[Qemu-devel] Virtualization project idea

[Qemu-devel] Virtualization project idea

[Dhananjay Goel]

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Hi there!

First I'd like to say that QEMU plaform is really cool and awesome.

I'm an engineering student and is searching for a feasible project in
virtualization. I'd like to know if its possible to share USB devices (flash
drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc) across guests and host (VMs). Also,
do you have any idea to extend it? Or any innovative idea so that we can
implement it.

I'd appreciate any help. Thanks in advance.

Best,
Dhananjay

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Virtualization project idea

[Dhananjay Goel]

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Hi there!

First I'd like to say that XEN plaform is really cool and awesome.

I'm an engineering student and is searching for a feasible project in
virtualization. I'd like to know if its possible to share USB devices (flash
drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc) across guests and host (VMs). Also,
do you have any idea to extend it? Or any innovative idea so that we can
implement it.

I'd appreciate any help. Thanks in advance.

Best,
Dhananjay

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Re: Virtualization project idea

[Pasi Kärkkäinen]

On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 12:14:12AM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>    Hi there!
>    First I'd like to say that XEN plaform is really cool and awesome.
>    I'm an engineering student and is searching for a feasible project in
>    virtualization. I'd like to know if its possible to share USB devices
>    (flash drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc) across guests and host
>    (VMs). Also, do you have any idea to extend it? Or any innovative idea so
>    that we can implement it.
>    I'd appreciate any help. Thanks in advance.
> 

Hello,

Take a look at: http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough

There's actually a project related to Xen pvusb that would need some help..
ie. porting the pvusb code to the recent pvops kernel, more info here: 
http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenDevelopmentProjects

It would be great if you could work on porting the drivers!

-- Pasi

RE: Virtualization project idea

[James Harper]

> Hi there!
> 
> First I'd like to say that XEN plaform is really cool and awesome.
> 
> I'm an engineering student and is searching for a feasible project in
> virtualization. I'd like to know if its possible to share USB devices
(flash
> drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc) across guests and host (VMs).
Also, do
> you have any idea to extend it? Or any innovative idea so that we can
> implement it.
> 
> I'd appreciate any help. Thanks in advance.
> 

Further to what Pasi said, I have partially ported the backend interface
and can hand you the code if you want. It's probable a bit stale vs the
current kernels and leaks memory under some circumstances but is
probably better than starting from scratch.

James

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Dhananjay Goel]

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Hi James/Pasi,

I had a look at http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough

<http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough>But I'm not sure if it
supports sharing USB devices across VMs (host and guest) i.e. if I plug in a
flash drive then it would detect in both host and guest and I'd be able edit
files from all VMs rather than mounting and unmounting everytime from 1 VM
to other.

Please let me know your thoughts on it.

Thanks,
Dhananjay


On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:28 AM, James Harper <james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> wrote:

> > Hi there!
> >
> > First I'd like to say that XEN plaform is really cool and awesome.
> >
> > I'm an engineering student and is searching for a feasible project in
> > virtualization. I'd like to know if its possible to share USB devices
> (flash
> > drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc) across guests and host (VMs).
> Also, do
> > you have any idea to extend it? Or any innovative idea so that we can
> > implement it.
> >
> > I'd appreciate any help. Thanks in advance.
> >
>
> Further to what Pasi said, I have partially ported the backend interface
> and can hand you the code if you want. It's probable a bit stale vs the
> current kernels and leaks memory under some circumstances but is
> probably better than starting from scratch.
>
> James
>

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Re: Virtualization project idea

[Pasi Kärkkäinen]

On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 01:37:49PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>    Hi James/Pasi,
>    I had a look at [1]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>    But I'm not sure if it supports sharing USB devices across VMs (host and
>    guest) i.e. if I plug in a flash drive then it would detect in both host
>    and guest and I'd be able edit files from all VMs rather than mounting and
>    unmounting everytime from 1 VM to other.
>    Please let me know your thoughts on it.
>

No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for direct passthru to one/single vm.
You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot) to make such sharing possible.

-- Pasi

>    Thanks,
>    Dhananjay
> 
>    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:28 AM, James Harper
>    <[2]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au> wrote:
> 
>      > Hi there!
>      >
>      > First I'd like to say that XEN plaform is really cool and awesome.
>      >
>      > I'm an engineering student and is searching for a feasible project in
>      > virtualization. I'd like to know if its possible to share USB devices
>      (flash
>      > drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc) across guests and host (VMs).
>      Also, do
>      > you have any idea to extend it? Or any innovative idea so that we can
>      > implement it.
>      >
>      > I'd appreciate any help. Thanks in advance.
>      >
> 
>      Further to what Pasi said, I have partially ported the backend interface
>      and can hand you the code if you want. It's probable a bit stale vs the
>      current kernels and leaks memory under some circumstances but is
>      probably better than starting from scratch.
>      James
> 
> References
> 
>    Visible links
>    1. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>    2. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Dhananjay Goel]

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No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for direct passthru to
one/single vm.
You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot) to make such sharing
possible.

*Comments: *Is it possible to share USB keyboard, USB mouse, USB modem, etc
across VMs i.e host and guest(s)? If we connect USB keyboard, is it possible
to use it in guests?

Also, is it possible for us to modify the device driver of USB 2.0 so that
all USB 2.0 devices are visible and can be used across all VMs? Please
suggest.

Thanks,
Dhananjay


On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:16 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen <pasik@iki.fi> wrote:

> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 01:37:49PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> >    Hi James/Pasi,
> >    I had a look at [1]
> http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >    But I'm not sure if it supports sharing USB devices across VMs (host
> and
> >    guest) i.e. if I plug in a flash drive then it would detect in both
> host
> >    and guest and I'd be able edit files from all VMs rather than mounting
> and
> >    unmounting everytime from 1 VM to other.
> >    Please let me know your thoughts on it.
> >
>
> No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for direct passthru to
> one/single vm.
> You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot) to make such sharing
> possible.
>
> -- Pasi
>
> >    Thanks,
> >    Dhananjay
> >
> >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:28 AM, James Harper
> >    <[2]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au> wrote:
> >
> >      > Hi there!
> >      >
> >      > First I'd like to say that XEN plaform is really cool and awesome.
> >      >
> >      > I'm an engineering student and is searching for a feasible project
> in
> >      > virtualization. I'd like to know if its possible to share USB
> devices
> >      (flash
> >      > drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc) across guests and host
> (VMs).
> >      Also, do
> >      > you have any idea to extend it? Or any innovative idea so that we
> can
> >      > implement it.
> >      >
> >      > I'd appreciate any help. Thanks in advance.
> >      >
> >
> >      Further to what Pasi said, I have partially ported the backend
> interface
> >      and can hand you the code if you want. It's probable a bit stale vs
> the
> >      current kernels and leaks memory under some circumstances but is
> >      probably better than starting from scratch.
> >      James
> >
> > References
> >
> >    Visible links
> >    1. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >    2. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>

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_______________________________________________
Xen-devel mailing list
Xen-devel@lists.xensource.com
http://lists.xensource.com/xen-devel

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Pasi Kärkkäinen]

On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:45:12PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>    No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for direct passthru to
>    one/single vm.
>    You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot) to make such sharing
>    possible.
>    Comments: Is it possible to share USB keyboard, USB mouse, USB modem, etc
>    across VMs i.e host and guest(s)? If we connect USB keyboard, is it
>    possible to use it in guests?
>

This is implemented in XCI (Xen Client Initiative), and there has been
some discussions how to get it traditional Xen, to help Xen VGA Passthrough usage.

See: http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough

>    Also, is it possible for us to modify the device driver of USB 2.0 so that
>    all USB 2.0 devices are visible and can be used across all VMs? Please
>    suggest.
> 

This won't be straight forward. Think about USB memory/flash stick.
If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to it, the filesystem
in it will get corrupted immediately!

USB Passthru cannot be used to 'share' devices, it's for giving one/single VM
direct access to the device.

-- Pasi

>    Thanks,
>    Dhananjay
> 
>    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:16 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen <[1]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> 
>      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 01:37:49PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>      >    Hi James/Pasi,
>      >    I had a look at
>      [1][2]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >    But I'm not sure if it supports sharing USB devices across VMs
>      (host and
>      >    guest) i.e. if I plug in a flash drive then it would detect in both
>      host
>      >    and guest and I'd be able edit files from all VMs rather than
>      mounting and
>      >    unmounting everytime from 1 VM to other.
>      >    Please let me know your thoughts on it.
>      >
> 
>      No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for direct passthru to
>      one/single vm.
>      You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot) to make such sharing
>      possible.
> 
>      -- Pasi
>      >    Thanks,
>      >    Dhananjay
>      >
>      >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:28 AM, James Harper
>      >    <[2][3]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au> wrote:
>      >
>      >      > Hi there!
>      >      >
>      >      > First I'd like to say that XEN plaform is really cool and
>      awesome.
>      >      >
>      >      > I'm an engineering student and is searching for a feasible
>      project in
>      >      > virtualization. I'd like to know if its possible to share USB
>      devices
>      >      (flash
>      >      > drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc) across guests and host
>      (VMs).
>      >      Also, do
>      >      > you have any idea to extend it? Or any innovative idea so that
>      we can
>      >      > implement it.
>      >      >
>      >      > I'd appreciate any help. Thanks in advance.
>      >      >
>      >
>      >      Further to what Pasi said, I have partially ported the backend
>      interface
>      >      and can hand you the code if you want. It's probable a bit stale
>      vs the
>      >      current kernels and leaks memory under some circumstances but is
>      >      probably better than starting from scratch.
>      >      James
>      >
>      > References
>      >
>      >    Visible links
>      >    1. [4]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >    2. mailto:[5]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> 
> References
> 
>    Visible links
>    1. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    2. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>    3. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>    4. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>    5. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au

Re: Virtualization project idea

[David Markey]

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Would USB over IP not be helpful here?

On 27 August 2010 10:19, Pasi Kärkkäinen <pasik@iki.fi> wrote:

> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:45:12PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> >    No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for direct passthru to
> >    one/single vm.
> >    You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot) to make such
> sharing
> >    possible.
> >    Comments: Is it possible to share USB keyboard, USB mouse, USB modem,
> etc
> >    across VMs i.e host and guest(s)? If we connect USB keyboard, is it
> >    possible to use it in guests?
> >
>
> This is implemented in XCI (Xen Client Initiative), and there has been
> some discussions how to get it traditional Xen, to help Xen VGA Passthrough
> usage.
>
> See: http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>
> >    Also, is it possible for us to modify the device driver of USB 2.0 so
> that
> >    all USB 2.0 devices are visible and can be used across all VMs? Please
> >    suggest.
> >
>
> This won't be straight forward. Think about USB memory/flash stick.
> If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to it, the filesystem
> in it will get corrupted immediately!
>
> USB Passthru cannot be used to 'share' devices, it's for giving one/single
> VM
> direct access to the device.
>
> -- Pasi
>
> >    Thanks,
> >    Dhananjay
> >
> >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:16 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen <[1]pasik@iki.fi>
> wrote:
> >
> >      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 01:37:49PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> >      >    Hi James/Pasi,
> >      >    I had a look at
> >      [1][2]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >    But I'm not sure if it supports sharing USB devices across VMs
> >      (host and
> >      >    guest) i.e. if I plug in a flash drive then it would detect in
> both
> >      host
> >      >    and guest and I'd be able edit files from all VMs rather than
> >      mounting and
> >      >    unmounting everytime from 1 VM to other.
> >      >    Please let me know your thoughts on it.
> >      >
> >
> >      No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for direct passthru to
> >      one/single vm.
> >      You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot) to make such
> sharing
> >      possible.
> >
> >      -- Pasi
> >      >    Thanks,
> >      >    Dhananjay
> >      >
> >      >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:28 AM, James Harper
> >      >    <[2][3]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au> wrote:
> >      >
> >      >      > Hi there!
> >      >      >
> >      >      > First I'd like to say that XEN plaform is really cool and
> >      awesome.
> >      >      >
> >      >      > I'm an engineering student and is searching for a feasible
> >      project in
> >      >      > virtualization. I'd like to know if its possible to share
> USB
> >      devices
> >      >      (flash
> >      >      > drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc) across guests and
> host
> >      (VMs).
> >      >      Also, do
> >      >      > you have any idea to extend it? Or any innovative idea so
> that
> >      we can
> >      >      > implement it.
> >      >      >
> >      >      > I'd appreciate any help. Thanks in advance.
> >      >      >
> >      >
> >      >      Further to what Pasi said, I have partially ported the
> backend
> >      interface
> >      >      and can hand you the code if you want. It's probable a bit
> stale
> >      vs the
> >      >      current kernels and leaks memory under some circumstances but
> is
> >      >      probably better than starting from scratch.
> >      >      James
> >      >
> >      > References
> >      >
> >      >    Visible links
> >      >    1. [4]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >    2. mailto:[5]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >
> > References
> >
> >    Visible links
> >    1. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    2. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >    3. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >    4. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >    5. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>
> _______________________________________________
> Xen-devel mailing list
> Xen-devel@lists.xensource.com
> http://lists.xensource.com/xen-devel
>

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Re: Virtualization project idea

[Pasi Kärkkäinen]

On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 10:20:44AM +0100, David Markey wrote:
>    Would USB over IP not be helpful here?
>

USB over IP is just another way of doing direct USB passthru,
it doesn't really allow sharing the devices.

-- Pasi

> 
>    On 27 August 2010 10:19, Pasi Kärkkäinen <[1]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> 
>      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:45:12PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>      >    No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for direct passthru to
>      >    one/single vm.
>      >    You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot) to make such
>      sharing
>      >    possible.
>      >    Comments: Is it possible to share USB keyboard, USB mouse, USB
>      modem, etc
>      >    across VMs i.e host and guest(s)? If we connect USB keyboard, is it
>      >    possible to use it in guests?
>      >
> 
>      This is implemented in XCI (Xen Client Initiative), and there has been
>      some discussions how to get it traditional Xen, to help Xen VGA
>      Passthrough usage.
> 
>      See: [2]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      >    Also, is it possible for us to modify the device driver of USB 2.0
>      so that
>      >    all USB 2.0 devices are visible and can be used across all VMs?
>      Please
>      >    suggest.
>      >
> 
>      This won't be straight forward. Think about USB memory/flash stick.
>      If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to it, the filesystem
>      in it will get corrupted immediately!
> 
>      USB Passthru cannot be used to 'share' devices, it's for giving
>      one/single VM
>      direct access to the device.
> 
>      -- Pasi
> 
>      >    Thanks,
>      >    Dhananjay
>      >
>      >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:16 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen
>      <[1][3]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
>      >
>      >      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 01:37:49PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>      >      >    Hi James/Pasi,
>      >      >    I had a look at
>      >      [1][2][4]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      >    But I'm not sure if it supports sharing USB devices across
>      VMs
>      >      (host and
>      >      >    guest) i.e. if I plug in a flash drive then it would detect
>      in both
>      >      host
>      >      >    and guest and I'd be able edit files from all VMs rather
>      than
>      >      mounting and
>      >      >    unmounting everytime from 1 VM to other.
>      >      >    Please let me know your thoughts on it.
>      >      >
>      >
>      >      No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for direct passthru
>      to
>      >      one/single vm.
>      >      You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot) to make such
>      sharing
>      >      possible.
>      >
>      >      -- Pasi
>      >      >    Thanks,
>      >      >    Dhananjay
>      >      >
>      >      >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:28 AM, James Harper
>      >      >    <[2][3][5]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au> wrote:
>      >      >
>      >      >      > Hi there!
>      >      >      >
>      >      >      > First I'd like to say that XEN plaform is really cool
>      and
>      >      awesome.
>      >      >      >
>      >      >      > I'm an engineering student and is searching for a
>      feasible
>      >      project in
>      >      >      > virtualization. I'd like to know if its possible to
>      share USB
>      >      devices
>      >      >      (flash
>      >      >      > drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc) across guests
>      and host
>      >      (VMs).
>      >      >      Also, do
>      >      >      > you have any idea to extend it? Or any innovative idea
>      so that
>      >      we can
>      >      >      > implement it.
>      >      >      >
>      >      >      > I'd appreciate any help. Thanks in advance.
>      >      >      >
>      >      >
>      >      >      Further to what Pasi said, I have partially ported the
>      backend
>      >      interface
>      >      >      and can hand you the code if you want. It's probable a bit
>      stale
>      >      vs the
>      >      >      current kernels and leaks memory under some circumstances
>      but is
>      >      >      probably better than starting from scratch.
>      >      >      James
>      >      >
>      >      > References
>      >      >
>      >      >    Visible links
>      >      >    1. [4][6]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      >    2. mailto:[5][7]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >
>      > References
>      >
>      >    Visible links
>      >    1. mailto:[8]pasik@iki.fi
>      >    2. [9]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >    3. mailto:[10]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >    4. [11]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >    5. mailto:[12]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> 
>      _______________________________________________
>      Xen-devel mailing list
>      [13]Xen-devel@lists.xensource.com
>      [14]http://lists.xensource.com/xen-devel
> 
> References
> 
>    Visible links
>    1. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    2. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>    3. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    4. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>    5. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>    6. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>    7. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>    8. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    9. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   10. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   11. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   12. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   13. mailto:Xen-devel@lists.xensource.com
>   14. http://lists.xensource.com/xen-devel

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Dhananjay Goel]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 4452 bytes --]

This won't be straight forward. Think about USB memory/flash stick.
If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to it, the filesystem
in it will get corrupted immediately!

--Why would it get corrupted immediately. Might be we can just lock a
specific file which is being edited? Please suggest.

Thanks,
Dhananjay


On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:49 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen <pasik@iki.fi> wrote:

> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:45:12PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> >    No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for direct passthru to
> >    one/single vm.
> >    You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot) to make such
> sharing
> >    possible.
> >    Comments: Is it possible to share USB keyboard, USB mouse, USB modem,
> etc
> >    across VMs i.e host and guest(s)? If we connect USB keyboard, is it
> >    possible to use it in guests?
> >
>
> This is implemented in XCI (Xen Client Initiative), and there has been
> some discussions how to get it traditional Xen, to help Xen VGA Passthrough
> usage.
>
> See: http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>
> >    Also, is it possible for us to modify the device driver of USB 2.0 so
> that
> >    all USB 2.0 devices are visible and can be used across all VMs? Please
> >    suggest.
> >
>
> This won't be straight forward. Think about USB memory/flash stick.
> If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to it, the filesystem
> in it will get corrupted immediately!
>
> USB Passthru cannot be used to 'share' devices, it's for giving one/single
> VM
> direct access to the device.
>
> -- Pasi
>
> >    Thanks,
> >    Dhananjay
> >
> >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:16 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen <[1]pasik@iki.fi>
> wrote:
> >
> >      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 01:37:49PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> >      >    Hi James/Pasi,
> >      >    I had a look at
> >      [1][2]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >    But I'm not sure if it supports sharing USB devices across VMs
> >      (host and
> >      >    guest) i.e. if I plug in a flash drive then it would detect in
> both
> >      host
> >      >    and guest and I'd be able edit files from all VMs rather than
> >      mounting and
> >      >    unmounting everytime from 1 VM to other.
> >      >    Please let me know your thoughts on it.
> >      >
> >
> >      No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for direct passthru to
> >      one/single vm.
> >      You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot) to make such
> sharing
> >      possible.
> >
> >      -- Pasi
> >      >    Thanks,
> >      >    Dhananjay
> >      >
> >      >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:28 AM, James Harper
> >      >    <[2][3]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au> wrote:
> >      >
> >      >      > Hi there!
> >      >      >
> >      >      > First I'd like to say that XEN plaform is really cool and
> >      awesome.
> >      >      >
> >      >      > I'm an engineering student and is searching for a feasible
> >      project in
> >      >      > virtualization. I'd like to know if its possible to share
> USB
> >      devices
> >      >      (flash
> >      >      > drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc) across guests and
> host
> >      (VMs).
> >      >      Also, do
> >      >      > you have any idea to extend it? Or any innovative idea so
> that
> >      we can
> >      >      > implement it.
> >      >      >
> >      >      > I'd appreciate any help. Thanks in advance.
> >      >      >
> >      >
> >      >      Further to what Pasi said, I have partially ported the
> backend
> >      interface
> >      >      and can hand you the code if you want. It's probable a bit
> stale
> >      vs the
> >      >      current kernels and leaks memory under some circumstances but
> is
> >      >      probably better than starting from scratch.
> >      >      James
> >      >
> >      > References
> >      >
> >      >    Visible links
> >      >    1. [4]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >    2. mailto:[5]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >
> > References
> >
> >    Visible links
> >    1. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    2. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >    3. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >    4. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >    5. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>

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Re: Virtualization project idea

[Dhananjay Goel]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 6824 bytes --]

 Would USB over IP not be helpful here?
>

USB over IP is just another way of doing direct USB passthru,
it doesn't really allow sharing the devices.

--Consider a use case: You are using your mobile for browsing internet on
PC. Your mobile device
acts a usb modem for the host machine. That can not be used in guest
for internet connectivity simuntaneously. You need to connect/disconnect
every time to access internet whereas it would have been seamless
internet connectivity.

Thanks,
Dhananjay


On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:53 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen <pasik@iki.fi> wrote:

> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 10:20:44AM +0100, David Markey wrote:
> >    Would USB over IP not be helpful here?
> >
>
> USB over IP is just another way of doing direct USB passthru,
> it doesn't really allow sharing the devices.
>
> -- Pasi
>
> >
> >    On 27 August 2010 10:19, Pasi Kärkkäinen <[1]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> >
> >      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:45:12PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> >      >    No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for direct
> passthru to
> >      >    one/single vm.
> >      >    You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot) to make
> such
> >      sharing
> >      >    possible.
> >      >    Comments: Is it possible to share USB keyboard, USB mouse, USB
> >      modem, etc
> >      >    across VMs i.e host and guest(s)? If we connect USB keyboard,
> is it
> >      >    possible to use it in guests?
> >      >
> >
> >      This is implemented in XCI (Xen Client Initiative), and there has
> been
> >      some discussions how to get it traditional Xen, to help Xen VGA
> >      Passthrough usage.
> >
> >      See: [2]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >      >    Also, is it possible for us to modify the device driver of USB
> 2.0
> >      so that
> >      >    all USB 2.0 devices are visible and can be used across all VMs?
> >      Please
> >      >    suggest.
> >      >
> >
> >      This won't be straight forward. Think about USB memory/flash stick.
> >      If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to it, the filesystem
> >      in it will get corrupted immediately!
> >
> >      USB Passthru cannot be used to 'share' devices, it's for giving
> >      one/single VM
> >      direct access to the device.
> >
> >      -- Pasi
> >
> >      >    Thanks,
> >      >    Dhananjay
> >      >
> >      >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:16 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen
> >      <[1][3]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> >      >
> >      >      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 01:37:49PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel
> wrote:
> >      >      >    Hi James/Pasi,
> >      >      >    I had a look at
> >      >      [1][2][4]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      >    But I'm not sure if it supports sharing USB devices
> across
> >      VMs
> >      >      (host and
> >      >      >    guest) i.e. if I plug in a flash drive then it would
> detect
> >      in both
> >      >      host
> >      >      >    and guest and I'd be able edit files from all VMs rather
> >      than
> >      >      mounting and
> >      >      >    unmounting everytime from 1 VM to other.
> >      >      >    Please let me know your thoughts on it.
> >      >      >
> >      >
> >      >      No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for direct
> passthru
> >      to
> >      >      one/single vm.
> >      >      You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot) to make
> such
> >      sharing
> >      >      possible.
> >      >
> >      >      -- Pasi
> >      >      >    Thanks,
> >      >      >    Dhananjay
> >      >      >
> >      >      >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:28 AM, James Harper
> >      >      >    <[2][3][5]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au> wrote:
> >      >      >
> >      >      >      > Hi there!
> >      >      >      >
> >      >      >      > First I'd like to say that XEN plaform is really
> cool
> >      and
> >      >      awesome.
> >      >      >      >
> >      >      >      > I'm an engineering student and is searching for a
> >      feasible
> >      >      project in
> >      >      >      > virtualization. I'd like to know if its possible to
> >      share USB
> >      >      devices
> >      >      >      (flash
> >      >      >      > drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc) across
> guests
> >      and host
> >      >      (VMs).
> >      >      >      Also, do
> >      >      >      > you have any idea to extend it? Or any innovative
> idea
> >      so that
> >      >      we can
> >      >      >      > implement it.
> >      >      >      >
> >      >      >      > I'd appreciate any help. Thanks in advance.
> >      >      >      >
> >      >      >
> >      >      >      Further to what Pasi said, I have partially ported the
> >      backend
> >      >      interface
> >      >      >      and can hand you the code if you want. It's probable a
> bit
> >      stale
> >      >      vs the
> >      >      >      current kernels and leaks memory under some
> circumstances
> >      but is
> >      >      >      probably better than starting from scratch.
> >      >      >      James
> >      >      >
> >      >      > References
> >      >      >
> >      >      >    Visible links
> >      >      >    1. [4][6]
> http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      >    2. mailto:[5][7]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >
> >      > References
> >      >
> >      >    Visible links
> >      >    1. mailto:[8]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >    2. [9]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >    3. mailto:[10]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >    4. [11]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >    5. mailto:[12]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >
> >      _______________________________________________
> >      Xen-devel mailing list
> >      [13]Xen-devel@lists.xensource.com
> >      [14]http://lists.xensource.com/xen-devel
> >
> > References
> >
> >    Visible links
> >    1. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    2. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >    3. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    4. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >    5. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >    6. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >    7. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >    8. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    9. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   10. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   11. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   12. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   13. mailto:Xen-devel@lists.xensource.com
> >   14. http://lists.xensource.com/xen-devel
>

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Re: Virtualization project idea

[Keir Fraser]

On 27/08/2010 10:25, "Dhananjay Goel" <dhananjaygoel123@gmail.com> wrote:

>  Would USB over IP not be helpful here?
>> 
> 
> USB over IP is just another way of doing direct USB passthru,
> it doesn't really allow sharing the devices.
> 
> --Consider a use case: You are using your mobile for browsing internet on PC.
> Your mobile device 
> acts a usb modem for the host machine. That can not be used in guest
> for internet connectivity simuntaneously. You need to connect/disconnect
> every time to access internet whereas it would have been seamless
> internet connectivity. 

You don't necessarily share network, disc, or mouse/keyboard at the USB
level. For network, as an example, the hardware device belongs to the host
which provides NATed or bridged networking to VMs. VMs see a virtual network
device rather than the underlying physical device. Similar principle applies
to other device classes -- VMs see a virtual device. If you want a VM to see
a property of a physical device that cannot be expressed in your virtual
device model, you pass that physical device through directly to that one VM.
If you want direct passthrough and some semblance of sharing between VMs...
that's harder to do.

 -- Keir

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Dhananjay Goel]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1510 bytes --]

On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 3:14 PM, Keir Fraser <keir.fraser@eu.citrix.com>wrote:

> On 27/08/2010 10:25, "Dhananjay Goel" <dhananjaygoel123@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >  Would USB over IP not be helpful here?
> >>
> >
> > USB over IP is just another way of doing direct USB passthru,
> > it doesn't really allow sharing the devices.
> >
> > --Consider a use case: You are using your mobile for browsing internet on
> PC.
> > Your mobile device
> > acts a usb modem for the host machine. That can not be used in guest
> > for internet connectivity simuntaneously. You need to connect/disconnect
> > every time to access internet whereas it would have been seamless
> > internet connectivity.
>
> You don't necessarily share network, disc, or mouse/keyboard at the USB
> level. For network, as an example, the hardware device belongs to the host
> which provides NATed or bridged networking to VMs. VMs see a virtual
> network
> device rather than the underlying physical device. Similar principle
> applies
> to other device classes -- VMs see a virtual device. If you want a VM to
> see
> a property of a physical device that cannot be expressed in your virtual
> device model, you pass that physical device through directly to that one
> VM.
> If you want direct passthrough and some semblance of sharing between VMs...
> that's harder to do.
>

I agree its difficult to do. But is it possible to do? Can we make such that
USB devices are shared across VMs? Any suggestion of how it can be done?

>
>  -- Keir
>
>
>

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Re: Virtualization project idea

[David Markey]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1810 bytes --]

I dont think so, I'm not sure there is anything in the USB protocol that
would allow this.

You would have to somehow have a lock, and allow only one VM access at a
time.

On 27 August 2010 10:48, Dhananjay Goel <dhananjaygoel123@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 3:14 PM, Keir Fraser <keir.fraser@eu.citrix.com>wrote:
>
>> On 27/08/2010 10:25, "Dhananjay Goel" <dhananjaygoel123@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> >  Would USB over IP not be helpful here?
>> >>
>> >
>> > USB over IP is just another way of doing direct USB passthru,
>> > it doesn't really allow sharing the devices.
>> >
>> > --Consider a use case: You are using your mobile for browsing internet
>> on PC.
>> > Your mobile device
>> > acts a usb modem for the host machine. That can not be used in guest
>> > for internet connectivity simuntaneously. You need to connect/disconnect
>> > every time to access internet whereas it would have been seamless
>> > internet connectivity.
>>
>> You don't necessarily share network, disc, or mouse/keyboard at the USB
>> level. For network, as an example, the hardware device belongs to the host
>> which provides NATed or bridged networking to VMs. VMs see a virtual
>> network
>> device rather than the underlying physical device. Similar principle
>> applies
>> to other device classes -- VMs see a virtual device. If you want a VM to
>> see
>> a property of a physical device that cannot be expressed in your virtual
>> device model, you pass that physical device through directly to that one
>> VM.
>> If you want direct passthrough and some semblance of sharing between
>> VMs...
>> that's harder to do.
>>
>
> I agree its difficult to do. But is it possible to do? Can we make such
> that USB devices are shared across VMs? Any suggestion of how it can be
> done?
>
>>
>>  -- Keir
>>
>>
>>
>

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Re: Virtualization project idea

[Dhananjay Goel]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 2173 bytes --]

Might be we can do it such that a file being accessed from USB has a lock in
a VM and release once we're done with the file. So, only one VM (at a time)
will have control on a file in USB device.

Thanks,
Dhananjay


On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 3:20 PM, David Markey <admin@dmarkey.com> wrote:

> I dont think so, I'm not sure there is anything in the USB protocol that
> would allow this.
>
> You would have to somehow have a lock, and allow only one VM access at a
> time.
>
>
> On 27 August 2010 10:48, Dhananjay Goel <dhananjaygoel123@gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 3:14 PM, Keir Fraser <keir.fraser@eu.citrix.com>wrote:
>>
>>> On 27/08/2010 10:25, "Dhananjay Goel" <dhananjaygoel123@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> >  Would USB over IP not be helpful here?
>>> >>
>>> >
>>> > USB over IP is just another way of doing direct USB passthru,
>>> > it doesn't really allow sharing the devices.
>>> >
>>> > --Consider a use case: You are using your mobile for browsing internet
>>> on PC.
>>> > Your mobile device
>>> > acts a usb modem for the host machine. That can not be used in guest
>>> > for internet connectivity simuntaneously. You need to
>>> connect/disconnect
>>> > every time to access internet whereas it would have been seamless
>>> > internet connectivity.
>>>
>>> You don't necessarily share network, disc, or mouse/keyboard at the USB
>>> level. For network, as an example, the hardware device belongs to the
>>> host
>>> which provides NATed or bridged networking to VMs. VMs see a virtual
>>> network
>>> device rather than the underlying physical device. Similar principle
>>> applies
>>> to other device classes -- VMs see a virtual device. If you want a VM to
>>> see
>>> a property of a physical device that cannot be expressed in your virtual
>>> device model, you pass that physical device through directly to that one
>>> VM.
>>> If you want direct passthrough and some semblance of sharing between
>>> VMs...
>>> that's harder to do.
>>>
>>
>> I agree its difficult to do. But is it possible to do? Can we make such
>> that USB devices are shared across VMs? Any suggestion of how it can be
>> done?
>>
>>>
>>>  -- Keir
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>

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Re: Virtualization project idea

[Keir Fraser]

On 27/08/2010 10:48, "Dhananjay Goel" <dhananjaygoel123@gmail.com> wrote:

>> You don't necessarily share network, disc, or mouse/keyboard at the USB
>> level. For network, as an example, the hardware device belongs to the host
>> which provides NATed or bridged networking to VMs. VMs see a virtual network
>> device rather than the underlying physical device. Similar principle applies
>> to other device classes -- VMs see a virtual device. If you want a VM to see
>> a property of a physical device that cannot be expressed in your virtual
>> device model, you pass that physical device through directly to that one VM.
>> If you want direct passthrough and some semblance of sharing between VMs...
>> that's harder to do.
> 
> I agree its difficult to do. But is it possible to do? Can we make such that
> USB devices are shared across VMs? Any suggestion of how it can be done? 

Well, no, not really. You go work it out and come back with some patches.
:-)

 -- Keir

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Marc - A. Dahlhaus]

Am Freitag, den 27.08.2010, 14:53 +0530 schrieb Dhananjay Goel:
> This won't be straight forward. Think about USB memory/flash stick.
> If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to it, the filesystem
> in it will get corrupted immediately!
> 
> Why would it get corrupted immediately. Might be we can just lock a
> specific file which is being edited? Please suggest.


Hello Dhananjay,


in short: You can't do that.

Well, you may share the blockdevice itself quite easily this way
(AoE,iSCSI and FCoE could also be a simple way to do it).

But a Filesystem on a blockdevice is a totaly other beast than what you
know as shared access to a filesystem over NFS or CIFS/SMB[2].

There is a thing called "filesystem-cache".

Every OS that connects to your "shared-usb-flash-drive" reads the
filesystem-metadata (what data is where to find on the block device and
what name has it, what folders are there and what is in it) and places
this data into its local cache.

And here the things start to get nasty.

OS 1 adds a Folder but don't write the metadata for it to the device.
OS 2 don't know about the Folder and stores a file to the exact same
place on the device where OS 1 placed its new folder.
OS 1 writes its Data to the device.
Your filesystem gone nuts by here.

Even if OS 1 wrote the metadata to the device in the first place, there
is no notification that data was changed on the device for OS 2. OS 2
doesn't know anything about it because no one talked to OS 2 about the
write to the device.

The meta-information about the writes are local to the 2 VM's because
the filesystem isn't designed to be aware of datachages origination from
remote sources. There is no information exchange about what to write
where an when between the VM's. The filesystem on your device is not
"cluster-aware".

So:

Access to a "non cluster-aware block device filesystem" is exclusive to
only one OS instance. Period. There is no way around this.

Network shares are protocols only that are served by a server and this
server has the exclusive access to the storage block device and the
filesystem on it. NFS and CIFS/SMB[2] are a level higher (a network
protocol) and are only serving the access to files over the network.
The protocols have messages that make the clients aware that new data
has arrived on the server if the client cares and asks for such
notifications.

That said, you might want to take a look at GFS2 or OCFS2 to get more
information about what it takes to use the same filesystem on more than
one OS-Instance.



That's just the filesystem case. All other things have also problems to
get things right when data changes under its feet without notification. 

You can't share an usbcam because one host might change the format that
the cam sends its data (eg. the resolution) the other hosts don't know
about that change and thus show only invalid data...

You would have to write drivers for every device that are aware of other
players on the same device and you also would need a
communication-channel for the players on the device.

As far as i know this is impossible.

The only possible way i know of for "sharing" usb devices (a bus with
only one Host and thus only one OS-driver for each device) is to have an
interface where it is possible to attach usb devices to only one vm at a
time and detach it afterwards before you can attach it to another vm.


Marc

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Pasi Kärkkäinen]

On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:53:54PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>    This won't be straight forward. Think about USB memory/flash stick.
>    If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to it, the filesystem
>    in it will get corrupted immediately!
> 
>    --Why would it get corrupted immediately. Might be we can just lock a
>    specific file which is being edited? Please suggest.
>

Because USB level has no idea about filesystems or files, or locking them!

Say you're using ext3 or NTFS in the VM for the USB device.
Those filesystems are NOT cluster-aware, ie. they're not aware of any sharing,
and they don't support any kind of sharing.

They expect exclusive access to the device.

If suddenly the bits on the device change from outside, 
the filesystem gets corrupted very easily.

Also you wouldn't see the changes made in other VMs,
unless you made sure all the caches are refreshed etc in the VM all the time.

You'd need to use some cluster-filesystem (GFS, GFS2, OCFS2, GPFS, etc).

-- Pasi

>    Thanks,
>    Dhananjay
> 
>    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:49 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen <[1]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> 
>      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:45:12PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>      >    No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for direct passthru to
>      >    one/single vm.
>      >    You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot) to make such
>      sharing
>      >    possible.
>      >    Comments: Is it possible to share USB keyboard, USB mouse, USB
>      modem, etc
>      >    across VMs i.e host and guest(s)? If we connect USB keyboard, is it
>      >    possible to use it in guests?
>      >
> 
>      This is implemented in XCI (Xen Client Initiative), and there has been
>      some discussions how to get it traditional Xen, to help Xen VGA
>      Passthrough usage.
> 
>      See: [2]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      >    Also, is it possible for us to modify the device driver of USB 2.0
>      so that
>      >    all USB 2.0 devices are visible and can be used across all VMs?
>      Please
>      >    suggest.
>      >
> 
>      This won't be straight forward. Think about USB memory/flash stick.
>      If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to it, the filesystem
>      in it will get corrupted immediately!
> 
>      USB Passthru cannot be used to 'share' devices, it's for giving
>      one/single VM
>      direct access to the device.
> 
>      -- Pasi
> 
>      >    Thanks,
>      >    Dhananjay
>      >
>      >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:16 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen
>      <[1][3]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
>      >
>      >      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 01:37:49PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>      >      >    Hi James/Pasi,
>      >      >    I had a look at
>      >      [1][2][4]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      >    But I'm not sure if it supports sharing USB devices across
>      VMs
>      >      (host and
>      >      >    guest) i.e. if I plug in a flash drive then it would detect
>      in both
>      >      host
>      >      >    and guest and I'd be able edit files from all VMs rather
>      than
>      >      mounting and
>      >      >    unmounting everytime from 1 VM to other.
>      >      >    Please let me know your thoughts on it.
>      >      >
>      >
>      >      No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for direct passthru
>      to
>      >      one/single vm.
>      >      You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot) to make such
>      sharing
>      >      possible.
>      >
>      >      -- Pasi
>      >      >    Thanks,
>      >      >    Dhananjay
>      >      >
>      >      >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:28 AM, James Harper
>      >      >    <[2][3][5]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au> wrote:
>      >      >
>      >      >      > Hi there!
>      >      >      >
>      >      >      > First I'd like to say that XEN plaform is really cool
>      and
>      >      awesome.
>      >      >      >
>      >      >      > I'm an engineering student and is searching for a
>      feasible
>      >      project in
>      >      >      > virtualization. I'd like to know if its possible to
>      share USB
>      >      devices
>      >      >      (flash
>      >      >      > drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc) across guests
>      and host
>      >      (VMs).
>      >      >      Also, do
>      >      >      > you have any idea to extend it? Or any innovative idea
>      so that
>      >      we can
>      >      >      > implement it.
>      >      >      >
>      >      >      > I'd appreciate any help. Thanks in advance.
>      >      >      >
>      >      >
>      >      >      Further to what Pasi said, I have partially ported the
>      backend
>      >      interface
>      >      >      and can hand you the code if you want. It's probable a bit
>      stale
>      >      vs the
>      >      >      current kernels and leaks memory under some circumstances
>      but is
>      >      >      probably better than starting from scratch.
>      >      >      James
>      >      >
>      >      > References
>      >      >
>      >      >    Visible links
>      >      >    1. [4][6]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      >    2. mailto:[5][7]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >
>      > References
>      >
>      >    Visible links
>      >    1. mailto:[8]pasik@iki.fi
>      >    2. [9]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >    3. mailto:[10]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >    4. [11]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >    5. mailto:[12]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> 
> References
> 
>    Visible links
>    1. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    2. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>    3. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    4. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>    5. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>    6. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>    7. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>    8. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    9. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   10. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   11. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   12. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Dhananjay Goel]

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Also you wouldn't see the changes made in other VMs,
unless you made sure all the caches are refreshed etc in the VM all the
time.

You'd need to use some cluster-filesystem (GFS, GFS2, OCFS2, GPFS, etc).

--Can you please suggest how NFS manages this because this case is handled
by NFS without any corruption?

We can share flash drive across VMs as we do with physical machines in LAN.
Please help!

Thanks,
Dhananjay


On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:27 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen <pasik@iki.fi> wrote:

> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:53:54PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> >    This won't be straight forward. Think about USB memory/flash stick.
> >    If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to it, the filesystem
> >    in it will get corrupted immediately!
> >
> >    --Why would it get corrupted immediately. Might be we can just lock a
> >    specific file which is being edited? Please suggest.
> >
>
> Because USB level has no idea about filesystems or files, or locking them!
>
> Say you're using ext3 or NTFS in the VM for the USB device.
> Those filesystems are NOT cluster-aware, ie. they're not aware of any
> sharing,
> and they don't support any kind of sharing.
>
> They expect exclusive access to the device.
>
> If suddenly the bits on the device change from outside,
> the filesystem gets corrupted very easily.
>
> Also you wouldn't see the changes made in other VMs,
> unless you made sure all the caches are refreshed etc in the VM all the
> time.
>
> You'd need to use some cluster-filesystem (GFS, GFS2, OCFS2, GPFS, etc).
>
> -- Pasi
>
> >    Thanks,
> >    Dhananjay
> >
> >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:49 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen <[1]pasik@iki.fi>
> wrote:
> >
> >      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:45:12PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> >      >    No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for direct
> passthru to
> >      >    one/single vm.
> >      >    You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot) to make
> such
> >      sharing
> >      >    possible.
> >      >    Comments: Is it possible to share USB keyboard, USB mouse, USB
> >      modem, etc
> >      >    across VMs i.e host and guest(s)? If we connect USB keyboard,
> is it
> >      >    possible to use it in guests?
> >      >
> >
> >      This is implemented in XCI (Xen Client Initiative), and there has
> been
> >      some discussions how to get it traditional Xen, to help Xen VGA
> >      Passthrough usage.
> >
> >      See: [2]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >      >    Also, is it possible for us to modify the device driver of USB
> 2.0
> >      so that
> >      >    all USB 2.0 devices are visible and can be used across all VMs?
> >      Please
> >      >    suggest.
> >      >
> >
> >      This won't be straight forward. Think about USB memory/flash stick.
> >      If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to it, the filesystem
> >      in it will get corrupted immediately!
> >
> >      USB Passthru cannot be used to 'share' devices, it's for giving
> >      one/single VM
> >      direct access to the device.
> >
> >      -- Pasi
> >
> >      >    Thanks,
> >      >    Dhananjay
> >      >
> >      >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:16 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen
> >      <[1][3]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> >      >
> >      >      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 01:37:49PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel
> wrote:
> >      >      >    Hi James/Pasi,
> >      >      >    I had a look at
> >      >      [1][2][4]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      >    But I'm not sure if it supports sharing USB devices
> across
> >      VMs
> >      >      (host and
> >      >      >    guest) i.e. if I plug in a flash drive then it would
> detect
> >      in both
> >      >      host
> >      >      >    and guest and I'd be able edit files from all VMs rather
> >      than
> >      >      mounting and
> >      >      >    unmounting everytime from 1 VM to other.
> >      >      >    Please let me know your thoughts on it.
> >      >      >
> >      >
> >      >      No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for direct
> passthru
> >      to
> >      >      one/single vm.
> >      >      You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot) to make
> such
> >      sharing
> >      >      possible.
> >      >
> >      >      -- Pasi
> >      >      >    Thanks,
> >      >      >    Dhananjay
> >      >      >
> >      >      >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:28 AM, James Harper
> >      >      >    <[2][3][5]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au> wrote:
> >      >      >
> >      >      >      > Hi there!
> >      >      >      >
> >      >      >      > First I'd like to say that XEN plaform is really
> cool
> >      and
> >      >      awesome.
> >      >      >      >
> >      >      >      > I'm an engineering student and is searching for a
> >      feasible
> >      >      project in
> >      >      >      > virtualization. I'd like to know if its possible to
> >      share USB
> >      >      devices
> >      >      >      (flash
> >      >      >      > drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc) across
> guests
> >      and host
> >      >      (VMs).
> >      >      >      Also, do
> >      >      >      > you have any idea to extend it? Or any innovative
> idea
> >      so that
> >      >      we can
> >      >      >      > implement it.
> >      >      >      >
> >      >      >      > I'd appreciate any help. Thanks in advance.
> >      >      >      >
> >      >      >
> >      >      >      Further to what Pasi said, I have partially ported the
> >      backend
> >      >      interface
> >      >      >      and can hand you the code if you want. It's probable a
> bit
> >      stale
> >      >      vs the
> >      >      >      current kernels and leaks memory under some
> circumstances
> >      but is
> >      >      >      probably better than starting from scratch.
> >      >      >      James
> >      >      >
> >      >      > References
> >      >      >
> >      >      >    Visible links
> >      >      >    1. [4][6]
> http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      >    2. mailto:[5][7]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >
> >      > References
> >      >
> >      >    Visible links
> >      >    1. mailto:[8]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >    2. [9]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >    3. mailto:[10]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >    4. [11]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >    5. mailto:[12]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >
> > References
> >
> >    Visible links
> >    1. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    2. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >    3. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    4. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >    5. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >    6. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >    7. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >    8. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    9. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   10. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   11. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   12. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>

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Re: Virtualization project idea

[Pasi Kärkkäinen]

On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 04:56:33PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>    Also you wouldn't see the changes made in other VMs,
>    unless you made sure all the caches are refreshed etc in the VM all the
>    time.
> 
>    You'd need to use some cluster-filesystem (GFS, GFS2, OCFS2, GPFS, etc).
>    --Can you please suggest how NFS manages this because this case is handled
>    by NFS without any corruption?
>    We can share flash drive across VMs as we do with physical machines in
>    LAN. Please help!
> 

How are you sharing USB flash drives with physical machines? 

-- Pasi

>    Thanks,
>    Dhananjay
> 
>    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:27 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen <[1]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> 
>      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:53:54PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>      >    This won't be straight forward. Think about USB memory/flash stick.
>      >    If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to it, the
>      filesystem
>      >    in it will get corrupted immediately!
>      >
>      >    --Why would it get corrupted immediately. Might be we can just lock
>      a
>      >    specific file which is being edited? Please suggest.
>      >
> 
>      Because USB level has no idea about filesystems or files, or locking
>      them!
> 
>      Say you're using ext3 or NTFS in the VM for the USB device.
>      Those filesystems are NOT cluster-aware, ie. they're not aware of any
>      sharing,
>      and they don't support any kind of sharing.
> 
>      They expect exclusive access to the device.
> 
>      If suddenly the bits on the device change from outside,
>      the filesystem gets corrupted very easily.
> 
>      Also you wouldn't see the changes made in other VMs,
>      unless you made sure all the caches are refreshed etc in the VM all the
>      time.
> 
>      You'd need to use some cluster-filesystem (GFS, GFS2, OCFS2, GPFS, etc).
> 
>      -- Pasi
> 
>      >    Thanks,
>      >    Dhananjay
>      >
>      >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:49 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen
>      <[1][2]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
>      >
>      >      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:45:12PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>      >      >    No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for direct
>      passthru to
>      >      >    one/single vm.
>      >      >    You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot) to make
>      such
>      >      sharing
>      >      >    possible.
>      >      >    Comments: Is it possible to share USB keyboard, USB mouse,
>      USB
>      >      modem, etc
>      >      >    across VMs i.e host and guest(s)? If we connect USB
>      keyboard, is it
>      >      >    possible to use it in guests?
>      >      >
>      >
>      >      This is implemented in XCI (Xen Client Initiative), and there has
>      been
>      >      some discussions how to get it traditional Xen, to help Xen VGA
>      >      Passthrough usage.
>      >
>      >      See: [2][3]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      >      >    Also, is it possible for us to modify the device driver of
>      USB 2.0
>      >      so that
>      >      >    all USB 2.0 devices are visible and can be used across all
>      VMs?
>      >      Please
>      >      >    suggest.
>      >      >
>      >
>      >      This won't be straight forward. Think about USB memory/flash
>      stick.
>      >      If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to it, the
>      filesystem
>      >      in it will get corrupted immediately!
>      >
>      >      USB Passthru cannot be used to 'share' devices, it's for giving
>      >      one/single VM
>      >      direct access to the device.
>      >
>      >      -- Pasi
>      >
>      >      >    Thanks,
>      >      >    Dhananjay
>      >      >
>      >      >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:16 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen
>      >      <[1][3][4]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
>      >      >
>      >      >      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 01:37:49PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel
>      wrote:
>      >      >      >    Hi James/Pasi,
>      >      >      >    I had a look at
>      >      >
>       [1][2][4][5]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      >      >    But I'm not sure if it supports sharing USB devices
>      across
>      >      VMs
>      >      >      (host and
>      >      >      >    guest) i.e. if I plug in a flash drive then it would
>      detect
>      >      in both
>      >      >      host
>      >      >      >    and guest and I'd be able edit files from all VMs
>      rather
>      >      than
>      >      >      mounting and
>      >      >      >    unmounting everytime from 1 VM to other.
>      >      >      >    Please let me know your thoughts on it.
>      >      >      >
>      >      >
>      >      >      No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for direct
>      passthru
>      >      to
>      >      >      one/single vm.
>      >      >      You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot) to
>      make such
>      >      sharing
>      >      >      possible.
>      >      >
>      >      >      -- Pasi
>      >      >      >    Thanks,
>      >      >      >    Dhananjay
>      >      >      >
>      >      >      >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:28 AM, James Harper
>      >      >      >    <[2][3][5][6]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au> wrote:
>      >      >      >
>      >      >      >      > Hi there!
>      >      >      >      >
>      >      >      >      > First I'd like to say that XEN plaform is really
>      cool
>      >      and
>      >      >      awesome.
>      >      >      >      >
>      >      >      >      > I'm an engineering student and is searching for a
>      >      feasible
>      >      >      project in
>      >      >      >      > virtualization. I'd like to know if its possible
>      to
>      >      share USB
>      >      >      devices
>      >      >      >      (flash
>      >      >      >      > drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc) across
>      guests
>      >      and host
>      >      >      (VMs).
>      >      >      >      Also, do
>      >      >      >      > you have any idea to extend it? Or any innovative
>      idea
>      >      so that
>      >      >      we can
>      >      >      >      > implement it.
>      >      >      >      >
>      >      >      >      > I'd appreciate any help. Thanks in advance.
>      >      >      >      >
>      >      >      >
>      >      >      >      Further to what Pasi said, I have partially ported
>      the
>      >      backend
>      >      >      interface
>      >      >      >      and can hand you the code if you want. It's
>      probable a bit
>      >      stale
>      >      >      vs the
>      >      >      >      current kernels and leaks memory under some
>      circumstances
>      >      but is
>      >      >      >      probably better than starting from scratch.
>      >      >      >      James
>      >      >      >
>      >      >      > References
>      >      >      >
>      >      >      >    Visible links
>      >      >      >    1.
>      [4][6][7]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      >      >    2. mailto:[5][7][8]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >      >
>      >      > References
>      >      >
>      >      >    Visible links
>      >      >    1. mailto:[8][9]pasik@iki.fi
>      >      >    2.
>      [9][10]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      >    3. mailto:[10][11]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >      >    4.
>      [11][12]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      >    5. mailto:[12][13]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >
>      > References
>      >
>      >    Visible links
>      >    1. mailto:[14]pasik@iki.fi
>      >    2. [15]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      >    3. mailto:[16]pasik@iki.fi
>      >    4. [17]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >    5. mailto:[18]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >    6. [19]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >    7. mailto:[20]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >    8. mailto:[21]pasik@iki.fi
>      >    9. [22]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >   10. mailto:[23]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >   11. [24]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >   12. mailto:[25]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> 
> References
> 
>    Visible links
>    1. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    2. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    3. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>    4. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    5. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>    6. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>    7. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>    8. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>    9. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   10. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   11. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   12. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   13. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   14. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   15. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>   16. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   17. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   18. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   19. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   20. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   21. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   22. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   23. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   24. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   25. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Dhananjay Goel]

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How are you sharing USB flash drives with physical machines

Comment: In ubuntu, plug in flash drive and access /media folder. Then right
click and click on "Sharing Options". Once you share it and give others the
right to add/edit the files, they can do so.

Thanks,
Dhananjay


On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 5:24 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen <pasik@iki.fi> wrote:

> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 04:56:33PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> >    Also you wouldn't see the changes made in other VMs,
> >    unless you made sure all the caches are refreshed etc in the VM all
> the
> >    time.
> >
> >    You'd need to use some cluster-filesystem (GFS, GFS2, OCFS2, GPFS,
> etc).
> >    --Can you please suggest how NFS manages this because this case is
> handled
> >    by NFS without any corruption?
> >    We can share flash drive across VMs as we do with physical machines in
> >    LAN. Please help!
> >
>
> How are you sharing USB flash drives with physical machines?
>
> -- Pasi
>
> >    Thanks,
> >    Dhananjay
> >
> >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:27 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen <[1]pasik@iki.fi>
> wrote:
> >
> >      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:53:54PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> >      >    This won't be straight forward. Think about USB memory/flash
> stick.
> >      >    If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to it, the
> >      filesystem
> >      >    in it will get corrupted immediately!
> >      >
> >      >    --Why would it get corrupted immediately. Might be we can just
> lock
> >      a
> >      >    specific file which is being edited? Please suggest.
> >      >
> >
> >      Because USB level has no idea about filesystems or files, or locking
> >      them!
> >
> >      Say you're using ext3 or NTFS in the VM for the USB device.
> >      Those filesystems are NOT cluster-aware, ie. they're not aware of
> any
> >      sharing,
> >      and they don't support any kind of sharing.
> >
> >      They expect exclusive access to the device.
> >
> >      If suddenly the bits on the device change from outside,
> >      the filesystem gets corrupted very easily.
> >
> >      Also you wouldn't see the changes made in other VMs,
> >      unless you made sure all the caches are refreshed etc in the VM all
> the
> >      time.
> >
> >      You'd need to use some cluster-filesystem (GFS, GFS2, OCFS2, GPFS,
> etc).
> >
> >      -- Pasi
> >
> >      >    Thanks,
> >      >    Dhananjay
> >      >
> >      >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:49 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen
> >      <[1][2]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> >      >
> >      >      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:45:12PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel
> wrote:
> >      >      >    No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for direct
> >      passthru to
> >      >      >    one/single vm.
> >      >      >    You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot) to
> make
> >      such
> >      >      sharing
> >      >      >    possible.
> >      >      >    Comments: Is it possible to share USB keyboard, USB
> mouse,
> >      USB
> >      >      modem, etc
> >      >      >    across VMs i.e host and guest(s)? If we connect USB
> >      keyboard, is it
> >      >      >    possible to use it in guests?
> >      >      >
> >      >
> >      >      This is implemented in XCI (Xen Client Initiative), and there
> has
> >      been
> >      >      some discussions how to get it traditional Xen, to help Xen
> VGA
> >      >      Passthrough usage.
> >      >
> >      >      See: [2][3]
> http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >      >      >    Also, is it possible for us to modify the device driver
> of
> >      USB 2.0
> >      >      so that
> >      >      >    all USB 2.0 devices are visible and can be used across
> all
> >      VMs?
> >      >      Please
> >      >      >    suggest.
> >      >      >
> >      >
> >      >      This won't be straight forward. Think about USB memory/flash
> >      stick.
> >      >      If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to it, the
> >      filesystem
> >      >      in it will get corrupted immediately!
> >      >
> >      >      USB Passthru cannot be used to 'share' devices, it's for
> giving
> >      >      one/single VM
> >      >      direct access to the device.
> >      >
> >      >      -- Pasi
> >      >
> >      >      >    Thanks,
> >      >      >    Dhananjay
> >      >      >
> >      >      >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:16 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen
> >      >      <[1][3][4]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> >      >      >
> >      >      >      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 01:37:49PM +0530, Dhananjay
> Goel
> >      wrote:
> >      >      >      >    Hi James/Pasi,
> >      >      >      >    I had a look at
> >      >      >
> >       [1][2][4][5]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      >      >    But I'm not sure if it supports sharing USB
> devices
> >      across
> >      >      VMs
> >      >      >      (host and
> >      >      >      >    guest) i.e. if I plug in a flash drive then it
> would
> >      detect
> >      >      in both
> >      >      >      host
> >      >      >      >    and guest and I'd be able edit files from all VMs
> >      rather
> >      >      than
> >      >      >      mounting and
> >      >      >      >    unmounting everytime from 1 VM to other.
> >      >      >      >    Please let me know your thoughts on it.
> >      >      >      >
> >      >      >
> >      >      >      No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for
> direct
> >      passthru
> >      >      to
> >      >      >      one/single vm.
> >      >      >      You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot) to
> >      make such
> >      >      sharing
> >      >      >      possible.
> >      >      >
> >      >      >      -- Pasi
> >      >      >      >    Thanks,
> >      >      >      >    Dhananjay
> >      >      >      >
> >      >      >      >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:28 AM, James Harper
> >      >      >      >    <[2][3][5][6]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au>
> wrote:
> >      >      >      >
> >      >      >      >      > Hi there!
> >      >      >      >      >
> >      >      >      >      > First I'd like to say that XEN plaform is
> really
> >      cool
> >      >      and
> >      >      >      awesome.
> >      >      >      >      >
> >      >      >      >      > I'm an engineering student and is searching
> for a
> >      >      feasible
> >      >      >      project in
> >      >      >      >      > virtualization. I'd like to know if its
> possible
> >      to
> >      >      share USB
> >      >      >      devices
> >      >      >      >      (flash
> >      >      >      >      > drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc)
> across
> >      guests
> >      >      and host
> >      >      >      (VMs).
> >      >      >      >      Also, do
> >      >      >      >      > you have any idea to extend it? Or any
> innovative
> >      idea
> >      >      so that
> >      >      >      we can
> >      >      >      >      > implement it.
> >      >      >      >      >
> >      >      >      >      > I'd appreciate any help. Thanks in advance.
> >      >      >      >      >
> >      >      >      >
> >      >      >      >      Further to what Pasi said, I have partially
> ported
> >      the
> >      >      backend
> >      >      >      interface
> >      >      >      >      and can hand you the code if you want. It's
> >      probable a bit
> >      >      stale
> >      >      >      vs the
> >      >      >      >      current kernels and leaks memory under some
> >      circumstances
> >      >      but is
> >      >      >      >      probably better than starting from scratch.
> >      >      >      >      James
> >      >      >      >
> >      >      >      > References
> >      >      >      >
> >      >      >      >    Visible links
> >      >      >      >    1.
> >      [4][6][7]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      >      >    2. mailto:[5][7][8]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      >
> >      >      > References
> >      >      >
> >      >      >    Visible links
> >      >      >    1. mailto:[8][9]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      >    2.
> >      [9][10]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      >    3. mailto:[10][11]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      >    4.
> >      [11][12]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      >    5. mailto:[12][13]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >
> >      > References
> >      >
> >      >    Visible links
> >      >    1. mailto:[14]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >    2. [15]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >      >    3. mailto:[16]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >    4. [17]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >    5. mailto:[18]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >    6. [19]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >    7. mailto:[20]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >    8. mailto:[21]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >    9. [22]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   10. mailto:[23]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   11. [24]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   12. mailto:[25]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >
> > References
> >
> >    Visible links
> >    1. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    2. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    3. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >    4. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    5. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >    6. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >    7. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >    8. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >    9. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   10. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   11. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   12. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   13. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   14. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   15. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >   16. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   17. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   18. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   19. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   20. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   21. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   22. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   23. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   24. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   25. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>

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Re: Virtualization project idea

[Pasi Kärkkäinen]

On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:16:32PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>    How are you sharing USB flash drives with physical machines
>    Comment: In ubuntu, plug in flash drive and access /media folder. Then
>    right click and click on "Sharing Options". Once you share it and give
>    others the right to add/edit the files, they can do so.
> 

That's NOT USB sharing at all! 
That's just a general filesystem share (nfs,cifs,whatever network share).

You can do that with Xen, over the network, just like with physical machines.

-- Pasi

>    Thanks,
>    Dhananjay
> 
>    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 5:24 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen <[1]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> 
>      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 04:56:33PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>      > * *Also you wouldn't see the changes made in other VMs,
>      > * *unless you made sure all the caches are refreshed etc in the VM all
>      the
>      > * *time.
>      >
>      > * *You'd need to use some cluster-filesystem (GFS, GFS2, OCFS2, GPFS,
>      etc).
>      > * *--Can you please suggest how NFS manages this because this case is
>      handled
>      > * *by NFS without any corruption?
>      > * *We can share flash drive across VMs as we do with physical machines
>      in
>      > * *LAN. Please help!
>      >
> 
>      How are you sharing USB flash drives with physical machines?
> 
>      -- Pasi
> 
>      > * *Thanks,
>      > * *Dhananjay
>      >
>      > * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:27 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen
>      <[1][2]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
>      >
>      > * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:53:54PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>      > * * *> * *This won't be straight forward. Think about USB memory/flash
>      stick.
>      > * * *> * *If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to it, the
>      > * * *filesystem
>      > * * *> * *in it will get corrupted immediately!
>      > * * *>
>      > * * *> * *--Why would it get corrupted immediately. Might be we can
>      just lock
>      > * * *a
>      > * * *> * *specific file which is being edited? Please suggest.
>      > * * *>
>      >
>      > * * *Because USB level has no idea about filesystems or files, or
>      locking
>      > * * *them!
>      >
>      > * * *Say you're using ext3 or NTFS in the VM for the USB device.
>      > * * *Those filesystems are NOT cluster-aware, ie. they're not aware of
>      any
>      > * * *sharing,
>      > * * *and they don't support any kind of sharing.
>      >
>      > * * *They expect exclusive access to the device.
>      >
>      > * * *If suddenly the bits on the device change from outside,
>      > * * *the filesystem gets corrupted very easily.
>      >
>      > * * *Also you wouldn't see the changes made in other VMs,
>      > * * *unless you made sure all the caches are refreshed etc in the VM
>      all the
>      > * * *time.
>      >
>      > * * *You'd need to use some cluster-filesystem (GFS, GFS2, OCFS2,
>      GPFS, etc).
>      >
>      > * * *-- Pasi
>      >
>      > * * *> * *Thanks,
>      > * * *> * *Dhananjay
>      > * * *>
>      > * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:49 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen
>      > * * *<[1][2][3]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
>      > * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:45:12PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel
>      wrote:
>      > * * *> * * *> * *No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for
>      direct
>      > * * *passthru to
>      > * * *> * * *> * *one/single vm.
>      > * * *> * * *> * *You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot)
>      to make
>      > * * *such
>      > * * *> * * *sharing
>      > * * *> * * *> * *possible.
>      > * * *> * * *> * *Comments: Is it possible to share USB keyboard, USB
>      mouse,
>      > * * *USB
>      > * * *> * * *modem, etc
>      > * * *> * * *> * *across VMs i.e host and guest(s)? If we connect USB
>      > * * *keyboard, is it
>      > * * *> * * *> * *possible to use it in guests?
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *This is implemented in XCI (Xen Client Initiative), and
>      there has
>      > * * *been
>      > * * *> * * *some discussions how to get it traditional Xen, to help
>      Xen VGA
>      > * * *> * * *Passthrough usage.
>      > * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *See:
>      [2][3][4]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * *Also, is it possible for us to modify the device
>      driver of
>      > * * *USB 2.0
>      > * * *> * * *so that
>      > * * *> * * *> * *all USB 2.0 devices are visible and can be used
>      across all
>      > * * *VMs?
>      > * * *> * * *Please
>      > * * *> * * *> * *suggest.
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *This won't be straight forward. Think about USB
>      memory/flash
>      > * * *stick.
>      > * * *> * * *If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to it, the
>      > * * *filesystem
>      > * * *> * * *in it will get corrupted immediately!
>      > * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *USB Passthru cannot be used to 'share' devices, it's for
>      giving
>      > * * *> * * *one/single VM
>      > * * *> * * *direct access to the device.
>      > * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *-- Pasi
>      > * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * *Thanks,
>      > * * *> * * *> * *Dhananjay
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:16 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen
>      > * * *> * * *<[1][3][4][5]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 01:37:49PM +0530, Dhananjay
>      Goel
>      > * * *wrote:
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Hi James/Pasi,
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *I had a look at
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *
>      [1][2][4][5][6]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *But I'm not sure if it supports sharing USB
>      devices
>      > * * *across
>      > * * *> * * *VMs
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *(host and
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *guest) i.e. if I plug in a flash drive then it
>      would
>      > * * *detect
>      > * * *> * * *in both
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *host
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *and guest and I'd be able edit files from all
>      VMs
>      > * * *rather
>      > * * *> * * *than
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *mounting and
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *unmounting everytime from 1 VM to other.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Please let me know your thoughts on it.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for
>      direct
>      > * * *passthru
>      > * * *> * * *to
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *one/single vm.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *You'd need some filesystem share (cifs/nfs/whatnot)
>      to
>      > * * *make such
>      > * * *> * * *sharing
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *possible.
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *-- Pasi
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Thanks,
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Dhananjay
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:28 AM, James Harper
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *<[2][3][5][6][7]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au>
>      wrote:
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> Hi there!
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> First I'd like to say that XEN plaform is
>      really
>      > * * *cool
>      > * * *> * * *and
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *awesome.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> I'm an engineering student and is
>      searching for a
>      > * * *> * * *feasible
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *project in
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> virtualization. I'd like to know if its
>      possible
>      > * * *to
>      > * * *> * * *share USB
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *devices
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *(flash
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc)
>      across
>      > * * *guests
>      > * * *> * * *and host
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *(VMs).
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *Also, do
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> you have any idea to extend it? Or any
>      innovative
>      > * * *idea
>      > * * *> * * *so that
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *we can
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> implement it.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> I'd appreciate any help. Thanks in
>      advance.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *Further to what Pasi said, I have partially
>      ported
>      > * * *the
>      > * * *> * * *backend
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *interface
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *and can hand you the code if you want. It's
>      > * * *probable a bit
>      > * * *> * * *stale
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *vs the
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *current kernels and leaks memory under some
>      > * * *circumstances
>      > * * *> * * *but is
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *probably better than starting from scratch.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *James
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> References
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Visible links
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *1.
>      > * * *[4][6][7][8]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *2.
>      mailto:[5][7][8][9]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> References
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * *Visible links
>      > * * *> * * *> * *1. mailto:[8][9][10]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * * *> * *2.
>      > * * *[9][10][11]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * *3. mailto:[10][11][12]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * * *> * *4.
>      > * * *[11][12][13]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * *5. mailto:[12][13][14]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *>
>      > * * *> References
>      > * * *>
>      > * * *> * *Visible links
>      > * * *> * *1. mailto:[14][15]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * *2.
>      [15][16]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      > * * *> * *3. mailto:[16][17]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * *4.
>      [17][18]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * *5. mailto:[18][19]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * *6.
>      [19][20]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * *7. mailto:[20][21]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * *8. mailto:[21][22]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * *9.
>      [22][23]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * 10. mailto:[23][24]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * 11.
>      [24][25]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * 12. mailto:[25][26]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >
>      > References
>      >
>      > * *Visible links
>      > * *1. mailto:[27]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * *2. mailto:[28]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * *3. [29]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      > * *4. mailto:[30]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * *5. [31]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * *6. mailto:[32]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * *7. [33]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * *8. mailto:[34]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * *9. mailto:[35]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * 10. [36]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 11. mailto:[37]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 12. [38]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 13. mailto:[39]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 14. mailto:[40]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * 15. [41]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      > * 16. mailto:[42]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * 17. [43]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 18. mailto:[44]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 19. [45]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 20. mailto:[46]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 21. mailto:[47]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * 22. [48]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 23. mailto:[49]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 24. [50]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 25. mailto:[51]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> 
> References
> 
>    Visible links
>    1. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    2. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    3. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    4. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>    5. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    6. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>    7. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>    8. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>    9. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   10. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   11. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   12. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   13. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   14. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   15. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   16. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>   17. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   18. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   19. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   20. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   21. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   22. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   23. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   24. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   25. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   26. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   27. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   28. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   29. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>   30. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   31. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   32. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   33. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   34. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   35. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   36. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   37. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   38. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   39. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   40. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   41. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>   42. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   43. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   44. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   45. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   46. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   47. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   48. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   49. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   50. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   51. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Dhananjay Goel]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 16267 bytes --]

Yes, exactly. So, we wanted to know if it is possible to *share USB* across
VMs.

Thanks,
Dhananjay


On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 6:23 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen <pasik@iki.fi> wrote:

> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:16:32PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> >    How are you sharing USB flash drives with physical machines
> >    Comment: In ubuntu, plug in flash drive and access /media folder. Then
> >    right click and click on "Sharing Options". Once you share it and give
> >    others the right to add/edit the files, they can do so.
> >
>
> That's NOT USB sharing at all!
> That's just a general filesystem share (nfs,cifs,whatever network share).
>
> You can do that with Xen, over the network, just like with physical
> machines.
>
> -- Pasi
>
> >    Thanks,
> >    Dhananjay
> >
> >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 5:24 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen <[1]pasik@iki.fi>
> wrote:
> >
> >      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 04:56:33PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> >      > * *Also you wouldn't see the changes made in other VMs,
> >      > * *unless you made sure all the caches are refreshed etc in the VM
> all
> >      the
> >      > * *time.
> >      >
> >      > * *You'd need to use some cluster-filesystem (GFS, GFS2, OCFS2,
> GPFS,
> >      etc).
> >      > * *--Can you please suggest how NFS manages this because this case
> is
> >      handled
> >      > * *by NFS without any corruption?
> >      > * *We can share flash drive across VMs as we do with physical
> machines
> >      in
> >      > * *LAN. Please help!
> >      >
> >
> >      How are you sharing USB flash drives with physical machines?
> >
> >      -- Pasi
> >
> >      > * *Thanks,
> >      > * *Dhananjay
> >      >
> >      > * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:27 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen
> >      <[1][2]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> >      >
> >      > * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:53:54PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel
> wrote:
> >      > * * *> * *This won't be straight forward. Think about USB
> memory/flash
> >      stick.
> >      > * * *> * *If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to it,
> the
> >      > * * *filesystem
> >      > * * *> * *in it will get corrupted immediately!
> >      > * * *>
> >      > * * *> * *--Why would it get corrupted immediately. Might be we
> can
> >      just lock
> >      > * * *a
> >      > * * *> * *specific file which is being edited? Please suggest.
> >      > * * *>
> >      >
> >      > * * *Because USB level has no idea about filesystems or files, or
> >      locking
> >      > * * *them!
> >      >
> >      > * * *Say you're using ext3 or NTFS in the VM for the USB device.
> >      > * * *Those filesystems are NOT cluster-aware, ie. they're not
> aware of
> >      any
> >      > * * *sharing,
> >      > * * *and they don't support any kind of sharing.
> >      >
> >      > * * *They expect exclusive access to the device.
> >      >
> >      > * * *If suddenly the bits on the device change from outside,
> >      > * * *the filesystem gets corrupted very easily.
> >      >
> >      > * * *Also you wouldn't see the changes made in other VMs,
> >      > * * *unless you made sure all the caches are refreshed etc in the
> VM
> >      all the
> >      > * * *time.
> >      >
> >      > * * *You'd need to use some cluster-filesystem (GFS, GFS2, OCFS2,
> >      GPFS, etc).
> >      >
> >      > * * *-- Pasi
> >      >
> >      > * * *> * *Thanks,
> >      > * * *> * *Dhananjay
> >      > * * *>
> >      > * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:49 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen
> >      > * * *<[1][2][3]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> >      > * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:45:12PM +0530, Dhananjay
> Goel
> >      wrote:
> >      > * * *> * * *> * *No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is for
> >      direct
> >      > * * *passthru to
> >      > * * *> * * *> * *one/single vm.
> >      > * * *> * * *> * *You'd need some filesystem share
> (cifs/nfs/whatnot)
> >      to make
> >      > * * *such
> >      > * * *> * * *sharing
> >      > * * *> * * *> * *possible.
> >      > * * *> * * *> * *Comments: Is it possible to share USB keyboard,
> USB
> >      mouse,
> >      > * * *USB
> >      > * * *> * * *modem, etc
> >      > * * *> * * *> * *across VMs i.e host and guest(s)? If we connect
> USB
> >      > * * *keyboard, is it
> >      > * * *> * * *> * *possible to use it in guests?
> >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      > * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *This is implemented in XCI (Xen Client Initiative),
> and
> >      there has
> >      > * * *been
> >      > * * *> * * *some discussions how to get it traditional Xen, to
> help
> >      Xen VGA
> >      > * * *> * * *Passthrough usage.
> >      > * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *See:
> >      [2][3][4]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >      > * * *> * * *> * *Also, is it possible for us to modify the device
> >      driver of
> >      > * * *USB 2.0
> >      > * * *> * * *so that
> >      > * * *> * * *> * *all USB 2.0 devices are visible and can be used
> >      across all
> >      > * * *VMs?
> >      > * * *> * * *Please
> >      > * * *> * * *> * *suggest.
> >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      > * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *This won't be straight forward. Think about USB
> >      memory/flash
> >      > * * *stick.
> >      > * * *> * * *If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to it,
> the
> >      > * * *filesystem
> >      > * * *> * * *in it will get corrupted immediately!
> >      > * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *USB Passthru cannot be used to 'share' devices, it's
> for
> >      giving
> >      > * * *> * * *one/single VM
> >      > * * *> * * *direct access to the device.
> >      > * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *-- Pasi
> >      > * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *> * *Thanks,
> >      > * * *> * * *> * *Dhananjay
> >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:16 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen
> >      > * * *> * * *<[1][3][4][5]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 01:37:49PM +0530,
> Dhananjay
> >      Goel
> >      > * * *wrote:
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Hi James/Pasi,
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *I had a look at
> >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      > * * *
> >      [1][2][4][5][6]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *But I'm not sure if it supports sharing
> USB
> >      devices
> >      > * * *across
> >      > * * *> * * *VMs
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *(host and
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *guest) i.e. if I plug in a flash drive
> then it
> >      would
> >      > * * *detect
> >      > * * *> * * *in both
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *host
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *and guest and I'd be able edit files from
> all
> >      VMs
> >      > * * *rather
> >      > * * *> * * *than
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *mounting and
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *unmounting everytime from 1 VM to other.
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Please let me know your thoughts on it.
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is
> for
> >      direct
> >      > * * *passthru
> >      > * * *> * * *to
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *one/single vm.
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *You'd need some filesystem share
> (cifs/nfs/whatnot)
> >      to
> >      > * * *make such
> >      > * * *> * * *sharing
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *possible.
> >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *-- Pasi
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Thanks,
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Dhananjay
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:28 AM, James
> Harper
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *<[2][3][5][6][7]
> james.harper@bendigoit.com.au>
> >      wrote:
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> Hi there!
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> First I'd like to say that XEN plaform
> is
> >      really
> >      > * * *cool
> >      > * * *> * * *and
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *awesome.
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> I'm an engineering student and is
> >      searching for a
> >      > * * *> * * *feasible
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *project in
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> virtualization. I'd like to know if
> its
> >      possible
> >      > * * *to
> >      > * * *> * * *share USB
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *devices
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *(flash
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards
> etc)
> >      across
> >      > * * *guests
> >      > * * *> * * *and host
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *(VMs).
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *Also, do
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> you have any idea to extend it? Or any
> >      innovative
> >      > * * *idea
> >      > * * *> * * *so that
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *we can
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> implement it.
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> I'd appreciate any help. Thanks in
> >      advance.
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *Further to what Pasi said, I have
> partially
> >      ported
> >      > * * *the
> >      > * * *> * * *backend
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *interface
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *and can hand you the code if you want.
> It's
> >      > * * *probable a bit
> >      > * * *> * * *stale
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *vs the
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *current kernels and leaks memory under
> some
> >      > * * *circumstances
> >      > * * *> * * *but is
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *probably better than starting from
> scratch.
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *James
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> References
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Visible links
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *1.
> >      > * * *[4][6][7][8]
> http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *2.
> >      mailto:[5][7][8][9]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *> References
> >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      > * * *> * * *> * *Visible links
> >      > * * *> * * *> * *1. mailto:[8][9][10]pasik@iki.fi
> >      > * * *> * * *> * *2.
> >      > * * *[9][10][11]
> http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      > * * *> * * *> * *3. mailto:[10][11][12]
> james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      > * * *> * * *> * *4.
> >      > * * *[11][12][13]
> http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      > * * *> * * *> * *5. mailto:[12][13][14]
> james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      > * * *>
> >      > * * *> References
> >      > * * *>
> >      > * * *> * *Visible links
> >      > * * *> * *1. mailto:[14][15]pasik@iki.fi
> >      > * * *> * *2.
> >      [15][16]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >      > * * *> * *3. mailto:[16][17]pasik@iki.fi
> >      > * * *> * *4.
> >      [17][18]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      > * * *> * *5. mailto:[18][19]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      > * * *> * *6.
> >      [19][20]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      > * * *> * *7. mailto:[20][21]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      > * * *> * *8. mailto:[21][22]pasik@iki.fi
> >      > * * *> * *9.
> >      [22][23]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      > * * *> * 10. mailto:[23][24]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      > * * *> * 11.
> >      [24][25]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      > * * *> * 12. mailto:[25][26]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >
> >      > References
> >      >
> >      > * *Visible links
> >      > * *1. mailto:[27]pasik@iki.fi
> >      > * *2. mailto:[28]pasik@iki.fi
> >      > * *3. [29]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >      > * *4. mailto:[30]pasik@iki.fi
> >      > * *5. [31]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      > * *6. mailto:[32]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      > * *7. [33]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      > * *8. mailto:[34]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      > * *9. mailto:[35]pasik@iki.fi
> >      > * 10. [36]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      > * 11. mailto:[37]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      > * 12. [38]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      > * 13. mailto:[39]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      > * 14. mailto:[40]pasik@iki.fi
> >      > * 15. [41]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >      > * 16. mailto:[42]pasik@iki.fi
> >      > * 17. [43]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      > * 18. mailto:[44]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      > * 19. [45]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      > * 20. mailto:[46]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      > * 21. mailto:[47]pasik@iki.fi
> >      > * 22. [48]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      > * 23. mailto:[49]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      > * 24. [50]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      > * 25. mailto:[51]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >
> > References
> >
> >    Visible links
> >    1. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    2. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    3. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    4. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >    5. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    6. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >    7. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >    8. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >    9. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   10. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   11. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   12. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   13. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   14. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   15. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   16. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >   17. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   18. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   19. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   20. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   21. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   22. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   23. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   24. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   25. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   26. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   27. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   28. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   29. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >   30. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   31. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   32. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   33. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   34. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   35. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   36. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   37. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   38. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   39. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   40. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   41. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >   42. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   43. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   44. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   45. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   46. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   47. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   48. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   49. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   50. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   51. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>

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Re: Virtualization project idea

[Pasi Kärkkäinen]

On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:33:35PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>    Yes, exactly. So, we wanted to know if it is possible to *share USB*
>    across VMs.
> 

I don't think USB protocol has been designed for *sharing*. 
I'm pretty certain only one computer/device/VM can use USB device at a time.

-- Pasi

>    Thanks,
>    Dhananjay
> 
>    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 6:23 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen <[1]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> 
>      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:16:32PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>      >    How are you sharing USB flash drives with physical machines
>      >    Comment: In ubuntu, plug in flash drive and access /media folder.
>      Then
>      >    right click and click on "Sharing Options". Once you share it and
>      give
>      >    others the right to add/edit the files, they can do so.
>      >
> 
>      That's NOT USB sharing at all!
>      That's just a general filesystem share (nfs,cifs,whatever network
>      share).
> 
>      You can do that with Xen, over the network, just like with physical
>      machines.
> 
>      -- Pasi
> 
>      >    Thanks,
>      >    Dhananjay
>      >
>      >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 5:24 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen
>      <[1][2]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
>      >
>      >      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 04:56:33PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>      >      > * *Also you wouldn't see the changes made in other VMs,
>      >      > * *unless you made sure all the caches are refreshed etc in the
>      VM all
>      >      the
>      >      > * *time.
>      >      >
>      >      > * *You'd need to use some cluster-filesystem (GFS, GFS2, OCFS2,
>      GPFS,
>      >      etc).
>      >      > * *--Can you please suggest how NFS manages this because this
>      case is
>      >      handled
>      >      > * *by NFS without any corruption?
>      >      > * *We can share flash drive across VMs as we do with physical
>      machines
>      >      in
>      >      > * *LAN. Please help!
>      >      >
>      >
>      >      How are you sharing USB flash drives with physical machines?
>      >
>      >      -- Pasi
>      >
>      >      > * *Thanks,
>      >      > * *Dhananjay
>      >      >
>      >      > * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:27 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen
>      >      <[1][2][3]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
>      >      >
>      >      > * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:53:54PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel
>      wrote:
>      >      > * * *> * *This won't be straight forward. Think about USB
>      memory/flash
>      >      stick.
>      >      > * * *> * *If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to it,
>      the
>      >      > * * *filesystem
>      >      > * * *> * *in it will get corrupted immediately!
>      >      > * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * *--Why would it get corrupted immediately. Might be we
>      can
>      >      just lock
>      >      > * * *a
>      >      > * * *> * *specific file which is being edited? Please suggest.
>      >      > * * *>
>      >      >
>      >      > * * *Because USB level has no idea about filesystems or files,
>      or
>      >      locking
>      >      > * * *them!
>      >      >
>      >      > * * *Say you're using ext3 or NTFS in the VM for the USB
>      device.
>      >      > * * *Those filesystems are NOT cluster-aware, ie. they're not
>      aware of
>      >      any
>      >      > * * *sharing,
>      >      > * * *and they don't support any kind of sharing.
>      >      >
>      >      > * * *They expect exclusive access to the device.
>      >      >
>      >      > * * *If suddenly the bits on the device change from outside,
>      >      > * * *the filesystem gets corrupted very easily.
>      >      >
>      >      > * * *Also you wouldn't see the changes made in other VMs,
>      >      > * * *unless you made sure all the caches are refreshed etc in
>      the VM
>      >      all the
>      >      > * * *time.
>      >      >
>      >      > * * *You'd need to use some cluster-filesystem (GFS, GFS2,
>      OCFS2,
>      >      GPFS, etc).
>      >      >
>      >      > * * *-- Pasi
>      >      >
>      >      > * * *> * *Thanks,
>      >      > * * *> * *Dhananjay
>      >      > * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:49 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen
>      >      > * * *<[1][2][3][4]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
>      >      > * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:45:12PM +0530, Dhananjay
>      Goel
>      >      wrote:
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * *No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is
>      for
>      >      direct
>      >      > * * *passthru to
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * *one/single vm.
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * *You'd need some filesystem share
>      (cifs/nfs/whatnot)
>      >      to make
>      >      > * * *such
>      >      > * * *> * * *sharing
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * *possible.
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * *Comments: Is it possible to share USB
>      keyboard, USB
>      >      mouse,
>      >      > * * *USB
>      >      > * * *> * * *modem, etc
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * *across VMs i.e host and guest(s)? If we
>      connect USB
>      >      > * * *keyboard, is it
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * *possible to use it in guests?
>      >      > * * *> * * *>
>      >      > * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *This is implemented in XCI (Xen Client Initiative),
>      and
>      >      there has
>      >      > * * *been
>      >      > * * *> * * *some discussions how to get it traditional Xen, to
>      help
>      >      Xen VGA
>      >      > * * *> * * *Passthrough usage.
>      >      > * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *See:
>      >      [2][3][4][5]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * *Also, is it possible for us to modify the
>      device
>      >      driver of
>      >      > * * *USB 2.0
>      >      > * * *> * * *so that
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * *all USB 2.0 devices are visible and can be
>      used
>      >      across all
>      >      > * * *VMs?
>      >      > * * *> * * *Please
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * *suggest.
>      >      > * * *> * * *>
>      >      > * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *This won't be straight forward. Think about USB
>      >      memory/flash
>      >      > * * *stick.
>      >      > * * *> * * *If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to
>      it, the
>      >      > * * *filesystem
>      >      > * * *> * * *in it will get corrupted immediately!
>      >      > * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *USB Passthru cannot be used to 'share' devices,
>      it's for
>      >      giving
>      >      > * * *> * * *one/single VM
>      >      > * * *> * * *direct access to the device.
>      >      > * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *-- Pasi
>      >      > * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * *Thanks,
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * *Dhananjay
>      >      > * * *> * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:16 PM, Pasi
>      K*rkk*inen
>      >      > * * *> * * *<[1][3][4][5][6]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
>      >      > * * *> * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 01:37:49PM +0530,
>      Dhananjay
>      >      Goel
>      >      > * * *wrote:
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Hi James/Pasi,
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *I had a look at
>      >      > * * *> * * *>
>      >      > * * *
>      >
>       [1][2][4][5][6][7]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *But I'm not sure if it supports sharing
>      USB
>      >      devices
>      >      > * * *across
>      >      > * * *> * * *VMs
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *(host and
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *guest) i.e. if I plug in a flash drive
>      then it
>      >      would
>      >      > * * *detect
>      >      > * * *> * * *in both
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *host
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *and guest and I'd be able edit files
>      from all
>      >      VMs
>      >      > * * *rather
>      >      > * * *> * * *than
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *mounting and
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *unmounting everytime from 1 VM to
>      other.
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Please let me know your thoughts on it.
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb is
>      for
>      >      direct
>      >      > * * *passthru
>      >      > * * *> * * *to
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *one/single vm.
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *You'd need some filesystem share
>      (cifs/nfs/whatnot)
>      >      to
>      >      > * * *make such
>      >      > * * *> * * *sharing
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *possible.
>      >      > * * *> * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *-- Pasi
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Thanks,
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Dhananjay
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:28 AM, James
>      Harper
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> *
>      *<[2][3][5][6][7][8]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au>
>      >      wrote:
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> Hi there!
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> First I'd like to say that XEN
>      plaform is
>      >      really
>      >      > * * *cool
>      >      > * * *> * * *and
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *awesome.
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> I'm an engineering student and is
>      >      searching for a
>      >      > * * *> * * *feasible
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *project in
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> virtualization. I'd like to know if
>      its
>      >      possible
>      >      > * * *to
>      >      > * * *> * * *share USB
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *devices
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *(flash
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards
>      etc)
>      >      across
>      >      > * * *guests
>      >      > * * *> * * *and host
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *(VMs).
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *Also, do
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> you have any idea to extend it? Or
>      any
>      >      innovative
>      >      > * * *idea
>      >      > * * *> * * *so that
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *we can
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> implement it.
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> I'd appreciate any help. Thanks in
>      >      advance.
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *Further to what Pasi said, I have
>      partially
>      >      ported
>      >      > * * *the
>      >      > * * *> * * *backend
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *interface
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *and can hand you the code if you
>      want. It's
>      >      > * * *probable a bit
>      >      > * * *> * * *stale
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *vs the
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *current kernels and leaks memory
>      under some
>      >      > * * *circumstances
>      >      > * * *> * * *but is
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *probably better than starting from
>      scratch.
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *James
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> References
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Visible links
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *1.
>      >      > * *
>      *[4][6][7][8][9]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *2.
>      >      mailto:[5][7][8][9][10]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >      > * * *> * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *> References
>      >      > * * *> * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * *Visible links
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * *1. mailto:[8][9][10][11]pasik@iki.fi
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * *2.
>      >      > * *
>      *[9][10][11][12]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * *3.
>      mailto:[10][11][12][13]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * *4.
>      >      > * *
>      *[11][12][13][14]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      > * * *> * * *> * *5.
>      mailto:[12][13][14][15]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >      > * * *>
>      >      > * * *> References
>      >      > * * *>
>      >      > * * *> * *Visible links
>      >      > * * *> * *1. mailto:[14][15][16]pasik@iki.fi
>      >      > * * *> * *2.
>      >      [15][16][17]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      >      > * * *> * *3. mailto:[16][17][18]pasik@iki.fi
>      >      > * * *> * *4.
>      >      [17][18][19]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      > * * *> * *5. mailto:[18][19][20]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >      > * * *> * *6.
>      >      [19][20][21]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      > * * *> * *7. mailto:[20][21][22]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >      > * * *> * *8. mailto:[21][22][23]pasik@iki.fi
>      >      > * * *> * *9.
>      >      [22][23][24]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      > * * *> * 10. mailto:[23][24][25]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >      > * * *> * 11.
>      >      [24][25][26]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      > * * *> * 12. mailto:[25][26][27]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >      >
>      >      > References
>      >      >
>      >      > * *Visible links
>      >      > * *1. mailto:[27][28]pasik@iki.fi
>      >      > * *2. mailto:[28][29]pasik@iki.fi
>      >      > * *3.
>      [29][30]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      >      > * *4. mailto:[30][31]pasik@iki.fi
>      >      > * *5.
>      [31][32]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      > * *6. mailto:[32][33]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >      > * *7.
>      [33][34]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      > * *8. mailto:[34][35]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >      > * *9. mailto:[35][36]pasik@iki.fi
>      >      > * 10.
>      [36][37]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      > * 11. mailto:[37][38]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >      > * 12.
>      [38][39]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      > * 13. mailto:[39][40]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >      > * 14. mailto:[40][41]pasik@iki.fi
>      >      > * 15.
>      [41][42]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      >      > * 16. mailto:[42][43]pasik@iki.fi
>      >      > * 17.
>      [43][44]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      > * 18. mailto:[44][45]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >      > * 19.
>      [45][46]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      > * 20. mailto:[46][47]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >      > * 21. mailto:[47][48]pasik@iki.fi
>      >      > * 22.
>      [48][49]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      > * 23. mailto:[49][50]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >      > * 24.
>      [50][51]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >      > * 25. mailto:[51][52]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >
>      > References
>      >
>      >    Visible links
>      >    1. mailto:[53]pasik@iki.fi
>      >    2. mailto:[54]pasik@iki.fi
>      >    3. mailto:[55]pasik@iki.fi
>      >    4. [56]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      >    5. mailto:[57]pasik@iki.fi
>      >    6. [58]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >    7. mailto:[59]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >    8. [60]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >    9. mailto:[61]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >   10. mailto:[62]pasik@iki.fi
>      >   11. [63]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >   12. mailto:[64]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >   13. [65]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >   14. mailto:[66]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >   15. mailto:[67]pasik@iki.fi
>      >   16. [68]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      >   17. mailto:[69]pasik@iki.fi
>      >   18. [70]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >   19. mailto:[71]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >   20. [72]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >   21. mailto:[73]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >   22. mailto:[74]pasik@iki.fi
>      >   23. [75]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >   24. mailto:[76]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >   25. [77]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >   26. mailto:[78]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >   27. mailto:[79]pasik@iki.fi
>      >   28. mailto:[80]pasik@iki.fi
>      >   29. [81]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      >   30. mailto:[82]pasik@iki.fi
>      >   31. [83]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >   32. mailto:[84]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >   33. [85]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >   34. mailto:[86]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >   35. mailto:[87]pasik@iki.fi
>      >   36. [88]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >   37. mailto:[89]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >   38. [90]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >   39. mailto:[91]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >   40. mailto:[92]pasik@iki.fi
>      >   41. [93]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      >   42. mailto:[94]pasik@iki.fi
>      >   43. [95]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >   44. mailto:[96]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >   45. [97]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >   46. mailto:[98]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >   47. mailto:[99]pasik@iki.fi
>      >   48. [100]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >   49. mailto:[101]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >   50. [102]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      >   51. mailto:[103]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> 
> References
> 
>    Visible links
>    1. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    2. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    3. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    4. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    5. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>    6. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    7. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>    8. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>    9. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   10. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   11. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   12. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   13. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   14. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   15. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   16. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   17. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>   18. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   19. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   20. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   21. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   22. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   23. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   24. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   25. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   26. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   27. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   28. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   29. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   30. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>   31. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   32. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   33. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   34. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   35. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   36. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   37. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   38. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   39. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   40. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   41. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   42. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>   43. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   44. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   45. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   46. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   47. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   48. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   49. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   50. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   51. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   52. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   53. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   54. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   55. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   56. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>   57. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   58. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   59. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   60. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   61. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   62. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   63. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   64. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   65. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   66. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   67. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   68. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>   69. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   70. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   71. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   72. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   73. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   74. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   75. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   76. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   77. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   78. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   79. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   80. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   81. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>   82. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   83. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   84. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   85. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   86. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   87. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   88. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   89. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   90. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   91. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   92. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   93. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>   94. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   95. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   96. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   97. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   98. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   99. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  100. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  101. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  102. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  103. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Michal Novotny]

On 08/27/2010 03:08 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:33:35PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>    
>>     Yes, exactly. So, we wanted to know if it is possible to *share USB*
>>     across VMs.
>>
>>      
> I don't think USB protocol has been designed for *sharing*.
> I'm pretty certain only one computer/device/VM can use USB device at a time.
>
> -- Pasi
>
>    

Pasi, I agree. I think the think here is that Dhananjay confused the USB 
device sharing with the file system sharing. I guess the USB protocol 
was not designed for sharing nevertheless sharing the filesystem on a 
USB stick is a completely different think.

Dhananajay, you need to plug in the USB stick onto one computer (and 
it's impossible to plug it into multiple computer at one time, of 
course) and then setup the sharing. Everybody here is talking about the 
hardware abstraction and virtualization and what you wrote is a 
completely different thing - it's software-related and this has nothing 
to do with the hardware emulation/abstraction what-so-ever.

Considering the NFS and all the sharing protocols there was something 
why it doesn't corrupt the data. I'm no expert on this subject but I 
think this is because they run in the server-client mode. All the 
clients are talking to the server and the server itself is one computer 
that's having the just one operating system working with this particular 
device - no matter what the underlaying device is - it may be everything 
- USB stick, IDE/SCSI/SAS drive or just a relay workstation to save all 
the data into one remote media (e.g. for replication). What I mean is 
that the basic thing is that it's running on only one operating system 
(because of it's connected to this one machine *only*) so it takes care 
of everything and it's aware of the write-cache and data operations 
being done to this media.

Michal

-- 
Michal Novotny<minovotn@redhat.com>, RHCE
Virtualization Team (xen userspace), Red Hat

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Christoph Egger]

On Friday 27 August 2010 15:08:47 Pasi Kärkkäinen wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:33:35PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> >    Yes, exactly. So, we wanted to know if it is possible to *share USB*
> >    across VMs.
>
> I don't think USB protocol has been designed for *sharing*.
> I'm pretty certain only one computer/device/VM can use USB device at a
> time.

This might work with firewire devices, I'm not sure.

Christoph


>
> -- Pasi
>
> >    Thanks,
> >    Dhananjay
> >
> >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 6:23 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen <[1]pasik@iki.fi>
> > wrote:
> >
> >      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:16:32PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> >      >    How are you sharing USB flash drives with physical machines
> >      >    Comment: In ubuntu, plug in flash drive and access /media
> >      > folder.
> >
> >      Then
> >
> >      >    right click and click on "Sharing Options". Once you share it
> >      > and
> >
> >      give
> >
> >      >    others the right to add/edit the files, they can do so.
> >
> >      That's NOT USB sharing at all!
> >      That's just a general filesystem share (nfs,cifs,whatever network
> >      share).
> >
> >      You can do that with Xen, over the network, just like with physical
> >      machines.
> >
> >      -- Pasi
> >
> >      >    Thanks,
> >      >    Dhananjay
> >      >
> >      >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 5:24 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen
> >
> >      <[1][2]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> >      >      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 04:56:33PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel 
wrote:
> >      >      > * *Also you wouldn't see the changes made in other VMs,
> >      >      > * *unless you made sure all the caches are refreshed etc in
> >      >      > the
> >
> >      VM all
> >
> >      >      the
> >      >
> >      >      > * *time.
> >      >      >
> >      >      > * *You'd need to use some cluster-filesystem (GFS, GFS2,
> >      >      > OCFS2,
> >
> >      GPFS,
> >
> >      >      etc).
> >      >
> >      >      > * *--Can you please suggest how NFS manages this because
> >      >      > this
> >
> >      case is
> >
> >      >      handled
> >      >
> >      >      > * *by NFS without any corruption?
> >      >      > * *We can share flash drive across VMs as we do with
> >      >      > physical
> >
> >      machines
> >
> >      >      in
> >      >
> >      >      > * *LAN. Please help!
> >      >
> >      >      How are you sharing USB flash drives with physical machines?
> >      >
> >      >      -- Pasi
> >      >
> >      >      > * *Thanks,
> >      >      > * *Dhananjay
> >      >      >
> >      >      > * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:27 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen
> >      >
> >      >      <[1][2][3]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> >      >      > * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:53:54PM +0530, Dhananjay
> >      >      > Goel
> >
> >      wrote:
> >      >      > * * *> * *This won't be straight forward. Think about USB
> >
> >      memory/flash
> >
> >      >      stick.
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *> * *If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to
> >      >      > it,
> >
> >      the
> >
> >      >      > * * *filesystem
> >      >      > * * *> * *in it will get corrupted immediately!
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * *--Why would it get corrupted immediately. Might
> >      >      > be we
> >
> >      can
> >
> >      >      just lock
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *a
> >      >      > * * *> * *specific file which is being edited? Please
> >      >      > suggest. * * *>
> >      >      >
> >      >      > * * *Because USB level has no idea about filesystems or
> >      >      > files,
> >
> >      or
> >
> >      >      locking
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *them!
> >      >      >
> >      >      > * * *Say you're using ext3 or NTFS in the VM for the USB
> >
> >      device.
> >
> >      >      > * * *Those filesystems are NOT cluster-aware, ie. they're
> >      >      > not
> >
> >      aware of
> >
> >      >      any
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *sharing,
> >      >      > * * *and they don't support any kind of sharing.
> >      >      >
> >      >      > * * *They expect exclusive access to the device.
> >      >      >
> >      >      > * * *If suddenly the bits on the device change from
> >      >      > outside, * * *the filesystem gets corrupted very easily.
> >      >      >
> >      >      > * * *Also you wouldn't see the changes made in other VMs,
> >      >      > * * *unless you made sure all the caches are refreshed etc
> >      >      > in
> >
> >      the VM
> >
> >      >      all the
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *time.
> >      >      >
> >      >      > * * *You'd need to use some cluster-filesystem (GFS, GFS2,
> >
> >      OCFS2,
> >
> >      >      GPFS, etc).
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *-- Pasi
> >      >      >
> >      >      > * * *> * *Thanks,
> >      >      > * * *> * *Dhananjay
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:49 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen
> >      >      > * * *<[1][2][3][4]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:45:12PM +0530,
> >      >      > Dhananjay
> >
> >      Goel
> >
> >      >      wrote:
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb
> >      >      > is
> >
> >      for
> >
> >      >      direct
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *passthru to
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *one/single vm.
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *You'd need some filesystem share
> >
> >      (cifs/nfs/whatnot)
> >
> >      >      to make
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *such
> >      >      > * * *> * * *sharing
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *possible.
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *Comments: Is it possible to share USB
> >
> >      keyboard, USB
> >
> >      >      mouse,
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *USB
> >      >      > * * *> * * *modem, etc
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *across VMs i.e host and guest(s)? If we
> >
> >      connect USB
> >
> >      >      > * * *keyboard, is it
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *possible to use it in guests?
> >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *This is implemented in XCI (Xen Client
> >      >      > Initiative),
> >
> >      and
> >
> >      >      there has
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *been
> >      >      > * * *> * * *some discussions how to get it traditional Xen,
> >      >      > to
> >
> >      help
> >
> >      >      Xen VGA
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *> * * *Passthrough usage.
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *See:
> >      >
> >      >     
> >      > [2][3][4][5]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *Also, is it possible for us to modify the
> >
> >      device
> >
> >      >      driver of
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *USB 2.0
> >      >      > * * *> * * *so that
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *all USB 2.0 devices are visible and can be
> >
> >      used
> >
> >      >      across all
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *VMs?
> >      >      > * * *> * * *Please
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *suggest.
> >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *This won't be straight forward. Think about USB
> >      >
> >      >      memory/flash
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *stick.
> >      >      > * * *> * * *If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes
> >      >      > to
> >
> >      it, the
> >
> >      >      > * * *filesystem
> >      >      > * * *> * * *in it will get corrupted immediately!
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *USB Passthru cannot be used to 'share' devices,
> >
> >      it's for
> >
> >      >      giving
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *> * * *one/single VM
> >      >      > * * *> * * *direct access to the device.
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *-- Pasi
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *Thanks,
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *Dhananjay
> >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:16 PM, Pasi
> >
> >      K*rkk*inen
> >
> >      >      > * * *> * * *<[1][3][4][5][6]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 01:37:49PM
> >      >      > +0530,
> >
> >      Dhananjay
> >
> >      >      Goel
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *wrote:
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Hi James/Pasi,
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *I had a look at
> >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *
> >
> >      
> > [1][2][4][5][6][7]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *But I'm not sure if it supports
> >      >      > sharing
> >
> >      USB
> >
> >      >      devices
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *across
> >      >      > * * *> * * *VMs
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *(host and
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *guest) i.e. if I plug in a flash
> >      >      > drive
> >
> >      then it
> >
> >      >      would
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *detect
> >      >      > * * *> * * *in both
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *host
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *and guest and I'd be able edit
> >      >      > files
> >
> >      from all
> >
> >      >      VMs
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *rather
> >      >      > * * *> * * *than
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *mounting and
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *unmounting everytime from 1 VM to
> >
> >      other.
> >
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Please let me know your thoughts on
> >      >      > it. * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *No, that's not possible with pvusb.
> >      >      > pvusb is
> >
> >      for
> >
> >      >      direct
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *passthru
> >      >      > * * *> * * *to
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *one/single vm.
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *You'd need some filesystem share
> >
> >      (cifs/nfs/whatnot)
> >
> >      >      to
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *make such
> >      >      > * * *> * * *sharing
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *possible.
> >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *-- Pasi
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Thanks,
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Dhananjay
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:28 AM,
> >      >      > James
> >
> >      Harper
> >
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> *
> >
> >      *<[2][3][5][6][7][8]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au>
> >
> >      >      wrote:
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> Hi there!
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> First I'd like to say that XEN
> >
> >      plaform is
> >
> >      >      really
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *cool
> >      >      > * * *> * * *and
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *awesome.
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> I'm an engineering student and
> >      >      > is
> >      >
> >      >      searching for a
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *> * * *feasible
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *project in
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> virtualization. I'd like to
> >      >      > know if
> >
> >      its
> >
> >      >      possible
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *to
> >      >      > * * *> * * *share USB
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *devices
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *(flash
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> drive, hard disk, mouse,
> >      >      > keyboards
> >
> >      etc)
> >
> >      >      across
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *guests
> >      >      > * * *> * * *and host
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *(VMs).
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *Also, do
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> you have any idea to extend it?
> >      >      > Or
> >
> >      any
> >
> >      >      innovative
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *idea
> >      >      > * * *> * * *so that
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *we can
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> implement it.
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> I'd appreciate any help. Thanks
> >      >      > in
> >      >
> >      >      advance.
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *Further to what Pasi said, I have
> >
> >      partially
> >
> >      >      ported
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *the
> >      >      > * * *> * * *backend
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *interface
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *and can hand you the code if you
> >
> >      want. It's
> >
> >      >      > * * *probable a bit
> >      >      > * * *> * * *stale
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *vs the
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *current kernels and leaks memory
> >
> >      under some
> >
> >      >      > * * *circumstances
> >      >      > * * *> * * *but is
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *probably better than starting
> >      >      > from
> >
> >      scratch.
> >
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *James
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> References
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Visible links
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *1.
> >      >      > * *
> >
> >      *[4][6][7][8][9]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *2.
> >      >
> >      >      mailto:[5][7][8][9][10]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> References
> >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *Visible links
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *1. mailto:[8][9][10][11]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *2.
> >      >      > * *
> >
> >      *[9][10][11][12]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *3.
> >
> >      mailto:[10][11][12][13]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *4.
> >      >      > * *
> >
> >      *[11][12][13][14]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *5.
> >
> >      mailto:[12][13][14][15]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> References
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * *Visible links
> >      >      > * * *> * *1. mailto:[14][15][16]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      > * * *> * *2.
> >      >
> >      >     
> >      > [15][16][17]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *> * *3. mailto:[16][17][18]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      > * * *> * *4.
> >      >
> >      >     
> >      > [17][18][19]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *> * *5.
> >      >      > mailto:[18][19][20]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au * * *> *
> >      >      > *6.
> >      >
> >      >     
> >      > [19][20][21]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *> * *7.
> >      >      > mailto:[20][21][22]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au * * *> *
> >      >      > *8. mailto:[21][22][23]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      > * * *> * *9.
> >      >
> >      >     
> >      > [22][23][24]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *> * 10.
> >      >      > mailto:[23][24][25]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au * * *> *
> >      >      > 11.
> >      >
> >      >     
> >      > [24][25][26]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >
> >      >      > * * *> * 12.
> >      >      > mailto:[25][26][27]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      >
> >      >      > References
> >      >      >
> >      >      > * *Visible links
> >      >      > * *1. mailto:[27][28]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      > * *2. mailto:[28][29]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      > * *3.
> >
> >      [29][30]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >
> >      >      > * *4. mailto:[30][31]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      > * *5.
> >
> >      [31][32]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >
> >      >      > * *6. mailto:[32][33]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      > * *7.
> >
> >      [33][34]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >
> >      >      > * *8. mailto:[34][35]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      > * *9. mailto:[35][36]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      > * 10.
> >
> >      [36][37]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >
> >      >      > * 11. mailto:[37][38]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      > * 12.
> >
> >      [38][39]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >
> >      >      > * 13. mailto:[39][40]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      > * 14. mailto:[40][41]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      > * 15.
> >
> >      [41][42]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >
> >      >      > * 16. mailto:[42][43]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      > * 17.
> >
> >      [43][44]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >
> >      >      > * 18. mailto:[44][45]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      > * 19.
> >
> >      [45][46]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >
> >      >      > * 20. mailto:[46][47]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      > * 21. mailto:[47][48]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      > * 22.
> >
> >      [48][49]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >
> >      >      > * 23. mailto:[49][50]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      > * 24.
> >
> >      [50][51]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >
> >      >      > * 25. mailto:[51][52]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >
> >      > References
> >      >
> >      >    Visible links
> >      >    1. mailto:[53]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >    2. mailto:[54]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >    3. mailto:[55]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >    4. [56]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >      >    5. mailto:[57]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >    6. [58]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >    7. mailto:[59]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >    8. [60]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >    9. mailto:[61]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   10. mailto:[62]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >   11. [63]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   12. mailto:[64]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   13. [65]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   14. mailto:[66]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   15. mailto:[67]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >   16. [68]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >      >   17. mailto:[69]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >   18. [70]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   19. mailto:[71]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   20. [72]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   21. mailto:[73]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   22. mailto:[74]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >   23. [75]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   24. mailto:[76]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   25. [77]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   26. mailto:[78]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   27. mailto:[79]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >   28. mailto:[80]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >   29. [81]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >      >   30. mailto:[82]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >   31. [83]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   32. mailto:[84]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   33. [85]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   34. mailto:[86]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   35. mailto:[87]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >   36. [88]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   37. mailto:[89]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   38. [90]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   39. mailto:[91]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   40. mailto:[92]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >   41. [93]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >      >   42. mailto:[94]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >   43. [95]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   44. mailto:[96]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   45. [97]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   46. mailto:[98]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   47. mailto:[99]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >   48. [100]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   49. mailto:[101]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   50. [102]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   51. mailto:[103]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >
> > References
> >
> >    Visible links
> >    1. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    2. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    3. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    4. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    5. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >    6. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    7. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >    8. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >    9. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   10. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   11. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   12. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   13. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   14. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   15. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   16. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   17. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >   18. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   19. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   20. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   21. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   22. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   23. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   24. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   25. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   26. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   27. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   28. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   29. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   30. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >   31. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   32. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   33. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   34. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   35. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   36. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   37. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   38. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   39. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   40. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   41. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   42. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >   43. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   44. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   45. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   46. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   47. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   48. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   49. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   50. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   51. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   52. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   53. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   54. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   55. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   56. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >   57. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   58. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   59. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   60. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   61. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   62. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   63. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   64. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   65. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   66. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   67. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   68. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >   69. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   70. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   71. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   72. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   73. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   74. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   75. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   76. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   77. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   78. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   79. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   80. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   81. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >   82. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   83. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   84. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   85. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   86. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   87. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   88. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   89. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   90. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   91. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   92. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   93. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >   94. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   95. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   96. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   97. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   98. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   99. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >  100. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >  101. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >  102. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >  103. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>
> _______________________________________________
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> Xen-devel@lists.xensource.com
> http://lists.xensource.com/xen-devel



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Re: Virtualization project idea

[Pasi Kärkkäinen]

On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 03:18:01PM +0200, Christoph Egger wrote:
> On Friday 27 August 2010 15:08:47 Pasi Kärkkäinen wrote:
> > On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:33:35PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> > >    Yes, exactly. So, we wanted to know if it is possible to *share USB*
> > >    across VMs.
> >
> > I don't think USB protocol has been designed for *sharing*.
> > I'm pretty certain only one computer/device/VM can use USB device at a
> > time.
> 
> This might work with firewire devices, I'm not sure.
> 

Yeah, firewire (iee1394) is designed to so that you can attach
the devices to multiple computers..

If you attach the same firewire-disk to multiple computers,
and use the disk from multiple computers at the same time,
you *will* corrupt the filesystem on the disk.

Unless you run some kind of filesystem that has lock-manager,
that can coordinate the shared access to the disk.. 
ie. you must be running cluster-aware filesystem.

-- Pasi

> Christoph
> 
> 
> >
> > -- Pasi
> >
> > >    Thanks,
> > >    Dhananjay
> > >
> > >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 6:23 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen <[1]pasik@iki.fi>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > >      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:16:32PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> > >      >    How are you sharing USB flash drives with physical machines
> > >      >    Comment: In ubuntu, plug in flash drive and access /media
> > >      > folder.
> > >
> > >      Then
> > >
> > >      >    right click and click on "Sharing Options". Once you share it
> > >      > and
> > >
> > >      give
> > >
> > >      >    others the right to add/edit the files, they can do so.
> > >
> > >      That's NOT USB sharing at all!
> > >      That's just a general filesystem share (nfs,cifs,whatever network
> > >      share).
> > >
> > >      You can do that with Xen, over the network, just like with physical
> > >      machines.
> > >
> > >      -- Pasi
> > >
> > >      >    Thanks,
> > >      >    Dhananjay
> > >      >
> > >      >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 5:24 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen
> > >
> > >      <[1][2]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> > >      >      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 04:56:33PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel 
> wrote:
> > >      >      > * *Also you wouldn't see the changes made in other VMs,
> > >      >      > * *unless you made sure all the caches are refreshed etc in
> > >      >      > the
> > >
> > >      VM all
> > >
> > >      >      the
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * *time.
> > >      >      >
> > >      >      > * *You'd need to use some cluster-filesystem (GFS, GFS2,
> > >      >      > OCFS2,
> > >
> > >      GPFS,
> > >
> > >      >      etc).
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * *--Can you please suggest how NFS manages this because
> > >      >      > this
> > >
> > >      case is
> > >
> > >      >      handled
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * *by NFS without any corruption?
> > >      >      > * *We can share flash drive across VMs as we do with
> > >      >      > physical
> > >
> > >      machines
> > >
> > >      >      in
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * *LAN. Please help!
> > >      >
> > >      >      How are you sharing USB flash drives with physical machines?
> > >      >
> > >      >      -- Pasi
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * *Thanks,
> > >      >      > * *Dhananjay
> > >      >      >
> > >      >      > * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:27 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen
> > >      >
> > >      >      <[1][2][3]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> > >      >      > * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:53:54PM +0530, Dhananjay
> > >      >      > Goel
> > >
> > >      wrote:
> > >      >      > * * *> * *This won't be straight forward. Think about USB
> > >
> > >      memory/flash
> > >
> > >      >      stick.
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *> * *If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to
> > >      >      > it,
> > >
> > >      the
> > >
> > >      >      > * * *filesystem
> > >      >      > * * *> * *in it will get corrupted immediately!
> > >      >      > * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * *--Why would it get corrupted immediately. Might
> > >      >      > be we
> > >
> > >      can
> > >
> > >      >      just lock
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *a
> > >      >      > * * *> * *specific file which is being edited? Please
> > >      >      > suggest. * * *>
> > >      >      >
> > >      >      > * * *Because USB level has no idea about filesystems or
> > >      >      > files,
> > >
> > >      or
> > >
> > >      >      locking
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *them!
> > >      >      >
> > >      >      > * * *Say you're using ext3 or NTFS in the VM for the USB
> > >
> > >      device.
> > >
> > >      >      > * * *Those filesystems are NOT cluster-aware, ie. they're
> > >      >      > not
> > >
> > >      aware of
> > >
> > >      >      any
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *sharing,
> > >      >      > * * *and they don't support any kind of sharing.
> > >      >      >
> > >      >      > * * *They expect exclusive access to the device.
> > >      >      >
> > >      >      > * * *If suddenly the bits on the device change from
> > >      >      > outside, * * *the filesystem gets corrupted very easily.
> > >      >      >
> > >      >      > * * *Also you wouldn't see the changes made in other VMs,
> > >      >      > * * *unless you made sure all the caches are refreshed etc
> > >      >      > in
> > >
> > >      the VM
> > >
> > >      >      all the
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *time.
> > >      >      >
> > >      >      > * * *You'd need to use some cluster-filesystem (GFS, GFS2,
> > >
> > >      OCFS2,
> > >
> > >      >      GPFS, etc).
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *-- Pasi
> > >      >      >
> > >      >      > * * *> * *Thanks,
> > >      >      > * * *> * *Dhananjay
> > >      >      > * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:49 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen
> > >      >      > * * *<[1][2][3][4]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> > >      >      > * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:45:12PM +0530,
> > >      >      > Dhananjay
> > >
> > >      Goel
> > >
> > >      >      wrote:
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb
> > >      >      > is
> > >
> > >      for
> > >
> > >      >      direct
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *passthru to
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *one/single vm.
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *You'd need some filesystem share
> > >
> > >      (cifs/nfs/whatnot)
> > >
> > >      >      to make
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *such
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *sharing
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *possible.
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *Comments: Is it possible to share USB
> > >
> > >      keyboard, USB
> > >
> > >      >      mouse,
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *USB
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *modem, etc
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *across VMs i.e host and guest(s)? If we
> > >
> > >      connect USB
> > >
> > >      >      > * * *keyboard, is it
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *possible to use it in guests?
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *This is implemented in XCI (Xen Client
> > >      >      > Initiative),
> > >
> > >      and
> > >
> > >      >      there has
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *been
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *some discussions how to get it traditional Xen,
> > >      >      > to
> > >
> > >      help
> > >
> > >      >      Xen VGA
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *Passthrough usage.
> > >      >      > * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *See:
> > >      >
> > >      >     
> > >      > [2][3][4][5]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *Also, is it possible for us to modify the
> > >
> > >      device
> > >
> > >      >      driver of
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *USB 2.0
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *so that
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *all USB 2.0 devices are visible and can be
> > >
> > >      used
> > >
> > >      >      across all
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *VMs?
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *Please
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *suggest.
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *This won't be straight forward. Think about USB
> > >      >
> > >      >      memory/flash
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *stick.
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes
> > >      >      > to
> > >
> > >      it, the
> > >
> > >      >      > * * *filesystem
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *in it will get corrupted immediately!
> > >      >      > * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *USB Passthru cannot be used to 'share' devices,
> > >
> > >      it's for
> > >
> > >      >      giving
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *one/single VM
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *direct access to the device.
> > >      >      > * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *-- Pasi
> > >      >      > * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *Thanks,
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *Dhananjay
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:16 PM, Pasi
> > >
> > >      K*rkk*inen
> > >
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *<[1][3][4][5][6]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 01:37:49PM
> > >      >      > +0530,
> > >
> > >      Dhananjay
> > >
> > >      >      Goel
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *wrote:
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Hi James/Pasi,
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *I had a look at
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *
> > >
> > >      
> > > [1][2][4][5][6][7]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *But I'm not sure if it supports
> > >      >      > sharing
> > >
> > >      USB
> > >
> > >      >      devices
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *across
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *VMs
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *(host and
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *guest) i.e. if I plug in a flash
> > >      >      > drive
> > >
> > >      then it
> > >
> > >      >      would
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *detect
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *in both
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *host
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *and guest and I'd be able edit
> > >      >      > files
> > >
> > >      from all
> > >
> > >      >      VMs
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *rather
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *than
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *mounting and
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *unmounting everytime from 1 VM to
> > >
> > >      other.
> > >
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Please let me know your thoughts on
> > >      >      > it. * * *> * * *> * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *No, that's not possible with pvusb.
> > >      >      > pvusb is
> > >
> > >      for
> > >
> > >      >      direct
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *passthru
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *to
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *one/single vm.
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *You'd need some filesystem share
> > >
> > >      (cifs/nfs/whatnot)
> > >
> > >      >      to
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *make such
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *sharing
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *possible.
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *-- Pasi
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Thanks,
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Dhananjay
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:28 AM,
> > >      >      > James
> > >
> > >      Harper
> > >
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> *
> > >
> > >      *<[2][3][5][6][7][8]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au>
> > >
> > >      >      wrote:
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> Hi there!
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> First I'd like to say that XEN
> > >
> > >      plaform is
> > >
> > >      >      really
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *cool
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *and
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *awesome.
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> I'm an engineering student and
> > >      >      > is
> > >      >
> > >      >      searching for a
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *feasible
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *project in
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> virtualization. I'd like to
> > >      >      > know if
> > >
> > >      its
> > >
> > >      >      possible
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *to
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *share USB
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *devices
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *(flash
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> drive, hard disk, mouse,
> > >      >      > keyboards
> > >
> > >      etc)
> > >
> > >      >      across
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *guests
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *and host
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *(VMs).
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *Also, do
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> you have any idea to extend it?
> > >      >      > Or
> > >
> > >      any
> > >
> > >      >      innovative
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *idea
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *so that
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *we can
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> implement it.
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> I'd appreciate any help. Thanks
> > >      >      > in
> > >      >
> > >      >      advance.
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *Further to what Pasi said, I have
> > >
> > >      partially
> > >
> > >      >      ported
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *the
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *backend
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *interface
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *and can hand you the code if you
> > >
> > >      want. It's
> > >
> > >      >      > * * *probable a bit
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *stale
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *vs the
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *current kernels and leaks memory
> > >
> > >      under some
> > >
> > >      >      > * * *circumstances
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *but is
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *probably better than starting
> > >      >      > from
> > >
> > >      scratch.
> > >
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *James
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> References
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Visible links
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *1.
> > >      >      > * *
> > >
> > >      *[4][6][7][8][9]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *2.
> > >      >
> > >      >      mailto:[5][7][8][9][10]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> References
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *Visible links
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *1. mailto:[8][9][10][11]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *2.
> > >      >      > * *
> > >
> > >      *[9][10][11][12]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *3.
> > >
> > >      mailto:[10][11][12][13]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *4.
> > >      >      > * *
> > >
> > >      *[11][12][13][14]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >
> > >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *5.
> > >
> > >      mailto:[12][13][14][15]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >
> > >      >      > * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> References
> > >      >      > * * *>
> > >      >      > * * *> * *Visible links
> > >      >      > * * *> * *1. mailto:[14][15][16]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >      > * * *> * *2.
> > >      >
> > >      >     
> > >      > [15][16][17]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *> * *3. mailto:[16][17][18]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >      > * * *> * *4.
> > >      >
> > >      >     
> > >      > [17][18][19]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *> * *5.
> > >      >      > mailto:[18][19][20]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au * * *> *
> > >      >      > *6.
> > >      >
> > >      >     
> > >      > [19][20][21]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *> * *7.
> > >      >      > mailto:[20][21][22]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au * * *> *
> > >      >      > *8. mailto:[21][22][23]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >      > * * *> * *9.
> > >      >
> > >      >     
> > >      > [22][23][24]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *> * 10.
> > >      >      > mailto:[23][24][25]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au * * *> *
> > >      >      > 11.
> > >      >
> > >      >     
> > >      > [24][25][26]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >      >
> > >      >      > * * *> * 12.
> > >      >      > mailto:[25][26][27]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >      >
> > >      >      > References
> > >      >      >
> > >      >      > * *Visible links
> > >      >      > * *1. mailto:[27][28]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >      > * *2. mailto:[28][29]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >      > * *3.
> > >
> > >      [29][30]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> > >
> > >      >      > * *4. mailto:[30][31]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >      > * *5.
> > >
> > >      [31][32]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >
> > >      >      > * *6. mailto:[32][33]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >      > * *7.
> > >
> > >      [33][34]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >
> > >      >      > * *8. mailto:[34][35]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >      > * *9. mailto:[35][36]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >      > * 10.
> > >
> > >      [36][37]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >
> > >      >      > * 11. mailto:[37][38]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >      > * 12.
> > >
> > >      [38][39]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >
> > >      >      > * 13. mailto:[39][40]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >      > * 14. mailto:[40][41]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >      > * 15.
> > >
> > >      [41][42]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> > >
> > >      >      > * 16. mailto:[42][43]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >      > * 17.
> > >
> > >      [43][44]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >
> > >      >      > * 18. mailto:[44][45]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >      > * 19.
> > >
> > >      [45][46]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >
> > >      >      > * 20. mailto:[46][47]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >      > * 21. mailto:[47][48]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >      > * 22.
> > >
> > >      [48][49]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >
> > >      >      > * 23. mailto:[49][50]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >      > * 24.
> > >
> > >      [50][51]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >
> > >      >      > * 25. mailto:[51][52]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >
> > >      > References
> > >      >
> > >      >    Visible links
> > >      >    1. mailto:[53]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >    2. mailto:[54]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >    3. mailto:[55]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >    4. [56]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> > >      >    5. mailto:[57]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >    6. [58]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >      >    7. mailto:[59]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >    8. [60]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >      >    9. mailto:[61]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >   10. mailto:[62]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >   11. [63]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >      >   12. mailto:[64]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >   13. [65]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >      >   14. mailto:[66]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >   15. mailto:[67]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >   16. [68]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> > >      >   17. mailto:[69]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >   18. [70]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >      >   19. mailto:[71]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >   20. [72]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >      >   21. mailto:[73]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >   22. mailto:[74]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >   23. [75]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >      >   24. mailto:[76]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >   25. [77]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >      >   26. mailto:[78]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >   27. mailto:[79]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >   28. mailto:[80]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >   29. [81]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> > >      >   30. mailto:[82]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >   31. [83]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >      >   32. mailto:[84]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >   33. [85]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >      >   34. mailto:[86]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >   35. mailto:[87]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >   36. [88]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >      >   37. mailto:[89]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >   38. [90]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >      >   39. mailto:[91]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >   40. mailto:[92]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >   41. [93]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> > >      >   42. mailto:[94]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >   43. [95]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >      >   44. mailto:[96]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >   45. [97]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >      >   46. mailto:[98]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >   47. mailto:[99]pasik@iki.fi
> > >      >   48. [100]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >      >   49. mailto:[101]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >      >   50. [102]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >      >   51. mailto:[103]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >
> > > References
> > >
> > >    Visible links
> > >    1. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >    2. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >    3. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >    4. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >    5. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> > >    6. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >    7. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >    8. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >    9. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   10. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   11. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   12. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   13. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   14. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   15. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   16. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   17. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> > >   18. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   19. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   20. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   21. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   22. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   23. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   24. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   25. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   26. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   27. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   28. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   29. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   30. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> > >   31. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   32. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   33. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   34. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   35. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   36. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   37. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   38. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   39. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   40. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   41. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   42. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> > >   43. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   44. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   45. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   46. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   47. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   48. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   49. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   50. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   51. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   52. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   53. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   54. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   55. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   56. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> > >   57. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   58. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   59. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   60. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   61. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   62. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   63. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   64. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   65. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   66. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   67. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   68. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> > >   69. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   70. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   71. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   72. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   73. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   74. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   75. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   76. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   77. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   78. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   79. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   80. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   81. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> > >   82. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   83. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   84. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   85. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   86. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   87. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   88. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   89. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   90. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   91. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   92. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   93. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> > >   94. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >   95. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   96. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   97. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >   98. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >   99. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> > >  100. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >  101. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> > >  102. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> > >  103. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Xen-devel mailing list
> > Xen-devel@lists.xensource.com
> > http://lists.xensource.com/xen-devel
> 
> 
> 
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> 

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Michal Novotny]

On 08/27/2010 03:22 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 03:18:01PM +0200, Christoph Egger wrote:
>    
>> On Friday 27 August 2010 15:08:47 Pasi Kärkkäinen wrote:
>>      
>>> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:33:35PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>>>        
>>>>     Yes, exactly. So, we wanted to know if it is possible to *share USB*
>>>>     across VMs.
>>>>          
>>> I don't think USB protocol has been designed for *sharing*.
>>> I'm pretty certain only one computer/device/VM can use USB device at a
>>> time.
>>>        
>> This might work with firewire devices, I'm not sure.
>>
>>      
> Yeah, firewire (iee1394) is designed to so that you can attach
> the devices to multiple computers..
>
> If you attach the same firewire-disk to multiple computers,
> and use the disk from multiple computers at the same time,
> you *will* corrupt the filesystem on the disk.
>
> Unless you run some kind of filesystem that has lock-manager,
> that can coordinate the shared access to the disk..
> ie. you must be running cluster-aware filesystem.
>
> -- Pasi
>
>    
Well guys, but we're talking about USB. The USB protocol is different 
from firewire one. But that's right that I didn't know that. How is it 
exactly done with the firewire to connect to multiple computers?

Michal

-- 
Michal Novotny<minovotn@redhat.com>, RHCE
Virtualization Team (xen userspace), Red Hat

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Dhananjay Goel]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 25532 bytes --]

I don't think USB protocol has been designed for *sharing*.
I'm pretty certain only one computer/device/VM can use USB device at a time.

--Please check: http://spice-space.org/ They're trying similar thing.

Thanks,
Dhananjay


On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 6:38 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen <pasik@iki.fi> wrote:

> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:33:35PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> >    Yes, exactly. So, we wanted to know if it is possible to *share USB*
> >    across VMs.
> >
>
> I don't think USB protocol has been designed for *sharing*.
> I'm pretty certain only one computer/device/VM can use USB device at a
> time.
>
> -- Pasi
>
> >    Thanks,
> >    Dhananjay
> >
> >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 6:23 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen <[1]pasik@iki.fi>
> wrote:
> >
> >      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:16:32PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> >      >    How are you sharing USB flash drives with physical machines
> >      >    Comment: In ubuntu, plug in flash drive and access /media
> folder.
> >      Then
> >      >    right click and click on "Sharing Options". Once you share it
> and
> >      give
> >      >    others the right to add/edit the files, they can do so.
> >      >
> >
> >      That's NOT USB sharing at all!
> >      That's just a general filesystem share (nfs,cifs,whatever network
> >      share).
> >
> >      You can do that with Xen, over the network, just like with physical
> >      machines.
> >
> >      -- Pasi
> >
> >      >    Thanks,
> >      >    Dhananjay
> >      >
> >      >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 5:24 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen
> >      <[1][2]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> >      >
> >      >      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 04:56:33PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel
> wrote:
> >      >      > * *Also you wouldn't see the changes made in other VMs,
> >      >      > * *unless you made sure all the caches are refreshed etc in
> the
> >      VM all
> >      >      the
> >      >      > * *time.
> >      >      >
> >      >      > * *You'd need to use some cluster-filesystem (GFS, GFS2,
> OCFS2,
> >      GPFS,
> >      >      etc).
> >      >      > * *--Can you please suggest how NFS manages this because
> this
> >      case is
> >      >      handled
> >      >      > * *by NFS without any corruption?
> >      >      > * *We can share flash drive across VMs as we do with
> physical
> >      machines
> >      >      in
> >      >      > * *LAN. Please help!
> >      >      >
> >      >
> >      >      How are you sharing USB flash drives with physical machines?
> >      >
> >      >      -- Pasi
> >      >
> >      >      > * *Thanks,
> >      >      > * *Dhananjay
> >      >      >
> >      >      > * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:27 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen
> >      >      <[1][2][3]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> >      >      >
> >      >      > * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:53:54PM +0530, Dhananjay
> Goel
> >      wrote:
> >      >      > * * *> * *This won't be straight forward. Think about USB
> >      memory/flash
> >      >      stick.
> >      >      > * * *> * *If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes to
> it,
> >      the
> >      >      > * * *filesystem
> >      >      > * * *> * *in it will get corrupted immediately!
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * *--Why would it get corrupted immediately. Might
> be we
> >      can
> >      >      just lock
> >      >      > * * *a
> >      >      > * * *> * *specific file which is being edited? Please
> suggest.
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      >
> >      >      > * * *Because USB level has no idea about filesystems or
> files,
> >      or
> >      >      locking
> >      >      > * * *them!
> >      >      >
> >      >      > * * *Say you're using ext3 or NTFS in the VM for the USB
> >      device.
> >      >      > * * *Those filesystems are NOT cluster-aware, ie. they're
> not
> >      aware of
> >      >      any
> >      >      > * * *sharing,
> >      >      > * * *and they don't support any kind of sharing.
> >      >      >
> >      >      > * * *They expect exclusive access to the device.
> >      >      >
> >      >      > * * *If suddenly the bits on the device change from
> outside,
> >      >      > * * *the filesystem gets corrupted very easily.
> >      >      >
> >      >      > * * *Also you wouldn't see the changes made in other VMs,
> >      >      > * * *unless you made sure all the caches are refreshed etc
> in
> >      the VM
> >      >      all the
> >      >      > * * *time.
> >      >      >
> >      >      > * * *You'd need to use some cluster-filesystem (GFS, GFS2,
> >      OCFS2,
> >      >      GPFS, etc).
> >      >      >
> >      >      > * * *-- Pasi
> >      >      >
> >      >      > * * *> * *Thanks,
> >      >      > * * *> * *Dhananjay
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:49 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen
> >      >      > * * *<[1][2][3][4]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:45:12PM +0530,
> Dhananjay
> >      Goel
> >      >      wrote:
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *No, that's not possible with pvusb. pvusb
> is
> >      for
> >      >      direct
> >      >      > * * *passthru to
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *one/single vm.
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *You'd need some filesystem share
> >      (cifs/nfs/whatnot)
> >      >      to make
> >      >      > * * *such
> >      >      > * * *> * * *sharing
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *possible.
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *Comments: Is it possible to share USB
> >      keyboard, USB
> >      >      mouse,
> >      >      > * * *USB
> >      >      > * * *> * * *modem, etc
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *across VMs i.e host and guest(s)? If we
> >      connect USB
> >      >      > * * *keyboard, is it
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *possible to use it in guests?
> >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *This is implemented in XCI (Xen Client
> Initiative),
> >      and
> >      >      there has
> >      >      > * * *been
> >      >      > * * *> * * *some discussions how to get it traditional Xen,
> to
> >      help
> >      >      Xen VGA
> >      >      > * * *> * * *Passthrough usage.
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *See:
> >      >      [2][3][4][5]
> http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *Also, is it possible for us to modify the
> >      device
> >      >      driver of
> >      >      > * * *USB 2.0
> >      >      > * * *> * * *so that
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *all USB 2.0 devices are visible and can be
> >      used
> >      >      across all
> >      >      > * * *VMs?
> >      >      > * * *> * * *Please
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *suggest.
> >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *This won't be straight forward. Think about USB
> >      >      memory/flash
> >      >      > * * *stick.
> >      >      > * * *> * * *If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes
> to
> >      it, the
> >      >      > * * *filesystem
> >      >      > * * *> * * *in it will get corrupted immediately!
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *USB Passthru cannot be used to 'share' devices,
> >      it's for
> >      >      giving
> >      >      > * * *> * * *one/single VM
> >      >      > * * *> * * *direct access to the device.
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *-- Pasi
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *Thanks,
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *Dhananjay
> >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:16 PM, Pasi
> >      K*rkk*inen
> >      >      > * * *> * * *<[1][3][4][5][6]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 01:37:49PM
> +0530,
> >      Dhananjay
> >      >      Goel
> >      >      > * * *wrote:
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Hi James/Pasi,
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *I had a look at
> >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *
> >      >
> >       [1][2][4][5][6][7]
> http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *But I'm not sure if it supports
> sharing
> >      USB
> >      >      devices
> >      >      > * * *across
> >      >      > * * *> * * *VMs
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *(host and
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *guest) i.e. if I plug in a flash
> drive
> >      then it
> >      >      would
> >      >      > * * *detect
> >      >      > * * *> * * *in both
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *host
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *and guest and I'd be able edit
> files
> >      from all
> >      >      VMs
> >      >      > * * *rather
> >      >      > * * *> * * *than
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *mounting and
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *unmounting everytime from 1 VM to
> >      other.
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Please let me know your thoughts on
> it.
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *No, that's not possible with pvusb.
> pvusb is
> >      for
> >      >      direct
> >      >      > * * *passthru
> >      >      > * * *> * * *to
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *one/single vm.
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *You'd need some filesystem share
> >      (cifs/nfs/whatnot)
> >      >      to
> >      >      > * * *make such
> >      >      > * * *> * * *sharing
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *possible.
> >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *-- Pasi
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Thanks,
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Dhananjay
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:28 AM,
> James
> >      Harper
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> *
> >      *<[2][3][5][6][7][8]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au>
> >      >      wrote:
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> Hi there!
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> First I'd like to say that XEN
> >      plaform is
> >      >      really
> >      >      > * * *cool
> >      >      > * * *> * * *and
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *awesome.
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> I'm an engineering student and
> is
> >      >      searching for a
> >      >      > * * *> * * *feasible
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *project in
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> virtualization. I'd like to
> know if
> >      its
> >      >      possible
> >      >      > * * *to
> >      >      > * * *> * * *share USB
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *devices
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *(flash
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> drive, hard disk, mouse,
> keyboards
> >      etc)
> >      >      across
> >      >      > * * *guests
> >      >      > * * *> * * *and host
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *(VMs).
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *Also, do
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> you have any idea to extend it?
> Or
> >      any
> >      >      innovative
> >      >      > * * *idea
> >      >      > * * *> * * *so that
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *we can
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> implement it.
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> I'd appreciate any help. Thanks
> in
> >      >      advance.
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *Further to what Pasi said, I have
> >      partially
> >      >      ported
> >      >      > * * *the
> >      >      > * * *> * * *backend
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *interface
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *and can hand you the code if you
> >      want. It's
> >      >      > * * *probable a bit
> >      >      > * * *> * * *stale
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *vs the
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *current kernels and leaks memory
> >      under some
> >      >      > * * *circumstances
> >      >      > * * *> * * *but is
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *probably better than starting
> from
> >      scratch.
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *James
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> References
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Visible links
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *1.
> >      >      > * *
> >      *[4][6][7][8][9]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *2.
> >      >      mailto:[5][7][8][9][10]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> References
> >      >      > * * *> * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *Visible links
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *1. mailto:[8][9][10][11]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *2.
> >      >      > * *
> >      *[9][10][11][12]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *3.
> >      mailto:[10][11][12][13]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *4.
> >      >      > * *
> >      *[11][12][13][14]
> http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      > * * *> * * *> * *5.
> >      mailto:[12][13][14][15]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> References
> >      >      > * * *>
> >      >      > * * *> * *Visible links
> >      >      > * * *> * *1. mailto:[14][15][16]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      > * * *> * *2.
> >      >      [15][16][17]
> http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >      >      > * * *> * *3. mailto:[16][17][18]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      > * * *> * *4.
> >      >      [17][18][19]
> http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      > * * *> * *5. mailto:[18][19][20]
> james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      > * * *> * *6.
> >      >      [19][20][21]
> http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      > * * *> * *7. mailto:[20][21][22]
> james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      > * * *> * *8. mailto:[21][22][23]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      > * * *> * *9.
> >      >      [22][23][24]
> http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      > * * *> * 10. mailto:[23][24][25]
> james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      > * * *> * 11.
> >      >      [24][25][26]
> http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      > * * *> * 12. mailto:[25][26][27]
> james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      >
> >      >      > References
> >      >      >
> >      >      > * *Visible links
> >      >      > * *1. mailto:[27][28]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      > * *2. mailto:[28][29]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      > * *3.
> >      [29][30]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >      >      > * *4. mailto:[30][31]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      > * *5.
> >      [31][32]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      > * *6. mailto:[32][33]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      > * *7.
> >      [33][34]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      > * *8. mailto:[34][35]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      > * *9. mailto:[35][36]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      > * 10.
> >      [36][37]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      > * 11. mailto:[37][38]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      > * 12.
> >      [38][39]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      > * 13. mailto:[39][40]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      > * 14. mailto:[40][41]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      > * 15.
> >      [41][42]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >      >      > * 16. mailto:[42][43]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      > * 17.
> >      [43][44]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      > * 18. mailto:[44][45]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      > * 19.
> >      [45][46]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      > * 20. mailto:[46][47]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      > * 21. mailto:[47][48]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >      > * 22.
> >      [48][49]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      > * 23. mailto:[49][50]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >      > * 24.
> >      [50][51]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >      > * 25. mailto:[51][52]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >
> >      > References
> >      >
> >      >    Visible links
> >      >    1. mailto:[53]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >    2. mailto:[54]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >    3. mailto:[55]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >    4. [56]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >      >    5. mailto:[57]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >    6. [58]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >    7. mailto:[59]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >    8. [60]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >    9. mailto:[61]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   10. mailto:[62]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >   11. [63]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   12. mailto:[64]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   13. [65]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   14. mailto:[66]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   15. mailto:[67]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >   16. [68]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >      >   17. mailto:[69]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >   18. [70]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   19. mailto:[71]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   20. [72]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   21. mailto:[73]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   22. mailto:[74]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >   23. [75]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   24. mailto:[76]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   25. [77]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   26. mailto:[78]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   27. mailto:[79]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >   28. mailto:[80]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >   29. [81]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >      >   30. mailto:[82]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >   31. [83]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   32. mailto:[84]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   33. [85]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   34. mailto:[86]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   35. mailto:[87]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >   36. [88]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   37. mailto:[89]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   38. [90]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   39. mailto:[91]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   40. mailto:[92]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >   41. [93]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >      >   42. mailto:[94]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >   43. [95]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   44. mailto:[96]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   45. [97]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   46. mailto:[98]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   47. mailto:[99]pasik@iki.fi
> >      >   48. [100]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   49. mailto:[101]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >      >   50. [102]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >      >   51. mailto:[103]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >
> > References
> >
> >    Visible links
> >    1. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    2. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    3. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    4. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    5. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >    6. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >    7. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >    8. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >    9. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   10. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   11. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   12. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   13. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   14. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   15. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   16. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   17. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >   18. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   19. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   20. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   21. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   22. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   23. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   24. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   25. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   26. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   27. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   28. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   29. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   30. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >   31. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   32. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   33. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   34. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   35. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   36. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   37. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   38. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   39. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   40. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   41. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   42. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >   43. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   44. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   45. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   46. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   47. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   48. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   49. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   50. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   51. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   52. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   53. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   54. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   55. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   56. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >   57. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   58. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   59. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   60. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   61. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   62. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   63. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   64. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   65. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   66. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   67. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   68. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >   69. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   70. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   71. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   72. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   73. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   74. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   75. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   76. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   77. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   78. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   79. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   80. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   81. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >   82. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   83. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   84. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   85. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   86. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   87. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   88. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   89. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   90. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   91. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   92. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   93. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
> >   94. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >   95. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   96. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   97. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >   98. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >   99. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
> >  100. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >  101. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> >  102. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
> >  103. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>

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Re: Virtualization project idea

[Pasi Kärkkäinen]

On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 03:17:39PM +0200, Michal Novotny wrote:
> On 08/27/2010 03:08 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen wrote:
>> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:33:35PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>>    
>>>     Yes, exactly. So, we wanted to know if it is possible to *share USB*
>>>     across VMs.
>>>
>>>      
>> I don't think USB protocol has been designed for *sharing*.
>> I'm pretty certain only one computer/device/VM can use USB device at a time.
>>
>> -- Pasi
>>
>>    
>
> Pasi, I agree. I think the think here is that Dhananjay confused the USB  
> device sharing with the file system sharing. I guess the USB protocol  
> was not designed for sharing nevertheless sharing the filesystem on a  
> USB stick is a completely different think.
>
> Dhananajay, you need to plug in the USB stick onto one computer (and  
> it's impossible to plug it into multiple computer at one time, of  
> course) and then setup the sharing. Everybody here is talking about the  
> hardware abstraction and virtualization and what you wrote is a  
> completely different thing - it's software-related and this has nothing  
> to do with the hardware emulation/abstraction what-so-ever.
>
> Considering the NFS and all the sharing protocols there was something  
> why it doesn't corrupt the data. I'm no expert on this subject but I  
> think this is because they run in the server-client mode. All the  
> clients are talking to the server and the server itself is one computer  
> that's having the just one operating system working with this particular  
> device - no matter what the underlaying device is - it may be everything  
> - USB stick, IDE/SCSI/SAS drive or just a relay workstation to save all  
> the data into one remote media (e.g. for replication). What I mean is  
> that the basic thing is that it's running on only one operating system  
> (because of it's connected to this one machine *only*) so it takes care  
> of everything and it's aware of the write-cache and data operations  
> being done to this media.
>

Yep.

If you want to share files from the hypervisor-host (from USB stick or from actual disk)
to the VMs you *can* do it today over-the-network (nfs,cifs,webdav,ftp) using the standard
client-server tools that have been used for over 20 years.

If you don't want to do it over-the-network, but somehow 'through' the hypervisor,
then you'd need to build some kind of special filesystem protocol that is able
to do the client-server communication over the hypervisor specific paths (xenbus etc).
And have drivers for it in the hypervisor-host, and in the VMs.

-- Pasi

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Pasi Kärkkäinen]

On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 03:26:46PM +0200, Michal Novotny wrote:
> On 08/27/2010 03:22 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen wrote:
>> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 03:18:01PM +0200, Christoph Egger wrote:
>>    
>>> On Friday 27 August 2010 15:08:47 Pasi Kärkkäinen wrote:
>>>      
>>>> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:33:35PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>>>>        
>>>>>     Yes, exactly. So, we wanted to know if it is possible to *share USB*
>>>>>     across VMs.
>>>>>          
>>>> I don't think USB protocol has been designed for *sharing*.
>>>> I'm pretty certain only one computer/device/VM can use USB device at a
>>>> time.
>>>>        
>>> This might work with firewire devices, I'm not sure.
>>>
>>>      
>> Yeah, firewire (iee1394) is designed to so that you can attach
>> the devices to multiple computers..
>>
>> If you attach the same firewire-disk to multiple computers,
>> and use the disk from multiple computers at the same time,
>> you *will* corrupt the filesystem on the disk.
>>
>> Unless you run some kind of filesystem that has lock-manager,
>> that can coordinate the shared access to the disk..
>> ie. you must be running cluster-aware filesystem.
>>
>> -- Pasi
>>
>>    
> Well guys, but we're talking about USB. The USB protocol is different  
> from firewire one. But that's right that I didn't know that. How is it  
> exactly done with the firewire to connect to multiple computers?
>

Some (or all?) firewire devices have 'daisy chain' connectors,
so you can link multiple devices together.. 

You can use those connectors to hook up the same device to multiple computers.

People have implemented for example cheap proof-of-concept failover Oracle DB clusters 
using firewire disks as cheap 'shared storage'.. there are many tutorials
about that on the internet.

-- Pasi

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Pasi Kärkkäinen]

On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:59:55PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>    I don't think USB protocol has been designed for *sharing*.
>    I'm pretty certain only one computer/device/VM can use USB device at a
>    time.
>    --Please check:*[1]http://spice-space.org/*They're trying similar thing.
> 

I think SPICE protocol allows you to *transport* (aka connect) single
USB device to single desktop OS. It's not USB sharing.

It's basicly USB-over-IP.. replacing the physical USB cable with IP connection.

-- Pasi

>    Thanks,
>    Dhananjay
> 
>    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 6:38 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen <[2]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> 
>      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:33:35PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>      > * *Yes, exactly. So, we wanted to know if it is possible to *share
>      USB*
>      > * *across VMs.
>      >
> 
>      I don't think USB protocol has been designed for *sharing*.
>      I'm pretty certain only one computer/device/VM can use USB device at a
>      time.
> 
>      -- Pasi
> 
>      > * *Thanks,
>      > * *Dhananjay
>      >
>      > * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 6:23 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen
>      <[1][3]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
>      >
>      > * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:16:32PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>      > * * *> * *How are you sharing USB flash drives with physical machines
>      > * * *> * *Comment: In ubuntu, plug in flash drive and access /media
>      folder.
>      > * * *Then
>      > * * *> * *right click and click on "Sharing Options". Once you share
>      it and
>      > * * *give
>      > * * *> * *others the right to add/edit the files, they can do so.
>      > * * *>
>      >
>      > * * *That's NOT USB sharing at all!
>      > * * *That's just a general filesystem share (nfs,cifs,whatever network
>      > * * *share).
>      >
>      > * * *You can do that with Xen, over the network, just like with
>      physical
>      > * * *machines.
>      >
>      > * * *-- Pasi
>      >
>      > * * *> * *Thanks,
>      > * * *> * *Dhananjay
>      > * * *>
>      > * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 5:24 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen
>      > * * *<[1][2][4]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
>      > * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 04:56:33PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel
>      wrote:
>      > * * *> * * *> * *Also you wouldn't see the changes made in other VMs,
>      > * * *> * * *> * *unless you made sure all the caches are refreshed etc
>      in the
>      > * * *VM all
>      > * * *> * * *the
>      > * * *> * * *> * *time.
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * *You'd need to use some cluster-filesystem (GFS, GFS2,
>      OCFS2,
>      > * * *GPFS,
>      > * * *> * * *etc).
>      > * * *> * * *> * *--Can you please suggest how NFS manages this because
>      this
>      > * * *case is
>      > * * *> * * *handled
>      > * * *> * * *> * *by NFS without any corruption?
>      > * * *> * * *> * *We can share flash drive across VMs as we do with
>      physical
>      > * * *machines
>      > * * *> * * *in
>      > * * *> * * *> * *LAN. Please help!
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *How are you sharing USB flash drives with physical
>      machines?
>      > * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *-- Pasi
>      > * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * *Thanks,
>      > * * *> * * *> * *Dhananjay
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:27 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen
>      > * * *> * * *<[1][2][3][5]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:53:54PM +0530, Dhananjay
>      Goel
>      > * * *wrote:
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *This won't be straight forward. Think about
>      USB
>      > * * *memory/flash
>      > * * *> * * *stick.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *If every VM sees it, and simultaneously writes
>      to it,
>      > * * *the
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *filesystem
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *in it will get corrupted immediately!
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *--Why would it get corrupted immediately.
>      Might be we
>      > * * *can
>      > * * *> * * *just lock
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *a
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *specific file which is being edited? Please
>      suggest.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *Because USB level has no idea about filesystems or
>      files,
>      > * * *or
>      > * * *> * * *locking
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *them!
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *Say you're using ext3 or NTFS in the VM for the USB
>      > * * *device.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *Those filesystems are NOT cluster-aware, ie.
>      they're not
>      > * * *aware of
>      > * * *> * * *any
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *sharing,
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *and they don't support any kind of sharing.
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *They expect exclusive access to the device.
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *If suddenly the bits on the device change from
>      outside,
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *the filesystem gets corrupted very easily.
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *Also you wouldn't see the changes made in other
>      VMs,
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *unless you made sure all the caches are refreshed
>      etc in
>      > * * *the VM
>      > * * *> * * *all the
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *time.
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *You'd need to use some cluster-filesystem (GFS,
>      GFS2,
>      > * * *OCFS2,
>      > * * *> * * *GPFS, etc).
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *-- Pasi
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Thanks,
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Dhananjay
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:49 PM, Pasi
>      K*rkk*inen
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *<[1][2][3][4][6]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 02:45:12PM +0530,
>      Dhananjay
>      > * * *Goel
>      > * * *> * * *wrote:
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *No, that's not possible with pvusb.
>      pvusb is
>      > * * *for
>      > * * *> * * *direct
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *passthru to
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *one/single vm.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *You'd need some filesystem share
>      > * * *(cifs/nfs/whatnot)
>      > * * *> * * *to make
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *such
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *sharing
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *possible.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Comments: Is it possible to share USB
>      > * * *keyboard, USB
>      > * * *> * * *mouse,
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *USB
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *modem, etc
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *across VMs i.e host and guest(s)? If we
>      > * * *connect USB
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *keyboard, is it
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *possible to use it in guests?
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *This is implemented in XCI (Xen Client
>      Initiative),
>      > * * *and
>      > * * *> * * *there has
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *been
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *some discussions how to get it traditional
>      Xen, to
>      > * * *help
>      > * * *> * * *Xen VGA
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *Passthrough usage.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *See:
>      > * * *> * *
>      *[2][3][4][5][7]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Also, is it possible for us to modify
>      the
>      > * * *device
>      > * * *> * * *driver of
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *USB 2.0
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *so that
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *all USB 2.0 devices are visible and can
>      be
>      > * * *used
>      > * * *> * * *across all
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *VMs?
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *Please
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *suggest.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *This won't be straight forward. Think about
>      USB
>      > * * *> * * *memory/flash
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *stick.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *If every VM sees it, and simultaneously
>      writes to
>      > * * *it, the
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *filesystem
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *in it will get corrupted immediately!
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *USB Passthru cannot be used to 'share'
>      devices,
>      > * * *it's for
>      > * * *> * * *giving
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *one/single VM
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *direct access to the device.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *-- Pasi
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Thanks,
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Dhananjay
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:16 PM, Pasi
>      > * * *K*rkk*inen
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *<[1][3][4][5][6][8]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 01:37:49PM
>      +0530,
>      > * * *Dhananjay
>      > * * *> * * *Goel
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *wrote:
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Hi James/Pasi,
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *I had a look at
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *
>      > * * *>
>      > * * *
>      [1][2][4][5][6][7][9]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *But I'm not sure if it supports
>      sharing
>      > * * *USB
>      > * * *> * * *devices
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *across
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *VMs
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *(host and
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *guest) i.e. if I plug in a flash
>      drive
>      > * * *then it
>      > * * *> * * *would
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *detect
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *in both
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *host
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *and guest and I'd be able edit
>      files
>      > * * *from all
>      > * * *> * * *VMs
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *rather
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *than
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *mounting and
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *unmounting everytime from 1 VM
>      to
>      > * * *other.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Please let me know your thoughts
>      on it.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *No, that's not possible with pvusb.
>      pvusb is
>      > * * *for
>      > * * *> * * *direct
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *passthru
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *to
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *one/single vm.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *You'd need some filesystem share
>      > * * *(cifs/nfs/whatnot)
>      > * * *> * * *to
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *make such
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *sharing
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *possible.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *-- Pasi
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Thanks,
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Dhananjay
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 4:28 AM,
>      James
>      > * * *Harper
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> *
>      > * * **<[2][3][5][6][7][8][10]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au>
>      > * * *> * * *wrote:
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> Hi there!
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> First I'd like to say that
>      XEN
>      > * * *plaform is
>      > * * *> * * *really
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *cool
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *and
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *awesome.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> I'm an engineering student
>      and is
>      > * * *> * * *searching for a
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *feasible
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *project in
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> virtualization. I'd like to
>      know if
>      > * * *its
>      > * * *> * * *possible
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *to
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *share USB
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *devices
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *(flash
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> drive, hard disk, mouse,
>      keyboards
>      > * * *etc)
>      > * * *> * * *across
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *guests
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *and host
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *(VMs).
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *Also, do
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> you have any idea to extend
>      it? Or
>      > * * *any
>      > * * *> * * *innovative
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *idea
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *so that
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *we can
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> implement it.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> I'd appreciate any help.
>      Thanks in
>      > * * *> * * *advance.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *Further to what Pasi said, I
>      have
>      > * * *partially
>      > * * *> * * *ported
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *the
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *backend
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *interface
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *and can hand you the code if
>      you
>      > * * *want. It's
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *probable a bit
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *stale
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *vs the
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *current kernels and leaks
>      memory
>      > * * *under some
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *circumstances
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *but is
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *probably better than starting
>      from
>      > * * *scratch.
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *James
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> References
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Visible links
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *1.
>      > * * *> * * *> * *
>      > * *
>      **[4][6][7][8][9][11]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *2.
>      > * * *> * * *mailto:[5][7][8][9][10][12]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> References
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Visible links
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *1.
>      mailto:[8][9][10][11][13]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *2.
>      > * * *> * * *> * *
>      > * *
>      **[9][10][11][12][14]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *3.
>      > * * *mailto:[10][11][12][13][15]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *4.
>      > * * *> * * *> * *
>      > * *
>      **[11][12][13][14][16]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * * *> * *5.
>      > * * *mailto:[12][13][14][15][17]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> References
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *Visible links
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *1. mailto:[14][15][16][18]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *2.
>      > * * *> * *
>      *[15][16][17][19]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *3. mailto:[16][17][18][20]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *4.
>      > * * *> * *
>      *[17][18][19][21]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *5.
>      mailto:[18][19][20][22]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *6.
>      > * * *> * *
>      *[19][20][21][23]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *7.
>      mailto:[20][21][22][24]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *8. mailto:[21][22][23][25]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * *9.
>      > * * *> * *
>      *[22][23][24][26]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * 10.
>      mailto:[23][24][25][27]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * 11.
>      > * * *> * *
>      *[24][25][26][28]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * * *> * 12.
>      mailto:[25][26][27][29]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> References
>      > * * *> * * *>
>      > * * *> * * *> * *Visible links
>      > * * *> * * *> * *1. mailto:[27][28][30]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * * *> * *2. mailto:[28][29][31]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * * *> * *3.
>      > * * *[29][30][32]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * *4. mailto:[30][31][33]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * * *> * *5.
>      > * * *[31][32][34]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * *6. mailto:[32][33][35]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * * *> * *7.
>      > * * *[33][34][36]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * *8. mailto:[34][35][37]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * * *> * *9. mailto:[35][36][38]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * * *> * 10.
>      > * * *[36][37][39]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * 11. mailto:[37][38][40]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * * *> * 12.
>      > * * *[38][39][41]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * 13. mailto:[39][40][42]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * * *> * 14. mailto:[40][41][43]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * * *> * 15.
>      > * * *[41][42][44]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * 16. mailto:[42][43][45]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * * *> * 17.
>      > * * *[43][44][46]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * 18. mailto:[44][45][47]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * * *> * 19.
>      > * * *[45][46][48]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * 20. mailto:[46][47][49]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * * *> * 21. mailto:[47][48][50]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * * *> * 22.
>      > * * *[48][49][51]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * 23. mailto:[49][50][52]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * * *> * 24.
>      > * * *[50][51][53]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * * *> * 25. mailto:[51][52][54]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *>
>      > * * *> References
>      > * * *>
>      > * * *> * *Visible links
>      > * * *> * *1. mailto:[53][55]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * *2. mailto:[54][56]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * *3. mailto:[55][57]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * *4.
>      [56][58]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      > * * *> * *5. mailto:[57][59]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * *6.
>      [58][60]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * *7. mailto:[59][61]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * *8.
>      [60][62]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * *9. mailto:[61][63]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * 10. mailto:[62][64]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * 11.
>      [63][65]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * 12. mailto:[64][66]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * 13.
>      [65][67]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * 14. mailto:[66][68]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * 15. mailto:[67][69]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * 16.
>      [68][70]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      > * * *> * 17. mailto:[69][71]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * 18.
>      [70][72]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * 19. mailto:[71][73]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * 20.
>      [72][74]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * 21. mailto:[73][75]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * 22. mailto:[74][76]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * 23.
>      [75][77]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * 24. mailto:[76][78]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * 25.
>      [77][79]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * 26. mailto:[78][80]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * 27. mailto:[79][81]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * 28. mailto:[80][82]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * 29.
>      [81][83]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      > * * *> * 30. mailto:[82][84]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * 31.
>      [83][85]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * 32. mailto:[84][86]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * 33.
>      [85][87]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * 34. mailto:[86][88]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * 35. mailto:[87][89]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * 36.
>      [88][90]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * 37. mailto:[89][91]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * 38.
>      [90][92]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * 39. mailto:[91][93]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * 40. mailto:[92][94]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * 41.
>      [93][95]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      > * * *> * 42. mailto:[94][96]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * 43.
>      [95][97]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * 44. mailto:[96][98]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * 45.
>      [97][99]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * 46. mailto:[98][100]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * 47. mailto:[99][101]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * * *> * 48.
>      [100][102]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * 49. mailto:[101][103]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * * *> * 50.
>      [102][104]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * * *> * 51. mailto:[103][105]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      >
>      > References
>      >
>      > * *Visible links
>      > * *1. mailto:[106]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * *2. mailto:[107]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * *3. mailto:[108]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * *4. mailto:[109]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * *5. [110]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      > * *6. mailto:[111]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * *7. [112]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * *8. mailto:[113]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * *9. [114]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 10. mailto:[115]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 11. mailto:[116]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * 12. [117]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 13. mailto:[118]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 14. [119]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 15. mailto:[120]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 16. mailto:[121]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * 17. [122]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      > * 18. mailto:[123]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * 19. [124]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 20. mailto:[125]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 21. [126]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 22. mailto:[127]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 23. mailto:[128]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * 24. [129]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 25. mailto:[130]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 26. [131]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 27. mailto:[132]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 28. mailto:[133]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * 29. mailto:[134]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * 30. [135]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      > * 31. mailto:[136]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * 32. [137]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 33. mailto:[138]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 34. [139]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 35. mailto:[140]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 36. mailto:[141]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * 37. [142]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 38. mailto:[143]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 39. [144]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 40. mailto:[145]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 41. mailto:[146]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * 42. [147]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      > * 43. mailto:[148]pasik@iki.fi
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>      > * 45. mailto:[150]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 46. [151]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 47. mailto:[152]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 48. mailto:[153]pasik@iki.fi
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>      > * 50. mailto:[155]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 51. [156]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 52. mailto:[157]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 53. mailto:[158]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * 54. mailto:[159]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * 55. mailto:[160]pasik@iki.fi
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>      > * 57. mailto:[162]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * 58. [163]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 59. mailto:[164]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 60. [165]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 61. mailto:[166]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 62. mailto:[167]pasik@iki.fi
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>      > * 64. mailto:[169]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
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>      > * 66. mailto:[171]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
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>      > * 69. mailto:[174]pasik@iki.fi
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>      > * 71. mailto:[176]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
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>      > * 73. mailto:[178]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 74. mailto:[179]pasik@iki.fi
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>      > * 76. mailto:[181]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 77. [182]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 78. mailto:[183]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 79. mailto:[184]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * 80. mailto:[185]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * 81. [186]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      > * 82. mailto:[187]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * 83. [188]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 84. mailto:[189]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 85. [190]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 86. mailto:[191]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 87. mailto:[192]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * 88. [193]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 89. mailto:[194]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 90. [195]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 91. mailto:[196]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 92. mailto:[197]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * 93. [198]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>      > * 94. mailto:[199]pasik@iki.fi
>      > * 95. [200]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 96. mailto:[201]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 97. [202]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > * 98. mailto:[203]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > * 99. mailto:[204]pasik@iki.fi
>      > *100. [205]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > *101. mailto:[206]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>      > *102. [207]http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>      > *103. mailto:[208]james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
> 
> References
> 
>    Visible links
>    1. http://spice-space.org/
>    2. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    3. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    4. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    5. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    6. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    7. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>    8. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    9. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   10. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   11. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   12. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   13. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   14. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   15. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   16. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   17. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   18. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   19. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>   20. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   21. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   22. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   23. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   24. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   25. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   26. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   27. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   28. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   29. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   30. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   31. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   32. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>   33. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   34. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   35. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   36. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   37. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   38. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   39. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   40. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   41. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   42. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   43. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   44. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>   45. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   46. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   47. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   48. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   49. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   50. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   51. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   52. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   53. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   54. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   55. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   56. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   57. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   58. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>   59. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   60. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   61. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   62. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   63. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   64. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   65. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   66. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   67. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   68. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   69. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   70. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>   71. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   72. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   73. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   74. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   75. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   76. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   77. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   78. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   79. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   80. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   81. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   82. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   83. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>   84. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   85. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   86. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   87. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   88. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   89. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   90. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   91. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   92. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   93. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   94. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   95. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>   96. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>   97. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>   98. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>   99. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  100. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  101. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  102. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  103. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  104. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  105. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  106. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  107. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  108. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  109. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  110. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>  111. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  112. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  113. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  114. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  115. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  116. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  117. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  118. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  119. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  120. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  121. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  122. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>  123. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  124. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  125. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  126. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  127. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  128. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  129. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  130. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  131. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  132. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  133. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  134. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  135. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>  136. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  137. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  138. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  139. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  140. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  141. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  142. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  143. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  144. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  145. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  146. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  147. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>  148. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  149. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  150. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  151. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  152. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  153. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  154. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  155. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  156. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  157. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  158. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  159. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  160. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  161. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>  162. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  163. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  164. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  165. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  166. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  167. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  168. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  169. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  170. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  171. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  172. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  173. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>  174. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  175. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  176. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  177. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  178. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  179. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  180. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  181. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  182. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  183. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  184. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  185. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  186. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>  187. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  188. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  189. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  190. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  191. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  192. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  193. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  194. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  195. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  196. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  197. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  198. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenVGAPassthrough
>  199. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  200. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  201. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  202. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  203. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  204. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>  205. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  206. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au
>  207. http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenUSBPassthrough
>  208. mailto:james.harper@bendigoit.com.au

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Dhananjay Goel]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 3237 bytes --]

If you don't want to do it over-the-network, but somehow 'through' the
hypervisor,
then you'd need to build some kind of special filesystem protocol that is
able
to do the client-server communication over the hypervisor specific paths
(xenbus etc).
And have drivers for it in the hypervisor-host, and in the VMs.

--So, is it possible to build a filesystem protocol to share USB devices? Is
my project feasible?

Thanks,
Dhananjay


On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 7:00 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen <pasik@iki.fi> wrote:

> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 03:17:39PM +0200, Michal Novotny wrote:
> > On 08/27/2010 03:08 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen wrote:
> >> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:33:35PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> >>
> >>>     Yes, exactly. So, we wanted to know if it is possible to *share
> USB*
> >>>     across VMs.
> >>>
> >>>
> >> I don't think USB protocol has been designed for *sharing*.
> >> I'm pretty certain only one computer/device/VM can use USB device at a
> time.
> >>
> >> -- Pasi
> >>
> >>
> >
> > Pasi, I agree. I think the think here is that Dhananjay confused the USB
> > device sharing with the file system sharing. I guess the USB protocol
> > was not designed for sharing nevertheless sharing the filesystem on a
> > USB stick is a completely different think.
> >
> > Dhananajay, you need to plug in the USB stick onto one computer (and
> > it's impossible to plug it into multiple computer at one time, of
> > course) and then setup the sharing. Everybody here is talking about the
> > hardware abstraction and virtualization and what you wrote is a
> > completely different thing - it's software-related and this has nothing
> > to do with the hardware emulation/abstraction what-so-ever.
> >
> > Considering the NFS and all the sharing protocols there was something
> > why it doesn't corrupt the data. I'm no expert on this subject but I
> > think this is because they run in the server-client mode. All the
> > clients are talking to the server and the server itself is one computer
> > that's having the just one operating system working with this particular
> > device - no matter what the underlaying device is - it may be everything
> > - USB stick, IDE/SCSI/SAS drive or just a relay workstation to save all
> > the data into one remote media (e.g. for replication). What I mean is
> > that the basic thing is that it's running on only one operating system
> > (because of it's connected to this one machine *only*) so it takes care
> > of everything and it's aware of the write-cache and data operations
> > being done to this media.
> >
>
> Yep.
>
> If you want to share files from the hypervisor-host (from USB stick or from
> actual disk)
> to the VMs you *can* do it today over-the-network (nfs,cifs,webdav,ftp)
> using the standard
> client-server tools that have been used for over 20 years.
>
> If you don't want to do it over-the-network, but somehow 'through' the
> hypervisor,
> then you'd need to build some kind of special filesystem protocol that is
> able
> to do the client-server communication over the hypervisor specific paths
> (xenbus etc).
> And have drivers for it in the hypervisor-host, and in the VMs.
>
> -- Pasi
>
>

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[-- Attachment #2: Type: text/plain, Size: 138 bytes --]

_______________________________________________
Xen-devel mailing list
Xen-devel@lists.xensource.com
http://lists.xensource.com/xen-devel

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Pasi Kärkkäinen]

On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 07:05:11PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>    If you don't want to do it over-the-network, but somehow 'through' the
>    hypervisor,
>    then you'd need to build some kind of special filesystem protocol that is
>    able
>    to do the client-server communication over the hypervisor specific paths
>    (xenbus etc).
>    And have drivers for it in the hypervisor-host, and in the VMs.
>    --So, is it possible to build a filesystem protocol to share USB devices?
>    Is my project feasible?
> 

Yes, you can build some filesystem protocol and share ANY filesystem, 
be it USB, SATA, SAS, RAID, whatnot.

If it's filesystem protocol it doesn't matter at all if it's USB or not.

-- Pasi

>    Thanks,
>    Dhananjay
> 
>    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 7:00 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen <[1]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> 
>      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 03:17:39PM +0200, Michal Novotny wrote:
>      > On 08/27/2010 03:08 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen wrote:
>      >> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:33:35PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>      >>
>      >>> * * Yes, exactly. So, we wanted to know if it is possible to *share
>      USB*
>      >>> * * across VMs.
>      >>>
>      >>>
>      >> I don't think USB protocol has been designed for *sharing*.
>      >> I'm pretty certain only one computer/device/VM can use USB device at
>      a time.
>      >>
>      >> -- Pasi
>      >>
>      >>
>      >
>      > Pasi, I agree. I think the think here is that Dhananjay confused the
>      USB
>      > device sharing with the file system sharing. I guess the USB protocol
>      > was not designed for sharing nevertheless sharing the filesystem on a
>      > USB stick is a completely different think.
>      >
>      > Dhananajay, you need to plug in the USB stick onto one computer (and
>      > it's impossible to plug it into multiple computer at one time, of
>      > course) and then setup the sharing. Everybody here is talking about
>      the
>      > hardware abstraction and virtualization and what you wrote is a
>      > completely different thing - it's software-related and this has
>      nothing
>      > to do with the hardware emulation/abstraction what-so-ever.
>      >
>      > Considering the NFS and all the sharing protocols there was something
>      > why it doesn't corrupt the data. I'm no expert on this subject but I
>      > think this is because they run in the server-client mode. All the
>      > clients are talking to the server and the server itself is one
>      computer
>      > that's having the just one operating system working with this
>      particular
>      > device - no matter what the underlaying device is - it may be
>      everything
>      > - USB stick, IDE/SCSI/SAS drive or just a relay workstation to save
>      all
>      > the data into one remote media (e.g. for replication). What I mean is
>      > that the basic thing is that it's running on only one operating system
>      > (because of it's connected to this one machine *only*) so it takes
>      care
>      > of everything and it's aware of the write-cache and data operations
>      > being done to this media.
>      >
> 
>      Yep.
> 
>      If you want to share files from the hypervisor-host (from USB stick or
>      from actual disk)
>      to the VMs you *can* do it today over-the-network (nfs,cifs,webdav,ftp)
>      using the standard
>      client-server tools that have been used for over 20 years.
> 
>      If you don't want to do it over-the-network, but somehow 'through' the
>      hypervisor,
>      then you'd need to build some kind of special filesystem protocol that
>      is able
>      to do the client-server communication over the hypervisor specific paths
>      (xenbus etc).
>      And have drivers for it in the hypervisor-host, and in the VMs.
>      -- Pasi
> 
> References
> 
>    Visible links
>    1. mailto:pasik@iki.fi

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Michal Novotny]

On 08/27/2010 03:30 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 03:17:39PM +0200, Michal Novotny wrote:
>    
>> On 08/27/2010 03:08 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen wrote:
>>      
>>> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:33:35PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>>>
>>>        
>>>>      Yes, exactly. So, we wanted to know if it is possible to *share USB*
>>>>      across VMs.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>          
>>> I don't think USB protocol has been designed for *sharing*.
>>> I'm pretty certain only one computer/device/VM can use USB device at a time.
>>>
>>> -- Pasi
>>>
>>>
>>>        
>> Pasi, I agree. I think the think here is that Dhananjay confused the USB
>> device sharing with the file system sharing. I guess the USB protocol
>> was not designed for sharing nevertheless sharing the filesystem on a
>> USB stick is a completely different think.
>>
>> Dhananajay, you need to plug in the USB stick onto one computer (and
>> it's impossible to plug it into multiple computer at one time, of
>> course) and then setup the sharing. Everybody here is talking about the
>> hardware abstraction and virtualization and what you wrote is a
>> completely different thing - it's software-related and this has nothing
>> to do with the hardware emulation/abstraction what-so-ever.
>>
>> Considering the NFS and all the sharing protocols there was something
>> why it doesn't corrupt the data. I'm no expert on this subject but I
>> think this is because they run in the server-client mode. All the
>> clients are talking to the server and the server itself is one computer
>> that's having the just one operating system working with this particular
>> device - no matter what the underlaying device is - it may be everything
>> - USB stick, IDE/SCSI/SAS drive or just a relay workstation to save all
>> the data into one remote media (e.g. for replication). What I mean is
>> that the basic thing is that it's running on only one operating system
>> (because of it's connected to this one machine *only*) so it takes care
>> of everything and it's aware of the write-cache and data operations
>> being done to this media.
>>
>>      
> Yep.
>
> If you want to share files from the hypervisor-host (from USB stick or from actual disk)
> to the VMs you *can* do it today over-the-network (nfs,cifs,webdav,ftp) using the standard
> client-server tools that have been used for over 20 years.
>
> If you don't want to do it over-the-network, but somehow 'through' the hypervisor,
> then you'd need to build some kind of special filesystem protocol that is able
> to do the client-server communication over the hypervisor specific paths (xenbus etc).
> And have drivers for it in the hypervisor-host, and in the VMs.
>
> -- Pasi
>
>    
Ok Pasi, I know what you mean. I was talking about physical machines 
since Dhananjay compared this to physical machines. I know sharing 
between VMs is possible using specific paths like the xenbus one.

Michal

-- 
Michal Novotny<minovotn@redhat.com>, RHCE
Virtualization Team (xen userspace), Red Hat

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Michal Novotny]

On 08/27/2010 03:33 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 03:26:46PM +0200, Michal Novotny wrote:
>    
>> On 08/27/2010 03:22 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen wrote:
>>      
>>> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 03:18:01PM +0200, Christoph Egger wrote:
>>>
>>>        
>>>> On Friday 27 August 2010 15:08:47 Pasi Kärkkäinen wrote:
>>>>
>>>>          
>>>>> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:33:35PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>            
>>>>>>      Yes, exactly. So, we wanted to know if it is possible to *share USB*
>>>>>>      across VMs.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>              
>>>>> I don't think USB protocol has been designed for *sharing*.
>>>>> I'm pretty certain only one computer/device/VM can use USB device at a
>>>>> time.
>>>>>
>>>>>            
>>>> This might work with firewire devices, I'm not sure.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>          
>>> Yeah, firewire (iee1394) is designed to so that you can attach
>>> the devices to multiple computers..
>>>
>>> If you attach the same firewire-disk to multiple computers,
>>> and use the disk from multiple computers at the same time,
>>> you *will* corrupt the filesystem on the disk.
>>>
>>> Unless you run some kind of filesystem that has lock-manager,
>>> that can coordinate the shared access to the disk..
>>> ie. you must be running cluster-aware filesystem.
>>>
>>> -- Pasi
>>>
>>>
>>>        
>> Well guys, but we're talking about USB. The USB protocol is different
>> from firewire one. But that's right that I didn't know that. How is it
>> exactly done with the firewire to connect to multiple computers?
>>
>>      
> Some (or all?) firewire devices have 'daisy chain' connectors,
> so you can link multiple devices together..
>
> You can use those connectors to hook up the same device to multiple computers.
>
> People have implemented for example cheap proof-of-concept failover Oracle DB clusters
> using firewire disks as cheap 'shared storage'.. there are many tutorials
> about that on the internet.
>
> -- Pasi
>
>    
Oh, great! Thanks for sharing this information!

Michal

-- 
Michal Novotny<minovotn@redhat.com>, RHCE
Virtualization Team (xen userspace), Red Hat

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Michal Novotny]

On 08/27/2010 03:34 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:59:55PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>    
>>     I don't think USB protocol has been designed for *sharing*.
>>     I'm pretty certain only one computer/device/VM can use USB device at a
>>     time.
>>     --Please check:*[1]http://spice-space.org/*They're trying similar thing.
>>
>>      
> I think SPICE protocol allows you to *transport* (aka connect) single
> USB device to single desktop OS. It's not USB sharing.
>
> It's basicly USB-over-IP.. replacing the physical USB cable with IP connection.
>
> -- Pasi
>
>    
Yeah, I think so. I think this is basically the USB over IP interface 
which makes the impression of sharing and it even may be called sharing 
but one device is being still physically connected to one slot/device 
and not multiple at once.

Michal

-- 
Michal Novotny<minovotn@redhat.com>, RHCE
Virtualization Team (xen userspace), Red Hat

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Dhananjay Goel]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 5110 bytes --]

Yes, you can build some filesystem protocol and share ANY filesystem,
be it USB, SATA, SAS, RAID, whatnot.

If it's filesystem protocol it doesn't matter at all if it's USB or not.

--But here we're sharing filesystem and not USB itself. Suppose we connect
internet through USB device, we can share data but not internet connection,
right?

*A few more questions:*

1) whether to use NFS and create plugins for different Oss. By plugin I mean
we'll be writing some code which will support windows sharing, some code for
linux sharing, etc
2) if not NFS then should we write some module to manage contexts and switch
between host and guest. This will involve some device driver coding
3) using NFS I guess we can't implement the USB internet . How to proceed on
that?

Thanks,
Dhananjay


On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 7:16 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen <pasik@iki.fi> wrote:

> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 07:05:11PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> >    If you don't want to do it over-the-network, but somehow 'through' the
> >    hypervisor,
> >    then you'd need to build some kind of special filesystem protocol that
> is
> >    able
> >    to do the client-server communication over the hypervisor specific
> paths
> >    (xenbus etc).
> >    And have drivers for it in the hypervisor-host, and in the VMs.
> >    --So, is it possible to build a filesystem protocol to share USB
> devices?
> >    Is my project feasible?
> >
>
> Yes, you can build some filesystem protocol and share ANY filesystem,
> be it USB, SATA, SAS, RAID, whatnot.
>
> If it's filesystem protocol it doesn't matter at all if it's USB or not.
>
> -- Pasi
>
> >    Thanks,
> >    Dhananjay
> >
> >    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 7:00 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen <[1]pasik@iki.fi>
> wrote:
> >
> >      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 03:17:39PM +0200, Michal Novotny wrote:
> >      > On 08/27/2010 03:08 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen wrote:
> >      >> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:33:35PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> >      >>
> >      >>> * * Yes, exactly. So, we wanted to know if it is possible to
> *share
> >      USB*
> >      >>> * * across VMs.
> >      >>>
> >      >>>
> >      >> I don't think USB protocol has been designed for *sharing*.
> >      >> I'm pretty certain only one computer/device/VM can use USB device
> at
> >      a time.
> >      >>
> >      >> -- Pasi
> >      >>
> >      >>
> >      >
> >      > Pasi, I agree. I think the think here is that Dhananjay confused
> the
> >      USB
> >      > device sharing with the file system sharing. I guess the USB
> protocol
> >      > was not designed for sharing nevertheless sharing the filesystem
> on a
> >      > USB stick is a completely different think.
> >      >
> >      > Dhananajay, you need to plug in the USB stick onto one computer
> (and
> >      > it's impossible to plug it into multiple computer at one time, of
> >      > course) and then setup the sharing. Everybody here is talking
> about
> >      the
> >      > hardware abstraction and virtualization and what you wrote is a
> >      > completely different thing - it's software-related and this has
> >      nothing
> >      > to do with the hardware emulation/abstraction what-so-ever.
> >      >
> >      > Considering the NFS and all the sharing protocols there was
> something
> >      > why it doesn't corrupt the data. I'm no expert on this subject but
> I
> >      > think this is because they run in the server-client mode. All the
> >      > clients are talking to the server and the server itself is one
> >      computer
> >      > that's having the just one operating system working with this
> >      particular
> >      > device - no matter what the underlaying device is - it may be
> >      everything
> >      > - USB stick, IDE/SCSI/SAS drive or just a relay workstation to
> save
> >      all
> >      > the data into one remote media (e.g. for replication). What I mean
> is
> >      > that the basic thing is that it's running on only one operating
> system
> >      > (because of it's connected to this one machine *only*) so it takes
> >      care
> >      > of everything and it's aware of the write-cache and data
> operations
> >      > being done to this media.
> >      >
> >
> >      Yep.
> >
> >      If you want to share files from the hypervisor-host (from USB stick
> or
> >      from actual disk)
> >      to the VMs you *can* do it today over-the-network
> (nfs,cifs,webdav,ftp)
> >      using the standard
> >      client-server tools that have been used for over 20 years.
> >
> >      If you don't want to do it over-the-network, but somehow 'through'
> the
> >      hypervisor,
> >      then you'd need to build some kind of special filesystem protocol
> that
> >      is able
> >      to do the client-server communication over the hypervisor specific
> paths
> >      (xenbus etc).
> >      And have drivers for it in the hypervisor-host, and in the VMs.
> >      -- Pasi
> >
> > References
> >
> >    Visible links
> >    1. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>

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http://lists.xensource.com/xen-devel

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Dhananjay Goel]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1598 bytes --]

Yeah, I think so. I think this is basically the USB over IP interface which
makes the impression of sharing and it even may be called sharing but one
device is being still physically connected to one slot/device and not
multiple at once.

--Yes, exactly. It is just connected to one slot/device and not multiple but
this device should be accessible to each virtual machine? As each virtual
machine is sharing the same hardware. Please let me know if it makes sense.

Thanks,
Dhananjay


On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 7:20 PM, Michal Novotny <minovotn@redhat.com> wrote:

> On 08/27/2010 03:34 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen wrote:
>
>> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:59:55PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>>
>>
>>>    I don't think USB protocol has been designed for *sharing*.
>>>    I'm pretty certain only one computer/device/VM can use USB device at a
>>>    time.
>>>    --Please check:*[1]http://spice-space.org/*They're trying similar
>>> thing.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> I think SPICE protocol allows you to *transport* (aka connect) single
>> USB device to single desktop OS. It's not USB sharing.
>>
>> It's basicly USB-over-IP.. replacing the physical USB cable with IP
>> connection.
>>
>> -- Pasi
>>
>>
>>
> Yeah, I think so. I think this is basically the USB over IP interface which
> makes the impression of sharing and it even may be called sharing but one
> device is being still physically connected to one slot/device and not
> multiple at once.
>
>
> Michal
>
> --
> Michal Novotny<minovotn@redhat.com>, RHCE
> Virtualization Team (xen userspace), Red Hat
>
>

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_______________________________________________
Xen-devel mailing list
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http://lists.xensource.com/xen-devel

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Pasi Kärkkäinen]

On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 07:25:39PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>    Yes, you can build some filesystem protocol and share ANY filesystem,
>    be it USB, SATA, SAS, RAID, whatnot.
> 
>    If it's filesystem protocol it doesn't matter at all if it's USB or not.
>    --But here we're sharing filesystem and not USB itself. Suppose we connect
>    internet through USB device, we can share data but not internet
>    connection, right?*
>    A few more questions:
>    1)*whether to use NFS and create plugins for different Oss. By plugin I
>    mean we'll be writing some code which will support windows sharing, some
>    code for linux sharing, etc
>    2)*if not NFS then should we write some module to manage contexts and
>    switch between host and guest. This will involve some device driver coding
>    3)*using NFS I guess we can't implement the USB internet . How to proceed
>    on that?
>

Uhm, this is a bit confusing now..
If you connect to Internet over an USB device, then you're using *IP* connection there.

You can share IP connection using the networking stack! Configure NAT, routing, bridging,
whatever you need. This is how it's done today with Xen and other virtualization solutions.
No need to know anything about USB to do that.

You need to start thinking about *functionality*, not about the fact if it's USB device or not.

USB device can be used only by *one* computer/host/VM. Then you can share it *from* 
that computer/host/VM using other protocols/means.

-- Pasi

>    Thanks,
>    Dhananjay
> 
>    On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 7:16 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen <[1]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> 
>      On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 07:05:11PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>      > * *If you don't want to do it over-the-network, but somehow 'through'
>      the
>      > * *hypervisor,
>      > * *then you'd need to build some kind of special filesystem protocol
>      that is
>      > * *able
>      > * *to do the client-server communication over the hypervisor specific
>      paths
>      > * *(xenbus etc).
>      > * *And have drivers for it in the hypervisor-host, and in the VMs.
>      > * *--So, is it possible to build a filesystem protocol to share USB
>      devices?
>      > * *Is my project feasible?
>      >
> 
>      Yes, you can build some filesystem protocol and share ANY filesystem,
>      be it USB, SATA, SAS, RAID, whatnot.
> 
>      If it's filesystem protocol it doesn't matter at all if it's USB or not.
> 
>      -- Pasi
> 
>      > * *Thanks,
>      > * *Dhananjay
>      >
>      > * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 7:00 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen
>      <[1][2]pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
>      >
>      > * * *On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 03:17:39PM +0200, Michal Novotny wrote:
>      > * * *> On 08/27/2010 03:08 PM, Pasi K*rkk*inen wrote:
>      > * * *>> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:33:35PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel
>      wrote:
>      > * * *>>
>      > * * *>>> * * Yes, exactly. So, we wanted to know if it is possible to
>      *share
>      > * * *USB*
>      > * * *>>> * * across VMs.
>      > * * *>>>
>      > * * *>>>
>      > * * *>> I don't think USB protocol has been designed for *sharing*.
>      > * * *>> I'm pretty certain only one computer/device/VM can use USB
>      device at
>      > * * *a time.
>      > * * *>>
>      > * * *>> -- Pasi
>      > * * *>>
>      > * * *>>
>      > * * *>
>      > * * *> Pasi, I agree. I think the think here is that Dhananjay
>      confused the
>      > * * *USB
>      > * * *> device sharing with the file system sharing. I guess the USB
>      protocol
>      > * * *> was not designed for sharing nevertheless sharing the
>      filesystem on a
>      > * * *> USB stick is a completely different think.
>      > * * *>
>      > * * *> Dhananajay, you need to plug in the USB stick onto one computer
>      (and
>      > * * *> it's impossible to plug it into multiple computer at one time,
>      of
>      > * * *> course) and then setup the sharing. Everybody here is talking
>      about
>      > * * *the
>      > * * *> hardware abstraction and virtualization and what you wrote is a
>      > * * *> completely different thing - it's software-related and this has
>      > * * *nothing
>      > * * *> to do with the hardware emulation/abstraction what-so-ever.
>      > * * *>
>      > * * *> Considering the NFS and all the sharing protocols there was
>      something
>      > * * *> why it doesn't corrupt the data. I'm no expert on this subject
>      but I
>      > * * *> think this is because they run in the server-client mode. All
>      the
>      > * * *> clients are talking to the server and the server itself is one
>      > * * *computer
>      > * * *> that's having the just one operating system working with this
>      > * * *particular
>      > * * *> device - no matter what the underlaying device is - it may be
>      > * * *everything
>      > * * *> - USB stick, IDE/SCSI/SAS drive or just a relay workstation to
>      save
>      > * * *all
>      > * * *> the data into one remote media (e.g. for replication). What I
>      mean is
>      > * * *> that the basic thing is that it's running on only one operating
>      system
>      > * * *> (because of it's connected to this one machine *only*) so it
>      takes
>      > * * *care
>      > * * *> of everything and it's aware of the write-cache and data
>      operations
>      > * * *> being done to this media.
>      > * * *>
>      >
>      > * * *Yep.
>      >
>      > * * *If you want to share files from the hypervisor-host (from USB
>      stick or
>      > * * *from actual disk)
>      > * * *to the VMs you *can* do it today over-the-network
>      (nfs,cifs,webdav,ftp)
>      > * * *using the standard
>      > * * *client-server tools that have been used for over 20 years.
>      >
>      > * * *If you don't want to do it over-the-network, but somehow
>      'through' the
>      > * * *hypervisor,
>      > * * *then you'd need to build some kind of special filesystem protocol
>      that
>      > * * *is able
>      > * * *to do the client-server communication over the hypervisor
>      specific paths
>      > * * *(xenbus etc).
>      > * * *And have drivers for it in the hypervisor-host, and in the VMs.
>      > * * *-- Pasi
>      >
>      > References
>      >
>      > * *Visible links
>      > * *1. mailto:[3]pasik@iki.fi
> 
> References
> 
>    Visible links
>    1. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    2. mailto:pasik@iki.fi
>    3. mailto:pasik@iki.fi

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Michal Novotny]

On 08/27/2010 04:00 PM, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> Yeah, I think so. I think this is basically the USB over IP interface 
> which makes the impression of sharing and it even may be called 
> sharing but one device is being still physically connected to one 
> slot/device and not multiple at once.
>
> --Yes, exactly. It is just connected to one slot/device and not 
> multiple but this device should be accessible to each virtual machine? 
> As each virtual machine is sharing the same hardware. Please let me 
> know if it makes sense.
>
> Thanks,
> Dhananjay

Basically that's right. It makes sense Dhananjay because this is the USB 
over IP type of sharing. Imagine you have one device, let's say 
hard-drive connected to the USB and there's some kind of protocol to 
share it over the internet. It's more or less like let's say FTP server 
with the exception that we don't access the FTP server application but 
we access the USB hard-drive instead. It can accept all the command 
using e.g. the HTTP protocol and the commands may be done simultaneously 
when not conflicting with the other clients for which the perfect 
example is the read-only access. Since it's not conflicting with any 
other client every user/client could place a request on some file and 
the file is being retrieved using the USB-over-IP protocol and the data 
sent to the client that requested them. The virtual machines are sharing 
the same hardware so that's why I used comparison to HTTP/FTP server and 
it's clients. The logic is pretty similar AFAIK.

Michal

>
>
> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 7:20 PM, Michal Novotny <minovotn@redhat.com 
> <mailto:minovotn@redhat.com>> wrote:
>
>     On 08/27/2010 03:34 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen wrote:
>
>         On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:59:55PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
>
>                I don't think USB protocol has been designed for *sharing*.
>                I'm pretty certain only one computer/device/VM can use
>             USB device at a
>                time.
>                --Please check:*[1]http://spice-space.org/*They're
>             <http://spice-space.org/*They%27re> trying similar thing.
>
>
>         I think SPICE protocol allows you to *transport* (aka connect)
>         single
>         USB device to single desktop OS. It's not USB sharing.
>
>         It's basicly USB-over-IP.. replacing the physical USB cable
>         with IP connection.
>
>         -- Pasi
>
>
>     Yeah, I think so. I think this is basically the USB over IP
>     interface which makes the impression of sharing and it even may be
>     called sharing but one device is being still physically connected
>     to one slot/device and not multiple at once.
>
>
>     Michal
>
>     -- 
>     Michal Novotny<minovotn@redhat.com <mailto:minovotn@redhat.com>>, RHCE
>     Virtualization Team (xen userspace), Red Hat
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Xen-devel mailing list
> Xen-devel@lists.xensource.com
> http://lists.xensource.com/xen-devel
>    


-- 
Michal Novotny<minovotn@redhat.com>, RHCE
Virtualization Team (xen userspace), Red Hat

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Gianni Tedesco]

On Thu, 2010-08-26 at 19:44 +0100, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> Hi there!
> 
> 
> First I'd like to say that XEN plaform is really cool and awesome.
> 
> 
> I'm an engineering student and is searching for a feasible project in
> virtualization. I'd like to know if its possible to share USB devices
> (flash drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc) across guests and host
> (VMs). Also, do you have any idea to extend it? Or any innovative idea
> so that we can implement it.

Yes see comments wrt USB pass-through. What about implementing USB over
IP? Possibly via a VNC extension so that remote USB devices can be
attached to a VM. Since VNC provides a terminal with keyboard/mouse/gfx,
why not USB too? I believe vbox has this functionality except using the
RDP protocol.

Gianni

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Konrad Rzeszutek Wilk]

> > I'm an engineering student and is searching for a feasible project in
> > virtualization. I'd like to know if its possible to share USB devices
> > (flash drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc) across guests and host
> > (VMs). Also, do you have any idea to extend it? Or any innovative idea
> > so that we can implement it.
> 
> Yes see comments wrt USB pass-through. What about implementing USB over
> IP? Possibly via a VNC extension so that remote USB devices can be
> attached to a VM. Since VNC provides a terminal with keyboard/mouse/gfx,
> why not USB too? I believe vbox has this functionality except using the
> RDP protocol.

That sounds pretty awesome. I think it might make sense to ask the QEMU
folks about this - they have some VNC experts on their mailing list.

[Qemu-devel] Re: [Xen-devel] Virtualization project idea

[Stefano Stabellini]

On Fri, 27 Aug 2010, Konrad Rzeszutek Wilk wrote:
> > > I'm an engineering student and is searching for a feasible project in
> > > virtualization. I'd like to know if its possible to share USB devices
> > > (flash drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc) across guests and host
> > > (VMs). Also, do you have any idea to extend it? Or any innovative idea
> > > so that we can implement it.
> > 
> > Yes see comments wrt USB pass-through. What about implementing USB over
> > IP? Possibly via a VNC extension so that remote USB devices can be
> > attached to a VM. Since VNC provides a terminal with keyboard/mouse/gfx,
> > why not USB too? I believe vbox has this functionality except using the
> > RDP protocol.
> 
> That sounds pretty awesome. I think it might make sense to ask the QEMU
> folks about this - they have some VNC experts on their mailing list.
> 

actually SPICE supports USB AFAIK and Gerd is adding SPICE support to
qemu as we speak

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Stefano Stabellini]

On Fri, 27 Aug 2010, Konrad Rzeszutek Wilk wrote:
> > > I'm an engineering student and is searching for a feasible project in
> > > virtualization. I'd like to know if its possible to share USB devices
> > > (flash drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc) across guests and host
> > > (VMs). Also, do you have any idea to extend it? Or any innovative idea
> > > so that we can implement it.
> > 
> > Yes see comments wrt USB pass-through. What about implementing USB over
> > IP? Possibly via a VNC extension so that remote USB devices can be
> > attached to a VM. Since VNC provides a terminal with keyboard/mouse/gfx,
> > why not USB too? I believe vbox has this functionality except using the
> > RDP protocol.
> 
> That sounds pretty awesome. I think it might make sense to ask the QEMU
> folks about this - they have some VNC experts on their mailing list.
> 

actually SPICE supports USB AFAIK and Gerd is adding SPICE support to
qemu as we speak

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Pasi Kärkkäinen]

On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 08:58:25AM +1000, James Harper wrote:
> > Hi there!
> > 
> > First I'd like to say that XEN plaform is really cool and awesome.
> > 
> > I'm an engineering student and is searching for a feasible project in
> > virtualization. I'd like to know if its possible to share USB devices
> (flash
> > drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc) across guests and host (VMs).
> Also, do
> > you have any idea to extend it? Or any innovative idea so that we can
> > implement it.
> > 
> > I'd appreciate any help. Thanks in advance.
> > 
> 
> Further to what Pasi said, I have partially ported the backend interface
> and can hand you the code if you want. It's probable a bit stale vs the
> current kernels and leaks memory under some circumstances but is
> probably better than starting from scratch.
> 

James: Please post your backend patch! I'll take a look if noone
else has time to look at it.

-- Pasi

[Qemu-devel] Re: [Xen-devel] Virtualization project idea

[David Markey]

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Wow, good news.

When are we porting our Xen stuff upstream? :)

On 27 August 2010 17:51, Stefano Stabellini <
stefano.stabellini@eu.citrix.com> wrote:

> On Fri, 27 Aug 2010, Konrad Rzeszutek Wilk wrote:
> > > > I'm an engineering student and is searching for a feasible project in
> > > > virtualization. I'd like to know if its possible to share USB devices
> > > > (flash drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc) across guests and host
> > > > (VMs). Also, do you have any idea to extend it? Or any innovative
> idea
> > > > so that we can implement it.
> > >
> > > Yes see comments wrt USB pass-through. What about implementing USB over
> > > IP? Possibly via a VNC extension so that remote USB devices can be
> > > attached to a VM. Since VNC provides a terminal with
> keyboard/mouse/gfx,
> > > why not USB too? I believe vbox has this functionality except using the
> > > RDP protocol.
> >
> > That sounds pretty awesome. I think it might make sense to ask the QEMU
> > folks about this - they have some VNC experts on their mailing list.
> >
>
> actually SPICE supports USB AFAIK and Gerd is adding SPICE support to
> qemu as we speak
>
> _______________________________________________
> Xen-devel mailing list
> Xen-devel@lists.xensource.com
> http://lists.xensource.com/xen-devel
>

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Re: Virtualization project idea

[David Markey]

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Wow, good news.

When are we porting our Xen stuff upstream? :)

On 27 August 2010 17:51, Stefano Stabellini <
stefano.stabellini@eu.citrix.com> wrote:

> On Fri, 27 Aug 2010, Konrad Rzeszutek Wilk wrote:
> > > > I'm an engineering student and is searching for a feasible project in
> > > > virtualization. I'd like to know if its possible to share USB devices
> > > > (flash drive, hard disk, mouse, keyboards etc) across guests and host
> > > > (VMs). Also, do you have any idea to extend it? Or any innovative
> idea
> > > > so that we can implement it.
> > >
> > > Yes see comments wrt USB pass-through. What about implementing USB over
> > > IP? Possibly via a VNC extension so that remote USB devices can be
> > > attached to a VM. Since VNC provides a terminal with
> keyboard/mouse/gfx,
> > > why not USB too? I believe vbox has this functionality except using the
> > > RDP protocol.
> >
> > That sounds pretty awesome. I think it might make sense to ask the QEMU
> > folks about this - they have some VNC experts on their mailing list.
> >
>
> actually SPICE supports USB AFAIK and Gerd is adding SPICE support to
> qemu as we speak
>
> _______________________________________________
> Xen-devel mailing list
> Xen-devel@lists.xensource.com
> http://lists.xensource.com/xen-devel
>

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http://lists.xensource.com/xen-devel

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Pasi Kärkkäinen]

On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 04:30:42PM +0300, Pasi Kärkkäinen wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 03:17:39PM +0200, Michal Novotny wrote:
> > On 08/27/2010 03:08 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen wrote:
> >> On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:33:35PM +0530, Dhananjay Goel wrote:
> >>    
> >>>     Yes, exactly. So, we wanted to know if it is possible to *share USB*
> >>>     across VMs.
> >>>
> >>>      
> >> I don't think USB protocol has been designed for *sharing*.
> >> I'm pretty certain only one computer/device/VM can use USB device at a time.
> >>
> >> -- Pasi
> >>
> >>    
> >
> > Pasi, I agree. I think the think here is that Dhananjay confused the USB  
> > device sharing with the file system sharing. I guess the USB protocol  
> > was not designed for sharing nevertheless sharing the filesystem on a  
> > USB stick is a completely different think.
> >
> > Dhananajay, you need to plug in the USB stick onto one computer (and  
> > it's impossible to plug it into multiple computer at one time, of  
> > course) and then setup the sharing. Everybody here is talking about the  
> > hardware abstraction and virtualization and what you wrote is a  
> > completely different thing - it's software-related and this has nothing  
> > to do with the hardware emulation/abstraction what-so-ever.
> >
> > Considering the NFS and all the sharing protocols there was something  
> > why it doesn't corrupt the data. I'm no expert on this subject but I  
> > think this is because they run in the server-client mode. All the  
> > clients are talking to the server and the server itself is one computer  
> > that's having the just one operating system working with this particular  
> > device - no matter what the underlaying device is - it may be everything  
> > - USB stick, IDE/SCSI/SAS drive or just a relay workstation to save all  
> > the data into one remote media (e.g. for replication). What I mean is  
> > that the basic thing is that it's running on only one operating system  
> > (because of it's connected to this one machine *only*) so it takes care  
> > of everything and it's aware of the write-cache and data operations  
> > being done to this media.
> >
> 
> Yep.
> 
> If you want to share files from the hypervisor-host (from USB stick or from actual disk)
> to the VMs you *can* do it today over-the-network (nfs,cifs,webdav,ftp) using the standard
> client-server tools that have been used for over 20 years.
> 
> If you don't want to do it over-the-network, but somehow 'through' the hypervisor,
> then you'd need to build some kind of special filesystem protocol that is able
> to do the client-server communication over the hypervisor specific paths (xenbus etc).
> And have drivers for it in the hypervisor-host, and in the VMs.
> 

Oh, and as mentioned on irc, something like VirtFS (http://www.linuxplumbersconf.org/2010/ocw/proposals/603)
could be implemented over xenbus.. to make 'filesystem sharing', or 'paravirtual filesystem' 
through the hypervisor.

-- Pasi

[Qemu-devel] Re: [Xen-devel] Virtualization project idea

[Pasi Kärkkäinen]

On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:01:49PM +0100, David Markey wrote:
>    Wow, good news.
>    When are we porting our Xen stuff upstream? :)
>

I think that's in progress right now.. two rounds of patches already sent.

-- Pasi

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Pasi Kärkkäinen]

On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 06:01:49PM +0100, David Markey wrote:
>    Wow, good news.
>    When are we porting our Xen stuff upstream? :)
>

I think that's in progress right now.. two rounds of patches already sent.

-- Pasi

Re: Virtualization project idea

[Gianni Tedesco]

On Fri, 2010-08-27 at 10:57 +0100, Keir Fraser wrote:
> On 27/08/2010 10:48, "Dhananjay Goel" <dhananjaygoel123@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> >> You don't necessarily share network, disc, or mouse/keyboard at the USB
> >> level. For network, as an example, the hardware device belongs to the host
> >> which provides NATed or bridged networking to VMs. VMs see a virtual network
> >> device rather than the underlying physical device. Similar principle applies
> >> to other device classes -- VMs see a virtual device. If you want a VM to see
> >> a property of a physical device that cannot be expressed in your virtual
> >> device model, you pass that physical device through directly to that one VM.
> >> If you want direct passthrough and some semblance of sharing between VMs...
> >> that's harder to do.
> > 
> > I agree its difficult to do. But is it possible to do? Can we make such that
> > USB devices are shared across VMs? Any suggestion of how it can be done? 
> 
> Well, no, not really. You go work it out and come back with some patches.
> :-)

You could do it at the USB class spec level I suppose, eg.
virtualisation layers for video, ccid, etc.. IOW it would be possible to
split a multi-slot smart-card reader in to several single-slot devices.
Or lets say a keyboard with an integrated microphone (or whatever) could
be split according to its separate well defined USB interfaces.

On the other hand, it's not clear any of it would be worth the lines of
code expended??

Gianni