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From: Geert Uytterhoeven <geert@linux-m68k.org>
To: Josh Triplett <josh@joshtriplett.org>
Cc: neil@brown.name, mishi@linux.com,
	Greg KH <gregkh@linuxfoundation.org>,
	Linux Kernel Mailing List <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	ksummit-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org
Subject: Re: [Ksummit-discuss] Call to Action Re: [PATCH 0/7] Code of Conduct: Fix some wording, and add an interpretation document
Date: Sun, 4 Nov 2018 11:35:56 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <CAMuHMdUyVMNd9qUFEqG=ULWVo6WaiPm3fAkAGh11ucWtptY4zA@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20181024121622.GA10942@localhost>

Hi Josh,

On Wed, Oct 24, 2018 at 2:16 PM Josh Triplett <josh@joshtriplett.org> wrote:
> On Tue, Oct 23, 2018 at 07:26:06AM +1100, NeilBrown wrote:
> > On Sun, Oct 21 2018, Josh Triplett wrote:
> > > On Mon, Oct 22, 2018 at 08:20:11AM +1100, NeilBrown wrote:
> > >> I call on you, Greg:
> > >>  - to abandon this divisive attempt to impose a "Code of Conduct"
> > >>  - to revert 8a104f8b5867c68
> > >>  - to return to your core competence of building a great team around
> > >>    a great kernel
> > >>
> > >>  #Isupportreversion
> > >>
> > >> I call on the community to consider what *does* need to be said, about
> > >> conduct, to people outside the community and who have recently joined.
> > >> What is the document that you would have liked to have read as you were
> > >> starting out?  It is all too long ago for me to remember clearly, and so
> > >> much has changed.
> > >
> > > The document I would have liked to have read when starting out is
> > > currently checked into the source tree in
> > > Documentation/process/code-of-conduct.rst .
> >
> > I'm curious - what would you have gained by reading that document?
>
> I would have then had rather less of a pervasive feeling of "if I make
> even a single mistake I get made an example of in ways that will feed
> people's quotes files for years to come".
>
> See
> https://hbr.org/2017/08/high-performing-teams-need-psychological-safety-heres-how-to-create-it
> for more on the benefits of that.

Funny how you post a link to that article ;-)
Because the psychological safety of the Linux kernel developers and
maintainers is exactly what is being affected, due to the atmosphere
surrounding this particular CoC.

While the addition of the CoC Clarification did improve the general
understanding, the addition of the CoC itself has already caused a
chilling effect. From chatting at the conferences in Edinburgh, people
do have concerns and comments, but many just do not want to express
their thoughts and feelings in public...

Gr{oetje,eeting}s,

                        Geert

--
Geert Uytterhoeven -- There's lots of Linux beyond ia32 -- geert@linux-m68k.org

In personal conversations with technical people, I call myself a hacker. But
when I'm talking to journalists I just say "programmer" or something like that.
                                -- Linus Torvalds

  parent reply	other threads:[~2018-11-04 10:36 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 104+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2018-10-20 13:49 [PATCH 0/7] Code of Conduct: Fix some wording, and add an interpretation document Greg Kroah-Hartman
2018-10-20 13:49 ` [PATCH 1/7] Code of conduct: Fix wording around maintainers enforcing the code of conduct Greg Kroah-Hartman
2018-10-20 13:50 ` [PATCH 2/7] Code of Conduct Interpretation: Add document explaining how the Code of Conduct is to be interpreted Greg Kroah-Hartman
2018-10-20 13:50 ` [PATCH 3/7] Code of Conduct Interpretation: Properly reference the TAB correctly Greg Kroah-Hartman
2018-10-20 13:50 ` [PATCH 4/7] Code of Conduct: Provide links between the two documents Greg Kroah-Hartman
2018-10-20 13:50 ` [PATCH 5/7] Code of Conduct Interpretation: Put in the proper URL for the committee Greg Kroah-Hartman
2018-10-20 19:01   ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2018-10-21  7:18     ` [Ksummit-discuss] " Greg KH
2018-10-20 13:51 ` [PATCH 6/7] Code of Conduct: Change the contact email address Greg Kroah-Hartman
2018-10-20 18:28   ` Alan Cox
2018-10-20 18:45     ` [Ksummit-discuss] " Trond Myklebust
2018-10-20 19:14       ` jonsmirl
2018-10-21  8:27         ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2018-10-21  9:23           ` Greg KH
2018-10-20 19:24     ` Tim.Bird
2018-10-20 20:07       ` Trond Myklebust
2018-10-21  0:13       ` Alan Cox
2018-10-21  6:19         ` Thomas Gleixner
2018-10-20 20:13     ` James Bottomley
2018-10-20 13:51 ` [PATCH 7/7] MAINTAINERS: Add an entry for the code of conduct Greg Kroah-Hartman
2018-10-21 21:20 ` Call to Action Re: [PATCH 0/7] Code of Conduct: Fix some wording, and add an interpretation document NeilBrown
2018-10-21 22:26   ` [Ksummit-discuss] " Josh Triplett
2018-10-21 23:37     ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2018-10-23  1:44       ` NeilBrown
2018-10-22 20:26     ` NeilBrown
2018-10-22 22:46       ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2018-10-23  1:31         ` NeilBrown
2018-10-23  6:26         ` Dan Carpenter
2018-10-23  6:40           ` Al Viro
2018-10-23  6:46             ` Dan Carpenter
2018-10-23  3:31       ` Al Viro
2018-10-23  4:25         ` NeilBrown
2018-10-23  4:52           ` Al Viro
2018-10-23  5:28             ` NeilBrown
2018-10-23  6:00               ` Al Viro
2018-10-23 20:45                 ` NeilBrown
2018-10-23  8:11           ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2018-10-23 14:22             ` Rainer Fiebig
2018-10-23 15:43               ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2018-10-23 17:51                 ` Rainer Fiebig
2018-10-23 21:14             ` NeilBrown
2018-10-24 12:16       ` Josh Triplett
2018-10-25 21:14         ` NeilBrown
2018-10-27  1:10           ` Josh Triplett
2018-10-28 21:48             ` NeilBrown
2018-11-01 16:45             ` Paul E. McKenney
2018-11-01 21:11               ` Josh Triplett
2018-11-02 13:13                 ` Paul E. McKenney
2018-11-01 21:50               ` NeilBrown
2018-11-02 13:33                 ` Paul E. McKenney
2018-11-03  8:36                   ` NeilBrown
2018-11-03 17:37                     ` Paul E. McKenney
2018-11-03 21:06                       ` NeilBrown
2018-11-03 22:23                         ` Paul E. McKenney
2018-11-02 13:52                 ` James Bottomley
2018-11-03  9:19                   ` Eric S. Raymond
2018-11-04 10:35         ` Geert Uytterhoeven [this message]
2018-10-21 22:33   ` Joe Perches
2018-10-21 22:37     ` Randy Dunlap
2018-10-22  9:09   ` Rainer Fiebig
2018-10-22 11:02   ` [Ksummit-discuss] " James Bottomley
2018-10-24  8:49   ` Laura Abbott
2018-10-25  7:56     ` The linux devs can rescind their license grant visionsofalice
2018-10-25  8:19       ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2018-10-25 19:39         ` Eric S. Raymond
2018-10-25 20:47           ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2018-10-25 21:41             ` Eric S. Raymond
2018-10-25 22:12               ` NeilBrown
2018-10-25 22:38                 ` Eric S. Raymond
2018-10-25 22:52                   ` NeilBrown
2018-11-04 10:47                 ` [Ksummit-discuss] " Geert Uytterhoeven
2018-10-25 23:06               ` Al Viro
2018-10-26  2:28                 ` Eric S. Raymond
2018-10-26  5:49                   ` Al Viro
2018-10-27  6:52                 ` visionsofalice
2018-10-27  7:32                   ` Al Viro
2018-10-27 16:18                     ` [Ksummit-discuss] " Tim.Bird
2018-10-27 22:09                       ` Jiri Kosina
     [not found]                         ` <CAK2MWOtNUTjWy5pTcGco5DNurqNCc=9CfDJ-Ko-K+6HDC55ikg@mail.gmail.com>
2018-10-27 23:07                           ` Eric S. Raymond
2018-10-27 23:40                           ` Al Viro
2018-10-28 21:13                         ` NeilBrown
2018-10-25 23:32             ` Iván Chavero
2018-10-26 13:15           ` Eben Moglen
2018-10-26 15:50             ` Eric S. Raymond
2018-10-26 15:53               ` Eben Moglen
2018-10-26 17:32             ` visionsofalice
2018-10-26 18:31               ` Eben Moglen
2018-10-27  7:12                 ` visionsofalice
2018-12-18 18:53                 ` The linux devs can rescind their license grant. - Analysis published? visionsofalice
2018-10-26 10:34         ` The linux devs can rescind their license grant visionsofalice
2018-10-29 22:31         ` Bradley M. Kuhn
2018-12-18 19:17           ` visionsofalice
2018-10-27  5:04       ` The linux devs can rescind their license grant. - Additional restrictive terms visionsofalice
2018-12-18 20:55       ` The CoC regime is a License violation " visionsofalice
2018-12-19  1:17       ` visionsofalice
2018-12-23 16:05       ` visionsofalice
2018-10-25 22:02     ` Call to Action Re: [PATCH 0/7] Code of Conduct: Fix some wording, and add an interpretation document NeilBrown
2018-10-25  8:06   ` Pavel Machek
2018-10-25 11:20   ` Rainer Fiebig
2018-10-25 22:18     ` NeilBrown
2018-10-26  8:33       ` Rainer Fiebig
2018-10-26 22:40         ` NeilBrown
2018-10-27 11:49           ` Rainer Fiebig
2018-10-21 23:36 ` Eric S. Raymond

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