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From: Peter Zijlstra <peterz@infradead.org>
To: Tejun Heo <tj@kernel.org>
Cc: Zefan Li <lizefan@huawei.com>,
	Mike Galbraith <umgwanakikbuti@gmail.com>,
	Ingo Molnar <mingo@kernel.org>,
	LKML <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	Cgroups <cgroups@vger.kernel.org>
Subject: Re: [PATCH] sched: Relax a restriction in sched_rt_can_attach()
Date: Wed, 6 May 2015 10:49:06 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20150506084906.GW23123@twins.programming.kicks-ass.net> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20150505190603.GZ1971@htj.duckdns.org>

On Tue, May 05, 2015 at 03:06:03PM -0400, Tejun Heo wrote:
> Hello, Peter.
> 
> On Tue, May 05, 2015 at 09:00:57PM +0200, Peter Zijlstra wrote:
> > On Tue, May 05, 2015 at 12:31:12PM -0400, Tejun Heo wrote:
> > > What I don't want to happen is controllers failing migrations
> > > willy-nilly for random reasons leaving users baffled, which we've
> > > actually been doing unfortunately.  Maybe we need to deal with this
> > > fixed resource arbitration as a separate class and allow them to fail
> > > migration w/ -EBUSY.
> > 
> > Ah, _that_ was the problem.
> > 
> > Which is something created by this co-mounting of controllers.
> 
> Yeah, partly, but also that it's an extra failure mode which isn't
> necessary for most controllers.

I can agree with reducing failure modes, but we should not do it at the
cost of functionality.

> > You could of course store the ss-id of the failing operation in
> > task_struct and have a file reporting the name of the ss-id.
> > 
> > That way, there is a simple way to find out which controller failed the
> > migrate.
> 
> Given that the resources which can fail are very limited, I don't
> think we need that right now as long as we limit and document the
> possible failure cases clearly.  Hopefully, this won't devolve into
> collection of arbitrary failures.

Right, but something like that would be fairly trivial to implement and
would give immediate resolution.

For example:

$ echo 123 > /cgroups/monkey/business/tasks
-EBUSY
$ cat /cgroups/monkey/business/errno
cpu:-EBUSY

(in fact, for a trivial implementation it doesn't matter which
cgroup/errno you cat)

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Peter Zijlstra <peterz-wEGCiKHe2LqWVfeAwA7xHQ@public.gmane.org>
To: Tejun Heo <tj-DgEjT+Ai2ygdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
Cc: Zefan Li <lizefan-hv44wF8Li93QT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>,
	Mike Galbraith
	<umgwanakikbuti-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>,
	Ingo Molnar <mingo-DgEjT+Ai2ygdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>,
	LKML <linux-kernel-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org>,
	Cgroups <cgroups-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org>
Subject: Re: [PATCH] sched: Relax a restriction in sched_rt_can_attach()
Date: Wed, 6 May 2015 10:49:06 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20150506084906.GW23123@twins.programming.kicks-ass.net> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20150505190603.GZ1971-piEFEHQLUPpN0TnZuCh8vA@public.gmane.org>

On Tue, May 05, 2015 at 03:06:03PM -0400, Tejun Heo wrote:
> Hello, Peter.
> 
> On Tue, May 05, 2015 at 09:00:57PM +0200, Peter Zijlstra wrote:
> > On Tue, May 05, 2015 at 12:31:12PM -0400, Tejun Heo wrote:
> > > What I don't want to happen is controllers failing migrations
> > > willy-nilly for random reasons leaving users baffled, which we've
> > > actually been doing unfortunately.  Maybe we need to deal with this
> > > fixed resource arbitration as a separate class and allow them to fail
> > > migration w/ -EBUSY.
> > 
> > Ah, _that_ was the problem.
> > 
> > Which is something created by this co-mounting of controllers.
> 
> Yeah, partly, but also that it's an extra failure mode which isn't
> necessary for most controllers.

I can agree with reducing failure modes, but we should not do it at the
cost of functionality.

> > You could of course store the ss-id of the failing operation in
> > task_struct and have a file reporting the name of the ss-id.
> > 
> > That way, there is a simple way to find out which controller failed the
> > migrate.
> 
> Given that the resources which can fail are very limited, I don't
> think we need that right now as long as we limit and document the
> possible failure cases clearly.  Hopefully, this won't devolve into
> collection of arbitrary failures.

Right, but something like that would be fairly trivial to implement and
would give immediate resolution.

For example:

$ echo 123 > /cgroups/monkey/business/tasks
-EBUSY
$ cat /cgroups/monkey/business/errno
cpu:-EBUSY

(in fact, for a trivial implementation it doesn't matter which
cgroup/errno you cat)

  reply	other threads:[~2015-05-06  8:50 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 43+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2015-05-04  0:54 [PATCH] sched: Relax a restriction in sched_rt_can_attach() Zefan Li
2015-05-04  0:54 ` Zefan Li
2015-05-04  3:13 ` Mike Galbraith
2015-05-04  3:13   ` Mike Galbraith
2015-05-04  4:39   ` Zefan Li
2015-05-04  4:39     ` Zefan Li
2015-05-04  5:10     ` Mike Galbraith
2015-05-04  5:10       ` Mike Galbraith
2015-05-04  5:39       ` Mike Galbraith
2015-05-04  5:39         ` Mike Galbraith
2015-05-04  9:11         ` Zefan Li
2015-05-04  9:11           ` Zefan Li
2015-05-04 12:08           ` Mike Galbraith
2015-05-04 12:08             ` Mike Galbraith
2015-05-04 12:37           ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-05-04 12:37             ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-05-04 14:09             ` Mike Galbraith
2015-05-05  3:46               ` Zefan Li
2015-05-05  3:46                 ` Zefan Li
2015-05-05  6:02                 ` Mike Galbraith
2015-05-05  6:02                   ` Mike Galbraith
2015-05-05  3:54             ` Zefan Li
2015-05-05  3:54               ` Zefan Li
2015-05-05 14:10               ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-05-05 14:18                 ` Tejun Heo
2015-05-05 15:19                   ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-05-05 16:31                     ` Tejun Heo
2015-05-05 19:00                       ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-05-05 19:06                         ` Tejun Heo
2015-05-05 19:06                           ` Tejun Heo
2015-05-06  8:49                           ` Peter Zijlstra [this message]
2015-05-06  8:49                             ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-05-05 14:41             ` Tejun Heo
2015-05-05 15:11               ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-05-05 16:13                 ` Tejun Heo
2015-05-05 16:50                   ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-05-05 18:29                     ` Thomas Gleixner
2015-05-05 19:00                       ` Tejun Heo
2015-05-05 19:00                         ` Tejun Heo
2015-05-06  9:12                         ` Thomas Gleixner
2015-05-05 18:31                     ` Tejun Heo
2015-05-05 14:09         ` Tejun Heo
2015-05-05 14:09           ` Tejun Heo

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