MOST(Media Oriented Systems Transport) Interface?

MOST(Media Oriented Systems Transport) Interface?

[Robin Getz]

Does anyone have a pointer for a MOST (Media Oriented Systems Transport) driver?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Media_Oriented_Systems_Transport

I have seen announcements of Linux systems that support MOST:

http://linuxdevices.com/news/NS2586090082.html

But I have not seen the driver architecture, or the protocol that people are running on them...

Any pointers? 

-Robin

Re: MOST(Media Oriented Systems Transport) Interface?

[Stephen Hemminger]

On Fri, 23 Feb 2007 18:26:30 -0500
Robin Getz <rgetz@blackfin.uclinux.org> wrote:

> Does anyone have a pointer for a MOST (Media Oriented Systems Transport) driver?
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Media_Oriented_Systems_Transport
> 
> I have seen announcements of Linux systems that support MOST:
> 
> http://linuxdevices.com/news/NS2586090082.html
> 
> But I have not seen the driver architecture, or the protocol that people are running on them...

Oh boy, yet another proprietary protocol stack. 

-- 
Stephen Hemminger <shemminger@linux-foundation.org>

Re: MOST(Media Oriented Systems Transport) Interface?

[Rik van Riel]

Robin Getz wrote:
> Does anyone have a pointer for a MOST (Media Oriented Systems Transport) driver?

Are there any applications that use that protocol?

Specifically, any applications worth caring about?

-- 
Politics is the struggle between those who want to make their country
the best in the world, and those who believe it already is.  Each group
calls the other unpatriotic.

Re: MOST(Media Oriented Systems Transport) Interface?

[Robin Getz]

On Fri 23 Feb 2007 20:47, Rik van Riel wrote:
> Robin Getz wrote:
> > Does anyone have a pointer for a MOST (Media Oriented Systems Transport) driver?
> 
> Are there any applications that use that protocol?

Many - all automotive embedded - If you drive a recent car - from Audi, Aston Martin, Ford, BMW, Honda, Hyundai/Kia, DaimlerChrysler, Jaguar, Land Rover, Nissan, Porsche, Toyota, Volvo, or VW - you may be using it today.

> Specifically, any applications worth caring about?

Again - depends on who you are. If you are one of the above - yes, you care allot. If you are a enthusiast you wants low level access to entertainment system in your car - then you care too.

It is like asking if I should care about applications using 100Base-T - as a user - I just want it to work and I only care when it doesn't work; as a driver developer - I care alot, but am agnostic to the application.


I found a spec that says MOST runs IP - 

http://www.mostcooperation.com/downloads/Specifications/MOST%20Specifications/MAMAC%20Specification

but thought I would ask if anyone else has any public work about the non-IP protocols. 

For those that might care, full spec is at:

http://www.mostcooperation.com/downloads/Specifications/MOST%20Specifications/MOSTSpecification.pdf

-Robin

Re: MOST(Media Oriented Systems Transport) Interface?

[Jan Kiszka]

Robin Getz wrote:
> Does anyone have a pointer for a MOST (Media Oriented Systems Transport) driver?
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Media_Oriented_Systems_Transport
> 
> I have seen announcements of Linux systems that support MOST:
> 
> http://linuxdevices.com/news/NS2586090082.html
> 
> But I have not seen the driver architecture, or the protocol that people are running on them...
> 
> Any pointers? 

The were some rumours earlier, but now I actually stumbled over the
release - and recalled this thread.

This might be what you are looking for:

http://most4linux.sourceforge.net/

Jan

Re: MOST(Media Oriented Systems Transport) Interface?

[Bernhard Walle]

Hello,

* Jan Kiszka <jan.kiszka@web.de> [2007-03-01 00:22]:
> Robin Getz wrote:
> > Does anyone have a pointer for a MOST (Media Oriented Systems Transport) driver?
> > 
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Media_Oriented_Systems_Transport
> > 
> > I have seen announcements of Linux systems that support MOST:
> > 
> > http://linuxdevices.com/news/NS2586090082.html
> > 
> > But I have not seen the driver architecture, or the protocol that people are running on them...
> > 
> > Any pointers? 
> 
> The were some rumours earlier, but now I actually stumbled over the
> release - and recalled this thread.

Quite interesting that you found it. It was released yesterday, and I
wanted to write an announcement in a few days, at least at the Xenomai
lists. Anyway ...

> This might be what you are looking for:
> 
> http://most4linux.sourceforge.net/

Yes, that's a MOST driver for a OS 8604 PCI interface that I wrote as
Diploma Thesis at Siemens. It was relased as OpenSource just now.

It only supports synchronous data transfer. The Most NetServices are
in userspace. There's a OpenSource demonstration available, but no
full NetServices implementation. You can buy a license from SMC or use
the specification to re-write an OSS implementation. However, that's
all userspace, so no GPL problem here. :)

I must say that it was more a demonstration how a Linux driver could
be ported to real-time Linux extension than a real productive working
MOST driver for Linux.

Well, but of course, it works. At least it did in my environement
(i386/single-CPU).

You can find more information on the homepage ...



Regards,
Bernhard

PS: SUSE has nothing to do with that driver, I only write with my SUSE
address because I don't want to re-subscribe because of one mail.

Re: MOST(Media Oriented Systems Transport) Interface?

[Bernhard Walle]

* Bernhard Walle <bernhard.walle@gmx.de> [2007-03-01 01:11]:
> * Jan Kiszka <jan.kiszka@web.de> [2007-03-01 00:22]:
> > Robin Getz wrote:
> > > Does anyone have a pointer for a MOST (Media Oriented Systems Transport) driver?
> > > 
> > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Media_Oriented_Systems_Transport
> > > 
> > > I have seen announcements of Linux systems that support MOST:
> > > 
> > > http://linuxdevices.com/news/NS2586090082.html

Just want to add that this implementation cannot be related to
http://most4linux.sourceforge.net/.

Regards,
Bernhard

Re: MOST(Media Oriented Systems Transport) Interface?

[Bernhard Walle]

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* Bernhard Walle <bernhard.walle@gmx.de> [2007-03-01 01:11]:
> PS: SUSE has nothing to do with that driver, I only write with my SUSE
> address because I don't want to re-subscribe because of one mail.

Interesting, because it was addressed to my gmx address in CC, Mutt
automatically choosed my gmx address, and it seems that everybody can
post to linux-kernel, even unsubscribed users. I didn't know that.


Regards,
Bernhard

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Re: MOST(Media Oriented Systems Transport) Interface?

[Robin Getz]

On Wed 28 Feb 2007 19:11, Bernhard Walle pondered:
> * Jan Kiszka <jan.kiszka@web.de> [2007-03-01 00:22]:
> > This might be what you are looking for:
> >
> > http://most4linux.sourceforge.net/

That's it - thanks for the pointer & Bernhard - thanks for the work.

What is the plan for this? It looks like you did the work on 2.6.14, what is 
the plan going forward? Is this something that you or anyone else wants to 
maintain/support newer devices on?

> It only supports synchronous data transfer. The Most NetServices are
> in userspace. There's a OpenSource demonstration available, but no
> full NetServices implementation. You can buy a license from SMC or use
> the specification to re-write an OSS implementation. However, that's
> all userspace, so no GPL problem here. :)

Is there any effort on making an open source NetServices implementation?

Thanks
-Robin

Re: MOST(Media Oriented Systems Transport) Interface?

[Hillier, Gernot]

Hi!

Am Donnerstag, 1. März 2007 16:16 schrieb Robin Getz:
> > > http://most4linux.sourceforge.net/
>
> That's it - thanks for the pointer & Bernhard - thanks for the work.
>
> What is the plan for this? It looks like you did the work on 2.6.14, what
> is the plan going forward? Is this something that you or anyone else wants
> to maintain/support newer devices on?

Ok, that's perhaps the point for me to step in. I supervised the thesis of 
Bernhard within our Embedded Linux group at Siemens CT SE 2.

Unfortunately, we currently don't plan doing further enhancements to this 
driver like porting it to other hardware. It was more or less an unplanned 
result of a thesis to show ways how to port drivers to a realtime extension - 
and as it was indeed a very good and usable result (thanks to Bernhard 
again!), we decided to open source it in the hope it might be useful.

However, if a real user community forms around the project, we might rethink 
this decision. However I can't promise anything...

> > It only supports synchronous data transfer. The Most NetServices are
> > in userspace. There's a OpenSource demonstration available, but no
> > full NetServices implementation. You can buy a license from SMC or use
> > the specification to re-write an OSS implementation. However, that's
> > all userspace, so no GPL problem here. :)
>
> Is there any effort on making an open source NetServices implementation?

No, definitely not. You can make basic usage of the package without 
NetServices (we provide small examples which don't need NetServices), but for 
real-world product usage you might still need to buy a NetServices license 
from SMSC.

-- 
Bye,
Gernot Hillier

Siemens AG
CT SE 2

Re: MOST(Media Oriented Systems Transport) Interface?

[Stephen Hemminger]

On Thu, 1 Mar 2007 11:48:05 +0100
Bernhard Walle <bernhard.walle@gmx.de> wrote:

> * Bernhard Walle <bernhard.walle@gmx.de> [2007-03-01 01:11]:
> > * Jan Kiszka <jan.kiszka@web.de> [2007-03-01 00:22]:
> > > Robin Getz wrote:
> > > > Does anyone have a pointer for a MOST (Media Oriented Systems Transport) driver?
> > > > 
> > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Media_Oriented_Systems_Transport
> > > > 
> > > > I have seen announcements of Linux systems that support MOST:
> > > > 
> > > > http://linuxdevices.com/news/NS2586090082.html
> 
> Just want to add that this implementation cannot be related to
> http://most4linux.sourceforge.net/.
> 

Great, looks good

-- 
Stephen Hemminger <shemminger@linux-foundation.org>

Re: MOST(Media Oriented Systems Transport) Interface?

[Bernhard Walle]

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Hello,

* Robin Getz <rgetz@blackfin.uclinux.org> [2007-03-01 16:16]:
> On Wed 28 Feb 2007 19:11, Bernhard Walle pondered:
> > * Jan Kiszka <jan.kiszka@web.de> [2007-03-01 00:22]:
> > > This might be what you are looking for:
> > >
> > > http://most4linux.sourceforge.net/
> 
> That's it - thanks for the pointer & Bernhard - thanks for the work.
> 
> What is the plan for this? It looks like you did the work on 2.6.14, what is 
> the plan going forward? Is this something that you or anyone else wants to 
> maintain/support newer devices on?

Most testing was done on 2.6.16. It definitively works with 2.6.17. I
just fixed it a few days ago to compile on 2.6.21 (ALSA was changed a
bit ;)). For the other statements, Gernot Hillier jumped in ...

> > It only supports synchronous data transfer. The Most NetServices are
> > in userspace. There's a OpenSource demonstration available, but no
> > full NetServices implementation. You can buy a license from SMC or use
> > the specification to re-write an OSS implementation. However, that's
> > all userspace, so no GPL problem here. :)
> 
> Is there any effort on making an open source NetServices implementation?

BTW: There _are_ patents on MOST, I think mostly NetServices, so it
might be difficult. :( But IANAL.


Regards,
Bernhard
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