[RFC] Question about async TLB flush and KVM pv tlb improvements

[RFC] Question about async TLB flush and KVM pv tlb improvements

[何容光(邦采)]

Hi there,

I saw this async TLB flush patch at https://lore.kernel.org/patchwork/patch/1082481/ , and I am wondering after one year, do you think if this patch is practical or there are functional flaws?
From my POV, Nadav's patch seems has no obvious flaw. But I am not familiar about the relationship between CPU's speculation exec and stale TLB, since it's usually transparent from programing. In which condition would machine check occurs? Is there some reference I can learn?
BTW, I am trying to improve kvm pv tlb flush that if a vCPU is preempted, as initiating CPU is not sending IPI to and waiting for the preempted vCPU, when the preempted vCPU is resuming, I want the VMM to inject an interrupt, perhaps NMI, to the vCPU and letting vCPU flush TLB instead of flush TLB for the vCPU, in case the vCPU is not in kernel mode or disabled interrupt, otherwise stick to VMM flush. Since VMM flush using INVVPID would flush all TLB of all PCID thus has some negative performance impacting on the preempted vCPU. So is there same problem as the async TLB flush patch?
Thanks in advance.

Re: [RFC] Question about async TLB flush and KVM pv tlb improvements

[Wanpeng Li]

On Tue, 25 Feb 2020 at 12:12, 何容光(邦采) <bangcai.hrg@alibaba-inc.com> wrote:
>
> Hi there,
>
> I saw this async TLB flush patch at https://lore.kernel.org/patchwork/patch/1082481/ , and I am wondering after one year, do you think if this patch is practical or there are functional flaws?
> From my POV, Nadav's patch seems has no obvious flaw. But I am not familiar about the relationship between CPU's speculation exec and stale TLB, since it's usually transparent from programing. In which condition would machine check occurs? Is there some reference I can learn?
> BTW, I am trying to improve kvm pv tlb flush that if a vCPU is preempted, as initiating CPU is not sending IPI to and waiting for the preempted vCPU, when the preempted vCPU is resuming, I want the VMM to inject an interrupt, perhaps NMI, to the vCPU and letting vCPU flush TLB instead of flush TLB for the vCPU, in case the vCPU is not in kernel mode or disabled interrupt, otherwise stick to VMM flush. Since VMM flush using INVVPID would flush all TLB of all PCID thus has some negative performance impacting on the preempted vCPU. So is there same problem as the async TLB flush patch?

PV TLB Shootdown is disabled in dedicated scenario, I believe there
are already heavy tlb misses in overcommit scenarios before this
feature, so flush all TLB associated with one specific VPID will not
worse that much.

    Wanpeng

回复：[RFC] Question about async TLB flush and KVM pv tlb improvements

[何容光(邦采)]

>> On Feb 24, 2020, at 8:12 PM, 何容光(邦采) <bangcai.hrg@alibaba-inc.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi there,
>> 
>> I saw this async TLB flush patch at
>> https://lore.kernel.org/patchwork/patch/1082481/ , and I am wondering
>> after one year, do you think if this patch is practical or there are
>> functional flaws? From my POV, Nadav's patch seems has no obvious flaw.
>> But I am not familiar about the relationship between CPU's speculation
>> exec and stale TLB, since it's usually transparent from programing. In
>> which condition would machine check occurs? Is there some reference I can
>> learn?

> I was/am held back by personal issues that consume my free time, which
> prevented me from sending a new version so far.

Good to hear that :)

> As for the patch-set - the greatest benefit in performance comes from
> running local/remote TLB flushes concurrently, and I will respin another
> version of that in two weeks time. I will send the async flushes afterwards.

In non-overcommitment virtualization environment, I think this will be 
beneficial. Since the async implementation still need remote CPU’s IPI 
response, pv tlb flush can address this scenario’s need.

Do you have any reference about relationship between CPU's speculation
and stale TLB, especially causing machine check? I want to learn about this, 
thanks.

回复：[RFC] Question about async TLB flush and KVM pv tlb improvements

[何容光(邦采)]

> On Tue, 25 Feb 2020 at 12:12, 何容光(邦采) <bangcai.hrg@alibaba-inc.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hi there,
>>
>> I saw this async TLB flush patch at https://lore.kernel.org/patchwork/patch/1082481/ , and I am wondering after one year, do you think if this patch is practical or there are functional flaws?
>> From my POV, Nadav's patch seems has no obvious flaw. But I am not familiar about the relationship between CPU's speculation exec and stale TLB, since it's usually transparent from programing. In which condition would machine check occurs? Is there some reference I can learn?
>> BTW, I am trying to improve kvm pv tlb flush that if a vCPU is preempted, as initiating CPU is not sending IPI to and waiting for the preempted vCPU, when the preempted vCPU is resuming, I want the VMM to inject an interrupt, perhaps NMI, to the vCPU and letting vCPU flush TLB instead of flush TLB for the vCPU, in case the vCPU is not in kernel mode or disabled interrupt, otherwise stick to VMM flush. Since VMM flush using INVVPID would flush all TLB of all PCID thus has some negative performance impacting on the preempted vCPU. So is there same problem as the async TLB flush patch?

> PV TLB Shootdown is disabled in dedicated scenario, I believe there
> are already heavy tlb misses in overcommit scenarios before this
> feature, so flush all TLB associated with one specific VPID will not
> worse that much.

If vcpus running on one pcpu is limited to a few, from my test, there 
can still be some beneficial. Especially if we can move all the logic to
VMM eliminating waiting of IPI, however correctness of functionally 
is a concern. This is also why I found Nadav's patch, do you have 
any advice on this?

Re: [RFC] Question about async TLB flush and KVM pv tlb improvements

[Wanpeng Li]

On Tue, 25 Feb 2020 at 15:53, 何容光(邦采) <bangcai.hrg@alibaba-inc.com> wrote:
>
> > On Tue, 25 Feb 2020 at 12:12, 何容光(邦采) <bangcai.hrg@alibaba-inc.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> Hi there,
> >>
> >> I saw this async TLB flush patch at https://lore.kernel.org/patchwork/patch/1082481/ , and I am wondering after one year, do you think if this patch is practical or there are functional flaws?
> >> From my POV, Nadav's patch seems has no obvious flaw. But I am not familiar about the relationship between CPU's speculation exec and stale TLB, since it's usually transparent from programing. In which condition would machine check occurs? Is there some reference I can learn?
> >> BTW, I am trying to improve kvm pv tlb flush that if a vCPU is preempted, as initiating CPU is not sending IPI to and waiting for the preempted vCPU, when the preempted vCPU is resuming, I want the VMM to inject an interrupt, perhaps NMI, to the vCPU and letting vCPU flush TLB instead of flush TLB for the vCPU, in case the vCPU is not in kernel mode or disabled interrupt, otherwise stick to VMM flush. Since VMM flush using INVVPID would flush all TLB of all PCID thus has some negative performance impacting on the preempted vCPU. So is there same problem as the async TLB flush patch?
>
> > PV TLB Shootdown is disabled in dedicated scenario, I believe there
> > are already heavy tlb misses in overcommit scenarios before this
> > feature, so flush all TLB associated with one specific VPID will not
> > worse that much.
>
> If vcpus running on one pcpu is limited to a few, from my test, there
> can still be some beneficial. Especially if we can move all the logic to

Unless the vCPU is preempted.

> VMM eliminating waiting of IPI, however correctness of functionally
> is a concern. This is also why I found Nadav's patch, do you have
> any advice on this?

Re: [RFC] Question about async TLB flush and KVM pv tlb improvements

[He Rongguang]

在 2020/2/25 16:41, Wanpeng Li 写道:
> On Tue, 25 Feb 2020 at 15:53, 何容光(邦采) <bangcai.hrg@alibaba-inc.com> wrote:
>>> On Tue, 25 Feb 2020 at 12:12, 何容光(邦采) <bangcai.hrg@alibaba-inc.com> wrote:
>>>> Hi there,
>>>>
>>>> I saw this async TLB flush patch at https://lore.kernel.org/patchwork/patch/1082481/ , and I am wondering after one year, do you think if this patch is practical or there are functional flaws?
>>>>  From my POV, Nadav's patch seems has no obvious flaw. But I am not familiar about the relationship between CPU's speculation exec and stale TLB, since it's usually transparent from programing. In which condition would machine check occurs? Is there some reference I can learn?
>>>> BTW, I am trying to improve kvm pv tlb flush that if a vCPU is preempted, as initiating CPU is not sending IPI to and waiting for the preempted vCPU, when the preempted vCPU is resuming, I want the VMM to inject an interrupt, perhaps NMI, to the vCPU and letting vCPU flush TLB instead of flush TLB for the vCPU, in case the vCPU is not in kernel mode or disabled interrupt, otherwise stick to VMM flush. Since VMM flush using INVVPID would flush all TLB of all PCID thus has some negative performance impacting on the preempted vCPU. So is there same problem as the async TLB flush patch?
>>> PV TLB Shootdown is disabled in dedicated scenario, I believe there
>>> are already heavy tlb misses in overcommit scenarios before this
>>> feature, so flush all TLB associated with one specific VPID will not
>>> worse that much.
>> If vcpus running on one pcpu is limited to a few, from my test, there
>> can still be some beneficial. Especially if we can move all the logic to
> Unless the vCPU is preempted.

Correct, in fact I am using a no-IPI-in-VM approch, that's why I am 
asking about the

async approch.

>> VMM eliminating waiting of IPI, however correctness of functionally
>> is a concern. This is also why I found Nadav's patch, do you have
>> any advice on this?