbd instance in another cluster. We are
> >>>> storing block device images, for some services like Database. We need
> >>>> to have a two clusters, synchronized, for a quick failover, if first
> >>>> cluster goes down, or for upgrade with restart, or many other cases.
> >>>>
> >>>> Volumes are in many sizes: 1-500GB
> >>>> external block device for kvm vm, like EBS.
> >>>>
> >>>> On Mon, Feb 18, 2013 at 3:07 PM, S?awomir Skowron <szibis@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>> Hi, Sorry for very late response, but i was sick.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Our case is to make a failover rbd instance in another cluster. We are
> >>>>> storing block device images, for some services like Database. We need to
> >>>>> have a two clusters, synchronized, for a quick failover, if first cluster
> >>>>> goes down, or for upgrade with restart, or many other cases.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Volumes are in many sizes: 1-500GB
> >>>>> external block device for kvm vm, like EBS.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Fri, Feb 1, 2013 at 12:27 AM, Neil Levine <neil.levine@inktank.com>
> >>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Skowron,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Can you go into a bit more detail on your specific use-case? What type
> >>>>>> of data are you storing in rbd (type, volume)?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Neil
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 10:42 PM, Skowron S?awomir
> >>>>>> <slawomir.skowron@grupaonet.pl> wrote:
> >>>>>>> I make new thread, because i think it's a diffrent case.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> We have managed async geo-replication of s3 service, beetwen two ceph
> >>>>>>> clusters in two DC's, and to amazon s3 as third. All this via s3 API. I love
> >>>>>>> to see native RGW geo-replication with described features in another thread.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> There is another case. What about RBD replication ?? It's much more
> >>>>>>> complicated, and for disaster recovery much more important, just like in
> >>>>>>> enterprise storage arrays.
> >>>>>>> One cluster in two DC's, not solving problem, because we need security
> >>>>>>> in data consistency, and isolation.
> >>>>>>> Do you thinking about this case ??
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Regards
> >>>>>>> Slawomir Skowron--
> >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
> >>>>>>> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> >>>>>>> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> >>>>>> --
> >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
> >>>>>> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> >>>>>> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> --
> >>>>> -----
> >>>>> Pozdrawiam
> >>>>>
> >>>>> S?awek "sZiBis" Skowron
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> -----
> >>>> Pozdrawiam
> >>>>
> >>>> S?awek "sZiBis" Skowron
> >>>> --
> >>>> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
> >>>> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> >>>> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> >> --
> >> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
> >> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> >> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> >>
> >>
> --
> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> 
> 

Re: Geo-replication with RBD

[Lorieri]

Hi Slawomir,

I'm not a ceph specialist, nor a developer, but I think Rados Object
Store API and Eleanor Cawthon's paper could be a possible solution for
radosgw replication.

Automatic recovery for RDB would be impraticable due the size of the
clusters. Some databases fixed it by giving a global id to
transactions but I believe it would break some ceph rules. If you look
at Amazon, they replicate databases using the database technology, not
by replicating the storage. If ceph creates a transaction log and the
internet goes down for few days, you would have to be able to save all
the transactions until it comes back, and then you will have to be
able to catch up.

But for your radosgw I believe it is possible to reproduce an
efficient transaction log by moving the logic and computation from
your embedded perl to the librados API (I'm sure if it is correct, I
mean the one you put some logic inside the OSDs) to populate a list of
transactions stored inside ceph, as described here:
http://ceph.com/papers/CawthonKeyValueStore.pdf , it may reduce the
sysadmin mistakes you mentioned. The problem is perl, nginx and AMPQ
is much simpler than rados and C.
If the replication stales the key-value list reduces the replication
because it aggregates updated objects with their last state, it also
makes it easy to deal with deleted objects, parallel copies and
buckets prioritization. If the replica data-center serves read-only
requests, adding a little more complexity, it would be possible to
replicate objects on demand by checking the transaction log before
serving an object, until the replication reaches a certain level of
acceptable delay.

For a complete data-center recovery, it would be nice to have tools to
simplify some operations, for example you could get from the crush map
one server of each branch, move them to the lost datacenter and set
them all as primary, replicate the data and wait for a recovery from
the journals. It is a huge operation that makes sense for a lot of
companies and I know some that did something similar for big raid
systems.

For lots of users like me, replication and its risks would be a
valuable and manageable feature and maybe it could be another project,
less strict with the fundamentals of ceph.



On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 2:19 PM, Sage Weil <sage@inktank.com> wrote:
>
> On Wed, 20 Feb 2013, S?awomir Skowron wrote:
> > Like i say, yes. Now it is only option, to migrate data from one
> > cluster to other, and now it must be enough, with some auto features.
> >
> > But is there any timeline, or any brainstorming in ceph internal
> > meetings, about any possible replication in block level, or something
> > like that ??
>
> I would like to get this in for cuttlefish (0.61).  See #4207 for the
> underlying rados bits.  We also need to settle the file format discussion;
> any input there would be appreciated!
>
> sage
>
>
> >
> > On 20 lut 2013, at 17:33, Sage Weil <sage@inktank.com> wrote:
> >
> > > On Wed, 20 Feb 2013, S?awomir Skowron wrote:
> > >> My requirement is to have full disaster recovery, buisness continuity,
> > >> and failover of automatet services on second Datacenter, and not on
> > >> same ceph cluster.
> > >> Datacenters have 10GE dedicated link, for communication, and there is
> > >> option to expand cluster into two DataCenters, but it is not what i
> > >> mean.
> > >> There are advantages of this option like fast snapshots, and fast
> > >> switch of services, but there are some problems.
> > >>
> > >> When we talk about disaster recovery i mean that whole storage cluster
> > >> have problems, not only services at top of storage. I am thinking
> > >> about bug, or mistake of admin, that makes cluster not accessible in
> > >> any copy, or a upgrade that makes data corruption, or upgrade that is
> > >> disruptive for services - auto failover services into another DC,
> > >> before upgrade cluster.
> > >>
> > >> If cluster have a solution to replicate data in rbd images to next
> > >> cluster, than, only data are migrated, and when disaster comes, than
> > >> there is no need to work on last imported snapshot (there can be
> > >> constantly imported snapshot with minutes, or hour, before last
> > >> production), but work on data from now. And when we have automated
> > >> solution to recover DB (one of app service on top of rbd) clusters in
> > >> new datacenter infrastructure, than we have a real disaster recovery
> > >> solution.
> > >>
> > >> That's why we made, a s3 api layer synchronization to another DC, and
> > >> Amazon, and only RBD is left.
> > >
> > > Have you read the thread from Jens last week, 'snapshot, clone and mount a
> > > VM-Image'?  Would this type of capability capture you're requirements?
> > >
> > > sage
> > >
> > >>
> > >> Dnia 19 lut 2013 o godz. 10:23 "S?bastien Han"
> > >> <han.sebastien@gmail.com> napisa?(a):
> > >>
> > >>> Hi,
> > >>>
> > >>> For of all, I have some questions about your setup:
> > >>>
> > >>> * What are your requirements?
> > >>> * Are the DCs far from each others?
> > >>>
> > >>> If they are reasonably close to each others, you can setup a single
> > >>> cluster, with replicas across both DCs and manage the RBD devices with
> > >>> pacemaker.
> > >>>
> > >>> Cheers.
> > >>>
> > >>> --
> > >>> Regards,
> > >>> S?bastien Han.
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>> On Mon, Feb 18, 2013 at 3:20 PM, S?awomir Skowron <szibis@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >>>> Hi, Sorry for very late response, but i was sick.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Our case is to make a failover rbd instance in another cluster. We are
> > >>>> storing block device images, for some services like Database. We need
> > >>>> to have a two clusters, synchronized, for a quick failover, if first
> > >>>> cluster goes down, or for upgrade with restart, or many other cases.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Volumes are in many sizes: 1-500GB
> > >>>> external block device for kvm vm, like EBS.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> On Mon, Feb 18, 2013 at 3:07 PM, S?awomir Skowron <szibis@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >>>>> Hi, Sorry for very late response, but i was sick.
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> Our case is to make a failover rbd instance in another cluster. We are
> > >>>>> storing block device images, for some services like Database. We need to
> > >>>>> have a two clusters, synchronized, for a quick failover, if first cluster
> > >>>>> goes down, or for upgrade with restart, or many other cases.
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> Volumes are in many sizes: 1-500GB
> > >>>>> external block device for kvm vm, like EBS.
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> On Fri, Feb 1, 2013 at 12:27 AM, Neil Levine <neil.levine@inktank.com>
> > >>>>> wrote:
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> Skowron,
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> Can you go into a bit more detail on your specific use-case? What type
> > >>>>>> of data are you storing in rbd (type, volume)?
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> Neil
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 10:42 PM, Skowron S?awomir
> > >>>>>> <slawomir.skowron@grupaonet.pl> wrote:
> > >>>>>>> I make new thread, because i think it's a diffrent case.
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> We have managed async geo-replication of s3 service, beetwen two ceph
> > >>>>>>> clusters in two DC's, and to amazon s3 as third. All this via s3 API. I love
> > >>>>>>> to see native RGW geo-replication with described features in another thread.
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> There is another case. What about RBD replication ?? It's much more
> > >>>>>>> complicated, and for disaster recovery much more important, just like in
> > >>>>>>> enterprise storage arrays.
> > >>>>>>> One cluster in two DC's, not solving problem, because we need security
> > >>>>>>> in data consistency, and isolation.
> > >>>>>>> Do you thinking about this case ??
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> Regards
> > >>>>>>> Slawomir Skowron--
> > >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
> > >>>>>>> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> > >>>>>>> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> > >>>>>> --
> > >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
> > >>>>>> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> > >>>>>> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> --
> > >>>>> -----
> > >>>>> Pozdrawiam
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> S?awek "sZiBis" Skowron
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>> --
> > >>>> -----
> > >>>> Pozdrawiam
> > >>>>
> > >>>> S?awek "sZiBis" Skowron
> > >>>> --
> > >>>> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
> > >>>> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> > >>>> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> > >> --
> > >> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
> > >> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> > >> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> > >>
> > >>
> > --
> > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
> > the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> > More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> >
> >
> --
> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in
> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html