From: Jeremy Allison <jra@samba.org>
To: Steve French <smfrench@gmail.com>,
linux-fsdevel <linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org>,
ebiggers@kernel.org,
samba-technical <samba-technical@lists.samba.org>,
Al Viro <viro@zeniv.linux.org.uk>,
Matthew Wilcox <willy@infradead.org>
Subject: Re: Streams support in Linux
Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2018 10:41:21 -0700 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <20180827174121.GD217636@jra3> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20180827170531.GC217636@jra3>
On Mon, Aug 27, 2018 at 10:05:31AM -0700, Jeremy Allison via samba-technical wrote:
> On Sat, Aug 25, 2018 at 08:03:03PM -0500, Steve French via samba-technical wrote:
> > On Sat, Aug 25, 2018 at 5:37 PM Al Viro via samba-technical
> > >
> > > Better yet, you need some new objects to represent those things, since
> > > you don't want any informative dentries. And not fs-private ones, at
> > > that, since those new syscalls of yours would have to operate on them
> > > (after all, renaming something opened would probably be expected to
> > > have the opened descriptor to keep accessing the same object, wouldn't
> > > it?)
> >
> > These are interesting questions, and there are cases where streams
> > have been shown to have value in Windows, and for Apple (in Macs).
> > Don't know whether the Solaris equivalent was useful - but presumably
> > was.
>
> Sorry Steve, can't let this pass :-). Please name *one* case
> where streams have value in Windows or Mac. And I'm not talking
> about the case for EA's, these clearly have value (plus we already
> have them :-).
>
> I'm talking about a case where there is clear value in having
> an openable/seekable stream on a file/directory.
>
> I can't think of a *single* case where a stream adds more
> utility than an EA used in the same case.
>
> I don't want theoretical "well it would be nice if..",
> I want clear "we couldn't have done it any other way"
> kinds of things.
Actually, to answer my own question, I do know of one
valid application that uses named streams.
The CIA exfiltration tools exposed by WikiLeaks used a
named stream on a top-level share directory to hide data being
stolen from the target (which is why I guess the CIA
doesn't employ NSA-level people, the NSA almost certainly
use the hidden data area behind Windows ACL store instead
as no known scanning tools look at that :-).
So if we really want to enable such things, by all means
add named streams to Linux :-) :-).
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2018-08-27 21:29 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 36+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2018-08-25 13:51 Streams support in Linux Matthew Wilcox
2018-08-25 14:47 ` Al Viro
2018-08-25 15:51 ` Matthew Wilcox
2018-08-25 18:00 ` Al Viro
2018-08-25 20:57 ` Matthew Wilcox
2018-08-25 22:36 ` Al Viro
2018-08-26 1:03 ` Steve French
2018-08-27 17:05 ` Jeremy Allison
2018-08-27 17:41 ` Jeremy Allison [this message]
2018-08-27 18:21 ` Matthew Wilcox
2018-08-27 18:45 ` Al Viro
2018-08-27 19:06 ` Jeremy Allison
2018-08-28 0:45 ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2018-08-28 1:07 ` Steve French
2018-08-28 18:12 ` Jeremy Allison
2018-08-28 18:32 ` Steve French
2018-08-28 18:40 ` Jeremy Allison
2018-08-28 19:43 ` Steve French
2018-08-28 19:47 ` Jeremy Allison
2018-08-28 20:43 ` Steve French
2018-08-28 20:47 ` Jeremy Allison
2018-08-28 20:51 ` Steve French
2018-08-28 21:19 ` Stefan Metzmacher
2018-08-28 21:22 ` Jeremy Allison
2018-08-28 21:23 ` Steve French
2018-08-29 5:13 ` Ralph Böhme
2018-08-29 13:46 ` Tom Talpey
2018-08-29 13:54 ` Aurélien Aptel
2018-08-29 15:02 ` Tom Talpey
2018-08-29 16:00 ` Jeremy Allison
2018-08-29 15:59 ` Jeremy Allison
2018-08-29 18:52 ` Andreas Dilger
2018-08-26 20:30 ` Matthew Wilcox
2018-08-25 16:25 ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2018-08-27 16:33 ` Jeremy Allison
2018-09-20 2:06 Shahbaz Youssefi
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